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LeMorted'Authur
Zombie Incursions
45
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Posted - 2014.01.17 06:56:00 -
[1] - Quote
I have almost always been a WindowGÇÖs user, or a DOS user. Dos was MicrosoftGÇÖs only stable system with security built in. All others follows under the joke "Microsoft Works." I tried the first version of Red Hat and it was nice for the money (free), but it would take hours to configure your computer and load interfaces. Then after hours and sometimes days of hard work an unstable bug may crash you. This happened several times in the first month for me and each time I lost several hours of work. I also lost several hours to reconfiguring and getting back to the more stable configuration a day or two before I updated. This left me with the belief that a paid for system was worth the time and money since you donGÇÖt lost time configuring and lost work. Even then Red Hat was great for old computers and the tools for hard drives, system operation and what not was great.
Now you have a stable OS, that is equal or better than Mac or Microsoft and it is the Official OS for the Chinese government. The development tools is unequal, because most propriety software has some offerings, and the amount of free tools and their functionality with shared libraries is great. Several programmers at CCP must be using it.
For example everyone is using Python (CCP included) now, there are a few great free library systems on (Mac/Micro) but most offer the libraries and functionality at a great cost and then one can find the same library as a open source in the Linux environment. Linux is quickly outpacing other OS as the OS to develop software because of its stability, functionality and cost. Now in my time in eve it seems there are a great number of military persons (other big user of Linux) and Engineers or Software people.
So basically my point is CCP would benefit by supporting Linux Officially by embracing the exponential massive growth with python programming community in the Linux universe for their employees (I bet a lot already do). With Ubuntu python IDE is built in, and installed as standard. The potential of all Chinese government computers running their software and subscripting or plexing their accounts, plus if the government is switching how many ohter users will too. CCP made a huge mistake with station walking (bitter vets mention it a lot) and lost a player base they have not recovered from, the low end computers. Ubuntu and its derivatives and other Linux OS's are very stable and low on resources required so leaving more room for internet space ships and their pixels. Ubuntu has been named the most secure OS http://news.softpedia.com/news/Ubuntu-12-04-Is-More-Secure-Than-Windows-8-and-Mac-OS-X-Says-UK-Goverment-416016.shtml. With a lot of concern regarding US spying practices CCP can only expand its player base by embracing Linux.
Or at least Ubuntu. Flying it like you stole it, because half of the others in eve have.-á |
Elmore Jones
Nebula II
35
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Posted - 2014.01.17 13:41:00 -
[2] - Quote
CCP did officially support a Cedega (commercial wine fork) version of EVE but it was dropped some time ago. The devs do take notice I believe of issues for wine users.
While I don't want to flame you for your post, it must be observed that a very similar topic crops up every 2 months or so. Personally I hold a small hope for SteamOS convincing developers to consider Linux when making games, and using OpenGL 4.4 up in place of DirectX - I am by nature a dreamer though ;)
+++ Reality Error 404 - Reboot Cosmos +++ |
LeMorted'Authur
Zombie Incursions
45
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Posted - 2014.01.17 14:48:00 -
[3] - Quote
Well, I did just switch over and I was assuming that on these forums this is a quarterly topic. Hope my late night banter was readable. One thing I think that may push them back into the fold is Ubuntu being such a secure OS and this being declared by the UK government. This is a big deal, because a lot of high level politicians will talk and the UK may recant this statement at some time and say something. Americans and British citizens both fought in Iraq so to me this is part of the fall out regarding NSA. Lobbyists in both America and UK will push for this statement to be removed.
Rand() % X, where x is the range, is only pseudo random leaving the lower numbers more likely to show up. I was born in 1981 and never did use DOS 1.0 but my uncles and family who did and code, have a drive with all the old DOS on it so they can access old file libraries with it. These libraries came with real encryption and real random number generation. They were removed. (so I am told) The difference then was Microsoft was a essentially a division of IBM and both would not defy NSA demands to remove it from later OS's. Ubuntu will always be more secure because there is a worldwide group of programmers who want to build what they want, and if NSA gets one system, then they will just leave and program another. Linux got its rebirth after NSA won their legal battles in the early 1990's and they just had enough kernel to operate an OS. A shame Obama is supported spying he ran against in his first campaign. Flying it like you stole it, because half of the others in eve have.-á |
Kismeteer
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
576
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Posted - 2014.01.17 16:46:00 -
[4] - Quote
rah rah rah Linux everywhere rabblerabblerabble.
Such a small population played Eve on Linux when they did support it, it wasn't worth continuing to support. So we support it ourselves and it works.
