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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Jenshae Chiroptera
149
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Posted - 2011.11.09 01:08:00 -
[1] - Quote
Okay, just to cover the bases, let us run through the general tips for mining in dangerous areas.
- Tank up - implants, CPU rigs, Damage Control, et cetera.
- Carry drones - ECM if they haven't been nerfed yet might help.
- Align to a safe point.
- Book mark two points - drift between them along the length of the belt, with "Approach" then if someone arrives, your speed is up to instantly warp away to them.
- D-scan - find a good guide that will help you set up your D-scan. You want to watch it for approaching ships and warp away.
I also suggest you might want to stop looking at your fellow miners as competition but now as compatriots. Make an intelligence channel so that you know what system the gankers are active in, try to put out scouts, start marking them with negative standing so that they have to keep making more alts to get the same results.
Then come back and let us know how this goes, so that CCP have some concrete information to act upon. CSM do you think? No matter the changes, high sec people chose the safests. Lots of stick and they will leave. Half the problem is the players in null sec; we do not want to be there with you. |
Mortis vonShadow
Balanaz Mining and Development Inc.
307
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 01:13:00 -
[2] - Quote
I thought you were bored with everything since you are the best at everything you try? Why this interest with EVE Online mining which I'm sure you will get bored with soon. Some days you're the bug, and some days your the windscreen. -á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á And some days, you're just a man with a gun. |
Jenshae Chiroptera
149
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 01:14:00 -
[3] - Quote
Mortis vonShadow wrote:I thought ...
Please try to keep your comments on topic, thanks.
CSM do you think? No matter the changes, high sec people chose the safests. Lots of stick and they will leave. Half the problem is the players in null sec; we do not want to be there with you. |
Stahlregen
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 01:15:00 -
[4] - Quote
Also go get a root. EVERY MORNING I WAKE UP AND OPEN PALM SLAM A VHS INTO THE SLOT. IT'S CHRONICLES OF RIDDICK AND RIGHT THEN AND THERE I START DOING THE MOVES ALONGSIDE THE MAIN CHARACTER, RIDDICK. I DO EVERY MOVE AND I DO EVERY MOVE HARD. MAKIN' WHOOSHING SOUNDS WHEN I SLAM DOWN SOME NECRO BASTARDS. NOT MANY CAN SAY THEY ESCAPED THE GALAXY'S MOST DANGEROUS PRISON. I CAN. |
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
40
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 01:23:00 -
[5] - Quote
Miners have been able to mitigate ganking since ganking was discovered. However, because it's much easier to get a free ride, they will instead play victim in order to get CCP to capitulate, and do their job for them. Considering the direction the game has been heading in, it's much more favorable for miners to not look after their own safety. Mama bear will be there to make the mean wolves go away.
Unfortunately, the carebears grossly underestimate how motivated hungry wolves become. Safety is a concept most fleeting, while they still roam the forest. |
Krios Ahzek
Juvenis Iratus
32
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 01:28:00 -
[6] - Quote
Buy an Eve account for your dog and train him to bark when he senses a gank approaching.
Animals have sixth senses for sensing danger. |
Ladie Harlot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
734
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 01:30:00 -
[7] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Okay, just to cover the bases, let us run through the general tips for mining in dangerous areas.
- Tank up - implants, CPU rigs, Damage Control, et cetera.
- Carry drones - ECM if they haven't been nerfed yet might help.
- Align to a safe point.
- Book mark two points - drift between them along the length of the belt, with "Approach" then if someone arrives, your speed is up to instantly warp away to them.
- D-scan - find a good guide that will help you set up your D-scan. You want to watch it for approaching ships and warp away.
I also suggest you might want to stop looking at your fellow miners as competition but now as compatriots. Make an intelligence channel so that you know what system the gankers are active in, try to put out scouts, start marking them with negative standing so that they have to keep making more alts to get the same results. Then come back and let us know how this goes, so that CCP have some concrete information to act upon. Most miners have zero interest in saving their exhumers from being ganked by following your suggestions. They feel they are entitled to afk mine while doing other things. The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet. |
Sverige Pahis
Thunderwaffe Goonswarm Federation
273
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 01:36:00 -
[8] - Quote
I heard a good way to avoid the gallente ice mining suicide ganks is to simply not mine in gallente space c/d |
Vigdis Thorisdottir
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
18
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 01:45:00 -
[9] - Quote
I'm all for the ganking to continue. Not because I find it entertaining or funny or sporting in any way.
But because I get pissed when I need to talk to someone in my lame industry corp, see them online, then try to talk to them only to find they're afk mining. With all the ganking going on, my corp channel is dead, but at least I know the people who are in it are actually playing the game.
Play and pay attention to your game and it's easy to not get ganked. Mining too boring to justify your attention? Then maybe that means it's a good time to try X-ing up when I'm trying to form a combat fleet.
/rant |
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
40
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 01:51:00 -
[10] - Quote
Vigdis Thorisdottir wrote:I'm all for the ganking to continue. Not because I find it entertaining or funny or sporting in any way.
But because I get pissed when I need to talk to someone in my lame industry corp, see them online, then try to talk to them only to find they're afk mining. With all the ganking going on, my corp channel is dead, but at least I know the people who are in it are actually playing the game.
Play and pay attention to your game and it's easy to not get ganked. Mining too boring to justify your attention? Then maybe that means it's a good time to try X-ing up when I'm trying to form a combat fleet.
/rant And now you probably understand why true carebears are such loathed and vitriolic creatures. Sounds like you belong in a pvp corporation, or at least one that doesn't shy away from pvp-oriented activities. |
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Ladie Harlot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
736
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 01:51:00 -
[11] - Quote
Vigdis Thorisdottir wrote:I'm all for the ganking to continue. Not because I find it entertaining or funny or sporting in any way.
But because I get pissed when I need to talk to someone in my lame industry corp, see them online, then try to talk to them only to find they're afk mining. With all the ganking going on, my corp channel is dead, but at least I know the people who are in it are actually playing the game.
Play and pay attention to your game and it's easy to not get ganked. Mining too boring to justify your attention? Then maybe that means it's a good time to try X-ing up when I'm trying to form a combat fleet.
/rant This guy or girl gets it.
The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet. |
Jenshae Chiroptera
149
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 01:52:00 -
[12] - Quote
Vigdis Thorisdottir wrote:... Play and pay attention to your game and it's easy to not get ganked. Mining too boring to justify your attention? Then maybe that means it's a good time to try X-ing up when I'm trying to form a combat fleet.
/rant
I can't mine with 100% attention and I do most of my mining in worm holes. The best I can do is semi-AFK, where I have two screens, I read on one, click D-scan on the other and glance across from time to time. CSM do you think? No matter the changes, high sec people chose the safests. Lots of stick and they will leave. Half the problem is the players in null sec; we do not want to be there with you. |
Brock Nelson
41
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 01:54:00 -
[13] - Quote
Nothing's going to stop gankers
So, why do you guys continue to try to find ways to fight them? |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
1013
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 01:59:00 -
[14] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Vigdis Thorisdottir wrote:... Play and pay attention to your game and it's easy to not get ganked. Mining too boring to justify your attention? Then maybe that means it's a good time to try X-ing up when I'm trying to form a combat fleet.
