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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
832
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Posted - 2014.04.04 17:47:00 -
[1] - Quote
I am not calling out fail of new players, but there is a recurring circle of fail that appears so blatant to my eyes, I am actually gobsmacked (yes GOBSMACKED) that CCP hasn't simply done this already...
Consider the recurring theme..the constant, every..fricken...day...theme....
1) New player joins EvE online and is deposited in 'high security' space 2) New player assumes high-security means 100% safe 3) New player gets ganked/scammed/awoxed/suspect baited/bumped 4) New player spergs and quits EvE to return to WoW 5) Goto step 1
How do we break this circle of fail that is based upon setting unreal expectations in the minds of new players?
This. (see proposed SIMPLE solution at bottom...)
For in my humble opinion, half the battle is just setting expectations up front properly, rather than setting the bears up for a later tranny surprise.
F Would you like to know more? |
Tyrendian Biohazard
Ubiquitous Hurt Exodus.
266
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Posted - 2014.04.04 17:54:00 -
[2] - Quote
Some believe that it is a test to see if a person truly belongs in New Eden.
Others call this a spam post for your blog. My twitch stream to help new players: http://www.twitch.tv/biohazrd51
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Herzav
Perkone Caldari State
16
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Posted - 2014.04.04 17:55:00 -
[3] - Quote
There's only so much that you can convey with words when it comes to the ''EvE is harsh motto'' Experience is the best teacher in my opinion. After doing the tutorial and living in hisec for a bit, it's up to the noob if he decides to move into low/null sec. |
Thorus Gallen
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2014.04.04 18:18:00 -
[4] - Quote
As somebody who is still relatively new and has performed the Circle of Fail (I mine in a Venture and make batteries) more than once since first joining in 2008, here is my .02:
If you can't handle getting ganked on your first ill-advised trip to .4, how are you going to handle losing a 220Bn Titan in an epic corporate battle? You got podded in a frigate? Cry me a river and come back after you've lost a cruiser in battle.
Eve ... is ... harsh. HTFU or move on. |
Klymer
Hedion University Amarr Empire
535
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Posted - 2014.04.04 18:54:00 -
[5] - Quote
OP either post what you have to say here so others can discuss and critique it or don't bother.
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Feyd Rautha Harkonnen
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
832
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Posted - 2014.04.04 18:56:00 -
[6] - Quote
Klymer wrote:OP either post what you have to say here so others can discuss and critique it or don't bother.
I did.
Would you like to know more? |
Kharaxus
Native Freshfood Minmatar Republic
44
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Posted - 2014.04.04 19:01:00 -
[7] - Quote
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote: Consider the recurring theme..the constant, every..fricken...day...theme....
1) New player joins EvE online and is deposited in 'high security' space 2) New player assumes high-security means 100% safe 3) New player gets ganked/scammed/awoxed/suspect baited/bumped 4) New player spergs and quits EvE to return to WoW 5) Goto step 1
How do we break this circle of fail that is based upon setting unreal expectations in the minds of new players?
1. 16 year old goes downtown to find a prostitute. 2. 16 year old attempts an act he has never done before only to discover the prostitute isn't female. 3. 16 year old runs away in fear having learned his lesson while prostitute laughs. 4. 16 year old wakes up the next day to try it again. 5. Back to 1.
How do we break this circle of fail that is based upon setting unreal expectations in the minds of new players? |
J'Poll
CDG Playgrounds Affirmative.
3934
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Posted - 2014.04.04 21:00:00 -
[8] - Quote
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote:I am not calling out fail of new players, but there is a recurring circle of fail that appears so blatant to my eyes, I am actually gobsmacked (yes GOBSMACKED) that CCP hasn't simply done this already... Consider the recurring theme..the constant, every..fricken...day...theme.... 1) New player joins EvE online and is deposited in 'high security' space 2) New player assumes high-security means 100% safe 3) New player gets ganked/scammed/awoxed/suspect baited/bumped 4) New player spergs and quits EvE to return to WoW 5) Goto step 1 How do we break this circle of fail that is based upon setting unreal expectations in the minds of new players? This. (see proposed SIMPLE solution at bottom...) For in my humble opinion, half the battle is just setting expectations up front properly, rather than setting the bears up for a later tranny surprise. F
Very simple.
