Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 30 40 50 60 .. 67 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 7 post(s) |
Tauranon
Weeesearch Greater Western Co-Prosperity Sphere
874
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 14:08:00 -
[1561] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
Yup.
And T1 ship mfg in high sec will be wiped out because of it. The CSM goon posted on the failed lawyer's web site that building a BS will be around 17% cheaper in null than high when you factor in the huge refining efficiency bonus null sec was just handed.
So the null sec cartels will now be able to jump out compressed ore, jump back with 7 BS hulls. mynnna stated on goon Pravda that null sec now has a 25-30M advantage over high sec, per hull. So net profits, worst case scenario, are in the 120-180 M range. round trip.
I think the JFs are just going to go back 1 jump with mins for production line capacity reasons (and profit for JF pilot reasons).
Quote:
Bye bye high sec T1 ship mfg near a major high sec hub.
So not only do mission runners and low skilled miners in high sec get killed, T1 ship manufacturers in high sec are also ruined. (and of couse, so are any capital ship manufacturers in low sec. I used to build Archons, Moros, and Thanatos near Jita, bu those days are over as well.)
nope. Highsec will be fine.
Can see how the cap business in low might be hard. but given you have to move mins in nullsec, moving them to a non-capturable station in low instead, isn't really any different imo. You might actually need to form a business relationship with someone to secure you mins. How terrible would that be.
Quote:
And all this does not even factor in all the other "big changes" coming by June, that at least 3 CSM members have stated are coming. Just like in the real world, in Eve the huge profits and income is in the manufacturing of finished products. The countries that only provide raw materials, and provide no added value, are impoverished.
Australia would be impoverished if we weren't exporting so much iron ore. Should see the wobbles the place gets whenever the price drops. You also have no idea what the changes are.
Quote:
Which is what high sec just became, a provider of raw materials and nothing more.
Oh, and I say that knowing that at the moment, according to the null sec propagandists, null sec does not make T2 products, but provides the raw materials and intermediate products. I expect that T2 manufacturing in high sec will be ruined soon as well with either an outright nerf to high sec, or a massive buff to T2 mfg in null sec, or both.
You have no idea what the changes are.
|
Silvetica Dian
Manson Family Advent of Fate
877
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 17:36:00 -
[1562] - Quote
Scipio Artelius wrote:Xeronikus wrote:Well, this solves all the issues I pointed out for all the other 99.X% of the players who are interested in null space but dislike the current conditions I mentioned earlier. How much of it is real knowledge and how much of it is just assumption though? Not you specifically, just all of us. It's often written on here that gaining sov for a small group is near impossible, but when was the last time one actually tried after looking for a suitable location?
Just FYI we are in the process of trying. It is hard work but we are making ground. Also living in npc null and ratting in sov space owned by people that won't undock with a red in local is super easy. Cloaky camping, running all their sigs and forcing them to constantly batphone their coalition to defend their POCO/POS against a group they heavily outnumber on their own. There numbers drop daily and we own the POS on their TCU in their form up system atm (also their only tech moon).
This isn't buffer we are trying to take though. It is their heartland. Maybe we will never take it but it is fun trying and we are making life hell for their ratters, their pvpers and their miners. We haven't started actually hitting the sov itself yet but it is defacto ours over a large part of the region as they don't dare use it any more.
Anyway ignoring the normal Dinsdale tinfoil i wanted to address the "i tried living in null and hated it thing" npc null corps are usually pvp/ pve hybrids and often have very little CTA /red pen BS and just roam for fun. renter corps tend to have plenty of pve and usually no CTA at all. no one invades proviblock except to have funs. the sov gets left alone. other people are out here solo or in very small groups doing PI, exploration, mining based out of POS's , pirate missions etc There are so many null lifestyle options and trying a big alliance and hating it just means you hate the big alliance lifestyle rather than every version.
