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Ole' McDolan
Vastly Intellectual Tall Tax Union
0
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Posted - 2014.04.13 12:26:00 -
[1] - Quote
Hello, what would be the best hybrid turret ship for running l4 security missions?
I prefer shooting from longer distance and using shield to tank(since I have SP invested into shield tanking already)
Thanks |
Ralph King-Griffin
Var Foundation inc.
709
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Posted - 2014.04.13 12:32:00 -
[2] - Quote
Rohk Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼a«£¦¬¦P¦¬a«£Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼ -á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-áIf In Doubt....Do....Excessively. Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼a«£¦¬¦P¦¬a«£Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼
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Ole' McDolan
Vastly Intellectual Tall Tax Union
0
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Posted - 2014.04.13 12:48:00 -
[3] - Quote
How should I fit it? |
Anize Oramara
S T R A T C O M Critical-Mass
158
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Posted - 2014.04.13 12:57:00 -
[4] - Quote
With hybrids |
Ralph King-Griffin
Var Foundation inc.
709
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Posted - 2014.04.13 13:57:00 -
[5] - Quote
And shields Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼a«£¦¬¦P¦¬a«£Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼ -á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-áIf In Doubt....Do....Excessively. Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼a«£¦¬¦P¦¬a«£Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼Gû¼
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Nolen Cadmar
Nexus Ore Technologies and Excavations Surely You're Joking
165
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Posted - 2014.04.13 19:31:00 -
[6] - Quote
You could try something like this. Total cost is ~290 M. If you want more tank, upgrade the booster to a deadspace. A Pith B-Type XL is ~70 M. You could also upgrade the hardeners.
[Rokh, L4 Mission Rokh]
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Power Diagnostic System II
X-Large Shield Booster II Large Micro Jump Drive Pith C-Type Kinetic Deflection Field Pith C-Type Thermic Dissipation Field Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Script Sensor Booster II, Targeting Range Script
425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L 425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L 425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L 425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L 425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L 425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L 425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L 425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I Large Capacitor Control Circuit I Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Insert drones of choice. Nolen's Spreadsheet Guru Services: Need a spreadsheet created, maintained, updated or repaired? Learn more about my services at:-á https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3865379 |
stoicfaux
4485
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Posted - 2014.04.13 19:47:00 -
[7] - Quote
Kronos, the rep bonus and bastion mode will more than make up for deficient armor skills.
WASABI: Warp Acceleration System Ancillary Boost Injected(Gäó)
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
11142
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Posted - 2014.04.14 11:22:00 -
[8] - Quote
stoicfaux wrote:Kronos, the rep bonus and bastion mode will more than make up for deficient armor skills.
This man speaks truth.
Plus, having long range blasters is just downright fun. Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship |
Jeanne-Luise Argenau
Cruis3r's Cr3w Inc. Sugar.
88
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Posted - 2014.04.14 14:26:00 -
[9] - Quote
stoicfaux wrote:Kronos, the rep bonus and bastion mode will more than make up for deficient armor skills.
if u can fly a marauder that is :P
rokh would be the standard t1 bs answer so, maybe a hyperion the rest has not enough mids to pull it off |
Dato Koppla
Elite Guards Stealth Wear Inc.
538
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Posted - 2014.04.14 14:36:00 -
[10] - Quote
Rokh, Mega and Hyperion can all do L4 missions with hybrid setups. Rokh has less dps but better range and tank, Hyperion shines with higher skills (sentry drones) and Mega has good turret dps and tracking bonus but lighter on tank. |
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Jeanne-Luise Argenau
Cruis3r's Cr3w Inc. Sugar.
88
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Posted - 2014.04.14 14:37:00 -
[11] - Quote
Dato Koppla wrote:Rokh, Mega and Hyperion can all do L4 missions with hybrid setups. Rokh has less dps but better range and tank, Hyperion shines with higher skills (sentry drones) and Mega has good turret dps and tracking bonus but lighter on tank.
yes but he was looking for shield hybrids and i dont believe the mega is good enough for that |
Daniel Plain
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
1928
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Posted - 2014.04.14 15:05:00 -
[12] - Quote
without a damage or tracking bonus, the rokh is a terrible mission ship.