Instead of making posts like this, actually be friendly and help/assist new players to overcome the hurdles.
And I don't see it as a failing system, I see it as a great way to seperate the grain from the chaf. Those that don't make it and go back to WoW weren't cut out for EVE anyway (no offence to them, each their own taste of game). What remains are the new players that are very worth putting effort in, every minute you can spare. Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy
Ever wanted to PvP but can't find people to fly with. Look no further and this chat: Redemption Road |
Oshia Launay
Galactic Fringe Inc
2
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Posted - 2014.04.04 21:06:00 -
[9] - Quote
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote:I am not calling out fail of new players, but there is a recurring circle of fail that appears so blatant to my eyes, I am actually gobsmacked (yes GOBSMACKED) that CCP hasn't simply done this already... Consider the recurring theme..the constant, every..fricken...day...theme.... 1) New player joins EvE online and is deposited in 'high security' space 2) New player assumes high-security means 100% safe 3) New player gets ganked/scammed/awoxed/suspect baited/bumped 4) New player spergs and quits EvE to return to WoW 5) Goto step 1 How do we break this circle of fail that is based upon setting unreal expectations in the minds of new players? This. (see proposed SIMPLE solution at bottom...) For in my humble opinion, half the battle is just setting expectations up front properly, rather than setting the bears up for a later tranny surprise. F In my opinion, the "community" has some soul searching to do first.
I'm a new player myself, and while I hardly care about all the ganking, scamming, 'awoxing', combat baiting, bumping, extortion, blobbing and what not, one thing has been quite blatant to me since I've joined EVE, and particularly reading forums: a significant segment of the 'community' consists of people who get their kick out of being, to put it quite simply: assholes. Call them trolls, griefers or whatever, they like nothing more than pissing off other players (see: 'collecting tears') and that mindset manifests itself well beyond the aforementioned activities (see 'bonus room'). Naturally, unsuspecting and vulnerable new players make perfect victims, and so they are picked on and ripped apart. Just as naturally, the perpetrators will invoke all sort of reasons why the victims are despicable subhuman (see: 'carebears') who deserve what they get (see: wearing a miniskirt).
That might throw off some new players.
For my part, I was hardly surprised to learn that people from various cesspits of the Internet (see: 4chan) made their home within EVE online. It shows.
The new player in EVE makes me think of a first time convict thrown into a supermax penitentiary. He gets the whistles on arrival; nobody wants to talk to him or associate with him in any fashion; he gets beaten to a pulp for sitting in someone's seat (which happens to be any seat he picks), for looking at someone the wrong way (which happens to be any way he looks at someone), or for stepping over some invisible line into some gang's territory in the courtyard (roughly the whole courtyard); he gets stabbed by some gang member ordered to do so in a test of loyalty, what little possessions he has are forcibly taken from him (after he's beaten to a pulp yet again); and he's informed by someone that from now on, his punk arse does not belong to him anymore. Guards don't care, and should he ever blabs to the warden, everything up to that point would feel like a jolly good time in retrospect.
Shockingly, some new players decide not to stick around. |
J'Poll
CDG Playgrounds Affirmative.
3934
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Posted - 2014.04.04 21:18:00 -
[10] - Quote
Tyrendian Biohazard wrote:Some believe that it is a test to see if a person truly belongs in New Eden.
Others call this a spam post for your blog.
