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Bienator II
madmen of the skies
2913
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Posted - 2014.10.24 04:52:09 -
[91] - Quote
Tedd Haggard wrote:DaReaper wrote: Comet mining would be as it says, you mine comets. Comets would be large moving objects in space, that would travel between systems and need to be scanned down. They would remain in a system for 12-24 hours, or until mined out, then they would move past the range of your sensors and appear in another system.
I love the idea of comet mining, but let's crunch some numbers on the reality of this. Average system is lets say about 20AU with an unknown amount of distance between systems (to much to warp so you need gates). 20AU = 2991957414 km Now for the sake of simplicity, let's just deal with the scenario of them 'remaining in system for 24 hours'... So to travel 20AU in 24 hours, the comet would be travelling at 124664892km/h or about 0.83AU/h. So I think we can rule out mining at this speed. So, let's see how long a comet would stay in system if it travelled at some speed a bit more achievable, say 5000m/s - that's 18000km/h; it's still really fast, but doable. 2991957414 km / 18000km = 166219.85 hours ,which is just under 19 years. So in the entire time EVE has been around, it would have travelled 1/2 of one system. That's why, if this is to happen, comets should spawn near orbital bodies and be on a collision path. This will allow them to travel at 'normal' speeds and yet have a short life span. unless you can web them using special equipment for mining purposes. would be the excuse why they stay on grid while you are there.
eve style bounties (done)
dust boarding parties
imagine there is war and everybody cloaks - join FW
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Tedd Haggard
Banana Co.
10
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Posted - 2014.10.24 05:12:31 -
[92] - Quote
Bienator II wrote: unless you can web them using special equipment for mining purposes. would be the excuse why they stay on grid while you are there.
Webbing doesn't make sense; webbing inhibits propulsion not momentum and gravitational pull. However, let's assume it does for a second, how would this play out? You would warp to a comet, web it, its velocity reduces and now it's going nowhere... forever. Awesome. |
The Hamilton
Outer Ring Sleeper Collective Illusion of Solitude
66
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Posted - 2014.10.24 09:10:21 -
[93] - Quote
**** ing great thread! And so good to hear about a feature so before my time here. I would love if some Dev's could weigh in on the thoughts here. Could you create an anomaly that moves at a fast pace? Not expecting the 30379 m/s or anything, but something that moves through the grid/s. |
Damjan Fox
Fox Industries and Exploration
43
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Posted - 2014.10.24 12:50:28 -
[94] - Quote
Sounds like a cool idea. +1 For that.
But, like someone already mentioned, the key to this is to keep it simple. Some of you guys are going way too far mentioning crazy new modules, ships, game mechanics etc...
I like the idea, of the comet travelling at high speed (~1000m/s) with a slightly but constantly changing flight path. This would mean, only the Venture and the Prospect would be fast enough to keep up with it, giving these ships a nice new role and furthermore, it would prevent afk mining, as you would have to manually fly next to the comet, making this a fun new gamepley element, in contrast to the static and boring "normal" mining.
Not sure what the comet should consist of (ice, ore, moon goo) but the payout should reflect the increased effort in contrast to normal mining. This would naturally attract gankers, making the whole thing even more interesting.
All in all, a really good idea and i would like too see that ingame. |
DaReaper
Net 7 The Last Brigade
1150
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Posted - 2014.10.24 14:56:19 -
[95] - Quote
The Hamilton wrote:**** ing great thread! And so good to hear about a feature so before my time here. I would love if some Dev's could weigh in on the thoughts here. Could you create an anomaly that moves at a fast pace? Not expecting the 30379 m/s or anything, but something that moves through the grid/s.
There was a mention at the game design round table of a possible prototyping project on comet mining. Granted, this doesn't really mean anything, but its a nice thought in the right direction. My goal with making this thread was to just see if there is an interest. At nearly 70+ likes, I think there is. More likes please, lets see if we can get CCP or even a CSM to push this a bit more.
OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!
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mr ed thehouseofed
Wrought iron Industries
19141
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Posted - 2014.10.25 12:05:00 -
[96] - Quote
+1 like this idea a lot
i want a eve pinball machine... -áconfirming -áCCP Cognac is best cognac
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DaReaper
Net 7
1154
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Posted - 2014.10.27 17:26:05 -
[97] - Quote
bump.. more likes please
OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!
