Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 20 30 40 50 60 70 80 90 100 .. 171 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 42 post(s) |
Arthur Aihaken
Erebus Solia
3438
|
Posted - 2014.05.02 21:59:00 -
[2611] - Quote
Kassandra Tielaxi wrote:Where is the love for the Nestor and other SOE ships? They are also pirate faction, and in the case of the Nestor, desperately need some help to balance them. Currently the Nestor is the most expensive, but the least capable of the faction battleships.
I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week. |
Sgt Ocker
Last Bastion of Freedom
196
|
Posted - 2014.05.02 22:13:00 -
[2612] - Quote
Kassandra Tielaxi wrote:Where is the love for the Nestor and other SOE ships? They are also pirate faction, and in the case of the Nestor, desperately need some help to balance them. Currently the Nestor is the most expensive, but the least capable of the faction battleships.
Two extremes for what could be the 2 best pirate Battleships Most expensive and least capable Cheapest and most limited use |
epicurus ataraxia
Z3R0 Return Mining Inc. Illusion of Solitude
741
|
Posted - 2014.05.03 00:07:00 -
[2613] - Quote
Sgt Ocker wrote:Kassandra Tielaxi wrote:Where is the love for the Nestor and other SOE ships? They are also pirate faction, and in the case of the Nestor, desperately need some help to balance them. Currently the Nestor is the most expensive, but the least capable of the faction battleships.
Two extremes for what could be the 2 best pirate Battleships Most expensive and least capable Cheapest and most limited use
I still believe that if the drone system is sorted out, then the rattlesnake can be a really good ship. somehow the new drone system needs to have the same capability over the whole range of targets as previously.
Seen some good posts over the last couple of days, Maybe some to those ideas (some of them yours) should be put into play.
The gila sort of works, A different role for it for sure, but should do ok.
The rattlesnake nice missiles, but the drone side is sadly very lacking.
Yes, All can be worked around, fits can be found to do a light target monster or a Gank specialist fit.
But other ships can do most of the roles people want to use it for , Better.
So can we have, Heavy or medium drones, capable across all classes of target please. If it is meant to now be a Mobile Brawler, sentries are now redundant, Make the remaining drone capability useful and desirable. There is one EvE. Many people. Many lifestyles. WE are EvE |
epicurus ataraxia
Z3R0 Return Mining Inc. Illusion of Solitude
741
|
Posted - 2014.05.03 00:09:00 -
[2614] - Quote
Kassandra Tielaxi wrote:Where is the love for the Nestor and other SOE ships? They are also pirate faction, and in the case of the Nestor, desperately need some help to balance them. Currently the Nestor is the most expensive, but the least capable of the faction battleships.
I think you might find a lot of people agree with you. There is one EvE. Many people. Many lifestyles. WE are EvE |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
5684
|
Posted - 2014.05.03 01:22:00 -
[2615] - Quote
epicurus ataraxia wrote: somehow the new drone system needs to have the same capability over the whole range of targets as previously.
No.
Because to do that, you would have to compensate by severely cutting the missile bonus, not to mention likely removing it's applicability to all size launchers. You don't get to have your cake and eat it too. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
-áPsychotic Monk for CSM9.
|
Priestess Lin
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
90
|
Posted - 2014.05.03 01:33:00 -
[2616] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:epicurus ataraxia wrote: somehow the new drone system needs to have the same capability over the whole range of targets as previously.
No. Because to do that, you would have to compensate by severely cutting the missile bonus, not to mention likely removing it's applicability to all size launchers. You don't get to have your cake and eat it too.
Wrong. That is an idiotic conclusion. No good reason we can't have bonuses on all our drones. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
5685
|
Posted - 2014.05.03 02:06:00 -
[2617] - Quote
Priestess Lin wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:epicurus ataraxia wrote: somehow the new drone system needs to have the same capability over the whole range of targets as previously.
No. Because to do that, you would have to compensate by severely cutting the missile bonus, not to mention likely removing it's applicability to all size launchers. You don't get to have your cake and eat it too. Wrong. That is an idiotic conclusion. No good reason we can't have bonuses on all our drones.