Not others...that's just the sole reason for this post. Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy
Ever wanted to PvP but can't find people to fly with. Look no further and this chat: Redemption Road |
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ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors Late Night Alliance
5092
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Posted - 2014.04.04 22:03:00 -
[11] - Quote
"You, the new player, are an adorable golden haired child. You are released, but with a map, into a wilderness park teeming with thousand of rapacious pedophiles. If you are cunning, you can someday BECOME one of the pedophiles!" ~Malcanis
I fail to see a problem with this. :D Change isn't bad, but it isn't always good. Sometimes, the oldest and most simple of things can be the most elegant and effective. |
Chad Ramsbottom
University of Caille Gallente Federation
19
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Posted - 2014.04.04 22:25:00 -
[12] - Quote
ShahFluffers wrote:"You, the new player, are an adorable golden haired child. You are released, but with a map, into a wilderness park teeming with thousands of rapacious pedophiles. If you are cunning, you can someday BECOME one of the pedophiles!" ~Malcanis
I fail to see a problem with this. :D
Only if, with hard work and dedication, I can become King Pedophile eventually |
Zan'der Hakaari
State War Academy Caldari State
2
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Posted - 2014.04.04 23:38:00 -
[13] - Quote
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote:blah blah blah....look at me!
F
The only true circle of fail here is you creating these look at me posts, the mods locking or deleting the posts and you creating yet another look at me post soon to be locked. |
J'Poll
CDG Playgrounds Affirmative.
3934
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Posted - 2014.04.05 01:05:00 -
[14] - Quote
ShahFluffers wrote:"You, the new player, are an adorable golden haired child. You are released, but with a map, into a wilderness park teeming with thousands of rapacious pedophiles. If you are cunning, you can someday BECOME one of the pedophiles!" ~Malcanis
I fail to see a problem with this. :D
Aah Malcanis, the king of awesome quotes. Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy
Ever wanted to PvP but can't find people to fly with. Look no further and this chat: Redemption Road |
J'Poll
CDG Playgrounds Affirmative.
3934
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Posted - 2014.04.05 01:07:00 -
[15] - Quote
LOL.
Look at his posting history, the only thing said OP can post is links to his blog, as apparantly if he doesn't nobody will visit it. Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy
Ever wanted to PvP but can't find people to fly with. Look no further and this chat: Redemption Road |
Ethikos
SniggWaffe WAFFLES.
1
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Posted - 2014.04.05 01:14:00 -
[16] - Quote
Frankly, the mechanics behind the "Circle of Fail" are what make EvE Online. There is risk in everything you do. At times the risk is very minimal, but it is still there. Frankly getting ganked in high sec in a newbie / cheap ship is kind of a silly argument. Unless you aggressed the ganker (unlikely), the ganker is going to die to Concord. Ask yourself what the ganker gained? They got a killmail that no one will care about, they got extremely minimal loot, and they lost their ship.
As the new player moves out of the safe space into more dangerous space, yes the risk increases. That is all part of the EvE learning cycle and what makes EvE so intriguing in my view. There is a real risk of your actions having negative consequences in game terms. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=266074 - Sniggwaffe (Waffles)
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Feyd Rautha Harkonnen
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
832
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Posted - 2014.04.05 03:39:00 -
[17] - Quote
J'Poll wrote: ... Very simple.
Instead of making posts like this, actually be friendly and help/assist new players to overcome the hurdles. ...
No, you pansy.
In fact, for your heresy against an ambassador of HTFU trying to perform a service to the community, I regretfully add a +1 to the Kill-It-Forward queue. I will shoot a carebear in the face on your behalf, and GOD have mercy on your soul.
Your heresy, my hands, their blood, your conscience.
God wills it. Would you like to know more? |
J'Poll
CDG Playgrounds Affirmative.
3935
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Posted - 2014.04.05 03:45:00 -
[18] - Quote
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote:J'Poll wrote: ... Very simple.
Instead of making posts like this, actually be friendly and help/assist new players to overcome the hurdles. ...