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Cidanel Afuran
Astro Technologies Apocalypse Now.
55
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Posted - 2014.10.27 17:37:40 -
[98] - Quote
Tedd Haggard wrote:Bienator II wrote: unless you can web them using special equipment for mining purposes. would be the excuse why they stay on grid while you are there.
Webbing doesn't make sense; webbing inhibits propulsion not momentum and gravitational pull. However, let's assume it does for a second, how would this play out? You would warp to a comet, web it, its velocity reduces and now it's going nowhere... forever. Awesome.
...no, it gives you options for group based play. You can go at it solo in a venture/prospect, or you can get friends to help web it down so that you can mine it in a barge or exhumer. It brings group play back to mining.
And if the lore around how webs work bothers you, we can make up some reason why it works.
"Webbing comets employs micro energy streams that disrupt the gravitational field unique to these cosmic objects"
All lore in the game is made up. Don't put down a decent idea because it doesn't fit the (fake/made up) physics in a video game. |
DaReaper
Net 7
1154
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Posted - 2014.10.27 17:53:25 -
[99] - Quote
Cidanel Afuran wrote:Tedd Haggard wrote:Bienator II wrote: unless you can web them using special equipment for mining purposes. would be the excuse why they stay on grid while you are there.
Webbing doesn't make sense; webbing inhibits propulsion not momentum and gravitational pull. However, let's assume it does for a second, how would this play out? You would warp to a comet, web it, its velocity reduces and now it's going nowhere... forever. Awesome. ...no, it gives you options for group based play. You can go at it solo in a venture/prospect, or you can get friends to help web it down so that you can mine it in a barge or exhumer. It brings group play back to mining. And if the lore around how webs work bothers you, we can make up some reason why it works. "Webbing comets employs micro energy streams that disrupt the gravitational field unique to these cosmic objects" All lore in the game is made up. Don't put down a decent idea because it doesn't fit the (fake/made up) physics in a video game.
I'll add.. there are lots of ways to make this work, beside just webbing. You could, as someone else suggested, have tractor beams for ships that can pull slower ships along, you can have a module that fires an 'anchor' at the comet that keeps you in range, but would have draw backs like stress on the hull and causes damage (thus a T3 industrial could sustain the forces [see what I did there?]) You could have a new form of web for just comets. The possibilities are vast in how this simple thing, and maybe 1-3 other things could change up a lot of game play. Not to mention make a way to move away from passive moon mining and turn it into an active activity. Or hell, at the very least give WH people access to some ice. It also opens up all kinds of exploration and pvp potential. The point is, this would be a nice somewhat simple shakeup to a lot of things.
So... make it happen ccp!
OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!
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Tedd Haggard
Banana Co.
11
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Posted - 2014.10.28 01:04:04 -
[100] - Quote
Cidanel Afuran wrote: All lore in the game is made up. Don't put down a decent idea because it doesn't fit the (fake/made up) physics in a video game.
Sorry for putting down your idea. I was more concerned about the gameplay of webbing; slowing down a comet means there's no mechanism for it to naturally decay (so it can respawn elsewhere) other than being completely mined out.
Put reality and lore aside for a second, at its very core any comet mining gameplay must be able to spawn in an area and despawn after a period of time. Because of the scale of systems, getting the comet to travel fast requires too much speed to traverse the system in a reasonable timeframe. Webbing will get it to go too slow (remember, it won't pick up speed after you stop webbing).
That's why I'm saying they should spawn near planets/stars and be on a collision course. This allows the comets to travel at 'normal' speeds, have changing mechanics based on proximity to the star and have an excuse to despawn after a period of time. |
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Cidanel Afuran
Astro Technologies Apocalypse Now.
55
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Posted - 2014.10.28 20:45:04 -
[101] - Quote
Tedd Haggard wrote: Sorry for putting down your idea. I was more concerned about the gameplay of webbing; slowing down a comet means there's no mechanism for it to naturally decay (so it can respawn elsewhere) other than being completely mined out.
Put reality and lore aside for a second, at its very core any comet mining gameplay must be able to spawn in an area and despawn after a period of time. Because of the scale of systems, getting the comet to travel fast requires too much speed to traverse the system in a reasonable timeframe. Webbing will get it to go too slow (remember, it won't pick up speed after you stop webbing).