Finally if some people stop looting and some move to other space then the price of meta 4 modules (esp guns) will rise offsetting the loss of reprocesing income. Having more people move out of high sec and creating more ecological niches in eve is a good thing. chain running incursions, missions or mining as a playstyle must get old and creating incentives for people to try something more exciting (even if it is doing the same in different space) must be a good thing.
hopefully i will see a few more of you at the far end of my gunsights. Money at its root is a form of rationing. When the richest 85 people have as much wealth as the poorest 3.5 billion (50% of humanity) it is clear where the source of poverty is. http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jan/20/trickle-down-economics-broken-promise-richest-85 |
Hasikan Miallok
Republic University Minmatar Republic
517
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 17:41:00 -
[1563] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:I'm a high sec mission runner and i don't feel screwed by this change. I do feel screwed by this thread though. Less conspiracy, more cowbell I always say.
Eve really does need more cowbell. |
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor Cosmic Consortium
5106
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 20:00:00 -
[1564] - Quote
Lucas Kell wrote:Mara Rinn wrote:The only issue I have with the reprocessing changes is allowing outposts to have a better refine efficiency than POSes. Why would that not be the case? A null outpost costs billions to set up and billions to keep running in sov bills. If a POS could do it better, that would be one hell of a blow, not to mention that it would make wormholes even more lucrative than they already will become. It would also remove the intentional difference they are putting in between null and high, by allowing a POS anywhere to refine at the highest possible rate.
Sure, an outpost costs tens of billions of ISK to set up and upgrade, almost as much as a single titan. The advantage that outpost has in refining efficiency will pay for the entire outpost in a few months of reprocessing. So you can stop crying your crocodile tears right there. Nevermind that outposts can't be destroyed so you'll never actually lose the materials you leave behind when someone captures it (just capture it back, or stay in the outpost so you can ship stuff out). Capturing back an outpost is a whole lot easier than taking back a POS that has been destroyed.
There are different refineries available for low/null which are more efficient than the hi sec ones. You need to read the devblog.
Other advantages that an outpost has over a POS:
- Unlimited storage space
- Many more activity lines
- No fuel
You can't dock a thousand carriers and dreadnoughts at a POS. So the advantages of an outpost are already worth the fees otherwise people wouldn't deploy and upgrade them.
The advantage of unlimited storage space will turn up again when CCP start talking about manufacturing lines.
Day 0 advice for new players: Day 0 Advice for New Players |
Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
2486
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 20:41:00 -
[1565] - Quote
Mara Rinn wrote:Lucas Kell wrote:Mara Rinn wrote:The only issue I have with the reprocessing changes is allowing outposts to have a better refine efficiency than POSes. Why would that not be the case? A null outpost costs billions to set up and billions to keep running in sov bills. If a POS could do it better, that would be one hell of a blow, not to mention that it would make wormholes even more lucrative than they already will become. It would also remove the intentional difference they are putting in between null and high, by allowing a POS anywhere to refine at the highest possible rate. Sure, an outpost costs tens of billions of ISK to set up and upgrade, almost as much as a single titan. The advantage that outpost has in refining efficiency will pay for the entire outpost in a few months of reprocessing. So you can stop crying your crocodile tears right there. Nevermind that outposts can't be destroyed so you'll never actually lose the materials you leave behind when someone captures it (just capture it back, or stay in the outpost so you can ship stuff out). Capturing back an outpost is a whole lot easier than taking back a POS that has been destroyed. There are different refineries available for low/null which are more efficient than the hi sec ones. You need to read the devblog. Other advantages that an outpost has over a POS:
- Unlimited storage space
- Many more activity lines
- No fuel
You can't dock a thousand carriers and dreadnoughts at a POS. So the advantages of an outpost are already worth the fees otherwise people wouldn't deploy and upgrade them. The advantage of unlimited storage space will turn up again when CCP start talking about manufacturing lines.
Talking about manufacturing lines? You mean nerfing the crap out of the quantity of high sec lines, because the same null sec cartels are crying tears over that too.
