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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 7 post(s) |
Sanara Estidal
Pro Synergy
22
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Posted - 2014.03.24 19:16:00 -
[1321] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Salvos Rhoska wrote:Malcanis wrote:In your own special way, like it or not, you've helped strengthen the process just a fraction. Yes. As have you by not running in the next elections. Thanks! There you see, we can agree! Hugs? Malcanis, you should run again. You'll get my 10 votes. |
Sanara Estidal
Pro Synergy
22
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Posted - 2014.03.24 19:18:00 -
[1322] - Quote
Salvos Rhoska wrote:Sanara Estidal wrote:But his views are represented, at last any he makes public or directs at a CSM. Just because the decisions made aren't in favour of his views doesn't mean they aren't represented. You didn't even vote. Why are you even continuing discussing this. Because I have the right to do so. I don't have to stop discussing things just because you've been proven wrong and are sad about it. |
Mario Putzo
Welping and Dunking.
433
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Posted - 2014.03.24 19:25:00 -
[1323] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Mario Putzo wrote:Nah its a 45% nerf EVERYWHERE. Again, it's not a matter of location, but of use case. Quote:It doesn't impact anyone anymore than anyone else. GǪother than that some can trivially compensate for this loss whereas others cannot because their respective use cases differ. Quote:Building 1000 ships in Null or 1000 ships in highsec requires the same costs, they return the same costs if those ships become "useless". GǪand in one case, they don't need the same scale of reconfigurations and have a more ready access to both materials and production services, whereas the other operates on a much larger scale and has less access. Thus the impacts will differ even though the numerical change is the same. Quote:That is why it is a blanket nerf. It impacts EVERY Person in this game, equally. GǪif they use the mechanic to begin with and if we just look at the nerf itself without taking the mechanical application into account.
You can take whatever you want to into account doesn't change anything. A guy building 1K ships in HS loses just as much as a guy making 1K ships in NS if both need to repurpose. Arguing that NS guy needs to repurpose more is subjective. He doesn't HAVE TO. He CHOOSES to.
Neither of them need to reconfigure at all, they can both stick them on market and contracts and let the market do its job. Or they can both bite the bullet and take a loss. This is like the argument yesterday about factoring in JF costs to the bonus NS gets. You don't HAVE TO have a JF. People CHOOSE to have one.
You can't include situational objectiveness into a blanket discussion because it is not a variable when discussing blanket changes. Now if Null was getting a 45% nerf and HS was only getting a 30% nerf then you could discuss the merits of situational change, as it stands within the announcement EVERYONE is getting the same treatment. |
Weaselior
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
6770
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Posted - 2014.03.24 19:29:00 -
[1324] - Quote
Mario Putzo wrote: You can take whatever you want to into account doesn't change anything. A guy building 1K ships in HS loses just as much as a guy making 1K ships in NS if both need to repurpose. Arguing that NS guy needs to repurpose more is subjective. He doesn't HAVE TO. He CHOOSES to.
nope, since to dump a finished product you bring it to jita and the NS guy has much higher transport costs to jita than the HS guy, the inability to reprocess battleships en masse hurts us more than highsec
that said, we lost that already with tiercide so w/e Head of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal Disadvantaged Persons Outreach Division:
"We hire one-half of the working class to kill the other half." |
Weaselior
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
6770
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Posted - 2014.03.24 19:32:00 -
[1325] - Quote
Mario Putzo wrote: You can take whatever you want to into account doesn't change anything. A guy building 1K ships in HS loses just as much as a guy making 1K ships in NS if both need to repurpose. Arguing that NS guy needs to repurpose more is subjective. He doesn't HAVE TO. He CHOOSES to.
Neither of them need to reconfigure at all, they can both stick them on market and contracts and let the market do its job. Or they can both bite the bullet and take a loss. This is like the argument yesterday about factoring in JF costs to the bonus NS gets. You don't HAVE TO have a JF. People CHOOSE to have one.