That's why I'm saying they should spawn near planets/stars and be on a collision course. This allows the comets to travel at 'normal' speeds, have changing mechanics based on proximity to the star and have an excuse to despawn after a period of time.
Ok, that makes sense. I thought you were one of the 'lore always trumps gameplay' people.
There are already some arbitrary guidelines (ie, ice every 4 hours, etc.) so I like your idea of 'collision course'. Or, you could have them disappear at downtime and spawn randomly in a system at any time of the day.
If they crash into planets, do they destroy any PI on that planet when they do? |
Tedd Haggard
Banana Co.
11
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Posted - 2014.10.29 01:40:52 -
[102] - Quote
Cidanel Afuran wrote:There are already some arbitrary guidelines (ie, ice every 4 hours, etc.) so I like your idea of 'collision course'. Or, you could have them disappear at downtime and spawn randomly in a system at any time of the day. If they crash into planets, do they destroy any PI on that planet when they do?
I'm not a fan of them magically disappearing at DT as there's no reason for them to.
As for smashing PI, yeah the thought occurred to me too. And heck, why not. Maybe CCP could write the comet spawning algorithm to prioritise planets with heavy PI usage. That may be a driver for indy people to 'protect' their PI assets by occasionally scanning around their planets for incoming comets.
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Catherine Laartii
Providence Guard Templis CALSF
361
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Posted - 2014.11.03 16:13:06 -
[103] - Quote
I would support this if you could 'lasso' them with webs like the space-cowboys we all imagine ourselves to be. :stetson: |
DaReaper
Net 7
1182
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Posted - 2014.11.04 18:29:17 -
[104] - Quote
Bump because this needs to be a thing.. more likes please!
OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!
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Amak Boma
Dragon Factory
31
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Posted - 2014.11.05 10:40:33 -
[105] - Quote
i have an option
comet mining could be very nice idea and is it , but it cant be hat easy player must navigate his mining barge/industrial throught debris fields and approac on comet orbit lets say 10 km. now deploy some sort of structure that need be anchored on surface of comet it could extract ice , water and gases from comet. extraction process could take untill mining platform storage is full also radius of comet should say how much resources has it
radius 550km 20 ice 1000 water 2000 noble gases radius 700km 50 ice 2200 water 3729 noble gases radius 900m 72 ice 3000 water 4204 noble gases radius 1100m 94 ice 5225 water 6224 noble gases radius 1400m 102 ice 6119 water 7548 noble gases
its just example , resources could be in different amount and type of course along comet radius
we would need a new mining barge type - excavator would be like retriever but capable of mining comets only the industrial ship could be able to deploy the structure to mine the comet itself but player need fly closer to grab ined materials. also new venture "prospect" could be capable of mining comet. what else?
new skillbook :comet extraction 1lvl takes 8 minutes 2lvl takes 24 minutes 3lvl takes 3 hours and 20 minutes 4lvl takes day and 5 hours 5lvl takes 4days and 2 hours
each skill allow you to use one comet mining laser per level and deploy one comet extractor platform per level.
restrictions 1 extractor structure per 1 comet 10 - 50 cmets per solar system but
7 comets in security system 1.0 14 comets in security system 0.9 20 comets in security system 0.8 24 comets in security system 0.7 31 comets in security system 0.6 37 comets in security system 0.5 40 comets in security system 0.4 47 comets in security system 0.3 52 comets in security system 0.2 58 comets in security system 0.1 70comets in security system 0.0 comets from 0.0 to -1.0 could spawn 10 more per system so in -1.0 you will find the most comets
comet spawning area : near sun , near planets. comets would be needed to be probed down with scanning probes.
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Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation Ineluctable.
885
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Posted - 2014.11.05 10:50:09 -
[106] - Quote
Amak Boma wrote: comet spawning area : near sun , near planets. comets would be needed to be probed down with scanning probes.
They should absolutely not be close to planets; quite in contrast, they should spawn at similar or even larger distances from celestials as Wormholes do. Comets are deep space objects coming from a sphere or ring in the outermost regions of a solar system. Therefore, they spawn far out and require long warps depending on the system.
Some systems also should not have any comets at all. For instance, Red Giants and White Dwarf systems: the former is currently blowing hot gas into space, which evaporates the ice that forms comets and the latter has gone through that phase already and the ice is already evaporated.