Most people viewed Orwell's writings as a warning. The harper regime and the goons treat them as a guidebook. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
20300
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 21:24:00 -
[1566] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:Talking about manufacturing lines? You mean nerfing the crap out of the quantity of high sec lines, because the same null sec cartels are crying tears over that too. No. Just reducing the number of free and universally available lines to sensible levels and rewarding those who invest in creating lines of their own and/or increasing the number of lines you get for making those investments. Most likely, both will happen (largely since both need to happen). GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skill plan 2.1. |
Mario Putzo
Welping and Dunking.
820
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 23:08:00 -
[1567] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:Talking about manufacturing lines? You mean nerfing the crap out of the quantity of high sec lines, because the same null sec cartels are crying tears over that too. No. Just reducing the number of free and universally available lines to sensible levels and rewarding those who invest in creating lines of their own and/or increasing the number of lines you get for making those investments. Most likely, both will happen (largely since both need to happen).
Likely you are right, considering that overall production must drop to coincide with the reduction of mineral availability, this would be a perfect time to reduce the "free" lines available to the playerbase. Otherwise without a reduction in production availability, you are going to have a massive bout of market inflation on hand.
|
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
20302
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 23:17:00 -
[1568] - Quote
Mario Putzo wrote:Likely you are right, considering that overall production must drop to coincide with the reduction of mineral availability, this would be a perfect time to reduce the "free" lines available to the playerbase. Otherwise without a reduction in production availability, you are going to have a massive bout of market inflation on hand. Mineral availability isn't being reduced, though, nor would it have any connection with a required reduction in free manufacturing facilities. And either way, reducing those manufacturing lines would certainly not keep any inflation at bay. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skill plan 2.1. |
Mario Putzo
Welping and Dunking.
820
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 23:24:00 -
[1569] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Mario Putzo wrote:Likely you are right, considering that overall production must drop to coincide with the reduction of mineral availability, this would be a perfect time to reduce the "free" lines available to the playerbase. Otherwise without a reduction in production availability, you are going to have a massive bout of market inflation on hand. Mineral availability isn't being reduced, though, nor would it have any connection with a required reduction in free manufacturing facilities. And either way, reducing those manufacturing lines would certainly not keep any inflation at bay.
Oh it most certainly is being touched. Unless you believe all reprocessing will be done in Nullsec from now on (don't make me laugh).
You are either going to have more market competition as "gun miners" go to market to maintain current production. Or you are going to have less production as "gun miners" take 45% longer to gain required production minerals.
You simply CAN NOT, have one without the other. It is mathematically impossible.
Either less production, or more miners.
Or Market inflation.
Im not sure what you and Lucas find so hard about this. Unless of course you really think that Minerals reprocessed from missions/ratting/plexing/PVP Loot never reach the market as raw minerals or as produced goods. Use your head.
And clearly you do not know what market inflation is. |
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor Cosmic Consortium
5108
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 23:31:00 -
[1570] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:Talking about manufacturing lines? You mean nerfing the crap out of the quantity of high sec lines, because the same null sec cartels are crying tears over that too.
I'm a hisec carebear and I've been "crying tears" over the ubiquity and stupidly low costs of hi sec manufacturing lines for quite some time. Anyone who currently has any kind of assembly line in a hi sec POS is doing it wrong. It should not be this way.
Day 0 advice for new players: Day 0 Advice for New Players |
|
Benny Ohu
Beneath the Ashes Margin of Silence
2783
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 23:36:00 -
[1571] - Quote
Mara Rinn wrote:Lucas Kell wrote:Mara Rinn wrote:The only issue I have with the reprocessing changes is allowing outposts to have a better refine efficiency than POSes. words Sure, an outpost costs tens of billions of ISK to set up and upgrade, almost as much as a single titan. The advantage that outpost has in refining efficiency will pay for the entire outpost in a few months of reprocessing. So you can stop crying your crocodile tears right there. Nevermind that outposts can't be destroyed so you'll never actually lose the materials you leave behind when someone captures it (just capture it back, or stay in the outpost so you can ship stuff out). Capturing back an outpost is a whole lot easier than taking back a POS that has been destroyed. I think everyone wants to be able to blow up outposts in the future, and if these changes are on the road to making nullsec more livable and redoing the sov system (I think they are), that's probably the plan. The biggest issue with destructible outposts was over what to do with people's assets left inside.