You can't include situational objectiveness into a blanket discussion because it is not a variable when discussing blanket changes. Now if Null was getting a 45% nerf and HS was only getting a 30% nerf then you could discuss the merits of situational change, as it stands within the announcement EVERYONE is getting the same treatment.
you strike me as the sort of person who doesn't get the joke when people say "The law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich as well as the poor to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal bread" Head of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal Disadvantaged Persons Outreach Division:
"We hire one-half of the working class to kill the other half." |
Sanara Estidal
Pro Synergy
22
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Posted - 2014.03.24 19:35:00 -
[1326] - Quote
Mario Putzo wrote:You can take whatever you want to into account doesn't change anything. A guy building 1K ships in HS loses just as much as a guy making 1K ships in NS if both need to repurpose. Arguing that NS guy needs to repurpose more is subjective. He doesn't HAVE TO. He CHOOSES to.
Neither of them need to reconfigure at all, they can both stick them on market and contracts and let the market do its job. Or they can both bite the bullet and take a loss. This is like the argument yesterday about factoring in JF costs to the bonus NS gets. You don't HAVE TO have a JF. People CHOOSE to have one.
You can't include situational objectiveness into a blanket discussion because it is not a variable when discussing blanket changes. Now if Null was getting a 45% nerf and HS was only getting a 30% nerf then you could discuss the merits of situational change, as it stands within the announcement EVERYONE is getting the same treatment. I'm a HS player and even I can see the glaring issue here. If someone in HS needs to repurpose, he can easily sell the ships. In null, if they changed ships, who's going to buy the spares? |
La Nariz
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1741
|
Posted - 2014.03.24 20:10:00 -
[1327] - Quote
I don't see anywhere in any of the CCP documents that "saying something I don't like in a cordial manner" is against the TOS. Perhaps all of you space lawyers should open a petition and ask a GM about it. Highsec deserves another nerf solely for this abomination of a thread. This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Proof Highsec reward needs to be nerfed: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AqC-BTui2uSGdDlxa2dWOG5ieHB0QXBVWW82bGN5TFE&usp=sharing |
Nick Bete
The Scope Gallente Federation
258
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Posted - 2014.03.24 20:20:00 -
[1328] - Quote
Sanara Estidal wrote: It is your right. So hurry up and leave. If you legitimately feel that is the way you can express your opinion, and you don't think the existing methods of getting your views across to CCP are effective, you are well within your right to leave...
I intend to shill just as soon as I can gather enough others who feel the same to do so as well. Then you, your null zealot pals and your alts can have this travesty of a game.
Leaving will be on my timetable not that of some anonymous internet tough guy. |
BoBoZoBo
Paragon Fury Tactical Narcotics Team
399
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Posted - 2014.03.24 20:32:00 -
[1329] - Quote
It was never logical to be able to reprocess something for the same it was built for to begin with and now they are laying down a platform for making the different security spaces have better intrinsic value.
It's a step in the right direction. Enjoy. Primary Test Subject GÇó SmackTalker Elite |
Batelle
Tymast Industries 150th
2349
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Posted - 2014.03.24 20:49:00 -
[1330] - Quote
Agreed with the above. Reprocessing something for its full mineral value is dumb and has introduced all kinds of problems. Getting rid of it lets CCP fix/improve all sorts of things. Getting into a "these players vs these other players" is missing the point.
Mario Putzo wrote: That is why it is a blanket nerf. It impacts EVERY Person in this game, equally.
Does that even mean anything in a game that is arguably zero-sum such as this one? It clearly directly affects people that rely on reprocessing mods for 100% value. If you don't do that a lot, then at most you'll be indirectly affected by the changes to the manufacturing landscape, prices, etc.
Nick Bete wrote:Sanara Estidal wrote: It is your right. So hurry up and leave. If you legitimately feel that is the way you can express your opinion, and you don't think the existing methods of getting your views across to CCP are effective, you are well within your right to leave...
I intend to shill just as soon as I can gather enough others who feel the same to do so as well. Then you, your null zealot pals and your alts can have this travesty of a game. Leaving will be on my timetable not that of some anonymous internet tough guy.
