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Noden Vorpalstar
The Knights of Polaris
222
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Posted - 2014.04.11 02:08:00 -
[1] - Quote
ISHUKONE ADMINISTRATORS ANNOUNCE ARCURIO TAKEOVER BID
I am interested in Caldari Capsuleer reaction to this recent announcement.
It would appear that Ishukone's business and diplomacy tactics are moving along with results which may yet prove to the benefit of the Caldari people.
I would also like to know when The Federal Senate will make an official announcement to The Federation regarding these negotiations. |
Gosakumori Noh
Seraglio Hastatus Hagia Sophia
614
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Posted - 2014.04.11 03:38:00 -
[2] - Quote
I first read this as "Ishukone Announces Aritcio Takeover Bid," which was much more intriguing. Really, Aritcio darling, you should, you know, do it. Maybe team up with Catiz for the proxy fight. |
Agiri Falken
State War Academy Caldari State
155
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Posted - 2014.04.11 03:53:00 -
[3] - Quote
Well, since you asked for capsuleers, I'm getting left out. So tears. Very 'lone. On a serious note, I'd call it a solid first step. |
Pieter Tuulinen
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
3477
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Posted - 2014.04.11 03:54:00 -
[4] - Quote
Uhm, good? "You let one of them go, but that's nothing new is it? Every now and then a little victim is allowed to escape; because she smiled, because he's got freckles, because they begged. And that's how you live with yourself. That's how you slaughter millions." "Only a killer would know that..." |
Saya Ishikari
Akagi Initiative
287
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Posted - 2014.04.11 04:01:00 -
[5] - Quote
I'd say Ishukone has a penchant for taking on burdens, and am glad to see the storm of outrage turned into nothing more than a serving of crow for those railing against the progress made so far. I hope that Archurio can be rebuilt quickly, for the sake of those far more personally touched by all of this than us. |
Eran Mintor
Esoteric Philosophy
530
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Posted - 2014.04.11 08:21:00 -
[6] - Quote
Sounds good.
-Eran |
Anja Suorsa
Pyre Falcon Defence and Security Imperial Outlaws.
275
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Posted - 2014.04.11 09:19:00 -
[7] - Quote
Positive news if taken at face value. Impossible to judge the cost however while the results of the investigation are withheld, So I will refrain from judgement. |
TomHorn
Dragonaurs Ndrangheta.
204
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Posted - 2014.04.11 11:21:00 -
[8] - Quote
Very surprised Noden, on face value welcome it. How do you feel, about your goverment potentially handing back some of their control of the planet to the State. |
Nauplius
Hoi Andrapodistai
160
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Posted - 2014.04.11 11:25:00 -
[9] - Quote
The wrath of God does wax large against Arcurio. For near the city's center there does fester a giant sore, a large Minmatar district containing Arcurio's hub of prostitution and vice[1]. Such a place offends the holy eyes of God, and causes Him to withdraw His blessings from Arcurio, and so celestial debris does fall upon the city.
But there is yet hope for Arcurio. By ritual cleansing of the Minmatar district and the sacrificial blooding of Minmatar Republic citizens therein unto a holy and righteous God will Arcurio prove itself worthy of God's renewed blessing. Amen. Amarr Victor.
[1] EVE: Source, page 123 |
Andreus Ixiris
Duty.
4517
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Posted - 2014.04.11 11:39:00 -
[10] - Quote
As a capsuleer interested in detente between the State and the Federation, I'm feeling incredibly smug about how catastrophically idiotic everyone who was making noise about Ishukone being treasonous looks right now.
This is an important step on the road to peace. Mane 614
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Xindi Kraid
Priano Trans-Stellar State Services Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
745
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Posted - 2014.04.11 11:51:00 -
[11] - Quote
Wow reclaiming one of our cities from the Gallente. That's a real heinous act of true traitors isn't it? |
Nicole Graves
Pyre Falcon Defence and Security Imperial Outlaws.