I think that making outposts useful as more than just as a place to dock is what has to come first, though. I'm hoping that's what's going on. |
Benny Ohu
Beneath the Ashes Margin of Silence
2783
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 23:38:00 -
[1572] - Quote
continuing to draw attention towards our efforts will leave us no choice but to advance our schedule. |
Domanique Altares
Rifterlings Point Blank Alliance
2558
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 23:40:00 -
[1573] - Quote
Benny Ohu wrote:continuing to draw attention towards our efforts will leave us no choice but to advance our schedule.
lol Rifterlings pirate corporation is now recruitng members for lowsec PvP operations. Newbie friendly, free T1 frigate and dessy hangar, solo tutoring and PvP classes for new members. Join our in game channel 'weflyrifters' and speak to a recruiter today. |
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor Cosmic Consortium
5109
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 23:44:00 -
[1574] - Quote
Benny Ohu wrote:I think everyone wants to be able to blow up outposts in the future, and if these changes are on the road to making nullsec more livable and redoing the sov system (I think they are), that's probably the plan. The biggest issue with destructible outposts was over what to do with people's assets left inside.
I think that making outposts useful as more than just as a place to dock is what has to come first, though. I'm hoping that's what's going on.
A destructible outpost is still a lower risk investment than a POS. More hit points to start with, and you'll be facing bigger fleets since outposts are more important to everyone in the alliance.
Outposts already have more value than a POS due to material logistics. When CCP gets around to rebalancing manufacturing lines, you'll see outposts becoming even more valuable simply because you have so much more storage capacity than a POS. Outposts don't need an advantage in game mechanics to support their value. They're already worth everything alliances pay for them, otherwise alliances wouldn't build them.
Day 0 advice for new players: Day 0 Advice for New Players |
Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
2486
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 23:50:00 -
[1575] - Quote
Mara Rinn wrote:Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:Talking about manufacturing lines? You mean nerfing the crap out of the quantity of high sec lines, because the same null sec cartels are crying tears over that too.
I'm a hisec carebear and I've been "crying tears" over the ubiquity and stupidly low costs of hi sec manufacturing lines for quite some time. Anyone who currently has any kind of assembly line in a hi sec POS is doing it wrong. It should not be this way.
So every casual player, who want to convert an LP blueprint into goods, or every non-intense industrialist, they should be gutted?
I love how I see who knows how many null sec cartel propagandists stating flatly that the only way to properly run missions is to blitz them, for LP, and the best bang for your buck is LP based items from 5 run BPC's. Now, we see the other shoe drop when the manufacturing lines these mission runners NEED are removed. Most people viewed Orwell's writings as a warning. The harper regime and the goons treat them as a guidebook. |
Marsha Mallow
151
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 23:53:00 -
[1576] - Quote
Dinsdale, if everyone is indeed a sockpuppet of the nullsec cartels controlled by mind beams from their toasters, how do we know you aren't one of them? How do you? - |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
20302
|
Posted - 2014.03.29 00:00:00 -
[1577] - Quote
Mario Putzo wrote:Oh it most certainly is being touched. Unless you believe all reprocessing will be done in Nullsec from now on (don't make me laugh). Eh. What? You're mixing up a whole lot of different and unrelated things here.
No, mineral availability is not being reduced. It's really as simple as that. Frankly, I'd be surprised if we are even in the double digits as far as percentage of mineral extraction potential goes at the moment. The demand is there and the market will respond; the minerals will be trivially be available in the same quantities as before. Will there be a slight hiccup during the switch-over? Sure. Will it rebound? Of course.
