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Illiar D'Anaari
Lassandar
11
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Posted - 2014.03.21 21:49:00 -
[1] - Quote
I've been wanting to run L5 missions for a while now but never really had the opportunity. With the (not so recent) changes to aggro, you can't simply include a logi, so I've been trying to find a duo of ship that could run it. The combo I could pull off soon with some friends would be a mix of rattlesnake and SNI. I believe the Rattler would be better than the SNI overall.
How much dps should I be able to tank, generally speaking? (is there a "rule" kinda like L4 where you should have at least X divided between gank and tank?)
I figured the fitting would be something along these lines:
[Rattlesnake, L5Passive] Damage Control II Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Drone Damage Amplifier II Drone Damage Amplifier II Drone Damage Amplifier II
Pithum A-Type Explosive Deflection Amplifier Pithum A-Type Explosive Deflection Amplifier Pithum A-Type Kinetic Deflection Amplifier Pithum A-Type Kinetic Deflection Amplifier Pithum B-Type Thermic Dissipation Amplifier Pithum B-Type EM Ward Amplifier Omnidirectional Tracking Link II, Optimal Range Script
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Nova Fury Cruise Missile Cruise Missile Launcher II, Nova Fury Cruise Missile Cruise Missile Launcher II, Nova Fury Cruise Missile Cruise Missile Launcher II, Nova Fury Cruise Missile Large S95a Remote Shield Booster Large S95a Remote Shield Booster
Large Core Defense Field Extender II Large Core Defense Field Extender II Large Core Defense Field Extender II
Garde II x5 Bouncer II x5 Warrior II x5 Hobgoblin II x5 Salvage Drone I x5 Medium Shield Maintenance Bot II x5
Using all 5 in EFT, I'm getting 1678 dps tanked against angels if I have the 2 shield transporters active on me. this goes up to 1995 if I add the med shield maintenance bots, but this seems like a poor tradeoff for the dps sentries would apply and therefore help reduce incoming dps. Does this seem like reasonable numbers? Anything I should change in the fit? This looks blingy as hell but the resistance amplifier are ridiculously inexpensive, so they seemed well worth it. |
dexington
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
1122
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Posted - 2014.03.21 22:13:00 -
[2] - Quote
I have been considering something similar, but armor tanked using two nestor, the rattler got a huge advantage when it comes to price.
I think the setup should work, it is of cause dependent on cap to run the shield transfer which i guess can be a problem in some missions.
I'm a relatively respectable citizen. Multiple felon perhaps, but certainly not dangerous. |
Illiar D'Anaari
Lassandar
11
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Posted - 2014.03.22 01:50:00 -
[3] - Quote
If I'm not mistaken, neuts come from towers a lot in L5s, right? Do they also switch aggro, like ships? never really noticed in L4s with sentries (they usually get killed first within the first minute or so of any missions anyway)
I went with the rattler as shield do have the advantage of passive regen, which armor does not, providing a sort of base tank, while armor would rely solely on the remote rep. Granted, the passive regen is a minor part of the tank but it's still that much more over armor.
One other thing I'm seeing as a good point for the Rattler is the fact that it's by far the worse gank target with it's massive ehp, and I assume L5 system have their fair share of gankers. |
dexington
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
1122
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Posted - 2014.03.22 06:40:00 -
[4] - Quote
You can find descriptions of the level 5 missions in the eve survival guide, but you can run into both ships and sentries who neut. I have no idea about how the tower behave in relation to aggro, normally i don't think tower switch target, as long as they can attack their current target. I'm a relatively respectable citizen. Multiple felon perhaps, but certainly not dangerous. |
Apelacja
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
66
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Posted - 2014.03.22 17:41:00 -
[5] - Quote
tewngu / command ship is a proper way......
And right now it is impossible to do some of thosse lvl 5 missions as long as u are not using bigger group or caps. before AI changes it was doable with bombers/af/domi now its a wasting of efford. IF u like missions go to militia and do mission in maximum 5 min with a simple bomber.
and yea remeber that fleet booster will not work after dc even on passive fits. And on some mission even that 10 % less shield can take u down.
about missions: angel fortress for example do 4 k dps omni :P. to take down carrier u need 1,5 k dps etc..... enemies abound will take u 2 h to end.....
choose wisely ( or create many alts ) and u will be fine
about fit: make simple passive tank fit tengu/venture can tank 1,8 k dps. |
Tauranon
Weeesearch Greater Western Co-Prosperity Sphere
858
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Posted - 2014.03.23 01:13:00 -
[6] - Quote
Illiar D'Anaari wrote:If I'm not mistaken, neuts come from towers a lot in L5s, right? Do they also switch aggro, like ships? never really noticed in L4s with sentries (they usually get killed first within the first minute or so of any missions anyway)
I went with the rattler as shield do have the advantage of passive regen, which armor does not, providing a sort of base tank, while armor would rely solely on the remote rep. Granted, the passive regen is a minor part of the tank but it's still that much more over armor.