/rant I can't mine with 100% attention and I do most of my mining in worm holes. The best I can do is semi-AFK, where I have two screens, I read on one, click D-scan on the other and glance across from time to time.
What if mining were something like the old asteroids game, where you used your mining lasers to blow the crap out of asteroids until they're in small enough pieces to scoop up into your mining ship's gaping maw by actively flying it to do so? zapzapzap! omnomnom!
Mining becomes an active-piloting activity involving real player skill. Miners pay attention and get ganked less. It becomes way harder to multibox efficiently, so mineral prices rise, capitals become expensive again, people actually care about T1 hull prices. A low denomination Interbus postage stamp is issued with my face on it.
Everybody is happy. Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Jenshae Chiroptera
149
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 02:13:00 -
[15] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Vigdis Thorisdottir wrote:... /rant I can't mine with 100% ... What if mining were ...
Quoted to OP. I like it the way it is because I can accomplish two things at once. I can see this as a good change, I probably wouldn't mine though as I would swop over to other active pursuits when I am giving the game my full attention. CSM do you think? No matter the changes, high sec people chose the safests. Lots of stick and they will leave. Half the problem is the players in null sec; we do not want to be there with you. |
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
40
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 02:15:00 -
[16] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:A low denomination Interbus postage stamp is issued with my face on it. See, it's thinking like that why the US Postal Office is billions of dollars into the red. |
VaMei
Meafi Corp
64
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 02:35:00 -
[17] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote: Align to a safe point.
Are you suggesting that passive alignment actually does anything in Eve?
Or, are you suggesting that a ship with an active align speed of 75m/s, and that needs to be w/in 10km of its target for 290s with max skills (over 640 with min) can actually do its job?
Either way... Here's your sign. |
Jenshae Chiroptera
150
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 02:37:00 -
[18] - Quote
VaMei wrote:... can actually do its job? ...
Works for me but under different conditions than you are probably imagining. CSM do you think? No matter the changes, high sec people chose the safests. Lots of stick and they will leave. Half the problem is the players in null sec; we do not want to be there with you. |
Corina Jarr
Spazzoid Enterprises Purpose Built
20
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 02:40:00 -
[19] - Quote
VaMei wrote:Jenshae Chiroptera wrote: Align to a safe point. Are you suggesting that passive alignment actually does anything in Eve? Or, are you suggesting that a ship with an active align speed of 75m/s, and that needs to be w/in 10km of its target for 290s with max skills (over 640 with min) can actually do its job? Either way... Here's your sign. Mining while aligned (there is no such thing as active or passive) is easy, and reduces the risk of mining to almost zero. All you need is two well placed bookmarks to fly between, and turn around when you feel the need.
Yes it takes planning, yes it is a little work, but do it and the ganker will have to work much more, if he even thinks is worth it. |
Jenshae Chiroptera
150
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 02:43:00 -
[20] - Quote
Corina Jarr wrote:... Mining while aligned ... is easy, and reduces the risk of mining to almost zero. All you need is two well placed bookmarks to ... In this case, we mean, where I just sit next to a rock, while being aligned one point, such as POS, while not moving. This helps cut only the align time out of warping away. CSM do you think? No matter the changes, high sec people chose the safests. Lots of stick and they will leave. Half the problem is the players in null sec; we do not want to be there with you. |
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Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
1018
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 02:49:00 -
[21] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Corina Jarr wrote:... Mining while aligned ... is easy, and reduces the risk of mining to almost zero. All you need is two well placed bookmarks to ... In this case, we mean, where I just sit next to a rock, while being aligned to one point, such as POS, while not moving. This helps cut only the align time out of warping away.
No it doesn't.
Seriously, don't get me started on this, I'm just asking you nicely, as a personal favour, not to repeat the myth that stationary alignment makes any difference whatsoever to warp-out time. I don't mind if you keep doing it - it's your ship - but please don't tell others to. Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Ladie Harlot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
742
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 02:49:00 -
[22] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Corina Jarr wrote:... Mining while aligned ... is easy, and reduces the risk of mining to almost zero. All you need is two well placed bookmarks to ... In this case, we mean, where I just sit next to a rock, while being aligned to one point, such as POS, while not moving. This helps cut only the align time out of warping away. If the ganker has a good warpin that still isn't always enough time to get out. Using two bookmarks and aligning back and forth between them at 75% top speed is the best way to be assured of getting out before you can be killed.
The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet. |
Jenshae Chiroptera
150
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 02:54:00 -
[23] - Quote
Ladie Harlot wrote:... If the ganker has a good warpin that still isn't always enough time to get out. Using two bookmarks and aligning back and forth between them at 75% top speed is the best way to be assured of getting out before you can be killed.
That is a lot of back and forth when you only have one asteroid in a grav site. CSM do you think? No matter the changes, high sec people chose the safests. Lots of stick and they will leave. Half the problem is the players in null sec; we do not want to be there with you. |
VaMei
Meafi Corp
65
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 02:54:00 -
[24] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:In this case, we mean, where I just sit next to a rock, while being aligned to one point, such as POS, while not moving. This helps cut only the align time out of warping away. Your ship is a vector in the physics simulation. When you are not moving you have location but no facing. The direction you see your ship facing is an effect produced by your client.
Skills and fittings being equal, a ship facing away and a ship facing toward will align at the same rate. |
Scrapyard Bob
EVE University Ivy League
321
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 02:57:00 -
[25] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote: In this case, we mean, where I just sit next to a rock, while being aligned to one point, such as POS, while not moving. This helps cut only the align time out of warping away.
If you are at zero-velocity, your warp-off speed is the same in every direction, no matter which way your ship points. Just make sure that your exit vector isn't littered with cans, rocks or other ships. And if you can get someone to apply a stasis web to you, you'll warp off far faster.
(Easily tested if you ever play around with a freighter after a gate jump.) |
Ladie Harlot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
743
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 03:01:00 -
[26] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Ladie Harlot wrote:... If the ganker has a good warpin that still isn't always enough time to get out. Using two bookmarks and aligning back and forth between them at 75% top speed is the best way to be assured of getting out before you can be killed.
That is a lot of back and forth when you only have one asteroid in a grav site. I don't think you are understanding how it works.
You create one bookmark 175k or more away from your asteroid then create another bookmark 175k or more away from the other side of your asteroid. Then you warp to your asteroid and start mining while aligning to and flying towards one of your waypoints at 75% speed. Before you get out of the mining laser range you align and fly towards the other waypoint at 75% speed. Exhumer top speeds are pretty slow so you'll have plenty of time in between having to turn around and if a ganker warps in you just warp to whichever bookmark you are aligning to and you instantly warp before the ganker can even lock you. The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet. |
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
417
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 03:05:00 -
[27] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:
What if mining were something like the old asteroids game, where you used your mining lasers to blow the crap out of asteroids until they're in small enough pieces to scoop up into your mining ship's gaping maw by actively flying it to do so? zapzapzap! omnomnom!
Mining becomes an active-piloting activity involving real player skill. Miners pay attention and get ganked less. It becomes way harder to multibox efficiently, so mineral prices rise, capitals become expensive again, people actually care about T1 hull prices. A low denomination Interbus postage stamp is issued with my face on it.
Everybody is happy.