Quote:Im not sure what you and Lucas find so hard about this. Probably the fact that you seem to think it will somehow increase unless the ratio of minerals produced and manufacturing lines available remains the sameGǪ and the fact that you seem to think that, for no particular reason, you assume that mineral availability will go (way) down, in spite of the fact that the change includes measures to ensure that it doesn't and in spite of the massive amounts of surplus ore available in the universe.
The overproduction capacity of the EVE universe is immense. There are ridiculously large margins left untapped at the moment. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skill plan 2.1. |
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor Cosmic Consortium
5109
|
Posted - 2014.03.29 00:02:00 -
[1578] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:So every casual player, who want to convert an LP blueprint into goods, or every non-intense industrialist, they should be gutted?
If you want to convert blueprints into items, specialise in manufacturing. If you don't, why should you be able to manufacture things just as well as the capsuleer with level 5 in the appropriate manufacturing skills?
So yes, you should be losing out on efficiency if you aren't trained to manufacture efficiently. This is not a black and white scenario, you can choose to manufacture at low efficiency and simply take a hit on the profit (who cares how inefficient you are at manufacturing combat scanner probes? the profit comes from the LP side of the sisters combat scanner probes).
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:I love how I see who knows how many null sec cartel propagandists stating flatly that the only way to properly run missions is to blitz them, for LP, and the best bang for your buck is LP based items from 5 run BPC's. Now, we see the other shoe drop when the manufacturing lines these mission runners NEED are removed.
When those manufacturing lines are removed and replaced by POS based manufacturing lines, you'll simply have to buddy up with an industrialist who runs a POS. Ideally CCP will allow us to rent POS based activity lines to people who aren't in our corporation or alliance.
Day 0 advice for new players: Day 0 Advice for New Players |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
20302
|
Posted - 2014.03.29 00:03:00 -
[1579] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:So every casual player, who want to convert an LP blueprint into goods, or every non-intense industrialist, they should be gutted? Who said they should? Mara certainly didn'tGǪ
Quote:I love how I see who knows how many null sec cartel Who?
Quote:propagandists stating flatly that the only way to properly run missions is to blitz them, for LP, and the best bang for your buck is LP based items from 5 run BPC's. Now, we see the other shoe drop when the manufacturing lines these mission runners NEED are removed. Yeah, seeGǪ that's the thing: they won't be removed, only reallocated to a more meaningful and balanced form. The only one saying that they will be removed is you, which I suppose makes you the GÇ£cartel propagandistGÇ¥. I mean, it only makes sense: outright removing them would benefit you directly, but not the game as a whole. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skill plan 2.1. |
Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
2486
|
Posted - 2014.03.29 00:20:00 -
[1580] - Quote
Mara Rinn wrote:Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:So every casual player, who want to convert an LP blueprint into goods, or every non-intense industrialist, they should be gutted? If you want to convert blueprints into items, specialise in manufacturing. If you don't, why should you be able to manufacture things just as well as the capsuleer with level 5 in the appropriate manufacturing skills? So yes, you should be losing out on efficiency if you aren't trained to manufacture efficiently. This is not a black and white scenario, you can choose to manufacture at low efficiency and simply take a hit on the profit (who cares how inefficient you are at manufacturing combat scanner probes? the profit comes from the LP side of the sisters combat scanner probes). Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:I love how I see who knows how many null sec cartel propagandists stating flatly that the only way to properly run missions is to blitz them, for LP, and the best bang for your buck is LP based items from 5 run BPC's. Now, we see the other shoe drop when the manufacturing lines these mission runners NEED are removed. When those manufacturing lines are removed and replaced by POS based manufacturing lines, you'll simply have to buddy up with an industrialist who runs a POS. Ideally CCP will allow us to rent POS based activity lines to people who aren't in our corporation or alliance.
I DO have perfect manufacturing skills, or good enough that I am satisfied with the loss of minerals. I am not talking about inefficiencies in skills. I am talking about the lack of slots to actually manufacture anything.