"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings" -MXZF |
Noxisia Arkana
Deadspace Knights
313
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Posted - 2014.04.14 16:14:00 -
[13] - Quote
Range bonus is a damage bonus. If you can use antimatter out to 70km+ then you don't have to switch to an ammo type that does much less DPS. |
Faux Sho
Umbra Victoria
8
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Posted - 2014.04.14 23:32:00 -
[14] - Quote
Cruise Missile/Sentry Armageddon is fun. |
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
2070
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Posted - 2014.04.15 03:13:00 -
[15] - Quote
Faux Sho wrote:Cruise Missile/Sentry Armageddon is fun.
And uses neither shields nor hybrids? |
Ireland VonVicious
Vicious Trading Company
305
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Posted - 2014.04.15 03:26:00 -
[16] - Quote
The answer is Vindicator.
Makes for a great shield incursion ship too. |
Alim Omaristos
Dont Pod Me Bro
26
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Posted - 2014.04.15 14:45:00 -
[17] - Quote
Nolen Cadmar wrote:You could try something like this. Total cost is ~290 M. If you want more tank, upgrade the booster to a deadspace. A Pith B-Type XL is ~70 M. You could also upgrade the hardeners.
[Rokh, L4 Mission Rokh]
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Power Diagnostic System II
X-Large Shield Booster II Large Micro Jump Drive Pith C-Type Kinetic Deflection Field Pith C-Type Thermic Dissipation Field Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Script Sensor Booster II, Targeting Range Script
425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L 425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L 425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L 425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L 425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L 425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L 425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L 425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I Large Capacitor Control Circuit I Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Insert drones of choice. where are the officer guns. What kind of **** fit is this. He will never have the dps for L4s with out at minimum officer guns.
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Robert Morningstar
Morningstar Excavations LTD Business Alliance of Manufacturers and Miners
68
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Posted - 2014.04.15 19:31:00 -
[18] - Quote
If your drone skills are also high go sentury domi only need 2-3 drone link leaving the rest for 425 rail gun 2 with tungstin should be able to reach out to 125k+ with both bounders and guns. |
Goldiiee
Bureau of Astronomical Anomalies
996
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Posted - 2014.04.15 22:03:00 -
[19] - Quote
Ireland VonVicious wrote:The answer is Vindicator.
Makes for a great shield incursion ship too. Agreed, even though the fits to make them viable are kind of prohibitively expensive it is almost a no brainer to get 1500 dps. There's not an rat invented yet that can stand up to a well equipped Vindicator.
Things that keep me up at night;-á Why do we use a voice communication device to send telegraphs? Moore's Law should state,-áOnce you have paid off the last PC upgrade you will need another. |
Faux Sho
Umbra Victoria
8
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Posted - 2014.04.16 10:52:00 -
[20] - Quote
Zhilia Mann wrote:Faux Sho wrote:Cruise Missile/Sentry Armageddon is fun. And uses neither shields nor hybrids?
Your observation skills are positively occult. |
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Daniel Plain
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
1932
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Posted - 2014.04.16 14:26:00 -
[21] - Quote
Noxisia Arkana wrote:Range bonus is a damage bonus. If you can use antimatter out to 70km+ then you don't have to switch to an ammo type that does much less DPS.
Edit: Not to mention, with high natural tank (resists)- you can probably get away with more mag stabs, and less tank than you would need on another ship (or in this case, a target painter or tracking computer). range bonus is not a damage bonus if the ships WITH a damage bonus still have sufficient range. as it stands, most decent mission ships are perfectly capable of projecting upwards of 1k dps to 40km. the rokh falls flat in this regard, with or without antimatter.
"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings" -MXZF |
Tarikla
Projet Aurora
43
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Posted - 2014.04.16 14:36:00 -
[22] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:stoicfaux wrote:Kronos, the rep bonus and bastion mode will more than make up for deficient armor skills.
This man speaks truth. Plus, having long range blasters is just downright fun.
All Hail our Kronos Overlords. |
Jill Antaris
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
70
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Posted - 2014.04.16 15:53:00 -
[23] - Quote
This would be one option, but the navy Domi does it far better(higher dps, extra med). Most of the platforms perform better in a armor tank, because you can combine mobility, tackle and good dps better with the given limits on CPU on gallente hulls.