Asteroids the game used space physics. EVE is set in a swimming pool with nebulae painted on the walls. I don't think CCP is in the mood to rewrite the game code to make a lot of people very upset.
What you are actually describing is how mining was done in Freelancer. So either CCP is good with it since apparently they and Microsoft share a bed now or they'll have MS lawyers up their ass for stealing intellectual property.
Take your best guess.
Mr Epeen
If you can read this, you haven't blocked me yet. |
Jenshae Chiroptera
150
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 03:05:00 -
[28] - Quote
Ladie Harlot wrote:... Exhumer top speeds are pretty slow so you'll have plenty of time in between having to turn around and if a ganker warps in you just warp to whichever bookmark you are aligning to and you instantly warp before the ganker can even lock you.
Thanks. Now why are you being helpful for a change? *Gets suspicious.* Ideas & stuff No matter the changes, high sec people chose the safests. Lots of stick and they will leave. Half the problem is the players in null sec; we do not want to be there with you. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
1019
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 03:05:00 -
[29] - Quote
Ladie Harlot wrote:Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Ladie Harlot wrote:... If the ganker has a good warpin that still isn't always enough time to get out. Using two bookmarks and aligning back and forth between them at 75% top speed is the best way to be assured of getting out before you can be killed.
That is a lot of back and forth when you only have one asteroid in a grav site. I don't think you are understanding how it works. You create one bookmark 175k or more away from your asteroid then create another bookmark 175k or more away from the other side of your asteroid. Then you warp to your asteroid and start mining while aligning to and flying towards one of your waypoints at 75% speed. Before you get out of the mining laser range you align and fly towards the other waypoint at 75% speed. Exhumer top speeds are pretty slow so you'll have plenty of time in between having to turn around and if a ganker warps in you just warp to whichever bookmark you are aligning to and you instantly warp before the ganker can even lock you.
Pro-tip - don't warp to your bookmark at 0, because you never know who might be waiting there... Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Ladie Harlot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
743
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 03:06:00 -
[30] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Ladie Harlot wrote:... Exhumer top speeds are pretty slow so you'll have plenty of time in between having to turn around and if a ganker warps in you just warp to whichever bookmark you are aligning to and you instantly warp before the ganker can even lock you. Thanks. Now why are you being helpful for a change? *Gets suspicious.*
When am I ever not helpful? Well other than trolling people for making bad threads about the CSM...
The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet. |
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Jenshae Chiroptera
150
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 03:08:00 -
[31] - Quote
Ladie Harlot wrote:When am I ever not helpful? Well other than trolling people for making bad threads about the CSM...
Yeah ... riiiight. I believe you. ^.- Ideas & stuff No matter the changes, high sec people chose the safests. Lots of stick and they will leave. Half the problem is the players in null sec; we do not want to be there with you. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
1019
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 03:08:00 -
[32] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Ladie Harlot wrote:... Exhumer top speeds are pretty slow so you'll have plenty of time in between having to turn around and if a ganker warps in you just warp to whichever bookmark you are aligning to and you instantly warp before the ganker can even lock you. Thanks. Now why are you being helpful for a change? *Gets suspicious.*
Oh that's easy. You see Ms Harlot can give you and any other miner who asks all the good-faith advice in the world - I've posted high survivability Hulk fits repeatedly - secure in the knowledge that only a tiny fraction, if any, of the miners they encounter are likely to follow it, and only a small fraction of those will take the trouble to practice and think about how to apply that advice in order to follow it correctly. Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Jenshae Chiroptera
150
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 03:12:00 -
[33] - Quote
*Hmmph.* Just wait! Revenge of the miners. Tomorrow night, we will do what we try to do every night - try to takeover the galaxy! Ideas & stuff No matter the changes, high sec people chose the safests. Lots of stick and they will leave. Half the problem is the players in null sec; we do not want to be there with you. |
Ladie Harlot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
743
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 03:14:00 -
[34] - Quote
Having all the information readily available makes our ice interdiction even funnier (at least to me) because there is no reason to lose your exhumer if you are actively playing the game but we are killing dozens of them every day because people are either afk or fit for maximum yield and no tank. The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet. |
Jenshae Chiroptera
150
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 03:35:00 -
[35] - Quote
Well can link this around. Part of the problem might be that they don't come on forums and such. Ideas & stuff No matter the changes, high sec people chose the safests. Lots of stick and they will leave. Half the problem is the players in null sec; we do not want to be there with you. |
Corina Jarr
Spazzoid Enterprises Purpose Built
20
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 03:38:00 -
[36] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Well can link this around. Part of the problem might be that they don't come on forums and such. That is a part. But.... when Hulkaggeddon was on, I would go and warn miners of systems that were going to get hit (the planned ones I knew of at least), then stick around and watch as many of them stayed. And died. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
1020
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 03:39:00 -
[37] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Well can link this around. Part of the problem might be that they don't come on forums and such.
If miners, as a class, were the kind of people who'd take that kind of advice, then there wouldn't be events like Hulkageddon or Ice Interdiction in the first place. Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
VaMei
Meafi Corp
65
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 03:46:00 -
[38] - Quote
Ladie Harlot wrote:...or fit for maximum yield and no tank.
What I've never understood is why someone would choose to fly a Hulk over a Covetor in a mining OP and NOT fit it for yield.
If you have someone else to haul for you the Hulk's cargo bay is renderd moot, and if you don't fit 2 MLUs you only out mine a Covetor with 1 MLU by 3% with Exhumer-IV and by 6% with Exhumer-V. To get that 3-6% yield bump you pay 12 times the price for your ship. That price tag is only the real reason you worry about tanking your Hulk in the 1st place.
Have you ever done the math to see how a Covetor and a Hulk do side in by side in terms of profit/hr? I did and it was insane. When you consider that you need to pay off your ship before you can actually claim profits, it takes a LONG time for the Hulk to actually pay for itself and then catch up with the profit that the Covetor was banking after the 1st or 2nd hour of mining.
If you think there's enough risk of loosing your ship that you need to tank it, you'll do as well to just use a Covetor and keep the other 184Misk safe in your wallet. |
Ladie Harlot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
744
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 03:51:00 -
[39] - Quote
VaMei wrote:What I've never understood is why someone would choose to fly a Hulk over a Covetor in a mining OP and NOT fit it for yield. For the people we're talking about the yield is everything. Hulks (or mackinaws for ice) have the potential to mine more per cycle than a coveter and, for them, that's the only thing that matters.
The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet. |
Corina Jarr
Spazzoid Enterprises Purpose Built
20
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 03:52:00 -
[40] - Quote
VaMei wrote:Ladie Harlot wrote:...or fit for maximum yield and no tank. What I've never understood is why someone would choose to fly a Hulk over a Covetor in a mining OP and NOT fit it for yield. If you have someone else to haul for you the Hulk's cargo bay is renderd moot, and if you don't fit 2 MLUs you only out mine a Covetor with 1 MLU by 3% with Exhumer-IV and by 6% with Exhumer-V. To get that 3-6% yield bump you pay 12 times the price for your ship. That price tag is only the real reason you worry about tanking your Hulk in the 1st place. Have you ever done the math to see how a Covetor and a Hulk do side in by side in terms of profit/hr? I did and it was insane. When you consider that you need to pay off your ship before you can actually claim profits, it takes a LONG time for the Hulk to actually pay for itself and then catch up with the profit that the Covetor was banking after the 1st or 2nd hour of mining. If you think there's enough risk of loosing your ship that you need to tank it, you'll do as well to just use a Covetor and keep the other 184Misk safe in your wallet. Those 2 (or 3 with t1) rig slots can be quite useful for the tank.