And as for partnering up with someone, that is ridiculous beyond the pale. Most people viewed Orwell's writings as a warning. The harper regime and the goons treat them as a guidebook. |
|
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
20302
|
Posted - 2014.03.29 00:27:00 -
[1581] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:I DO have perfect manufacturing skills, or good enough that I am satisfied with the loss of minerals. I am not talking about inefficiencies in skills. I am talking about the lack of slots to actually manufacture anything. GǪso again, the one who'd benefit from an actual reduction would be you. Is that why you keep claiming (wishing?) that it'll happen?
Quote:And as for partnering up with someone, that is ridiculous beyond the pale. How so?
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skill plan 2.1. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
4019
|
Posted - 2014.03.29 00:31:00 -
[1582] - Quote
Mallak Azaria wrote:Jenn aSide wrote:I'm a high sec mission runner and i don't feel screwed by this change. I do feel screwed by this thread though. Less conspiracy, more cowbell I always say. Sometimes conspiracy is a good source of inspiration. I'm going to suggest that our CSM representitives make it their mission to make CCP bring in only changes that will directly affect Dinsdale in a negative way.
See, there have been a few times where I almost think that you guys did something just because Dinsdale claimed you were going to, and you all thought "hey, that is a good idea!".
And now I'm getting my own tinfoil, I suppose. Not posting on my main, and loving it.-á Because free speech.-á
Psychotic Monk for CSM9.
|
Falin Whalen
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
606
|
Posted - 2014.03.29 00:50:00 -
[1583] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:And as for partnering up with someone, that is ridiculous beyond the pale. Dinsdale "I do it myself" Pirannha, folks. "it's only because of their stupidity that they're able to be so sure of themselves." The Trial - Franz Kafka-á |
Darkblad
Hilfe is like Free Entertainment
159
|
Posted - 2014.03.29 00:58:00 -
[1584] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:And as for partnering up with someone, that is ridiculous beyond the pale. Yeah, a Sandbox also should support those MSOrpg players ... EVE Infolinks -+-áOld and new-áPortraits |
Alesha Kalishi
Amarr Corp 1969j131200
2
|
Posted - 2014.03.29 00:59:00 -
[1585] - Quote
Knew I trained Scrap Metal Processing to 5 for a reason. :)
|
Faux Sho
Umbra Victoria
0
|
Posted - 2014.03.29 01:09:00 -
[1586] - Quote
As a new player who is running high sec missions, i'm not sure what to think. While I do run the missions and loot/salvage sometimes; i do not believe that I am going to miss much with teh changes.
Sure it's nice to refine that stuff that's less than 100k, but I'm not playing this game to nickle and dime my way through. The little amount of ISK I get from refining now isn't going to be missed in the larger picture; at least for me. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
4029
|
Posted - 2014.03.29 01:33:00 -
[1587] - Quote
Darkblad wrote:Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:And as for partnering up with someone, that is ridiculous beyond the pale. Yeah, a Sandbox also should support those MSOrpg players ...
Oh, so very much this.
Far too many of the carebear oriented suggestions come from people who, judging by what they're asking for, are asking to have a single player game.
The answer is basically "you're playing the wrong game". Not posting on my main, and loving it.-á Because free speech.-á
Psychotic Monk for CSM9.
|
Tauranon
Weeesearch Greater Western Co-Prosperity Sphere
876
|
Posted - 2014.03.29 01:45:00 -
[1588] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:Mara Rinn wrote:Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:Talking about manufacturing lines? You mean nerfing the crap out of the quantity of high sec lines, because the same null sec cartels are crying tears over that too.