No, you pansy. In fact, for your heresy against an ambassador of HTFU trying to perform a service to the community, I regretfully add a +1 to the Kill-It-Forward queue. I will shoot a carebear in the face on your behalf, and GOD have mercy on your soul. Your heresy, my hands, their blood, your conscience. God wills it.
And how much do you think I care about that. Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy
Ever wanted to PvP but can't find people to fly with. Look no further and this chat: Redemption Road |
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
832
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Posted - 2014.04.05 03:52:00 -
[19] - Quote
But you do seem to care, as you seem to follow me around like a lost puppy and pop up in every thread I am in to sperg abuse at me....
In fact, I feel tortured by you..your wanton abuse and preventing me from disengaging from this conflict because you made me invest so much time in this...its crossing the line.....you crossed the LINE! Your constant bickering with me....you.... but.... for... AUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGH
(sounds of head smacking on a desk repeatedly)
I am going to contact Ripard Teg immediately to see if he can do a blog post to gin up a witch hunt to get you banned Ero..er I mean J'Poll
...THEN I am going to shoot a carebear in the face. Would you like to know more? |
Anslo
Scope Works
4771
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Posted - 2014.04.05 03:59:00 -
[20] - Quote
Man Feyd you're desperate for attention aren't you? Sad really...
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Feyd Rautha Harkonnen
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
832
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Posted - 2014.04.05 04:05:00 -
[21] - Quote
Anslo wrote:Man Feyd you're desperate for attention aren't you? Sad really... Thanks for the bump Anslo!
What are your thoughts on the circle of fail though? How did you escape it? Surely a better tutorial would help wouldnt it?
(checks Anslo's KB...)
Oh...perhaps I spoke too soon. No soup for you.
NEXT! Would you like to know more? |
WouldYouEver HaveSexWith aGoat
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
54
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Posted - 2014.04.05 04:25:00 -
[22] - Quote
Kind of sad seeing how people in this community react to a reasonable suggestion like the OP is making. Did this OP perhaps upset any of you before this? As the suggestion seems quite sound.
How is more information ever a bad thing? Every time these new players come here and whine about a loss, scam, awox, etc, the reaction here "learn to play". Really? Learn to play, but you don't want to provide information to learn with.
As Cenk would say, "think about it..." |
Yarda Black
Epidemic. Nulli Secunda
102
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Posted - 2014.04.05 10:10:00 -
[23] - Quote
This may sound odd but...
I don't want to break that circle.
Every time I run into somebody, I'd like that person to have gone through all kinds of trouble. By the time we meet, I want that new player to have hardened up. I want him/her to know he/she can lose stuff. I definitely want him/her knowing I can lose stuff by blowing me up.
So...
This hurdle new players have to deal with? This phenomenon where people who cant stand losing stuff and not being safe all the time leave? Fan right here. |
Haedonism Bot
Revolutionary Front
1064
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Posted - 2014.04.05 11:21:00 -
[24] - Quote
J'Poll wrote:LOL.
Look at his posting history, the only thing said OP can post is links to his blog, as apparantly if he doesn't nobody will visit it.
Yes, he whores his blog pretty shamelessly on the forums. But to be fair, it's probably the second most entertaining active EVE blog out there right now, and contains lots of helpful info for newbies. www.everevolutionaryfront.blogspot.com
Psychotic Monk for CSM9 |
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ISD Ezwal
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
1099
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Posted - 2014.04.05 13:43:00 -
[25] - Quote
Thread locked.
The Rules: 18. New player bashing will not be tolerated.
New members of the EVE Online community are encouraged to use, but are not restricted to the EVE New Citizens Q&A forum. This forum is specifically designed to provide a platform for those who are new to the EVE community to ask questions and learn more about EVE. More experienced forum users are encouraged to participate by assisting new players with helpful and courteous responses. All flaming, trolling and posts of a derogatory nature will be deleted, and will be considered a severe breach of the forum rules. ISD Ezwal Captain Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department |
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