If I get lucky on the resists, I can shield tank a non nueting cruiser (t1 and it does depend on the cruiser) for eternity... and Concord doesn't take that long. For a non combat ship, fitted for max yield, thats pretty good. |
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Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
1022
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 03:53:00 -
[41] - Quote
VaMei wrote:Ladie Harlot wrote:...or fit for maximum yield and no tank. What I've never understood is why someone would choose to fly a Hulk over a Covetor in a mining OP and NOT fit it for yield. If you have someone else to haul for you the Hulk's cargo bay is renderd moot, and if you only fit 1 MLU you out mine a Covetor with 1 MLU by only 3% with Exhumer-IV and by 6% with Exhumer-V. To get that 3-6% yield bump you pay 12 times the price for your ship. That price tag is only the real reason you worry about tanking your Hulk in the 1st place. Have you ever done the math to see how a Covetor and a Hulk do side in by side in terms of profit/hr? I did and it was insane. When you consider that you need to pay off your ship before you can actually claim profits, it takes a LONG time for the Hulk to actually pay for itself and then catch up with the profit that the Covetor was banking after the 1st or 2nd hour of mining. If you think there's enough risk of loosing your ship that you need to tank it, you'll do as well to just use a Covetor and keep the other 184Misk safe in your wallet.
Once upon a time, long, long ago, people used to mine in 0.0
You could pay off a hulk in an evening because they could tank the belt rats whilst a covetor would die in a fire.
Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
VaMei
Meafi Corp
65
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 03:55:00 -
[42] - Quote
Ladie Harlot wrote:VaMei wrote:What I've never understood is why someone would choose to fly a Hulk over a Covetor in a mining OP and NOT fit it for yield. For the people we're talking about the yield is everything. Hulks (or mackinaws for ice) have the potential to mine more per cycle than a coveter and, for them, that's the only thing that matters.
Yeah, too many people focused on chasing the big numbers, but chasing the wrong numbers; M3/hr rather than isk after cost. |
Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
141
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 04:00:00 -
[43] - Quote
VaMei wrote:Ladie Harlot wrote:VaMei wrote:What I've never understood is why someone would choose to fly a Hulk over a Covetor in a mining OP and NOT fit it for yield. For the people we're talking about the yield is everything. Hulks (or mackinaws for ice) have the potential to mine more per cycle than a coveter and, for them, that's the only thing that matters. Yeah, too many people focused on chasing the big numbers, but chasing the wrong numbers; M3/hr rather than isk after cost.
It's the only thing that can matter because anything less is worse income than the pitiful income with a hulk/mack. We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |
VaMei
Meafi Corp
65
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 04:00:00 -
[44] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Once upon a time, long, long ago, people used to mine in 0.0
You could pay off a hulk in an evening because they could tank the belt rats whilst a covetor would die in a fire.
Those were good days. +100Misk / Hulk hr was good times. I couldn't fly a Hulk back then, but I'd tank the belt rats for the real miners while I mined what I could from my Domi. |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
601
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 04:01:00 -
[45] - Quote
It never ceases to amaze me that even after we've suicide ganked over 1000 Mackinaws, people still believe that they can safely mine ice in high-sec Gallente space. |
Brock Nelson
44
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 04:07:00 -
[46] - Quote
Andski wrote:It never ceases to amaze me that even after we've suicide ganked over 1000 Mackinaws, people still believe that they can safely mine ice in high-sec Gallente space.
Pubbies |
Ladie Harlot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
745
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 04:07:00 -
[47] - Quote
Pubbies never change. The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet. |
Krios Ahzek
Juvenis Iratus
34
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 04:14:00 -
[48] - Quote
Andski wrote:It never ceases to amaze me that even after we've suicide ganked over 1000 Mackinaws, people still believe that they can safely mine ice in high-sec Gallente space.
If for some arcane reason they manage to succeed... Profits are doubled thanks to your efforts. Someone ninja-mining in a covetor might just make money. The hero you're stuck with anyways. |
Jenshae Chiroptera
150
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 04:17:00 -
[49] - Quote
Krios Ahzek wrote:Andski wrote:It never ceases to amaze me that even after we've suicide ganked over 1000 Mackinaws, people still believe that they can safely mine ice in high-sec Gallente space. If for some arcane reason they manage to succeed... Profits are doubled thanks to your efforts. Someone ninja-mining in a covetor might just make money.
Goons might be helping to remove high sec bots and make that ice more profitable for other pilots Ideas & stuff No matter the changes, high sec people chose the safests. Lots of stick and they will leave. Half the problem is the players in null sec; we do not want to be there with you. |
Krios Ahzek
Juvenis Iratus
34
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 04:23:00 -
[50] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Krios Ahzek wrote:Andski wrote:It never ceases to amaze me that even after we've suicide ganked over 1000 Mackinaws, people still believe that they can safely mine ice in high-sec Gallente space. If for some arcane reason they manage to succeed... Profits are doubled thanks to your efforts. Someone ninja-mining in a covetor might just make money. Goons might be helping to remove high sec bots and make that ice more profitable for other pilots
Well actually with doubled prices you'll get as much mining in a covetor as you would get with a mack with normal prices. The hero you're stuck with anyways. |
|
Scrapyard Bob
EVE University Ivy League
322
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 04:36:00 -
[51] - Quote
Krios Ahzek wrote: Well actually with doubled prices you'll get as much mining in a covetor as you would get with a mack with normal prices.
Mack, max-skill, no-tank - 49.5 blocks/hr Mack, tanked - 45/hr Hulk, no tank - 41/hr Hulk, tanked - 37/hr Covetor, no-tank - 31.6/hr Cove, tanked 28.8/hr
So yes, about that. |
Jenshae Chiroptera
152
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 18:48:00 -
[52] - Quote
Very tempting, just for the sake of screwing with Goons. Ideas & stuff No matter the changes, high sec people chose the safests. Lots of stick and they will leave. Half the problem is the players in null sec; we do not want to be there with you. |
Ptraci
3 R Corporation
82
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 01:21:00 -
[53] - Quote
Destiny Corrupted wrote: they will instead play victim in order to get CCP to capitulate,
You know, when the goons are claiming Mackinaw kills in the thousands, miners aren't "playing" victim, they are the victim. But I bet you think that girl in the short mini-skirt and tube top was just begging to be raped, too. Amirite?
Anyway 'nuff said, wouldn't want you to think I was crying. 250k ice is real nice, and I haven't lost a ship since this "interdiction" started. |
Ladie Harlot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
848
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 01:23:00 -
[54] - Quote
Ptraci wrote:But I bet you think that girl in the short mini-skirt and tube top was just begging to be raped, too. Amirite? Because getting your pixel ship blown up in a video game is just like getting raped in real life right?