One other thing I'm seeing as a good point for the Rattler is the fact that it's by far the worse gank target with it's massive ehp, and I assume L5 system have their fair share of gankers.
I used to do level 5s with 2 dominixes. Old school was one assist domi and one gunnery domi, but now you'd just use identical RR domis. Many L5s don't have neuts, of the ones that do, most neut towers are neut tower Is, or neut tower IIs, you won't usually see the 250km range huge hitpoint neut tower III that can be found in nullsec exploration.
The worst case is for a few salvos you might need to capacitor tank 80units/sec, and then you might need to balance between not triggering too much more stuff and capacitor tanking 40 units/sec. I don't think I ever capped out.
Ganking defence via EHP is kinda irrelevant for lowsec, but I'm happy if you use rattlesnakes because I got plenty more BPCs to sell. IMO your best defence is keeping an eye on d-scan and getting out when probes show, but battleships so big that its likely the prober will one hit your mission pocket and then that mission is more or less burned. As a secondary defence I'd want neuts in cargo and deploy depots, for similar reasons I'd carry more tank pieces so I could switch out some DDAs for dealing with peak damage if required.
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Gary Bell
Wrecking Shots Black Legion.
123
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Posted - 2014.03.30 14:44:00 -
[7] - Quote
Most missions have enough nuet power to cap you out easily.. If you tr to blitz the carrier mission it will kill you.. I have seen it cap out and almost kill a stupid aeon pilot hung on rocks that couldent warp out.. So yeah dont take it lightly. A perfect skills snake full passive recharge has been able to do most lvl fives for quite a while.. It requires t2 rigs and near perfect skills.. Nighthawk can do most blaster missions with the same setup.
The fastest way by far is still a carrier..
And the more alts you have with standings the better you will be as you can pick and choose much easier |
RoCkEt X
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
70
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Posted - 2014.03.31 20:05:00 -
[8] - Quote
You're over thinking it...
you need: 1x Ship with a 'decent' tank to soak up neuts. Neuts come from batteries and do not switch aggro. Using a t3 to do this means you'll sig tank most of it. (use full passive tanked loki/tengu)
your second char flies a dps ship: Paladin (tachyon) Golem (cruise) Vargur (AC) Machariel (AC) Nightmare (Tachyon)
Marauders are preferable, with the bastion tank etc. Can also MJD out of tackle range and warp out at any point, tractor beams are also useful for tractoring mission objectives.
Rattlesnakes do work as tanks, but some missions can be dicey; and fit to tank your dps is poor... if you're trying to solo 5's in a rattler then you're missing the point of lvl 5's. Most of your isk comes from LP, so blitzing is a must.
Also... stray carrier is a b!tch. If you wanna blitz it you'll need a supercap.
-Rock.
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Kontrapshun
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
16
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Posted - 2014.03.31 22:11:00 -
[9] - Quote
Here's the Dual Box Rattlesnake fit for any Level 5 mission that I've tried. Two of these in a room just destroys everything.
Rattlesnake. Lows Damage Control II (Still runs even when I've been capped out). Ballistic Control System II (X 2) Drone Damage Amp II (x 2) Co-Processor II
Mids (Omni-tanked for Low Sec Gank 63/70/77/65 ; otherwise change for mission) X-Large Ancillary Shield Booster (x 2 of these) (cap 400's Navy = fill up your hold and run one at a time for best use) Shield Booster Amp II (x 2 of these) EM Ward Amp II (x 1) Thermic Dissipation Amplifier II (x 1) Kinetic Deflection Amp II (x 1)
Highs Arbalest Cruise Launcher (x 4) Drone Link Augmentor 1 (x 2)
Rigs Large Core Defense Operational Solidifier 1 (x 2) Large Processor Overclocking unit 1 (x 1)
Spec's EFT Rates Defense @ 3184 overall DPS 904 with Garde II and plain old T1 Missiles
Try this on SISI first to get the hang of the missions, but I have never had to warp out just shooting the proper order of things.
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Gary Bell
Wrecking Shots Black Legion.
123
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Posted - 2014.04.01 14:15:00 -
[10] - Quote
Why anyone would ever wanna mission with cap boosters is beyond me.. Stray carrier can be done by one carrier you just have to tank for it and be very sure of what your doing.. otherwise splodey pop
Dident even think about the marauder changes.. That woulda been nice five years ago in khanid lol
There is also a glitch where you can warp a cloaky into stray carrier burn off like 200kms.. Warp in your carrier.. then warp down to the mission and the nuets never aggro you fro some reason..