46
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Posted - 2014.04.11 12:19:00 -
[12] - Quote
Without knowing the details of the agreement involved for both parties it is quite hard to judge what to make of this.
I don't understand why returning Arcurio to the Caldari demanded such secrecy but we'll probably find that out with the CEP investigation.
-Nicole Graves. |
Noden Vorpalstar
The Knights of Polaris
223
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Posted - 2014.04.11 12:20:00 -
[13] - Quote
TomHorn wrote:Very surprised Noden, on face value welcome it. How do you feel, about your goverment potentially handing back some of their control of the planet to the State.
Well seeing as there have been no official reports or news briefs publically released by The Federal Senate, I would like to know what sorts of agreements are being discussed.
Are The Senate and Ishukone working on ensuring the safety of all who live on the planet? Will businesses which have ties to the Federation be protected and allowed to compete in the changing environment? And how can the more moderate members of both The Federation and The State be brought in to further strengthen any diplomatic relations?
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Anja Suorsa
Pyre Falcon Defence and Security Imperial Outlaws.
275
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Posted - 2014.04.11 12:23:00 -
[14] - Quote
Nicole Graves wrote:Without knowing the details of the agreement involved for both parties it is quite hard to judge what to make of this.
I don't understand why returning Arcurio to the Caldari demanded such secrecy but we'll probably find that out with the CEP investigation.
-Nicole Graves.
Pretty much.
A lot of people counting chickens before they've hatched here. |
Agiri Falken
State War Academy Caldari State
160
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Posted - 2014.04.11 13:13:00 -
[15] - Quote
Anja Suorsa wrote:Positive news if taken at face value. Impossible to judge the cost however while the results of the investigation are withheld, So I will refrain from judgement. Pretty fair outlook, I'd say. Fast as this is going, we'll probably know soon. |
Stitcher
Alexylva Paradox
3527
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Posted - 2014.04.11 14:08:00 -
[16] - Quote
Anja Suorsa wrote:Positive news if taken at face value. Impossible to judge the cost however while the results of the investigation are withheld, So I will refrain from judgement.
I'd dispute that the cost is impossible to judge. As I said elsewhere, whatever the price may be, it must be A: within Ishukone's power to give, and B: not sufficient to cause them any major long-term financial or political difficulty.
While Ishukone may be authorised to serve as curators and caretakers of many districts on Home, they're NOT authorized to barter using assets that don't belong to them or to make unilateral political decisions which directly involve the rest of the State.
There's still a fairly long list of things they could authorise: an ISK lump sum, the establishment of Gallentean corporate and civil enclaves and arcologies in Ishukone-controlled planetary districts -manufacturing and research contracts at Ishukone facilities, a number of ships, a trade in proprietary technology and patents, the promise that they will pitch a policy idea to the CEP (without guarantee of acceptance), a guarantee to admit Senate human rights inspectors to Ishukone facilities and abide by their recommendations (within reason) for a minimum of five years... and so on.
What they couldn't authorise is stuff like swapping a Black Rise system, ending the militia conflict, or selling Jita 4-4 to the Federation Navy, because those things fall outside of their jurisdiction and authority. And they wouldn't do anything which would significantly destabilize them financially or politically because that would be counterproductive to the long-term interests of the corporation, the State and Home.
Ishukone doesn't write checks it can't cash. I strongly doubt that any price they could or would accept would be an unreasonable one. An in-character blog and a video: http://verinsjournal.blogspot.com http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tu1mbsgo738
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Diana Kim
State Protectorate Caldari State
1007
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Posted - 2014.04.11 15:17:00 -
[17] - Quote
Buying from fed scum, what does already belongs to us, is a humiliation to all Caldari.
There was time, when Caldari stood up from knees and took back our planet. Even the megacorp CEO and leader of the whole State fought in the battle together with regular soldiers. Don't forget about this.