[Hyperion, New Setup 1] Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Tracking Enhancer II Tracking Enhancer II Drone Damage Amplifier II Internal Force Field Array I
Phased Weapon Navigation Array Generation Extron Pith B-Type Large Shield Booster Kinetic Deflection Field II Kinetic Deflection Field II Caldari Navy Thermic Dissipation Field
425mm Railgun II, Antimatter Charge L 425mm Railgun II, Antimatter Charge L 425mm Railgun II, Antimatter Charge L 425mm Railgun II, Antimatter Charge L 425mm Railgun II, Antimatter Charge L 425mm Railgun II, Antimatter Charge L Drone Link Augmentor I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I Large Capacitor Control Circuit I Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Caldari Navy Warden x5 Hobgoblin II x10
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Ole' McDolan
Vastly Intellectual Tall Tax Union
0
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Posted - 2014.04.16 19:06:00 -
[24] - Quote
Thanks for your exhausting answers, I will be a little more specific.
Up until now I have been running L4s with Raven. Comfortably hitting up to 93km (targeting range) without problems, my hobs II (or precision missiles if necessary) tearing apart anything that is smaller and dangerous.
However running L4s over and over again is super dull, so I wanted to try Incursions, therefore I am skilling up hybrids now in hopes of using Rokh for them, since I have caldari BS at level 5 already. In future I hope to use Vindicator, but that is quite a distant future for me right now.
And since running L4s with missiles is also pretty dull, I thought I could start using hybrids as well to practice for incursions.
So my reason for wanting a shield tank is simply because I have invested skills in it and now I have higher priority for my SP than putting them in armor tank, and also Rokh would benefit from my Caldari BS at 5. Also I am looking for T1 BS due to financial and skill reasons. While 1k dps at 40km is nice, it is way too close for comfort due to me being used to run cruise missiles and kill stuff at over twice that. Dominix is way out of my skill queue and I am not a huge fan of drone boats.
But now some of you say that Rokh is abysmal in terms of mission runing, which is kinda a bummer. Is it really that bad?
I mean in EFT using All Skills 5 the difference between the Raven build I am using and the Rokh fit posted by Nolen there is only about 80dps more on Raven (antimatter on Rokh) On the other hand the Rokh will shoot things at probably higher range and has more EHP(just guessing, dont know where do I see the optimal range and falloff with all the bonuses included in EFT). However it has about 3 times the signature size (not sure how will this affect mission running, but since there is MJD on the Rokh I assume it wont be a huge problem unless I screw up royally). Also I will definitely skill up for Vindicator, so Hyperion is a possibility, but right now I cant afford to skill up armor tank.
So if this was between shield tanked Hyperion and Rokh, which one would be better suited for L4 security missions? Which one is better in the hands of a capable pilot? Which one is better for a newbie?
Thanks for your thoughts and opinions, I appreciate you spending time reading and posting. |
Dersen Lowery
Laurentson INC StructureDamage
1102
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Posted - 2014.04.16 21:32:00 -
[25] - Quote
The general rule is that newbies should prefer tank to gank within reason, and veterans will prefer gank to tank. Endgame PVE ships are pretty much glass cannons. So that points to the Rokh as a more new-player friendly ship.
Incursion FCs like to see all four resists around or above 70%, which the Rokh can do very easily, especially since you've trained Caldari Battleship V: You get a 20% bonus to all resists for free.
You'll never get that much DPS out of it, but railgun alpha isn't bad at all, and its range is unparalleled, so you can shoot things from anywhere on grid behind the safety of a monster tank. If too many rats get too close and defeat your tracking, hit the MJD and kill them at leisure.
(Note that Incursion fits are highly idiosyncratic, and they don't often look like mission fits, mostly because you're outsourcing your tank to the logistics pilots in an Incursion.) Proud founder and member of the Belligerent Desirables. |
James Baboli
Ferrous Infernum
24
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Posted - 2014.04.16 22:27:00 -
[26] - Quote
As an incursion FC, I will ask you to please run a shield mega or navy mega (for VGs+ AS) or a hype/ navy mega for HQs while skilling into a vindi. The rokh has the tank for incursions, but its anemic damage, lack of utility bonus ( even with TPs, its meh, and for webs, faggedaboutit with vindis on grid) and general reputation as a cap hog in HQs or perpetual leech in VGs make it a substandard incursion boat in any community seeking to be competitive. That crazy bag FC with the silly things on the hull that shouldn't but just did. |
Ole' McDolan
Vastly Intellectual Tall Tax Union
0
|
Posted - 2014.04.17 11:31:00 -
[27] - Quote
James Baboli wrote:As an incursion FC, I will ask you to please run a shield mega or navy mega (for VGs+ AS) or a hype/ navy mega for HQs while skilling into a vindi. The rokh has the tank for incursions, but its anemic damage, lack of utility bonus ( even with TPs, its meh, and for webs, faggedaboutit with vindis on grid) and general reputation as a cap hog in HQs or perpetual leech in VGs make it a substandard incursion boat in any community seeking to be competitive.