You are loathsome. The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet. |
sYnc Vir
Wolfsbrigade
29
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 02:01:00 -
[55] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Vigdis Thorisdottir wrote:... Play and pay attention to your game and it's easy to not get ganked. Mining too boring to justify your attention? Then maybe that means it's a good time to try X-ing up when I'm trying to form a combat fleet.
/rant I can't mine with 100% attention and I do most of my mining in worm holes. The best I can do is semi-AFK, where I have two screens, I read on one, click D-scan on the other and glance across from time to time. What if mining were something like the old asteroids game, where you used your mining lasers to blow the crap out of asteroids until they're in small enough pieces to scoop up into your mining ship's gaping maw by actively flying it to do so? zapzapzap! omnomnom! Mining becomes an active-piloting activity involving real player skill. Miners pay attention and get ganked less. It becomes way harder to multibox efficiently, so mineral prices rise, capitals become expensive again, people actually care about T1 hull prices. A low denomination Interbus postage stamp is issued with my face on it. Everybody is happy.
Multibox miners cant play mini games, and they are the only ones that actually sit at their damn screens to mine.
Remove active tank mods, see how many people afk mine if they cant tank the rats because all their drones got killed first. |
Ptraci
3 R Corporation
82
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 02:04:00 -
[56] - Quote
Ladie Harlot wrote:Ptraci wrote:But I bet you think that girl in the short mini-skirt and tube top was just begging to be raped, too. Amirite? Because getting your pixel ship blown up in a video game is just like getting raped in real life right? You are loathsome.
Yes I am loathsome, because all analogies are meant to be taken seriously. A fictional girl getting raped is about as devastating as a fictional person getting blown up. Besides, stop focusing on the girl. No one has been raped. She's not real. The point was about the poster's attitude. Troll harder. |
Corina Jarr
Spazzoid Enterprises Purpose Built
27
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 02:04:00 -
[57] - Quote
Quote:Multibox miners cant play mini games, and they are the only ones that actually sit at their damn screens to mine. Incorrect. I always mine at my computer, never afk (unless I need a restroom break). And I only have one account, so multiboxing would be rather hard. |
Corina Jarr
Spazzoid Enterprises Purpose Built
27
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 02:08:00 -
[58] - Quote
Ptraci wrote:Ladie Harlot wrote:Ptraci wrote:But I bet you think that girl in the short mini-skirt and tube top was just begging to be raped, too. Amirite? Because getting your pixel ship blown up in a video game is just like getting raped in real life right? You are loathsome. Yes I am loathsome, because all analogies are meant to be taken seriously. A fictional girl getting raped is about as devastating as a fictional person getting blown up. Besides, stop focusing on the girl. No one has been raped. She's not real. The point was about the poster's attitude. Troll harder. The analogy is a fail anyway.
A closer one would be this.
A girl in a skimpy outfit is walking down the street and sees a bar. The sign over the bar says, "Girls wearing skimpy outfits will be raped here." But she doesn't read it and goes in. If she gets raped, it is 100% (ok, maybe 99) her fault. Still punish the rapist, but she would get no sympathy from me.
This is pretty much the exact thing that is happening.
Except I will have a little sympathy for the miner the first time they get ganked. After that though... |
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
106
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 02:09:00 -
[59] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Vigdis Thorisdottir wrote:... Play and pay attention to your game and it's easy to not get ganked. Mining too boring to justify your attention? Then maybe that means it's a good time to try X-ing up when I'm trying to form a combat fleet.
/rant I can't mine with 100% attention and I do most of my mining in worm holes. The best I can do is semi-AFK, where I have two screens, I read on one, click D-scan on the other and glance across from time to time. What if mining were something like the old asteroids game, where you used your mining lasers to blow the crap out of asteroids until they're in small enough pieces to scoop up into your mining ship's gaping maw by actively flying it to do so? zapzapzap! omnomnom! Mining becomes an active-piloting activity involving real player skill. Miners pay attention and get ganked less. It becomes way harder to multibox efficiently, so mineral prices rise, capitals become expensive again, people actually care about T1 hull prices. A low denomination Interbus postage stamp is issued with my face on it. Everybody is happy.
Do this and combine with the archeological side of exploration where artifacts and ancient sites pop up in the rocks and we have a winner here.
How many people - especially you old farts here - played Asteroids for HOURS in the arcades and the Atari 2600 during its reign?
Heck in many ways in EvE the appearance of belt rats is like the appearance of that UFO in Asteroids. I wonder if the original EvE devs were giving a nod to Asteroids when they thought of belt rats.
|
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
106
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 02:11:00 -
[60] - Quote
Ladie Harlot wrote:Ptraci wrote:But I bet you think that girl in the short mini-skirt and tube top was just begging to be raped, too. Amirite? Because getting your pixel ship blown up in a video game is just like getting raped in real life right? You are loathsome.
Probably not butt there is hurt all the same.
Sorry, couldn't help it.
|
|
Renan Ruivo
Hipernova Vera Cruz Alliance
302
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 02:13:00 -
[61] - Quote
Would be really fun if the "carebear" afk miners were to suddenly stop mining... Rated ARG for Pirates. **** you. |
Ladie Harlot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
852
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 02:14:00 -
[62] - Quote
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:Ladie Harlot wrote:Ptraci wrote:But I bet you think that girl in the short mini-skirt and tube top was just begging to be raped, too. Amirite? Because getting your pixel ship blown up in a video game is just like getting raped in real life right? You are loathsome. Probably not butt there is hurt all the same. Sorry, couldn't help it. It's really not funny. Trying to equate video game violence with real world rap.e is disgusting. The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet. |
P42ALPHA
nul-li-fy RED.OverLord
20
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 02:25:00 -
[63] - Quote
LOLLOLOLLOLLOLOLOLOLOL
|
Renan Ruivo
Hipernova Vera Cruz Alliance
302
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 02:26:00 -
[64] - Quote
P42ALPHA wrote:LOLLOLOLLOLLOLOLOLOLOL
LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL Rated ARG for Pirates. **** you. |
Ludi Burek
The Player Haters Corp
5
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 02:36:00 -
[65] - Quote
So I did some mackinaw ganking in the trusty catalyst few jumps out of jita the other day. Yes, for Lols! Does it make you mad?
The thing is, I'm gonna reveal something absolutely amazing here.....
wait for it....
For every mackinaw killed I had to skip about 5 on average because they were too tanky for me? You see that? That's your intervention right there lol
Also, it's hilarious how these "real players" allow a frig to move around the belt scanning one by one, no one flinching or saying anything or warping out. Even when being ganked none were pointed or even attempted to move. Some even continued to pod mine for a while.
These are either some really dumb people, or you know, the other thing that shall not be named. Seriously, you are campaigning to protect this kind of "player"?