There is a good reason. The fact that it would make the ship into an all powerful frigate muncher, and wouldn't give cruisers much chance either.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
-áPsychotic Monk for CSM9.
|
Omnathious Deninard
Novis Initiis
2333
|
Posted - 2014.05.03 02:12:00 -
[2618] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Priestess Lin wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:epicurus ataraxia wrote: somehow the new drone system needs to have the same capability over the whole range of targets as previously.
No. Because to do that, you would have to compensate by severely cutting the missile bonus, not to mention likely removing it's applicability to all size launchers. You don't get to have your cake and eat it too. Wrong. That is an idiotic conclusion. No good reason we can't have bonuses on all our drones. There is a good reason. The fact that it would make the ship into an all powerful frigate muncher, and wouldn't give cruisers much chance either. I am convince that there are some players who have no concept of balance at all. -á --á |
Arthur Aihaken
Erebus Solia
3438
|
Posted - 2014.05.03 02:31:00 -
[2619] - Quote
The only redeeming feature with the Rattlesnake is the Gecko. Too bad it can only run one... I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
5685
|
Posted - 2014.05.03 02:36:00 -
[2620] - Quote
Arthur Aihaken wrote:The only redeeming feature with the Rattlesnake is the Gecko. Too bad it can only run one...
Of note, does the Gecko count as a heavy drone? If so, that's like having a pocket assault frigate alongside a Navy Scorpion. Not really half bad, considering the Gecko has the tracking of a medium gun turret and a fuckton of damage. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
-áPsychotic Monk for CSM9.
|
|
Omnathious Deninard
Novis Initiis
2333
|
Posted - 2014.05.03 02:42:00 -
[2621] - Quote
Arthur Aihaken wrote:The only redeeming feature with the Rattlesnake is the Gecko. Too bad it can only run one... Where am I missing the stats for the gecko? Were they displayed during they key note? -á --á |
Arthur Aihaken
Erebus Solia
3438
|
Posted - 2014.05.03 02:49:00 -
[2622] - Quote
Omnathious Deninard wrote:Where am I missing the stats for the gecko? Were they displayed during they key note? They weren't, but you can view the ship and stats already in-game (just search for Gecko). I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week. |
FT Diomedes
The Graduates RAZOR Alliance
380
|
Posted - 2014.05.03 04:06:00 -
[2623] - Quote
Arthur Aihaken wrote:Omnathious Deninard wrote:Where am I missing the stats for the gecko? Were they displayed during they key note? They weren't, but you can view the ship and stats already in-game (just search for Gecko).
Looks interesting... This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine. |
Priestess Lin
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
90
|
Posted - 2014.05.03 05:40:00 -
[2624] - Quote
The super drone idea is new and interesting, but please don't do this to the Rattlesnake. We like our drones as our primary weapon system. The Snake has never been considered OP and so it doesn't make sense that it is losing more than it is gaining with these changes.
I suggest creating new ships with the super drones so Guristas pilots won't be screwed over unnecessarily.
There claims that the Snake doesn't have a role. Why can't its role remain versatility and resistance to ewar? With these changes it has the same weaknesses as other pirate faction battleships but real less DPS.
We forgive you for not understanding the Rattlesnake. Just give it some more high/mid/low slots, please. Its DPS does need a boost but it shouldn't come at the cost of gutting everything good about it. |
baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
11311
|
Posted - 2014.05.03 06:48:00 -
[2625] - Quote
Priestess Lin wrote:The super drone idea is new and interesting, but please don't do this to the Rattlesnake. We like our drones as our primary weapon system. The Snake has never been considered OP and so it doesn't make sense that it is losing more than it is gaining with these changes.
I suggest creating new ships with the super drones so Guristas pilots won't be screwed over unnecessarily.
There claims that the Snake doesn't have a role. Why can't its role remain versatility and resistance to ewar? With these changes it has the same weaknesses as other pirate faction battleships but less real DPS.
We forgive you for not understanding the Rattlesnake, its hard to know everything about every ship. Just give it some more high/mid/low slots, please. Its DPS does need a boost but it shouldn't come at the cost of gutting everything good about it.