I just dont get why is that. I tried 2 builds in EFT just to see if the difference is so big to constitute as one being a cap or hog or a leech, but the dps difference was 64 dps. Hyperion did 64 dps, but at 13km shorter optimal range. The difference in alpha was 326.
I just dont see that big reason for me to reskill to gallente BS level 5 right now for the sake fo having 64 dps more.
The builds I tested were:
[Rokh, Test] Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Power Diagnostic System II
X-Large Shield Booster II Large Micro Jump Drive Adaptive Invulnerability Field II Adaptive Invulnerability Field II Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Script Sensor Booster II, Targeting Range Script
425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L 425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L 425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L 425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L 425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L 425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L 425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L 425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I Large Capacitor Control Circuit I Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
AND
[Hyperion, Test] Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Tracking Enhancer II Tracking Enhancer II Tracking Enhancer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Sensor Booster II, Targeting Range Script Large Micro Jump Drive Adaptive Invulnerability Field II Adaptive Invulnerability Field II Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Script
425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L 425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L 425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L 425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L 425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L 425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L Large S95a Remote Shield Booster
Large Core Defense Field Extender I Large Core Defense Field Extender I Large Anti-Thermal Screen Reinforcer I
Heavy Shield Maintenance Bot I x5 Warrior II x10
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Jeanne-Luise Argenau
Cruis3r's Cr3w Inc. Constructive. Criticism.
88
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Posted - 2014.04.17 14:37:00 -
[28] - Quote
hyperion is only better when u use 5 sentries. i get around 1040dps that way
[Hyperion, shield mission]
6x 350mm Prototype Gauss Gun (Antimatter Charge L)
Large Micro Jump Drive Heavy Capacitor Booster II (Cap Booster 800) X-Large C5-L Emergency Shield Overload I Domination Kinetic Deflection Amplifier Domination Thermic Dissipation Amplifier
3x Drone Damage Amplifier II 3x Federation Navy Magnetic Field Stabilizer Internal Force Field Array I
Large Hybrid Locus Coordinator II Large Drone Scope Chip II Large Hybrid Metastasis Adjuster II
5x Garde II 5x Hobgoblin II |
RavenPaine
RaVeN Alliance
774
|
Posted - 2014.04.17 15:16:00 -
[29] - Quote
If you thought a Raven was boring.... You'll probably self destruct after 2 missions in a Rokh. |
James Baboli
Ferrous Infernum
24
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Posted - 2014.04.17 21:59:00 -
[30] - Quote
Ole' McDolan wrote:James Baboli wrote:As an incursion FC, I will ask you to please run a shield mega or navy mega (for VGs+ AS) or a hype/ navy mega for HQs while skilling into a vindi. The rokh has the tank for incursions, but its anemic damage, lack of utility bonus ( even with TPs, its meh, and for webs, faggedaboutit with vindis on grid) and general reputation as a cap hog in HQs or perpetual leech in VGs make it a substandard incursion boat in any community seeking to be competitive. I just dont get why is that. I tried 2 builds in EFT just to see if the difference is so big to constitute as one being a cap or hog or a leech, but the dps difference was 64 dps. Hyperion did 64 dps, but at 13km shorter optimal range. The difference in alpha was 326. I just dont see that big reason for me to reskill to gallente BS level 5 right now for the sake fo having 64 dps more. The builds I tested were: *mission fits snipped* In mission fits, the rokh will perform much better than either of those with similar skills. especially with rails. The reason I posted that is more because the rokh underperforms in incursion fits. That 64dps will turn into 2-300 with fully skilled blasters and faction damage mods + rigs for DPS, as is common on the better t1 hulls while finishing the grind to pirate BS skills. If incursions, especially top tier incursions is really a goal, gallante BS for mach/vindi or amar BS for NM is certainly almost a requirement at some point. That crazy bag FC with the silly things on the hull that shouldn't but just did. |
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