Once the steambox goes live, MAYBE we get better support? But I kind of doubt it because the launcher fiasco and who the hell can play eve on their TV. |
Elmore Jones
Nebula II
35
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Posted - 2014.01.18 01:35:00 -
[5] - Quote
MS was never a division of IBM. IBM, against normal policy, allowed MS to keep the rights to MSDOS. The rest is shoddy quality of release history lol.
+++ Reality Error 404 - Reboot Cosmos +++ |
LeMorted'Authur
Zombie Incursions
45
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Posted - 2014.01.19 00:11:00 -
[6] - Quote
Elmore Jones wrote:MS was never a division of IBM. IBM, against normal policy, allowed MS to keep the rights to MSDOS. The rest is shoddy quality of release history lol.
I said effectively in the beginning. Microsoft was building the MS-DOS OS according to IBM specs, under direction of IBM. Flying it like you stole it, because half of the others in eve have.-á |
LeMorted'Authur
Zombie Incursions
45
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Posted - 2014.01.19 00:18:00 -
[7] - Quote
Kismeteer wrote:rah rah rah Linux everywhere rabblerabblerabble.
Such a small population played Eve on Linux when they did support it, it wasn't worth continuing to support. So we support it ourselves and it works.
Once the steambox goes live, MAYBE we get better support? But I kind of doubt it because the launcher fiasco and who the hell can play eve on their TV.
Cool, I just switched over, from windows and the sudo commands in the terminal is so much better than I remember from before. I don't think I am using either another Windows or Mac OS again. I really like sudo apt-get install. I am very impressed by what the community has made.
I bought more Ram for my new build instead of Windows 7. So if I am going to play eve, it is all on Ubuntu or not at all.
But I do think the NSA spying and Chinese Government will change the amount of users who want to use Eve on Linux. The former because of its open doors installed on a large range of programs and the latter because China is using Ubuntu to develop its own secure OS. Flying it like you stole it, because half of the others in eve have.-á |
Psychedemic
Native Freshfood Minmatar Republic
0
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Posted - 2014.01.24 15:19:00 -
[8] - Quote
It works fine through Wine. |
Delt0r Garsk
Shits N Giggles
88
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Posted - 2014.01.26 15:39:00 -
[9] - Quote
It should be pointed out that it works fine on wine because they "kinda" support wine. Sure its not official. But if a version really breaks with wine, its usually a fairly short time before a release fixes it. I doubt that is coincidence.
I have not used windows for 10 years now. If it stopped working on wine, i would need revised my subscription. I know that there are a lot of people who use wine non exclusively to play eve as well. In a recent public fleet it was over 50% that where on linux.
I'm pretty sure CCP probably know the hard numbers. But right now it make sense for them to simply ensure it works with wine. Less work etc. |
Bayta Charante
We Love Beer
6
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Posted - 2014.01.29 00:16:00 -
[10] - Quote
They would have to rewrite the whole graphics stuff since it's all written for DirectX. So until they need to redo that part again like they did on -+2009? they are not going to port the game to OpenGL, so until THAT happens there won't be a native Linux client since everything else is much easier to port.
Even so that isn't sure, they might stick with DirectX when that time comes just because! |
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micha c
1
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Posted - 2014.01.31 03:06:00 -
[11] - Quote
i'd totally support that motion, if it were one. I'd even buy that for a reasonable price!
Since: 1. I'm backing up my system (right now) on linux, using PartED, sleak and easy usb backup and recovery solution. Haven't found a better and reliable solution using MS products as a fallback if the system partition gets fried along with my ssd. wich kinda happened just a few minutes ago :/
2. WinXP support runs out this april. 3 Win7 treats me like a child, dialogs are in plain english. If i'd want my computer talk to me like a normal person, i'd go out and find me some company. 4. 'merican comercial products can't be trusted in the light of recent events. And even on potent hardware, Windows feels sluggish and laggy at times. Wich is hardly explainable in a time were computers are capable of accurately simulating atombomb tests. Archaic example but meh. |
Seras Victoria Egivand
United Star Alliance UNITED STAR FEDERATION
8
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Posted - 2014.01.31 04:44:00 -
[12] - Quote
we will prob get a linux port when ccp quits believing the windows hype... |
Marsan
Caldari Provisions
199
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Posted - 2014.02.03 21:56:00 -
[13] - Quote
Honestly I suspect that they will more likely wrap Eve with wine like they did before. Eve is tightly wedded to windows, and it would need a lot of work to replace components with multi-platform alternatives. My big worry is that the devs will decide they must have tessellation or other directx 11 feature. Hopefully wine will support newer versions of directx before the number of windows 98 eve users dries up. On the plus side thing like the humble bundle and steambox are keeping linux gaming in the minds of the suits... Former forum cheerleader CCP, now just a hopeful small portion of the community. |
Zwo Zateki
Russian Allied Incursions
106
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Posted - 2014.02.04 23:06:00 -
[14] - Quote
I don't think that OpenGL/D3D debacle is relevant to Linux port now since D3D9 is supported on Linux. -Ü-¦-+-¦-+ RAISA Shield: -¦-é-+-Ç-¦-¦-+-+-Å -í-¦-+-î-ê-+ -¦-+-Å -ç-¦-¦-+-+-¦-+-¦ -+ -+-¦ -é-+-+-î-¦-+ |
Veldar Reku
Wu Xi Holdings
10
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Posted - 2014.02.05 03:37:00 -
[15] - Quote
LeMorted'Authur wrote:or a DOS user. Dos was MicrosoftGÇÖs only stable system with security built in.