I will say with 100% certainty, every whiner here is a serial afk miner, a bot owner, or just trolling. |
K Suri
Red Gooey Bananas
29
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 02:38:00 -
[66] - Quote
Ladie Harlot wrote:Ptraci wrote:But I bet you think that girl in the short mini-skirt and tube top was just begging to be raped, too. Amirite? Because getting your pixel ship blown up in a video game is just like getting raped in real life right? You are loathsome. You're just jealous 'cos no-one WOULD **** you Harlot. Probably better off in a short mini-skirt and a tube-top because buck naked would just scare them off. |
Renan Ruivo
Hipernova Vera Cruz Alliance
303
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 02:40:00 -
[67] - Quote
If you want to AFK mine, fit a mining laser to an It MKV, tank it up and leave it there till dt. Rated ARG for Pirates. **** you. |
Corina Jarr
Spazzoid Enterprises Purpose Built
27
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 02:41:00 -
[68] - Quote
Renan Ruivo wrote:If you want to AFK mine, fit a mining laser to an It MKV, tank it up and leave it there till dt. Oh dear... I remember my noob days, doing that.... |
Renan Ruivo
Hipernova Vera Cruz Alliance
303
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 02:41:00 -
[69] - Quote
K Suri wrote:Ladie Harlot wrote:Ptraci wrote:But I bet you think that girl in the short mini-skirt and tube top was just begging to be raped, too. Amirite? Because getting your pixel ship blown up in a video game is just like getting raped in real life right? You are loathsome. You're just jealous 'cos no-one WOULD **** you Harlot. Probably better off in a short mini-skirt and a tube-top because buck naked would just scare them off.
No-one would **** you either. You look like a she-male. Rated ARG for Pirates. **** you. |
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
421
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 02:51:00 -
[70] - Quote
Harlot you might want to get on the pipe to some corpies that actually play the game. I've been watching (OK, AFK cloak with the sound turned up) Triton Industries pulling Gallente Ice for the last two hours.
I'm getting an itchy salvage finger here. Less blather, more gank.
Mr Epeen If you can read this, you haven't blocked me yet. |
|
Ladie Harlot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
857
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 02:54:00 -
[71] - Quote
Mr Epeen wrote:Harlot you might want to get on the pipe to some corpies that actually play the game. I've been watching (OK, AFK cloak with the sound turned up) Triton Industries pulling Gallente Ice for the last two hours. I'm getting an itchy salvage finger here. Less blather, more gank. Mr Epeen I guess you still haven't checked the price of oxygen isotopes. Just because we're allowing a mackinaw or two to mine ice doesn't mean it ever makes it out of the system. Sorry to disappoint you.
The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet. |
Jenshae Chiroptera
154
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 11:31:00 -
[72] - Quote
Ladie Harlot wrote:Ladie Harlot wrote:Ptraci wrote:But I bet you think that girl in the short mini-skirt and tube top was just begging to be raped, too. Amirite? ... video game is just like ...t? It's really not funny. Trying to equate video game violence with real world rap.e is disgusting.
I get it. They are just saying that those people probably have that sort of mentality. Ideas & stuff No matter the changes, high sec people chose the safests. Lots of stick and they will leave. Half the problem is the players in null sec; we do not want to be there with you. |
Sirane Elrek
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
17
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 12:20:00 -
[73] - Quote
Mr Epeen wrote:Harlot you might want to get on the pipe to some corpies that actually play the game. I've been watching (OK, AFK cloak with the sound turned up) Triton Industries pulling Gallente Ice for the last two hours.
I'm getting an itchy salvage finger here. Less blather, more gank. Those guys have bought a mining license, so Goonswarm isn't going to **** with them. |
Mr Bill Bravor
State War Academy Caldari State
1
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 12:25:00 -
[74] - Quote
Miners and Traders have something in common in that even though other people are doing it around them they really wish they would just go away or in the miners case get ganked. The miners that do have techniques that keep them safe do not share them just as traders don't share their routes.
When we are ganked it is just figured in the cost of business, definitely not something to whine about on the forums.
|
Ptraci
3 R Corporation
82
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 12:27:00 -
[75] - Quote
Ladie Harlot wrote:Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:Ladie Harlot wrote:Ptraci wrote:But I bet you think that girl in the short mini-skirt and tube top was just begging to be raped, too. Amirite? Because getting your pixel ship blown up in a video game is just like getting raped in real life right? You are loathsome. Probably not butt there is hurt all the same. Sorry, couldn't help it. It's really not funny. Trying to equate video game violence with real world rap.e is disgusting.
Yes but no matter how hard you try, you cannot turn me into a rapist by alluding that one is worse than the other. If you have a valid point about raep to make go right ahead, but using a strawman argument to try to turn me into something I'm not is just stupid.
Sounds like someone needs to chill. |
Stella Dust
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 12:27:00 -
[76] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Mortis vonShadow wrote:I thought ... Please try to keep your comments on topic, thanks.
Actually I thought he was on topic, as he's taken the information you've given in another thread you started and applied it to this thread (that you also started) which it is also relevant to.
Your answer to him suggests you're making threads for the sole purpose of trolling them. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
1048
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 13:06:00 -
[77] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Ladie Harlot wrote:Ladie Harlot wrote:Ptraci wrote:But I bet you think that girl in the short mini-skirt and tube top was just begging to be raped, too. Amirite? ... video game is just like ...t? It's really not funny. Trying to equate video game violence with real world rap.e is disgusting. I get it. They are just saying that those people probably have that sort of mentality.
Doom II caused Columbine c/d? Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
1371
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 13:12:00 -
[78] - Quote
Can the miner ganking be stopped now without intervention from CCP?
Yes. Invade goon space. They'll be far too busy to gank some pointless miners. GÇöGÇöGÇö GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥ GÇö Karath Piki-á |
Ptraci
3 R Corporation
82
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 13:32:00 -
[79] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Can the miner ganking be stopped now without intervention from CCP?
Yes. Invade goon space. They'll be far too busy to gank some pointless miners.
Offering the services of my Widow and covert cyno alt if anyone feels like making a black ops run on good intel. |
Eternus8lux8lucis
Whack-A-Mole
3
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 13:42:00 -
[80] - Quote
Flat out no. Itll end when people no longer want to do it or its not profitable or theres no lolz in it anymore. Will the Ice Interdiction end? Yes, but the when is left up to the Goons and possibly those copycatters willing to continue the practice.
For CCP to intervene to stop it theyd break mining, break highsec and have sealed their fate regarding the use of bots in high sec for all activities.
Whoevers got the Mackinaw bpos in Goons is making a killing atm along while driving up ice prices as an ancillary benefit. Just like Helicity Boson who I am entirely certain owns a hulk bpo has made hulkaggedon a yearly staple to drive sales. |
|
Imryn Xaran
Coherent Light Enterprises
2
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 13:51:00 -
[81] - Quote
Destiny Corrupted wrote:Miners have been able to mitigate ganking since ganking was discovered. However, because it's much easier to get a free ride, they will instead play victim in order to get CCP to capitulate, and do their job for them. Considering the direction the game has been heading in, it's much more favorable for miners to not look after their own safety. Mama bear will be there to make the mean wolves go away.
Unfortunately, the carebears grossly underestimate how motivated hungry wolves become. Safety is a concept most fleeting, while they still roam the forest.
I have quoted Destiny here but what I am going to say is a response to any number of players who have made similar comments.
If I was Hilmar and I was reading this I would think "Ok so no matter how hard we make it the suicide gankers will continue to do their thing? And continue to pay me their lovely subs for me to spend on Dust? Great, lets throw a bone to the crybaby miners just to make sure they don't un-sub and move on."