We must treasure the sacrifice that many have made for our nation. |
Tiberious Thessalonia
True Slave Foundations Shaktipat Revelators
2141
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Posted - 2014.04.11 15:32:00 -
[18] - Quote
Diana Kim wrote:Buying from fed scum, what does already belongs to us, is a humiliation to all Caldari.
There was time, when Caldari stood up from knees and took back our planet. Even the megacorp CEO and leader of the whole State fought in the battle together with regular soldiers. Don't forget about this.
We must treasure the sacrifice that many have made for our nation.
Hate to say it but she has a point here. Buying back something that was stolen from you might get you back what ever it was, but it also brings profit to the person who stole it and gives them inducement to try it again. |
Claudia Osyn
Mythic Security Service
308
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Posted - 2014.04.11 15:39:00 -
[19] - Quote
Good for them. The lack of money is the root of all evil. |
Stitcher
Alexylva Paradox
3528
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Posted - 2014.04.11 15:47:00 -
[20] - Quote
Tiberious Thessalonia wrote:Buying back something that was stolen from you might get you back what ever it was, but it also brings profit to the person who stole it and gives them inducement to try it again.
I think at this point we've eliminated the most practical avenues of recovery that don't involve that particular downside.
It's a shame, but the fact is that we want Home back. Asking nicely didn't work at all: violence didn't work in the long run. Negotiation may have its own flaws, not least being that, I agree, we really shouldn't HAVE to pay for what is ours, but given that the alternative is, it seems, to never get it back at all then, well, I guess the thief gets paid.
We'll deal with any future attempts at theft as and when they happen, and if they do then we'll either successfully fend them off, or else we lose Home again, in which case we'll be able to add this approach as the third one on the list that didn't work and look for a new tactic. If on the other hand there are no future attempts...
Does it mean that the Federation's beaten us in that regard? Sure, you could argue that. The thing is, I reckon I can live with defeat if it means getting Home back. A defeat where you still get what you want has a very weak bite, and some objectives are worth swallowing your pride for. An in-character blog and a video: http://verinsjournal.blogspot.com http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tu1mbsgo738
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Gregory Na'Dare
The Knights of Polaris
40
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Posted - 2014.04.11 16:05:00 -
[21] - Quote
Noden Vorpalstar wrote:TomHorn wrote:Very surprised Noden, on face value welcome it. How do you feel, about your goverment potentially handing back some of their control of the planet to the State. Well seeing as there have been no official reports or news briefs publically released by The Federal Senate, I would like to know what sorts of agreements are being discussed. Are The Senate and Ishukone working on ensuring the safety of all who live on the planet? Will businesses which have ties to the Federation be protected and allowed to compete in the changing environment? And how can the more moderate members of both The Federation and The State be brought in to further strengthen any diplomatic relations? You didn't ask me particularly but I will give you an answer. Hearing the place you were born has just been traded away to an implacable enemy makes me nervous as h***. For me the desire for peace isn't nearly so great as wanting my friends and family to be safe. I just hope those responsible on both sides kept the costs in mind when they set the price. |
Stitcher
Alexylva Paradox
3529
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Posted - 2014.04.11 16:20:00 -
[22] - Quote
well, you can either adapt to changing circumstances and put in the work to ensure that the "implacable enemy" doesn't turn out to be the mirror-helmeted shockprod-swinging thugs you fear, or you can whine about it.
If you're worried about Caldari brutality, maybe it's time to start talking to us rather than insulting us by assuming that it's going to happen and making worried noises on GalNet. An in-character blog and a video: http://verinsjournal.blogspot.com http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tu1mbsgo738
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Pieter Tuulinen
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
3486
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Posted - 2014.04.11 16:28:00 -
[23] - Quote
You really used Shockprods? We were issued with Sicksticks and I always preferred them because of their lack of EM output. We used Shockprods once in a Civil Disobedience scenario and you could barely get messages through your helmet radios while they were fired up. "You let one of them go, but that's nothing new is it? Every now and then a little victim is allowed to escape; because she smiled, because he's got freckles, because they begged. And that's how you live with yourself. That's how you slaughter millions." "Only a killer would know that..." |
Makoto Priano
Priano Trans-Stellar State Services Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
6173
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Posted - 2014.04.11 16:31:00 -
[24] - Quote
Sicksticks?