Comedy gold. "CCP is changing policy, and has asked that we discontinue the bonus credit program after November 7th. So until then, enjoy a super-bonus of 1B Blink Credit for each 60-day GTC you buy!"
Never forget. |
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ISD Ezwal
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
1023
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Posted - 2014.03.24 21:10:00 -
[1331] - Quote
Thread temporarily locked for some thorough cleaning. ISD Ezwal Captain Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department |
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Ralph King-Griffin
Var Foundation inc.
422
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Posted - 2014.03.25 00:59:00 -
[1332] - Quote
and now, the mighty ISD Ezwal shall slumber. i still don't think its that big of a deal. really. (the refining changes i mean) If in doubt...do...excessively. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
3361
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Posted - 2014.03.25 01:04:00 -
[1333] - Quote
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:and now, the mighty ISD Ezwal shall slumber. i still don't think its that big of a deal. really.
Yeah, gotta give him a round of applause on that. 30 pages... Good Lord. Not posting on my main, and loving it.-á Because free speech.-á
Psychotic Monk for CSM9.
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Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
2462
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Posted - 2014.03.25 01:07:00 -
[1334] - Quote
Flashbang Thereal wrote:I tried to read the devblog, but i got completly lost :-/ Im affraid of what this change wil mean for my new alt. Its a industry/mission alt. My gameplay on that alt use alot of reprossesing, due to the fact that i build everything i need for mission/mining. When i unlock lev4 missions, i wil buy a bpc for a mission battleship. Mine all the minerals i need to build it, and reprosess loot from lev3 missions to get the minerals i cant mine in highsec. I have done this from day 1 on this alt grinding rocks for a retriver with the tiny venture, building cruiser and battlecruiser for lev 2/3 missions. Its already hard as f... doing all this. And now ccp wil make it even harder??
Your style of play is now completely unviable. You are faced with at best, 45% of your loot income wiped out. You can thank the null sec cartels, as they strike another blow for the "little guy". Most people viewed Orwell's writings as a warning. The harper regime and the goons treat them as a guidebook. |
Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
2462
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Posted - 2014.03.25 01:11:00 -
[1335] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Ralph King-Griffin wrote:and now, the mighty ISD Ezwal shall slumber. i still don't think its that big of a deal. really. Yeah, gotta give him a round of applause on that. 30 pages... Good Lord.
Why? Most people viewed Orwell's writings as a warning. The harper regime and the goons treat them as a guidebook. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
3361
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Posted - 2014.03.25 01:13:00 -
[1336] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Ralph King-Griffin wrote:and now, the mighty ISD Ezwal shall slumber. i still don't think its that big of a deal. really. Yeah, gotta give him a round of applause on that. 30 pages... Good Lord. Why?
Because it took him a hell of a while to do it? Considering these guys don't get paid, yeah, that deserves some big props. Not posting on my main, and loving it.-á Because free speech.-á
Psychotic Monk for CSM9.
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
20246
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Posted - 2014.03.25 01:15:00 -
[1337] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:Your style of play is now completely unviable. What play style is that? It certainly can't be missions or any other form of ratting, since the mineral content of loot is such an utterly minute part of it. Nor can it be mining since it is tweaked to remain pretty much the same. So you're obviously not talking about his play style, but rather something completely different.
His play style remains largely untouched. He just has to do a bit more mining and a bit less mission-running for his minerals (which is how it should be).
Quote:You are faced with at best, 45% of your loot income wiped out. That just means you can now switch to doing something far more productive and worth-while with your time and actually start earning some proper money. Loot minerals were always fool's gold (and a pretty silly intrusion on mining) and anything that leads people away from it is a good thing
Quote:You can that the null sec cartels Who?