Just saying, if you want people to take your point of view seriously you probably shouldn't be saying that you will continue to pay and play no matter what they do. |
Rhinanna
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
64
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 14:00:00 -
[82] - Quote
VaMei wrote:Jenshae Chiroptera wrote: Align to a safe point. Are you suggesting that passive alignment actually does anything in Eve? Or, are you suggesting that a ship with an active align speed of 75m/s, and that needs to be w/in 10km of its target for 290s with max skills (over 640 with min) can actually do its job? Either way... Here's your sign.
Well assuming that you have no ability to improvise shortly, at minimum that gives you 266s between 'out of range' points along that line.
Of course when you are approaching 'out of range' you can also turn round and face the other one so you never go out of range. -The sword is only as sharp as the one who wields it! Other names: Drenzul (WoT, WoW, Lineage 2, WarH, BloodBowl, BSG, SC2 and lots more)-á |
Jenshae Chiroptera
154
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 14:00:00 -
[83] - Quote
Eternus8lux8lucis wrote:... Whoevers got the Mackinaw bpos in Goons is making a killing atm along while driving up ice prices as an ancillary benefit. Just like Helicity Boson who I am entirely certain owns a hulk bpo has made hulkaggedon a yearly staple to drive sales.
There is no BPO for a Mackinaw; they are T2
Ideas & stuff No matter the changes, high sec people chose the safests. Lots of stick and they will leave. Half the problem is the players in null sec; we do not want to be there with you. |
Eternus8lux8lucis
Whack-A-Mole
3
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 14:19:00 -
[84] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Eternus8lux8lucis wrote:... Whoevers got the Mackinaw bpos in Goons is making a killing atm along while driving up ice prices as an ancillary benefit. Just like Helicity Boson who I am entirely certain owns a hulk bpo has made hulkaggedon a yearly staple to drive sales. There is no BPO for a Mackinaw; they are T2 Macks and Hulks were released with RMR (2005) and the bpo lottery was changed to invention in Revelations (2006) one year later. This would have given enough time for people to get a hulk or mackinaw bpo by the old lottery system. Its possible but not guaranteed that anyone actually got one during that time period. But if you ask me that would provide the perfect cover to get rid of HUGE stockpiles of these ships through these events and make enormous amounts of isk in the process. And Helicity runs it yearly.
Just me pondering reasons for in game events. |
|
CCP Phantom
C C P C C P Alliance
143
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 14:38:00 -
[85] - Quote
Off topic posts removed, please stay on topic and polite. CCP Phantom - German Community Coordinator |
|
Stella Dust
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
5
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 15:18:00 -
[86] - Quote
Eternus8lux8lucis wrote:Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Eternus8lux8lucis wrote:... Whoevers got the Mackinaw bpos in Goons is making a killing atm along while driving up ice prices as an ancillary benefit. Just like Helicity Boson who I am entirely certain owns a hulk bpo has made hulkaggedon a yearly staple to drive sales. There is no BPO for a Mackinaw; they are T2 Macks and Hulks were released with RMR (2005) and the bpo lottery was changed to invention in Revelations (2006) one year later. This would have given enough time for people to get a hulk or mackinaw bpo by the old lottery system. Its possible but not guaranteed that anyone actually got one during that time period. But if you ask me that would provide the perfect cover to get rid of HUGE stockpiles of these ships through these events and make enormous amounts of isk in the process. And Helicity runs it yearly. Just me pondering reasons for in game events.
Goons v's TEST, that would be an ingame event, Hulkageddon is nothing more than a turkey shoot. |
Eternus8lux8lucis
Whack-A-Mole
5
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 15:29:00 -
[87] - Quote
Stella Dust wrote:
Goons v's TEST, that would be an ingame event, Hulkageddon is nothing more than a turkey shoot.
Seems I just got hit by the "lose your post feature"
Tbh its good economics. Freighters, orcas, mining barges and industrial ships that do not venture out of high sec have such a low chance if any at all of dying. The profit margins of producing these ships drops as the market saturation increases until only new players skilling into the ships are the only new buyers making the bpos and production of these ships almost worthless. To spur market dynamics events such as Hulkaggedon and the Ice Interdiction not only increase demand but also boost prices on these ships. Allowing the bpo holders and producers to again make a profit off the ships other than just turning minerals into a ship and reselling minerals in that formula.
Imo there should be more events like Hulkaggedon for Frieghters and larger ship classes and Hulkaggedon should run twice a year.
Before you scream about the miners and poor sods who are innocently ganked just remember that as a producer and Industrialist for many years in Eve its necessary when there is no decay effect. Or else you reach a point where you dont need to produce. |
Jenshae Chiroptera
156
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 15:50:00 -
[88] - Quote
Eternus8lux8lucis wrote:[... ganked ... and Industrialist for many years in Eve its necessary when there is no decay effect. Or else you reach a point where you dont need to produce.
I don't know what you are smoking but for profit ganking goes on all the time in high sec. Miners get can flipped.
Besides that, there is null, low and worm hole space 3/4 parts of space where they are not safe. Why is there so little mining in those places? Ideas and CSM stuff No matter the changes, high sec people chose the safests. Lots of stick and they will leave. Half the problem is the players in null sec; we do not want to be there with you. |
Stella Dust
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
5
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Posted - 2011.11.10 15:53:00 -
[89] - Quote
Eternus8lux8lucis wrote:Stella Dust wrote:
Goons v's TEST, that would be an ingame event, Hulkageddon is nothing more than a turkey shoot.
Seems I just got hit by the "lose your post feature" Tbh its good economics. Freighters, orcas, mining barges and industrial ships that do not venture out of high sec have such a low chance if any at all of dying. The profit margins of producing these ships drops as the market saturation increases until only new players skilling into the ships are the only new buyers making the bpos and production of these ships almost worthless. To spur market dynamics events such as Hulkaggedon and the Ice Interdiction not only increase demand but also boost prices on these ships. Allowing the bpo holders and producers to again make a profit off the ships other than just turning minerals into a ship and reselling minerals in that formula. Imo there should be more events like Hulkaggedon for Frieghters and larger ship classes and Hulkaggedon should run twice a year. Before you scream about the miners and poor sods who are innocently ganked just remember that as a producer and Industrialist for many years in Eve its necessary when there is no decay effect. Or else you reach a point where you dont need to produce.
All well and good, but I do wonder if it's the right targets. They have to mine a lot of ore to be able to buy a Hulk in the first place, would be much better to just have more wars. Problem is the larger corps don't seem to like wars (as such) anymore as it can weaken them, so they resort to hitting weaker targets. |
AureoLion
Etoilles Mortant Ltd. Solyaris Chtonium
22
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 15:53:00 -
[90] - Quote
You've got mids. Don't use them to tank, use them to web. spiderweb your barges, and enjoy being able to be hard aligned at 10 m/s. |
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Eternus8lux8lucis
Whack-A-Mole
6
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 16:06:00 -
[91] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Eternus8lux8lucis wrote:[... ganked ... and Industrialist for many years in Eve its necessary when there is no decay effect. Or else you reach a point where you dont need to produce. I don't know what you are smoking but for profit ganking goes on all the time in high sec. Miners get can flipped. Besides that, there is null, low and worm hole space 3/4 parts of space where they are not safe. Why is there so little mining in those places?