But if you mess that up you will prob die..
But yeah a Marauder with a depot to keep changing fits as needed for cap etc.. and if all else fails a mobile mjd unit just incase something crazy happens and you should be good to go
*And Kont Like Rock said that may tank missions but in Lvl fives the Lp is the hole idea.. You make 100k a mission with good skills.. So blitzing is the only proper way to run them |
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Kontrapshun
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
16
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Posted - 2014.04.02 00:38:00 -
[11] - Quote
Gary Bell wrote: *And Kont Like Rock said that may tank missions but in Lvl fives the Lp is the hole idea.. You make 100k a mission with good skills.. So blitzing is the only proper way to run them
It's fun to experiment really! The Cap boosters are a bit of a pain, but there is no mission that it can't tank and the DPS is very high. If the NPC's switch aggro it really doesn't matter. If a pirate enters, they can't kill the ships unless it's a well tanked gang.
I know when you dual box, it's basically one Tank and one DPS,,,, but I like trying all the missions, more for the fun, not the ISK per hour..... not much else in this game that is challenging.
EDIT: Wow just EFT my Rattlesnake fit with a Golem and it's CRAZY @ 10,240 Defense..... OTT |
Gary Bell
Wrecking Shots Black Legion.
123
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Posted - 2014.04.08 13:24:00 -
[12] - Quote
Kontrapshun wrote:Gary Bell wrote: *And Kont Like Rock said that may tank missions but in Lvl fives the Lp is the hole idea.. You make 100k a mission with good skills.. So blitzing is the only proper way to run them It's fun to experiment really! The Cap boosters are a bit of a pain, but there is no mission that it can't tank and the DPS is very high. EDIT: Wow just EFT my Rattlesnake fit with a Golem and it's CRAZY @ 10,240 Defense..... OTT
The issue is the alpha from the rats in the room.. And tbh I am ballz ass rich and still dont ever feel the need to experiment with like 9 bil in ships..
Test server is that way ---->
Also with the fighter changes coming your best bet is to scare off the locals and run these things in carriers.. The HP buff and dps changes are gonna make it bals |
Tarsas Phage
Freight Club
276
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Posted - 2014.04.10 21:16:00 -
[13] - Quote
Kontrapshun wrote:Gary Bell wrote: *And Kont Like Rock said that may tank missions but in Lvl fives the Lp is the hole idea.. You make 100k a mission with good skills.. So blitzing is the only proper way to run them It's fun to experiment really! The Cap boosters are a bit of a pain, but there is no mission that it can't tank and the DPS is very high. EDIT: Wow just EFT my Rattlesnake fit with a Golem and it's CRAZY @ 10,240 Defense..... OTT
Believe me, there's not much experimenting when it comes to L5s. There's only very few ways to do them solo, and these ways are just slight variations of each other. Rsnakes can tank, but to use 1 or even 2 them as your DPS platform as well means you're going to be stuck in the mission of inordinate amounts of time... something you don't want to do in lowsec, as well as for your wallet as blitzing them is the name of the game.
There are also tons of variation between L5 missions, as Rocket mentioned. Stray Carrier and The Fortress are not to be taken lightly (one guy I knew almost lost his Hel in The Fortress, because he got neuted out so he couldn't cyno out, and stuck on the mission's deadspace beacon so he couldn't warp out. He had to bring in another carrier to cap himself up in order to get out of there.
One of them (Prison Break) is bugged in that you can't even finish it as the pass key to activate the mission's internal acceleration gates doesn't even drop from the NPC that it's supposed to. In the years that this mission has existed, it has been reported to CCP many times and yet never fixed.
You're going to find that most of them will be [Decline, wait another 4 hours to pull another one] when it comes to L5s. |
Nolen Cadmar
Nexus Ore Technologies and Excavations Surely You're Joking
151
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Posted - 2014.04.11 17:18:00 -
[14] - Quote
Here's what my alliance uses for L5's. It's worked well so far. Easily accompanied by active tank ships. The Rattle is passive tanked and used to tank the neuts.
[Rattlesnake, L5-EM/Therm]
Shield Power Relay II Shield Power Relay II Shield Power Relay II Shield Power Relay II Shield Power Relay II Shield Power Relay II
Pithum B-Type EM Ward Amplifier Pithum B-Type EM Ward Amplifier Pithum A-Type Thermic Dissipation Amplifier Large Shield Extender II Large Shield Extender II Large Shield Extender II Shield Recharger II
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile Drone Link Augmentor I Drone Link Augmentor I
Large Core Defense Field Purger II Large Core Defense Field Purger II Large Core Defense Field Purger II
Add drones of choice. Nolen's Spreadsheet Guru Services: Need a spreadsheet created, maintained, updated or repaired? Learn more about my services at:-á https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3865379 |
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