I'm a hisec carebear and I've been "crying tears" over the ubiquity and stupidly low costs of hi sec manufacturing lines for quite some time. Anyone who currently has any kind of assembly line in a hi sec POS is doing it wrong. It should not be this way. So every casual player, who want to convert an LP blueprint into goods, or every non-intense industrialist, they should be gutted? I love how I see who knows how many null sec cartel propagandists stating flatly that the only way to properly run missions is to blitz them, for LP, and the best bang for your buck is LP based items from 5 run BPC's. Now, we see the other shoe drop when the manufacturing lines these mission runners NEED are removed.
Dinsdale, I looked last night over Vale of the Silent, at all the production lines available to me via alliance.
Guess what. 4 stations had lines in use, and only one had more than 5 lines in use. ie when we talk about nerfing highsec manufacturing, we are literally talking about nerfing a location where 95%+ of all manufacturing is done. it is -that- badly out of balance.
I have about 20 spaceships in Vale now, and they all came from the same place. Jita. As did every module that isn't deadspace.
ie right now, the table is impossibly tilted against null production, and as and when a problem arises with highsec production as a result of these changes, CCP can reconsider the balance again.
Right now, this really, needs to be done.
|
Lucas Kell
JSR1 AND GOLDEN GUARDIAN PRODUCTIONS SpaceMonkey's Alliance
2905
|
Posted - 2014.03.29 01:52:00 -
[1589] - Quote
Mara Rinn wrote:Sure, an outpost costs tens of billions of ISK to set up and upgrade, almost as much as a single titan. The advantage that outpost has in refining efficiency will pay for the entire outpost in a few months of reprocessing. So you can stop crying your crocodile tears right there. Nevermind that outposts can't be destroyed so you'll never actually lose the materials you leave behind when someone captures it (just capture it back, or stay in the outpost so you can ship stuff out). Capturing back an outpost is a whole lot easier than taking back a POS that has been destroyed. There are different refineries available for low/null which are more efficient than the hi sec ones. You need to read the devblog. Other advantages that an outpost has over a POS:
- Unlimited storage space
- Many more activity lines
- No fuel
You can't dock a thousand carriers and dreadnoughts at a POS. So the advantages of an outpost are already worth the fees otherwise people wouldn't deploy and upgrade them. The advantage of unlimited storage space will turn up again when CCP start talking about manufacturing lines. So are you purposely ignoring sov costs? You can't hold an outpost without them. Sov bills are their fuel.
Also, they are supposed to be better than a POS, always have. You'll just have to deal with that. The Indecisive Noob - A new EVE Fan Blog for news and stuff. Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list. |
Lucas Kell
JSR1 AND GOLDEN GUARDIAN PRODUCTIONS SpaceMonkey's Alliance
2905
|
Posted - 2014.03.29 01:58:00 -
[1590] - Quote
Mario Putzo wrote:Tippia wrote:Mario Putzo wrote:Likely you are right, considering that overall production must drop to coincide with the reduction of mineral availability, this would be a perfect time to reduce the "free" lines available to the playerbase. Otherwise without a reduction in production availability, you are going to have a massive bout of market inflation on hand. Mineral availability isn't being reduced, though, nor would it have any connection with a required reduction in free manufacturing facilities. And either way, reducing those manufacturing lines would certainly not keep any inflation at bay. Oh it most certainly is being touched. Unless you believe all reprocessing will be done in Nullsec from now on (don't make me laugh). You are either going to have more market competition as "gun miners" go to market to maintain current production. Or you are going to have less production as "gun miners" take 45% longer to gain required production minerals. You simply CAN NOT, have one without the other. It is mathematically impossible. Either less production, or more miners. Or Market inflation. Im not sure what you and Lucas find so hard about this. Unless of course you really think that Minerals reprocessed from missions/ratting/plexing/PVP Loot never reach the market as raw minerals or as produced goods. Use your head. And clearly you do not know what market inflation is. We discussed this. At length, remember? You spewed a lot of flawed math and overestimated by a massive margin the number of minerals from gun mining.
The Indecisive Noob - A new EVE Fan Blog for news and stuff. Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list. |
|
|
|
|
Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 30 40 50 60 .. 67 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |