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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 17 post(s) |
Jenn aSide
STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries
5778
|
Posted - 2014.04.08 20:41:00 -
[631] - Quote
Rain6637 wrote:Jenn aSide wrote:Tyberius Franklin wrote:I'm not saying sentry use is the end of all things, just that having the option is nice, and now the gila doesn't. All around I see it as losing flexibility, and not much of a max DPS boost, or any major boost, in exchange. for people willing to maintain a fleet and use the absolute best tool for the job on an individual basis that's great. For more generalist use cases other drone ships will be better. I don't see that as doing the gila any favors in a game of hardwire optimizations.
The problem is the ishtar, meaning less use of the current Gila. It becomes the "Domi vs Rattlesnake" just with cruisers, unless you need a bunch of passive shield tank, why use a 'Sanke for pve when a Domi can get almost as much dps with just drones (and more with guns) for 1/4th the cost. The ishtar isn't that expensive, but after a pilot can fly an ishtar, there just isn't much need for the Gila which is why you see Ishtars doing PVE stuff in Guristas space rather than the actual Gurista's Cruiser. With the kin/therm bonus, extra launcher and bonused to hell hammerheads that are better against small targets close in the Gila actually has something of an edge over the ishtar for the 1st time i can remember. I'm not kidding, I'm going to fly that sucker till the armor shakes off in Serp/guristas pve.. what missions or PVE are you running, because I can't think of many lucrative ones that plant you close to your targets, close enough that mediums are the best option.
I get Buzz kill and gone berserk a lot, and pirate invasion. Forsaken Hubs , Forsaken Rally Points and Havens (pirate gate version) all spawn ships at a central point. And I use ogres not mediums, but after this change it will be mediums. Remember that drones will also be faster. And unlike the people who use Gilas for sentries, I actually have a prop mod on mine and am flying after my heavies. |
Jenn aSide
STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries
5779
|
Posted - 2014.04.08 20:52:00 -
[632] - Quote
Nash MacAllister wrote:Jenn aSide wrote: You mean like the Ogre IIs i already use in pve? with my Gila and Domi?
Prepare to be amazed then lol. How can so many pve jocks be so clueless about pve? Isn't that what a PVE player is supposed to know about?
Then you, my ignorant (or possibly just trolling/dumb) friend, are probably the slowest PVE'er in the game. Targets at zero, yep, Ogre's tear them up. Everything else, which is most of PVE targets? Yeah, Ogre's are not going to make it.
Which is why they make these thigns called Drone nav comps, which I use on my Domi (not the gila).
And how can I be the wrost PVEr in the game when several of you have demonstrated that you either don't know how to keep arrgo off drones or don't want to take the effort to do so lol?
Quote: Fighting at zero = most of w-space PVP. Certainly I'll take some bonuses to heavies thanks. Who said the Gila had to solely be a PVE ship?
Absolutly no one. I am a pve player, I am addressing the ridiculas notion that the new Gila is somehow going to suck at pve because it no long has the sentry crutch people have been relying on since the NPC AI change instead of learning how to actually play. A Gila PVPr can address the pvp concerns if they wish.
This discussion is exactly like the Faction Battleship discussion. When CCP announced the changes, people who couldn't see how much the changes to the Navy Raven were gonna rock (aka EFT warriors) cried foul and predicted that no one would use the new Navy Raven for pve because "you can get just as much dps from a regular raven or navy scorp and more from the Fleet Typhooon!!!!1". They called those of us who tried to explain why the new Navy Raven was going to rock "delusional".
They predicted that Navy Ravens would, by now, cost less than Rattlesnakes because no one would fly it because it sucks.
Here, many months later, the Navy Raven is a very well regarded pve ship and even after the markets settled down is STILL way more expensive to by than the Fleet Typhoon (don't get me wrong, the Fleet phoon is great and I fly it, but the Navy Raven is something special....which we tried to explain way back then lol). |
Shepard Wong Ogeko
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
730
|
Posted - 2014.04.08 20:52:00 -
[633] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:Rain6637 wrote:Jenn aSide wrote:Tyberius Franklin wrote:I'm not saying sentry use is the end of all things, just that having the option is nice, and now the gila doesn't. All around I see it as losing flexibility, and not much of a max DPS boost, or any major boost, in exchange. for people willing to maintain a fleet and use the absolute best tool for the job on an individual basis that's great. For more generalist use cases other drone ships will be better. I don't see that as doing the gila any favors in a game of hardwire optimizations.
The problem is the ishtar, meaning less use of the current Gila. It becomes the "Domi vs Rattlesnake" just with cruisers, unless you need a bunch of passive shield tank, why use a 'Sanke for pve when a Domi can get almost as much dps with just drones (and more with guns) for 1/4th the cost. The ishtar isn't that expensive, but after a pilot can fly an ishtar, there just isn't much need for the Gila which is why you see Ishtars doing PVE stuff in Guristas space rather than the actual Gurista's Cruiser. With the kin/therm bonus, extra launcher and bonused to hell hammerheads that are better against small targets close in the Gila actually has something of an edge over the ishtar for the 1st time i can remember. I'm not kidding, I'm going to fly that sucker till the armor shakes off in Serp/guristas pve.. what missions or PVE are you running, because I can't think of many lucrative ones that plant you close to your targets, close enough that mediums are the best option. I get Buzz kill and gone berserk a lot, and pirate invasion. Forsaken Hubs , Forsaken Rally Points and Havens (pirate gate version) all spawn ships at a central point. And I use ogres not mediums, but after this change it will be mediums. Remember that drones will also be faster. And unlike the people who use Gilas for sentries, I actually have a prop mod on mine and am flying after my heavies.
Eve tells me my drone boat pilot can get 750 dps with Wasp II's in a Gila. I doubt it will get that much using 2 super buffed Vespas. I could make it up with adding missiles, but if I was going to kill rats with missiles I would just go with a Tengu and be able to run much more profitable sites. |
Lugia3
Emerald Inc. Easily Excited
931
|
Posted - 2014.04.08 20:53:00 -
[634] - Quote
Xequecal wrote:Nash MacAllister wrote:Jenn aSide wrote: You mean like the Ogre IIs i already use in pve? with my Gila and Domi?
Prepare to be amazed then lol. How can so many pve jocks be so clueless about pve? Isn't that what a PVE player is supposed to know about?
Then you, my ignorant (or possibly just trolling/dumb) friend, are probably the slowest PVE'er in the game. Targets at zero, yep, Ogre's tear them up. Everything else, which is most of PVE targets? Yeah, Ogre's are not going to make it. Fighting at zero = most of w-space PVP. Certainly I'll take some bonuses to heavies thanks. Who said the Gila had to solely be a PVE ship? I'm pretty sure that the Gila will output more drone DPS against T3s than an Ishtar with Ogres. Even with a tracking bonus, Ogres will not apply full DPS to cruisers.
Ogres have a sig res of 125. "CCP Dolan is full of ****." - CCP Bettik |
Jenn aSide
STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries
5779
|
Posted - 2014.04.08 20:53:00 -
[635] - Quote
Shepard Wong Ogeko wrote:
Eve tells me my drone boat pilot can get 750 dps with Wasp II's in a Gila. I doubt it will get that much using 2 super buffed Vespas. I could make it up with adding missiles, but if I was going to kill rats with missiles I would just go with a Tengu and be able to run much more profitable sites.
If you aren't using missiles with a Gila right now, you're already much better off with an Ishtar. |
Torei Dutalis
IceBox Inc.
10
|
Posted - 2014.04.08 20:59:00 -
[636] - Quote
Good to see that the cynabal is now going to be sitting at an appropriate power grid. To be honest I'd still like to see the ship not having changes to its mass/speed/agility. Tweaking the ship's iconic speed and agility seems unnecessary. I'd also parrot the opinion that the warp speed bonus is extremely lackluster. Sure it's better than no bonus, but the point about how often do you put warp speed rigs on your cruisers still rings true. |
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1080
|
Posted - 2014.04.08 21:00:00 -
[637] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:Nash MacAllister wrote:Jenn aSide wrote: You mean like the Ogre IIs i already use in pve? with my Gila and Domi?
Prepare to be amazed then lol. How can so many pve jocks be so clueless about pve? Isn't that what a PVE player is supposed to know about?
Then you, my ignorant (or possibly just trolling/dumb) friend, are probably the slowest PVE'er in the game. Targets at zero, yep, Ogre's tear them up. Everything else, which is most of PVE targets? Yeah, Ogre's are not going to make it. Which is why they make these thigns called Drone nav comps, which I use on my Domi (not the gila). And how can I be the wrost PVEr in the game when several of you have demonstrated that you either don't know how to keep arrgo off drones or don't want to take the effort to do so lol? ... Absolutly no one. I am a pve player, I am addressing the ridiculas notion that the new Gila is somehow going to suck at pve because it no long has the sentry crutch people have been relying on since the NPC AI change instead of learning how to actually play. A Gila PVPr can address the pvp concerns if they wish. You stated it requires RR+ewar, which means reconfiguring my boat to sustain that when one of them, if the strategy works, I won't need since all the damage will come in to my local tank. That isn't really a worthwhile effort when I can just use sentries in most cases. You call it a crutch, I think it's using the right tool for the job.
It undoubtedly did lose PvE flexibility.
|
Waktaku Aek
Ministry of War Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2014.04.08 21:06:00 -
[638] - Quote
Thanks for having an ear to the community and reconsidering the heavy nerf on the Cynabal and picking one of the suggested specific trait in this thread.
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Jenn aSide
STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries
5780
|
Posted - 2014.04.08 21:13:00 -
[639] - Quote
Tyberius Franklin wrote:You stated it requires RR+ewar, which means reconfiguring my boat to sustain that when one of them, if the strategy works, I won't need since all the damage will come in to my local tank.
The point is that you use the RR to keep aggro off your drones and perhaps fleet mates in the site/mission with you.
This solves the problem of not being able to bring newbs in weaker ships to observe ( a concern voiced by many at the time of the NPC AI change), allows you to being in a high dps/low tank alt to help clear or allows you to bring an alt in a noctis (or a new bro in a salvage frig) to sweep up even faster than bookmarking and coming back .
Quote: That isn't really a worthwhile effort when I can just use sentries in most cases. You call it a crutch, I think it's using the right tool for the job.
It undoubtedly did lose PvE flexibility.
Even if so, the thing will actually be more fun to fly. I use mine as a mobile heavy drone brawler already, this is just making it that much better. And how much flexibility does a ship that doesn't get much current use need? |
Shepard Wong Ogeko
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
730
|
Posted - 2014.04.08 21:13:00 -
[640] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:Shepard Wong Ogeko wrote:
Eve tells me my drone boat pilot can get 750 dps with Wasp II's in a Gila. I doubt it will get that much using 2 super buffed Vespas. I could make it up with adding missiles, but if I was going to kill rats with missiles I would just go with a Tengu and be able to run much more profitable sites.
If you aren't using missiles with a Gila right now, you're already much better off with an Ishtar.
The missiles on the Gila currently don't have any damage bonus. I'd make more isk/hr dropping and orbiting an MTU and putting salvagers in the highs. Overall, why pick a drone boat and then bother with locking rats and stocking ammo?
Ishtar is hands down better at pure drone ratting because it gets velocity and tracking bonuses, so it applies damage faster/better. I think that is something missing from a lot of the discussion of the changes to the Guristas ships. The Gallente ships get damage and velocity/tracking bonuses. While high dps numbers look awesome, the other bonuses mean that the damage is better applied. |
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Michael Harari
Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
1145
|
Posted - 2014.04.08 21:14:00 -
[641] - Quote
Lisa Sophie d'Elancourt wrote:What's the reason CCP decided neutrons can't be fitted in vigilant? Give up pg penalty.
Neutrons fit fine. With ions you can even fit double 1600 plate
[Vigilant, New Setup 2] 1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I Internal Force Field Array I Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Experimental 10MN Microwarpdrive I Warp Disruptor II Federation Navy Stasis Webifier Federation Navy Stasis Webifier
Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Antimatter Charge M
Medium Trimark Armor Pump II Medium Trimark Armor Pump II Medium Ancillary Current Router II |
Arthur Aihaken
Arsenite
3253
|
Posted - 2014.04.08 21:15:00 -
[642] - Quote
Waktaku Aek wrote:Thanks for having an ear to the community and reconsidering the heavy nerf on the Cynabal and picking one of the suggested specific trait in this thread. "Thanks for not f**king up the Cynabal?" It used to be we praised people for doing a good job, not for when they repeatedly screw up and the community forces them to do a 180-¦. Making any decision is preferable to indecision, but we also hope that people learn from their mistakes and stop making bad decisions, too (rapid launchers, NestorGǪ). I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week. |
Liam Inkuras
Justified Chaos
918
|
Posted - 2014.04.08 21:16:00 -
[643] - Quote
Thank you Rise so much for hearing our calls that were drowned out by the clamour, and giving the Angel lineup a warp speed bonus. You have just made many BSB residents very happy I wear my goggles at night.
Any spelling/grammatical errors come complimentary with my typing on a phone |
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1080
|
Posted - 2014.04.08 21:19:00 -
[644] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:Even if so, the thing will actually be more fun to fly. I use mine as a mobile heavy drone brawler already, this is just making it that much better. And how much flexibility does a ship that doesn't get much current use need? I would think the answer to that would be all that it can get. Also I found situational drone swapping to be nice as far as making a drone ship fun to fly. For this ship there is only 1 "right" type of drone which strikes me as less fun, but to each their own.
|
Mike Voidstar
Voidstar Free Flight Foundation
519
|
Posted - 2014.04.08 21:31:00 -
[645] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:Tyberius Franklin wrote:You stated it requires RR+ewar, which means reconfiguring my boat to sustain that when one of them, if the strategy works, I won't need since all the damage will come in to my local tank. The point is that you use the RR to keep aggro off your drones and perhaps fleet mates in the site/mission with you. This solves the problem of not being able to bring newbs in weaker ships to observe ( a concern voiced by many at the time of the NPC AI change), allows you to being in a high dps/low tank alt to help clear or allows you to bring an alt in a noctis (or a new bro in a salvage frig) to sweep up even faster than bookmarking and coming back . Quote: That isn't really a worthwhile effort when I can just use sentries in most cases. You call it a crutch, I think it's using the right tool for the job.
It undoubtedly did lose PvE flexibility.
Even if so, the thing will actually be more fun to fly. I use mine as a mobile heavy drone brawler already, this is just making it that much better. And how much flexibility does a ship that doesn't get much current use need?
RR & Ewar keeping aggro off drones is a myth or a bad joke. It does work if you have more than 3 fleetmates, but it wont keep the aggro off you fleet either, you just lose fewer drones.
You claim to be a PVE pilot, but you must not be using drones regularly. If you were you would have done the same tests and experienced the same stupidity of missions staying locked on your drones on a regular basis. Even calling them in and waiting 5 minutes wont help when the AI decides drones need to die. I have done tests where I used Target Painters and Webs on enemies, RR on my fleet and then launced and immediately recalled light drones after holding them 5 minutes. Often a light would make it back in structure, but more often I would lose a light and a second would make it back in armor.
The RR/Ewar thing is only effective intermittantly, and almost never without fleetmates on grid. AI has a point where it just wants drones dead, and once it is reached you either use sentries or yku may as well reshjp.
I hope the new direction of Gurista helps with that, because drones need something to help them survive in the environment badly. |
Ganthrithor
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
849
|
Posted - 2014.04.08 21:39:00 -
[646] - Quote
CCP Rise wrote:Alright, you guys are getting major real time updates here, I might as well start live tweeting our meetings!
With regards to the Cynabal - we are not going to try and add some kind of web/scram immunity/resistance. While this kind of bonus would certainly be fun, it would force us to make severe changes to all three Angel ships to compensate for the increased power, which would surely feel terrible for all the people enjoying them now. This would be especially true for PVE players who couldn't make use of the new bonus but would be stuck with a much worse ship than they are used to.
The option we do feel good about is warp speed. It supports the hit and run playstyle that Angels are already best at without forcing us to make changes to the combat performance. So, we are looking at roughly a 50% increase in warp speed and acceleration for all three, putting the Cynabal at warp speed multiplier of 4.5, which is basically destroyer speed. I've also updated the OP with a new powergrid number.
We've also adjusted powergrid on the Ashimmu to make some more room for those PG heavy energy war mods.
We spent time playing with the Vigilant in a lot of different configurations and feel completely confident in the current fitting numbers.
Hope this makes you Angel fans more excited
Yeah, warp speed bonus sounds interesting. It will be nice on the Cynabal, but it will be a godsend on the Mach... I'd completely written the Mach off as a viable skirmishing ship when you guys changed the warp mechanics... it just became too slow to be useful.
I, too, was thinking about web resistance last night, but came to the conclusion that there was no way to balance it: either you'd have a token resistance bonus that wouldn't really make an appreciable difference in a fight, or you'd have a big enough bonus that it did make a difference-- in which case you'd be looking at some of the fastest ships in the game being nearly uncatchable.
The other bonus I used to think would be good on Angel ships was point/scram range, since they're kiting ships, and point range is one of Gallente's gimmicks. But with the tracking enhancer nerf, that bonus would be basically useless on the Cynabal. On the Dram it would let you use it as a great tackler for gangs (you'd have to forgo your damage application due to range, but whatever). On the Machariel it would be great, since while the Mach is really fast and nimble for a battleship, it's still a bit clumsy to kite with compared to a cruiser. A point range bonus would give you more room for maneuvering errors while kiting, and the long falloff of BS autocannons means you'd actually still be doing damage while staying at the edge of your point range. The poor Cynabal would be pretty shafted with the point range bonus though... what's the point of increased tackle range when you have to close to 20-25km to do any damage anyway?
I still think you guys should re-design the Vigilant. Give it a utility high by dropping a hardpoint and boosting the damage output of the remaining guns. Swap its web-strength bonus for a point/scram range bonus, and give web strength to the Ashimmu. |
Jenn aSide
STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries
5781
|
Posted - 2014.04.08 21:54:00 -
[647] - Quote
Mike Voidstar wrote:Jenn aSide wrote:Tyberius Franklin wrote:You stated it requires RR+ewar, which means reconfiguring my boat to sustain that when one of them, if the strategy works, I won't need since all the damage will come in to my local tank. The point is that you use the RR to keep aggro off your drones and perhaps fleet mates in the site/mission with you. This solves the problem of not being able to bring newbs in weaker ships to observe ( a concern voiced by many at the time of the NPC AI change), allows you to being in a high dps/low tank alt to help clear or allows you to bring an alt in a noctis (or a new bro in a salvage frig) to sweep up even faster than bookmarking and coming back . Quote: That isn't really a worthwhile effort when I can just use sentries in most cases. You call it a crutch, I think it's using the right tool for the job.
It undoubtedly did lose PvE flexibility.
Even if so, the thing will actually be more fun to fly. I use mine as a mobile heavy drone brawler already, this is just making it that much better. And how much flexibility does a ship that doesn't get much current use need? RR & Ewar keeping aggro off drones is a myth or a bad joke. It does work if you have more than 3 fleetmates, but it wont keep the aggro off you fleet either, you just lose fewer drones. You claim to be a PVE pilot, but you must not be using drones regularly. If you were you would have done the same tests and experienced the same stupidity of missions staying locked on your drones on a regular basis. Even calling them in and waiting 5 minutes wont help when the AI decides drones need to die. I have done tests where I used Target Painters and Webs on enemies, RR on my fleet and then launced and immediately recalled light drones after holding them 5 minutes. Often a light would make it back in structure, but more often I would lose a light and a second would make it back in armor. The RR/Ewar thing is only effective intermittantly, and almost never without fleetmates on grid. AI has a point where it just wants drones dead, and once it is reached you either use sentries or yku may as well reshjp. I hope the new direction of Gurista helps with that, because drones need something to help them survive in the environment badly.
then you are doing something wrong. With both the Domi and the Gila I land, find a structure belonging to the NPCs (like a bunker or wall) and Damp it, launch a can wih 1 missile and lock the can, and rep it (if in the domi, in the gila I lock and ogre and rep it when its in range, the Gila in Afterburning, set apporach on an ogre). Get aggro and launch ogre IIs. In 3 months I lost 4 or 5 of them total and rarely have to recall due to aggro switching. Again,if you arne't getting those results, you are doing soething wrong.
In null its even easier because I justt fit a Cetus ECM Burst. The heavies are better for semi AFK because of the small npcs who even at 100+k with sentries will sometimes get under the guns where as the heavies will eventually kill the little things.
This is with one ship on grid unless I brong my nooctis alt to semi afk salavge (salvage drones + MTU + ewar/logi/FoF gila means I can walk away for 5 minutes at a time, just need to come back and restart missiles.
Maybe you should try it again. |
Carmello Oskald
Little Hole
0
|
Posted - 2014.04.08 21:55:00 -
[648] - Quote
Ohh, hey look. The gila is not utilized as much as the ishtar due to the ishtar being a ton better even though gila is faction. Lets balance this out by making the gila even worse..... I get just under 600 dps on my gila, now its dropping down to 460 will all level Vs. I liked the idea of only 2 drones, but only medium drones is a ballache |
Callidus Marus
The Scope Gallente Federation
5
|
Posted - 2014.04.08 21:57:00 -
[649] - Quote
Well I looked at the Vigilant again and I think Rise is right.
The PG Reduction brings it more in line with the Deimos and makes fitting a bit harder. I don't belive it will hurt to much but I don't like it.
To the guys/girls that say the Vigilant is to powerfull:
I think most of you don't like the Web and have a problem with that bonus, which is understandable but I think it gives some uniquness to these 3 ships, and the vigilant is probably the worst to have it from these 3.
The guys saying the ship has to much damage and tank. Well I think it just don't. It's comparable to a deimos (more damage less tank).
You can counter a vigilant with kiting (correct 18.2 km web range with overheat faction and no links it normaly goes something arround 2100m/s)
And pretty much everyform of EWAR or energy warfare. ECM works Tracking disruption is harder because of the web but you can reduce null range Sensor dampening was viable before these changes. And neuts will kill it's cap pretty fast. ( All those monster numbers you read in this threat didn't had a cap booster and it only last for 1.5min on full usage)
Vigilants were never OP or an I win button.
|
Carmen Electra
Drunk Chaos
323
|
Posted - 2014.04.08 22:03:00 -
[650] - Quote
Callidus Marus wrote:Vigilants were never OP or an I win button.
Agreed. Seen lots of Ishtars and Deimoses. It's pretty rare to see Vigilants flying around. If they were broken, don't you think we'd see more people exploiting their brokenness?
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Mr Floydy
Questionable Ethics. Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork
194
|
Posted - 2014.04.08 22:06:00 -
[651] - Quote
Carmello Oskald wrote:now its dropping down to 460 will all level Vs.
Doing it wrong. I'm afraid you are just bad at fitting.
Why are you looking to fly it with only a single damage mod and no missiles? |
TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc Shadow Cartel
614
|
Posted - 2014.04.08 22:09:00 -
[652] - Quote
because if you can't make a fleet out of it, it's clearly not OP |
Redjon Gilead Aerten
Senex Legio
4
|
Posted - 2014.04.08 22:09:00 -
[653] - Quote
BadAssMcKill wrote:#38Posted: 2013.09.22 14:31 | Report P much can guarantee that much like HMLs, the drake, the cane and other stuff CCP will forget they buffed a load of stuff and nerf the Cynabal and Mach far too hard
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=279634&p=2
Back in september of last year.
Yep, it happened. |
Carmello Oskald
Little Hole
0
|
Posted - 2014.04.08 22:23:00 -
[654] - Quote
Mr Floydy wrote:Carmello Oskald wrote:now its dropping down to 460 will all level Vs. Doing it wrong. I'm afraid you are just bad at fitting. Why are you looking to fly it with only a single damage mod and no missiles?
You can only use 2 medium drones on the gila now..... I've estimated according to valkerie IIs Again, I havent got any missiles on my current fit and I do 600 dps with garde Is |
Lisa Sophie d'Elancourt
Empusa.
1
|
Posted - 2014.04.08 22:24:00 -
[655] - Quote
Naomi Anthar wrote:Wow thanks for keeping quiet substantial pwg nerf on vigilant while you save Cyna/Ashimmu !!! Gj Rise. Cynas should stay as good as they are and Ashimmu won't suffer with pwg since it won't fit one more med neut/nos at all. As someone noticed already you show clearly obssesional butthurt about vigilant. |
Sniper Smith
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
42
|
Posted - 2014.04.08 22:33:00 -
[656] - Quote
scorchlikeshiswhiskey wrote:When do we get a look at the rumored missile faction? Gonna take a shot in the dark and say probably around the same time as they ANNOUNCE them.
I wouldn't hold my breath for it being in the Summer Update.. They just finished introducing SOE and they are still trying to fix that. To add another missile faction means, since they already used up the "friendly pirate" faction, means they need to make a new enemy, new rats, maybe missions, area of nullsec, etc.
Best bet I would say would be next winter's update. I mean don't get me wrong, I'd love to see it in the summer, but I just don't see them getting to it by then. |
Naomi Anthar
321
|
Posted - 2014.04.08 22:43:00 -
[657] - Quote
So what now ?
We actually are coming to conclusion that poor serpentis ships are underpowered now ?
Come on , give me a break. Or i wll just pass on from laughing. |
Naomi Anthar
321
|
Posted - 2014.04.08 22:50:00 -
[658] - Quote
Lisa Sophie d'Elancourt wrote:Naomi Anthar wrote:Wow thanks for keeping quiet substantial pwg nerf on vigilant while you save Cyna/Ashimmu !!! Gj Rise. Cynas should stay as good as they are and Ashimmu won't suffer with pwg since it won't fit one more med neut/nos at all. As someone noticed already you show clearly obssesional butthurt about vigilant.
Yeah i'm butthurt about 90% webs. Not only me, i would say plenty of people are about serpentis ships. You got me. I'm butthurt, what you gonna do about it ? Not that butthurt as before tho - as some nerf did slip in for one of those "underpowered" hulls.
Obssesional ? As soon as topic will go down, same will happen with "obssesion" clearly making not really an obssesion.
I try to make an impact when impact can be made - aka when we can provide feedback.
Can't recall myself making single topic about serpentis being op. Hardly can call that my priority.
This balance pass is small victory tho, maybe BS changes can make me smile even more.
Now eat the nerf like a man. |
Carmen Electra
Drunk Chaos
323
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Posted - 2014.04.08 22:56:00 -
[659] - Quote
Naomi Anthar wrote:Yeah i'm butthurt about 90% webs.
So hop in a ship with 90% web yourself. That is literally the best way to get it nerfed (assuming that's what you want). If it's really that broken, players (grrr goons) will be exploiting it to death.
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Xavier Azabu
Pwn 'N Play Nulli Secunda
8
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Posted - 2014.04.08 23:08:00 -
[660] - Quote
Callidus Marus wrote:Well I looked at the Vigilant again and I think Rise is right.
The PG Reduction brings it more in line with the Deimos and makes fitting a bit harder. I don't belive it will hurt to much but I don't like it.
To the guys/girls that say the Vigilant is to powerfull:
I think most of you don't like the Web and have a problem with that bonus, which is understandable but I think it gives some uniquness to these 3 ships, and the vigilant is probably the worst to have it from these 3.
The guys saying the ship has to much damage and tank. Well I think it just don't. It's comparable to a deimos (more damage less tank).
You can counter a vigilant with kiting (correct 18.2 km web range with overheat faction and no links it normaly goes something arround 2100m/s)
And pretty much everyform of EWAR or energy warfare. ECM works Tracking disruption is harder because of the web but you can reduce null range Sensor dampening was viable before these changes. And neuts will kill it's cap pretty fast. ( All those monster numbers you read in this threat didn't had a cap booster and it only last for 1.5min on full usage)
Vigilants were never OP or an I win button.
Exactly, which is why they should do something else other than just nerfing the powergrid a bit in this pass. The tank on a Vigilant is not enough to justify its price or rarity.
It's sort of like trying to nerf a Thorax because it does more damage than most other T1 cruisers. Sure it does if it gets into that in-your-face range. But there are plenty of counters.
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