Quote:as they strike another blow for the "little guy". How does this in any way affect the GÇ£little guyGÇ¥ and what makes you think that there are any plans or any goal to strike a blow against them? And who's interested in doing that anyway? GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skill plan 2.1. |
Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
2462
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Posted - 2014.03.25 01:22:00 -
[1338] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Ralph King-Griffin wrote:and now, the mighty ISD Ezwal shall slumber. i still don't think its that big of a deal. really. Yeah, gotta give him a round of applause on that. 30 pages... Good Lord. Why? Because it took him a hell of a while to do it? Considering these guys don't get paid, yeah, that deserves some big props.
Sorry, we are not allowed to discuss moderation, or I would have some very choice words about the intent of this moderation. Most people viewed Orwell's writings as a warning. The harper regime and the goons treat them as a guidebook. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
20246
|
Posted - 2014.03.25 01:24:00 -
[1339] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:Sorry, we are not allowed to discuss moderation, or I would have some very choice words about the intent of this moderation. Such as GÇ£bravoGÇ¥, GÇ£it really needed a clean-upGÇ¥, and GÇ£long time comingGÇ¥? GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skill plan 2.1. |
Marsha Mallow
150
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Posted - 2014.03.25 01:26:00 -
[1340] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:Why? Because it's a tough job shuffling about with a mop and bucket, watching the drivileged talk **** and smear it upon everything they touch. I deliberately took a cleaning job as a teenager and earned my Scrubber certificiate (and badge). Have to say the lower orders were unanimous in agreeing that the overlords should spend at least a year scrubbing toilets, preferably with someone (not their parents) shouting abuse behind them.
Having said that, I for one quote enjoy an Ezwal scrubbing. HANDS UP, ISDS INCOMING etc - |
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Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
3361
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Posted - 2014.03.25 01:32:00 -
[1341] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote: Sorry, we are not allowed to discuss moderation, or I would have some very choice words about the intent of this moderation.
How very odd. Considering what an issue you have with the rumor mongering rule, I would have felt you'd have no issue with "choice words". Not posting on my main, and loving it.-á Because free speech.-á
Psychotic Monk for CSM9.
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Dramaticus
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
486
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Posted - 2014.03.25 01:44:00 -
[1342] - Quote
All those posts lost, like trash in space. The 'do-nothing' member of the GoonSwarm Economic Warfare Cabal
The edge is REALLY hard to see at times but it DOES exist and in this case we were looking at a situation where a new feature created for all of our customers was being virtually curbstomped by five of them |
Sirikar Nakasoroki
Greyskulls
0
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Posted - 2014.03.25 02:16:00 -
[1343] - Quote
Love the logic behind all this..
People don't use current compression methods such as rorqual to transport minerals..CCP's fault.
solution nerf refine on modules to prevent a certain part of the player base using a module in the way its not intended, in this case using modules to compress minerals.
At the same time cut mission runners loot refines by 45% as a knock on effect should they collect the loot, knock on effect will probably be more mission blitzing and possibly a increase in price on salvage materials considering if people won't bother looting in missions they probably won't bother salvaging either, be interesting to see the numbers on how much salvage materials come from high sec mission loot.
instead why not just fix the compression problem with the rorqual and null sec stations, the reprocessing change is not even needed.
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Mario Putzo
Welping and Dunking.
445
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Posted - 2014.03.25 02:38:00 -
[1344] - Quote
wrong thread remove pls |
Muestereate
Minions LLC
202
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Posted - 2014.03.25 02:46:00 -
[1345] - Quote
You had your chance, the ax man's sleeping |
Shizuken
Venerated Stars
220
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Posted - 2014.03.25 03:25:00 -
[1346] - Quote
Sirikar Nakasoroki wrote:Love the logic behind all this..
People don't use current compression methods such as rorqual to transport minerals..CCP's fault.
solution nerf refine on modules to prevent a certain part of the player base using a module in the way its not intended, in this case using modules to compress minerals.
At the same time cut mission runners loot refines by 45% as a knock on effect should they collect the loot, knock on effect will probably be more mission blitzing and possibly a increase in price on salvage materials considering if people won't bother looting in missions they probably won't bother salvaging either, be interesting to see the numbers on how much salvage materials come from high sec mission loot.
instead why not just fix the compression problem with the rorqual and null sec stations, the reprocessing change is not even needed.