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Corraidhin Farsaidh
Farsaidh's Freeborn
741
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Posted - 2014.11.05 11:01:14 -
[107] - Quote
Rivr Luzade wrote:Amak Boma wrote: comet spawning area : near sun , near planets. comets would be needed to be probed down with scanning probes.
They should absolutely not be close to planets; quite in contrast, they should spawn at similar or even larger distances from celestials as Wormholes do. Comets are deep space objects coming from a sphere or ring in the outermost regions of a solar system. Therefore, they spawn far out and require long warps depending on the system. Some systems also should not have any comets at all. For instance, Red Giants and White Dwarf systems: the former is currently blowing hot gas into space, which evaporates the ice that forms comets and the latter has gone through that phase already and the ice is already evaporated.
Alternatively finding a comet in these systems could be a much more dangerous proposition due to the explosive decomposition of the comet. Greater risk for greater reward (and less material to grab but better stuff from the core of the comet). |
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation Ineluctable.
885
|
Posted - 2014.11.05 11:59:26 -
[108] - Quote
Absolutely agreed, that's an interesting variety to the system, which gives the game much needed flavor.
--
Amak Boma wrote: new skillbook :comet extraction 1lvl takes 8 minutes 2lvl takes 24 minutes 3lvl takes 3 hours and 20 minutes 4lvl takes day and 5 hours 5lvl takes 4days and 2 hours
I also go as far as to demand this skill being an x3 or higher. Comet Mining is not a basic task inexperienced miners can do and it should certainly not be possible to do this activity in a Venture or completely under-skilled barge. Instead, players should be required to train a range of skills in order to be able to fly the proper ships with proper stats and proper equipment. An x1 skill does not make players think about that; however, an x3 requires in itself more training time and thus implicates to the intelligent and observant player that this skill and activity demands more devotion than just casual hopping in. |
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Farsaidh's Freeborn
742
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Posted - 2014.11.05 12:09:25 -
[109] - Quote
No need for new skills I think if it is pretty much balance towards needing a fast frigate/prospector anyway. Use gas harvesting on any gas clouds explosively ejected (assuming you survive), ice harvesters on any ice surface, mining lasers once the ice is burnt away (some should be vaporized with each explosive decomposition), and simple scoop to cargo for any gobets of moon-goo etc the get blown clear. |
Caja Wrython
Fusion Enterprises Ltd Brothers of Tangra
0
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Posted - 2014.11.05 13:06:26 -
[110] - Quote
We need this adding before I die of old age, I'm 34, run with it CCP.
I like the grapple/tractor beam idea to latch on to the comet while its moving... |
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Corraidhin Farsaidh
Farsaidh's Freeborn
742
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Posted - 2014.11.05 13:09:55 -
[111] - Quote
Caja Wrython wrote:We need this adding before I die of old age, I'm 34, run with it CCP.
I like the grapple/tractor beam idea to latch on to the comet while its moving...
I'd actually be against the grapple/tractor as this defeats the point of the comet being fast moving and rewuiring active piloting to chase down/mine. I'd even go as far as to limit the ability to orbit it automatically but that might be a bit evil :D |
Caja Wrython
Fusion Enterprises Ltd Brothers of Tangra
0
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Posted - 2014.11.05 13:14:14 -
[112] - Quote
Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote:Caja Wrython wrote:We need this adding before I die of old age, I'm 34, run with it CCP.