Alright. So, I had basic drill and weapons training along with everyone else-- the usual twirl-an-old-rifle, field-strip-a-gun, shoot-some-targets, why-are-we-running-twenty-kilometers-oh-Maker stuff -- but didn't get much familiarization with non-lethal weapons.
Are these sonic? Or do they use narcotic injection methods? Priano Trans-Stellar: elegant solutions for the State's needs. |
Stitcher
Alexylva Paradox
3530
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Posted - 2014.04.11 16:38:00 -
[25] - Quote
Come on, have you ever known a modern professional security force use EITHER mirrored helmets or shockprods? I was expressing scorn for the things Na'Dare here is scared of.
No, we had NII* batons, shoulder-mounted TOLVID** systems and SID*** guns for riot work. Plus stick-and-shock rounds, gelbag rounds and emetic gas grenades****.
*Neural Impulse Inhibitor **Targeted Optical-spectrum Laser Visual Interference and Disruption ***Sonic Induced Disorientation ****Affectionately known as EGGs. An in-character blog and a video: http://verinsjournal.blogspot.com http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tu1mbsgo738
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Bryen Verrisai
EVE University Ivy League
144
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Posted - 2014.04.11 16:41:00 -
[26] - Quote
Sick sticks are sonic-based non-lethal weaponry. Effective, but their ethical legitimacy is a frequent topic of debate in the Federation. |
Morwen Lagann
Tyrathlion Interstellar
1154
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Posted - 2014.04.11 16:42:00 -
[27] - Quote
I really don't think Afraldir needs to be weaponized. Morwen Lagann CEO, Tyrathlion Interstellar |
Pieter Tuulinen
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
3486
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Posted - 2014.04.11 16:54:00 -
[28] - Quote
Bryen Verrisai wrote:Sick sticks are sonic-based non-lethal weaponry. Effective, but their ethical legitimacy is a frequent topic of debate in the Federation due to the unsettling effects of the weapon and speculated long-term side-effects.
I can't recall ever hearing complaints. Mind you, that wasn't my department. At least they don't cause contact burns, like Shockprods can in the rain or when deployed alongside watercannon.
As for mirrored helmets, can you imagine keeping those clean? "You let one of them go, but that's nothing new is it? Every now and then a little victim is allowed to escape; because she smiled, because he's got freckles, because they begged. And that's how you live with yourself. That's how you slaughter millions." "Only a killer would know that..." |
Noden Vorpalstar
The Knights of Polaris
225
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Posted - 2014.04.11 16:58:00 -
[29] - Quote
Stitcher wrote: I was expressing scorn for the things Na'Dare here is scared of.
Pilot Na'Dare's fears are not unwarranted. Keep in mind that he is Gallentean born on Caldari Prime. 'Home' is just as much a part of his life as it is ethnic Caldari.
None of us can say for sure yet, what may have been negotiated between The Senate and Ishukone, however it can be assumed that each side is giving up something. We can only wait to see what that cost is, and if it has been worth it. |
Stitcher
Alexylva Paradox
3530
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Posted - 2014.04.11 17:01:00 -
[30] - Quote
Can you imagine how heavy mirrored helmets would have to be to provide any real protection, for that matter?
Give me a solid opaque armour-composite covered with micro visual-spectrum sensor scales any time. Ishukone Watch Type 12 riot armor wasn't that far removed from the assault dropsuits worn by a DUST merc. Minus the shields and sophisticated EWAR systems, obviously. An in-character blog and a video: http://verinsjournal.blogspot.com http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tu1mbsgo738
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