Except this isn't the only problem. The other one being fixed is the fact that levels4-5 of all Resource Processing skills are marginally useful.
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Mocam
EVE University Ivy League
431
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Posted - 2014.03.25 03:32:00 -
[1347] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Quote:You are faced with at best, 45% of your loot income wiped out. That just means you can now switch to doing something far more productive and worth-while with your time and actually start earning some proper money. Loot minerals were always fool's gold (and a pretty silly intrusion on mining) and anything that leads people away from it is a good thing
Let me see if I've got this straight...
So this style of game play, reprocessing these assets to resources - which you state is LESS INCOME - takes a hit and this is good?
A large portion of mission runners have been using this reprocessing as a source of income - you state it's a poor source of income. This change will remove it as viable to many... That converts play to clear and blitz styles for pure faucet income.
How is pushing people to stop relying on lesser income sources in highsec over to cookie-cutter, faucet income a good thing for *ANYONE* in the game?
I always assumed more focus on wealth transfer and sinks vs faucet income was a good thing. Silly me.
Yes let's force players to stop wasting their time paying processing and sales fees vs just getting at those bounties and mission payouts! It'll be the best thing for the economy! |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
3363
|
Posted - 2014.03.25 03:48:00 -
[1348] - Quote
Mocam wrote:Tippia wrote:Quote:You are faced with at best, 45% of your loot income wiped out. That just means you can now switch to doing something far more productive and worth-while with your time and actually start earning some proper money. Loot minerals were always fool's gold (and a pretty silly intrusion on mining) and anything that leads people away from it is a good thing Let me see if I've got this straight... So this style of game play, reprocessing these assets to resources - which you state is LESS INCOME - takes a hit and this is good? A large portion of mission runners have been using this reprocessing as a source of income - you state it's a poor source of income. This change will remove it as viable to many... That converts play to clear and blitz styles for pure faucet income. How is pushing people to stop relying on lesser income sources in highsec over to cookie-cutter, faucet income a good thing for *ANYONE* in the game? I always assumed more focus on wealth transfer and sinks vs faucet income was a good thing. Silly me. Yes let's force players to stop wasting their time paying processing and sales fees vs just getting at those bounties and mission payouts! It'll be the best thing for the economy!
Ah, E-Uni posting hasn't changed, it seems.
Firstly, yes, it's a good thing. In fact it's a great thing, because the easy availablity of minerals from loot drops with minimal refining skills pushed out plenty of legit uses for the skill, and in fact made it rather pointless to level up the Refining set of skills up.
Secondly, a tiny minority of people mission precisely this wrong way. They'll be happier just making more money.
Thirdly, yes, this will push them to LP sources of income instead of mineral sources. That is also a good thing, mineral inflation is a bad thing, especially when it just pops up from killing NPCs. That's why they nerfed drone mineral drops, too. This is just an extension of that same policy.
Fourth, it's a good thing for almost everyone, as it helps diversify the industrial landscape. Refining will actually become a thing now. Not posting on my main, and loving it.-á Because free speech.-á
Psychotic Monk for CSM9.
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Mara Pahrdi
The Order of Anoyia
681
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Posted - 2014.03.25 06:02:00 -
[1349] - Quote
ISD Ezwal wrote: Ezwal walks outside for a much needed break and a smoke, gazes at the stars....relaxes.....ah the tranquillity.....
21 pages deleted from 45 .
That break is well deserved . Remove insurance. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
3363
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Posted - 2014.03.25 06:07:00 -
[1350] - Quote
Mara Pahrdi wrote:ISD Ezwal wrote: Ezwal walks outside for a much needed break and a smoke, gazes at the stars....relaxes.....ah the tranquillity.....
21 pages deleted from 45 . That break is well deserved .
45? It was well over 50 when he locked it, I thought? Not posting on my main, and loving it.-á Because free speech.-á
Psychotic Monk for CSM9.
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