I like the grapple/tractor beam idea to latch on to the comet while its moving... I'd actually be against the grapple/tractor as this defeats the point of the comet being fast moving and rewuiring active piloting to chase down/mine. I'd even go as far as to limit the ability to orbit it automatically but that might be a bit evil :D
Humm yeah want to discourage AFK'ers, ok I stand corrected. I would want this to be something you needed your corp mates for, something you can't do solo, someone has to do Y while some does X to collect the goodness. |
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Farsaidh's Freeborn
742
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Posted - 2014.11.05 13:17:36 -
[113] - Quote
I'd go with soloable so that newer players can also take part (in my view new players should be able to do most things in game with varying degrees of success) but much more efficient in a fleet (one gas grabbe, one ice grabber, one ore grabber and everyone chases the goop :D ) or with higher skills and better ships. |
DaReaper
Net 7
1190
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Posted - 2014.11.05 15:41:46 -
[114] - Quote
Amak Boma wrote:i have an option
comet mining could be very nice idea and is it , but it cant be hat easy player must navigate his mining barge/industrial throught debris fields and approac on comet orbit lets say 10 km. now deploy some sort of structure that need be anchored on surface of comet it could extract ice , water and gases from comet. extraction process could take untill mining platform storage is full also radius of comet should say how much resources has it
radius 550km 20 ice 1000 water 2000 noble gases radius 700km 50 ice 2200 water 3729 noble gases radius 900m 72 ice 3000 water 4204 noble gases radius 1100m 94 ice 5225 water 6224 noble gases radius 1400m 102 ice 6119 water 7548 noble gases
its just example , resources could be in different amount and type of course along comet radius
we would need a new mining barge type - excavator would be like retriever but capable of mining comets only the industrial ship could be able to deploy the structure to mine the comet itself but player need fly closer to grab ined materials. also new venture "prospect" could be capable of mining comet. what else?
new skillbook :comet extraction 1lvl takes 8 minutes 2lvl takes 24 minutes 3lvl takes 3 hours and 20 minutes 4lvl takes day and 5 hours 5lvl takes 4days and 2 hours
each skill allow you to use one comet mining laser per level and deploy one comet extractor platform per level.
restrictions 1 extractor structure per 1 comet 10 - 50 cmets per solar system but
7 comets in security system 1.0 14 comets in security system 0.9 20 comets in security system 0.8 24 comets in security system 0.7 31 comets in security system 0.6 37 comets in security system 0.5 40 comets in security system 0.4 47 comets in security system 0.3 52 comets in security system 0.2 58 comets in security system 0.1 70comets in security system 0.0 comets from 0.0 to -1.0 could spawn 10 more per system so in -1.0 you will find the most comets
comet spawning area : near sun , near planets. comets would be needed to be probed down with scanning probes.
my issue with a deployable structure that goes on the comet is then I just fly to comet, match speed, deploy structure, go dock, come back in an hour or so, and get my stuff. repeat.
My main point is to make it something you have to do actively. You need to be adjusting speeds or monitoring yoru shields or something.
OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!
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DaReaper
Net 7
1190
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Posted - 2014.11.05 15:42:58 -
[115] - Quote
Caja Wrython wrote:Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote:Caja Wrython wrote:We need this adding before I die of old age, I'm 34, run with it CCP.
I like the grapple/tractor beam idea to latch on to the comet while its moving... I'd actually be against the grapple/tractor as this defeats the point of the comet being fast moving and rewuiring active piloting to chase down/mine. I'd even go as far as to limit the ability to orbit it automatically but that might be a bit evil :D Humm yeah want to discourage AFK'ers, ok I stand corrected. I would want this to be something you needed your corp mates for, something you can't do solo, someone has to do Y while some does X to collect the goodness.
I don't mind anchoring or a tractor beam... but on most normal ships it would put a lot of hull stress and could randomly do damage. But if you had a T3 ship designed to do that...
naw, I still want it to be an active activity
OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!
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DaReaper
Net 7
1218
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Posted - 2014.11.10 17:14:44 -
[116] - Quote
Bump.. gimme more likes!!!!@@!#@#!@#$! Mining needs a shake up. Bring on the Comets!
OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!
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per
Terpene Conglomerate
24
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Posted - 2014.11.10 17:32:23 -
[117] - Quote
response from some dev would be cool, like: yes / maybe in next ten years / never?
also +1 to the topic, so many corp/ally buddies were looking for this feature when it was presented back then ... still some talks about it from time to time ... it has such potential if done well ... id love this and i dont even mine ;) |
Bearcastle
Bionesis Technologies
13
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Posted - 2014.11.10 19:36:05 -
[118] - Quote
Bump |
per
Terpene Conglomerate
24
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Posted - 2014.11.12 16:16:51 -
[119] - Quote
2014 humans landed on a comet few decades later, all comets mined out no more comets for us ;) |
DaReaper
Net 7
1224
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Posted - 2014.11.12 16:22:14 -
[120] - Quote
per wrote:2014 humans landed on a comet few decades later, all comets mined out no more comets for us ;)
lol I just want to mine them in eve... come on ccp make it happen!!!!! ;)
OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!
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