Id suggest you go reread my post again as you have absolutely no clue what I just wrote or said. |
Jenshae Chiroptera
156
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 20:10:00 -
[92] - Quote
Eternus8lux8lucis wrote:... Id suggest you go reread my post again as you have absolutely no clue what I just wrote or said. Yeah. Yeah. Ship destruction drives the economy, the usual thing.
Wars and picking on the little guys, mercs, they take their toll of miners. Takes a few before people wake up. Hulk only makes about 22M a day. There is more than enough ships being destroyed to create enough demand for the ore that miners produce.
I really don't see what the problem is. Ideas and CSM stuff No matter the changes, high sec people chose the safests. Lots of stick and they will leave. Half the problem is the players in null sec; we do not want to be there with you. |
Zowie Powers
Hole in the wall
9
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 20:22:00 -
[93] - Quote
If miner ganks are a problem, then they should cry harder on the forums. NuCCP will protect them. |
Eternus8lux8lucis
Whack-A-Mole
6
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 21:29:00 -
[94] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Eternus8lux8lucis wrote:... Id suggest you go reread my post again as you have absolutely no clue what I just wrote or said. Yeah. Yeah. Ship destruction drives the economy, the usual thing. Wars and picking on the little guys, mercs, they take their toll of miners. Takes a few before people wake up. Hulk only makes about 22M a day. There is more than enough ships being destroyed to create enough demand for the ore that miners produce. I really don't see what the problem is. Actually Im specifically speaking of the destruction of industrial ships to rebuild the resale markets on these classes of ships and nothing else. As if there was no ganking of industrial ships at all in the eve world, especially in high sec, you would effectively NEVER have to buy another ship and keep that ship forever as theres no decay. This means that ALL the high sec industrial ship owners will NEVER buy another ship EVER again. This means lower prices and profit margins of those selling those ships over the long run. Hence any bpo or inventor is going to need to create artificial demand for their products... aka suiciding or large scale hulkaggedons to increase demand. Effectively creating a much needed demand for their supply using in game mechanics.
This is smart economics through warfare. If isk is all I care about then Ill make it even if it hurts you, them or the little guy. As long as my bottom line is improved then its all good. This is the way business really works anyway in RL as well. Its not the ore that they want to create a demand for its the ships of that ship class. And if you cannot see that then you are blind. And if you do this on a large enough level you create a huge demand vacuum that you can fill nicely. Welcome to Eve in the year 2011. |
Eternus8lux8lucis
Whack-A-Mole
6
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 21:40:00 -
[95] - Quote
Stella Dust wrote:
All well and good, but I do wonder if it's the right targets. They have to mine a lot of ore to be able to buy a Hulk in the first place, would be much better to just have more wars. Problem is the larger corps don't seem to like wars (as such) anymore as it can weaken them, so they resort to hitting weaker targets.
Miners that do not PvP or care about PvPing only create isk and wealth and do not spend it on anything of any consequence but more things to acquire more wealth. Its like being "farmer rich".... I didnt make anything last year on my crops because I spent it all on a new tractor and barns. So the reality is that the only way they arent just increasing your wallets forever with the same ships or modules is by the destruction of said ships and modules in some way. And seeing as the high sec denizens will never go to low or null to do so in any meaningful way or put their ships in harms way for any good reason by staying in high sec if someone wishes to create demand for those products they must create it artificially.
When you get metaminers running multiple accounts, something I did in high sec for many years, you simply build up a wallet and have absolutely no new expenses or losses to speak of. Once a ship is bought and fitted out its never lost to anything or for any reason. Its simply a means to make more isk. A tool that never breaks, wears out or needs to be replaced. So once you max out your skills and your ships, implants and modules for max yield there is no really good reason for you to ever lose that in high sec other than the suicide gank or being stupid and being war decced, something evaded by having all your alts in NPC corps, etc. So from first hand knowledge I am well aware that whether someone is a botter or not they are simply making isk in a virtually risk free method forever.
So if I wanted to as a large alliance create a wealth source thats untouchable I would simply create enough accounts and have everyone high sec mine. All in NPC corps. They wouldnt make the top isk per hour in game but would make steady isk with absolutely no risk. You add in bots and botting to the equation and suddenly you have high sec perforated with mining bots with absolutely no risk. Voila you have the current Eve setup.
Along comes the suicide ganker. No longer risk free for anyone. |
Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
47
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 21:50:00 -
[96] - Quote
Ladie Harlot wrote:Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Okay, just to cover the bases, let us run through the general tips for mining in dangerous areas.
- Tank up - implants, CPU rigs, Damage Control, et cetera.
- Carry drones - ECM if they haven't been nerfed yet might help.
- Align to a safe point.
- Book mark two points - drift between them along the length of the belt, with "Approach" then if someone arrives, your speed is up to instantly warp away to them.
- D-scan - find a good guide that will help you set up your D-scan. You want to watch it for approaching ships and warp away.
I also suggest you might want to stop looking at your fellow miners as competition but now as compatriots. Make an intelligence channel so that you know what system the gankers are active in, try to put out scouts, start marking them with negative standing so that they have to keep making more alts to get the same results. Then come back and let us know how this goes, so that CCP have some concrete information to act upon. Most miners have zero interest in saving their exhumers from being ganked by following your suggestions. They feel they are entitled to afk mine while doing other things.
And you feel entitled to prove them wrong.
Its all about perspective, neither of you are right. |
tengen san
Triton-TC
2
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 22:22:00 -
[97] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Well can link this around. Part of the problem might be that they don't come on forums and such. If miners, as a class, were the kind of people who'd take that kind of advice, then there wouldn't be events like Hulkageddon or Ice Interdiction in the first place.
This/ The lack of organization. Clobber the belt with a fleet of 50 retrievers, place them along the Ice filed, its 250km long. The expense of 1 hulk buys you around 30 fitted retrieves, modules = two ice harvesters and thatGÇÖs it. Replace every single one the soonest its get ganked would surely air bag the whole Interdiction.
ItGÇÖs the simple bio-strategy of the swarm, simply to organize and implement for a sustained time, but impossible to task, as miners have no organized loyal to their profession.
Advising them to a better fit it just as fruitless, I sell Hulks with a resistance package of 29k, but they will fly on yield anyway.
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tengen san
Triton-TC
2
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 22:35:00 -
[98] - Quote
Ladie Harlot wrote:Mr Epeen wrote:Harlot you might want to get on the pipe to some corpies that actually play the game. I've been watching (OK, AFK cloak with the sound turned up) Triton Industries pulling Gallente Ice for the last two hours. I'm getting an itchy salvage finger here. Less blather, more gank. Mr Epeen I guess you still haven't checked the price of oxygen isotopes. Just because we're allowing a mackinaw or two to mine ice doesn't mean it ever makes it out of the system. Sorry to disappoint you.
Right, but the current pricing of OI is just a hype generated trough the Ice interdiction and bears no economical relevance. Cutting off a mere 6,5% - 7.5% of the overall available resource can't create a shortage justifying a upswing of prices as seen today, not even a 10% -15% could do it.
Hype the market and the lemmings run after it. Question is will it sustain?!
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Kengutsi Akira
Ministry of War Amarr Empire
153
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 23:11:00 -
[99] - Quote
In answer to title: no
moving on https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=255722#post255722
My stance on WiS |
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