This must be a troll or someone completely ignorant.
DOS + security => NaN
DOS was a *single* application "OS", where the only application running, had ALL permissions. If you are trying to compare this to any modern OS, stop now. Even Windows 3.1 running under the 386 Enhanced Mode was light years ahead in stability over DOS. How do I know this? I wrote some toy programs for DOS* and Windows 3.1 and Windows 95, etc. You can probably ask others familiar with programming environments, as it was at the time, before making mistakes of comparing DOS to anything.
Cheers, Veldar
* Side note: back when I was trying to optimize one of my programs with liberal usage of assembly, I managed to forget some opcode and somehow managed to essentially write garbage to a few sectors at the beginning of my massive 80MB HD. Needless to say, DOS did not protect my file system from being destroyed
So now, please, get off my lawn!
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Z'zauoe Euopaeqorua
Native Freshfood Minmatar Republic
1
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Posted - 2014.02.05 09:00:00 -
[16] - Quote
Never. Well, unless big companys decide to boot Windows. |
Seras Victoria Egivand
United Star Alliance UNITED STAR FEDERATION
37
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Posted - 2014.02.05 20:40:00 -
[17] - Quote
They have the money to build a statue i think they have enough to work on proper development of a linux and mac client properly. |
Ravow
Cosmic Encounter
18
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Posted - 2014.02.05 21:47:00 -
[18] - Quote
A native client will not append and we do not want a Transgaming inferior client like the "Linux" client we got a couple year ago.. Even Mac user are learning to ditch the Mac client in profit of the Win client+Wine as it work better.
A Native Linux port could append when everyone will ditch Tainted driver and use MESA+Gallium instead as D3D9 is supported on these. But still, EVE have others dependency (VC++, probably some more) to replace and it can be some work. |
Katrina Bekers
Rim Collection RC Sorry We're In Your Space Eh
196
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Posted - 2014.02.06 17:42:00 -
[19] - Quote
It's that time of the year again? Oh, my, time flies! << THE RABBLE BRIGADE >> |
Seras Victoria Egivand
United Star Alliance UNITED STAR FEDERATION
45
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Posted - 2014.02.09 23:03:00 -
[20] - Quote
Katrina Bekers wrote:It's that time of the year again? Oh, my, time flies!
yep because always having to rely on wine is the way to go ..... :eyeroll: |
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Mylan Utrigas
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2014.02.10 03:13:00 -
[21] - Quote
Seras Victoria Egivand wrote:Katrina Bekers wrote:It's that time of the year again? Oh, my, time flies! yep because always having to rely on wine is the way to go ..... :eyeroll:
I gotta say, I would love a dedicated Linux client...
Wine is very hit or miss with me. It randomly stopped working, and I have been unable to get it working again since.
I really dislike having Windows on my computer just for the sake of being able to play a game (but that is literally the only reason why I keep a Windows partition, otherwise I'd do without it). |
Air Bermesiah
Federal Defense Union Gallente Federation
1
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Posted - 2014.02.11 16:28:00 -
[22] - Quote
Katrina Bekers wrote:It's that time of the year again? Oh, my, time flies!
i love you lol I always see you here and I always enjoy your comments lol
no but really guys, she's right. Even I started one of these threads on a different character over a year ago. It comes up every month or two, and the answer is always the same :/
just, cross your fingers and tell CCP what you want. thats literally all you can do. CCP is probably going to have to rewrite the game sometime in the upcoming years- maybe we'll et lucky and they'll do something that will benefit us. but ultimately, it's highly unlikely that we will see a native client unless you can find a team of ~50 linux designers who are willing to program the entire game for linux, under contract, for free. It saddens me, too, as a linux user- but we should count our blessings- and our resources would be better spent helping the wine project get better for now. |
Mylan Utrigas
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2014.02.12 02:17:00 -
[23] - Quote
Personally, I think it's a good idea to bring it up.
CCP needs to know who would like it to run on Linux. If no on asks, it will never happen, because for all they know, no one cares.
Companies need feedback to know who their community is :-) |
Bayta Charante
Zero Atmosphere Combat Academy
7
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Posted - 2014.02.16 06:00:00 -
[24] - Quote
Mylan Utrigas wrote:Personally, I think it's a good idea to bring it up.
CCP needs to know who would like it to run on Linux. If no on asks, it will never happen, because for all they know, no one cares.
Companies need feedback to know who their community is :-)
The thing is that even the people that doesn't know that needs a linux client, needs a linux client.
It's all part of a big step we all together need to take. How many times have you people ever heard "oh man! I really like linux, but dual booting is sh#$*t. If only [put any game's name here] were available native on linux"
The truth is that even though you can go to WineHQ to see what commands to actually type, or just copypastel, to make the game run it's still voodoo for most users. |
Seras Victoria Egivand
United Star Alliance UNITED STAR FEDERATION
47
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Posted - 2014.02.16 07:30:00 -
[25] - Quote
Bayta Charante wrote:Mylan Utrigas wrote:Personally, I think it's a good idea to bring it up.
CCP needs to know who would like it to run on Linux. If no on asks, it will never happen, because for all they know, no one cares.
Companies need feedback to know who their community is :-) The thing is that even the people that doesn't know that needs a linux client, needs a linux client. It's all part of a big step we all together need to take. How many times have you people ever heard "oh man! I really like linux, but dual booting is sh#$*t. If only [put any game's name here] were available native on linux" The truth is that even though you can go to WineHQ to see what commands to actually type, or just copypastel, to make the game run it's still voodoo for most users.
Honestly as newer games come out and older games get updated (mmo's) the less and less viable wine becomes.. (not that it was really viable)... Yes we know the game works under wine.. It works ok.... The more ccp migrates the newer parts of the game to direct x and or if ms pulls the whole lock down though the windows store.... How much more viable is it then?
Yes wine is voodoo to some... But the amounts of steps some games require and or if the game requires 400 diffrent patches and steps to get it to wrk under linux with wine at which point does it just become more viable to just load it under windows? Point being is there is alot of linux gamers out there... They just need to make a linux client. (mac os 2) |
Marsan
Caldari Provisions
207
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Posted - 2014.02.21 02:15:00 -
[26] - Quote
Honestly I don't think they can switch to dx11 fully as the mac client is a wine client under the hood, and windows 98 is going to hang on for a few more years.
Personally I find wine works for every game I've tried it on in 2014. Also with steam for linux, and humble bundle there are a lot more linux games available. Gaming under linux has been on a roll for years. Former forum cheerleader CCP, now just a hopeful small portion of the community. |
Environmental Protection
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2014.03.01 03:28:00 -
[27] - Quote
I recently just switched from Gentoo to Ubuntu and Wine works much better. Some performance penalty but it's not that bad.
Recently in Gentoo Wine stopped working altogether, so it's definitely an improvement.
I'm still in the "I would be super stoked if there was a native Linux client" camp. |
Marsan
High Life Side Line Vacation
212
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Posted - 2014.03.11 18:22:00 -
[28] - Quote
Valve just open sourced their dx9 to opengl lib. This is big as they MIT licensed it, and put it on github. If a number of small companies as well as Valve put some work into it it could make porting DX games easier. http://www.gamingonlinux.com/articles/valve-has-posted-their-direct3d-to-opengl-translation-layer-onto-github.3248/
On the other hand crytek is now supporting Linux which was the big road block to linux support in Star Citizen. (It remains to be seen if RSI actually follows through with prior statements about linux support.) http://www.crytek.com/news/conference-attendees-can-also-see-a-brand-new-mobile-game-extra-engine-updates-and-much-more-at-crytek-s-booth Former forum cheerleader CCP, now just a hopeful small portion of the community. |
Neuntausend
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
69
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Posted - 2014.03.12 08:31:00 -
[29] - Quote
Well, "Limited subset of Direct3D 9.0c" and "Some SM3 support" doesn't really give me any confidence that this is better than what we already had. |
Marsan
High Life Side Line Vacation
212
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Posted - 2014.03.13 00:55:00 -
[30] - Quote
Environmental Protection wrote:I recently just switched from Gentoo to Ubuntu and Wine works much better. Some performance penalty but it's not that bad.
Recently in Gentoo Wine stopped working altogether, so it's definitely an improvement.
I'm still in the "I would be super stoked if there was a native Linux client" camp.
Are you running Unity? Try running a lighter window manager or kde and shutoff desktop effects. Former forum cheerleader CCP, now just a hopeful small portion of the community. |
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