Do what you know to be right. This is the most reasonable solution. The majority agree it is not up to snuff and it is not a good way to treat your customers.
Additionally, considering its shield tanked, uses missiles, has a Caldari style hull, stats and maneuverability. I don't see why this ship needs to be even more like Caldari.
The current snake on TQ is not versatile at all. It is by far the worst pirate battleship and it is out shined by the domi in every way as a drone boat and only sees use as a supertanked level 4 drake with drones. The CFC are sitting on a mountain of BPCs that we simply could not shift. The new rattle is a hell of a lot more adaptable and one of the most deadly solo battleships and is the best battleship than can be made into a dedicated anti frig/cruiser platform. It is something unique rather than simply a shield domi and it is perfectly understandable that this guristas ship is a caldari missile boat with a twist as that is what guristas are all about. Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship |
Giullare
Insurgent New Eden Tribe RAZOR Alliance
40
|
Posted - 2014.05.03 08:24:00 -
[2626] - Quote
Rattlesnake is still a little behind other pirate battleships. It can use a minor boost like +1 high slot (not even missile hardpoint). |
epicurus ataraxia
Z3R0 Return Mining Inc. Illusion of Solitude
741
|
Posted - 2014.05.03 09:26:00 -
[2627] - Quote
Omnathious Deninard wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Priestess Lin wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:epicurus ataraxia wrote: somehow the new drone system needs to have the same capability over the whole range of targets as previously.
No. Because to do that, you would have to compensate by severely cutting the missile bonus, not to mention likely removing it's applicability to all size launchers. You don't get to have your cake and eat it too. Wrong. That is an idiotic conclusion. No good reason we can't have bonuses on all our drones. There is a good reason. The fact that it would make the ship into an all powerful frigate muncher, and wouldn't give cruisers much chance either. I am convince that there are some players who have no concept of balance at all. Keeping it polite, I also believe there are players who have no concept of balance.
I am suggesting not one iota of extra power, I am also suggesting keeping drones as useful as they currently are. I can accept that they are tuned to have an emphasis on mobile brawling. I find making them an incompetent system is a nerf not a buff.
Taking an icecream and dipping it in mud is not balance. It is an excuse some claim has validity, which stops us from having nice things. It is certainly not balance. There is one EvE. Many people. Many lifestyles. WE are EvE |
Mournful Conciousness
Embers Children TOHA Conglomerate
745
|
Posted - 2014.05.03 09:29:00 -
[2628] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Priestess Lin wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:epicurus ataraxia wrote: somehow the new drone system needs to have the same capability over the whole range of targets as previously.
No. Because to do that, you would have to compensate by severely cutting the missile bonus, not to mention likely removing it's applicability to all size launchers. You don't get to have your cake and eat it too. Wrong. That is an idiotic conclusion. No good reason we can't have bonuses on all our drones. There is a good reason. The fact that it would make the ship into an all powerful frigate muncher, and wouldn't give cruisers much chance either.
You mean like a vindicator, bhaalgorn and machariel?
Embers Children is recruiting carefully selected pilots who like wormholes, green killboards and the sweet taste of tears. You can convo me in game or join the chat "TOHA Lounge".
|
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
5695
|
Posted - 2014.05.03 09:36:00 -
[2629] - Quote
Mournful Conciousness wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Priestess Lin wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:epicurus ataraxia wrote: somehow the new drone system needs to have the same capability over the whole range of targets as previously.
No. Because to do that, you would have to compensate by severely cutting the missile bonus, not to mention likely removing it's applicability to all size launchers. You don't get to have your cake and eat it too. Wrong. That is an idiotic conclusion. No good reason we can't have bonuses on all our drones. There is a good reason. The fact that it would make the ship into an all powerful frigate muncher, and wouldn't give cruisers much chance either. You mean like a vindicator, bhaalgorn and machariel?
Notice how none of those 3 have bonused small or medium signature radius guns? "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
-áPsychotic Monk for CSM9.
|
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
1321
|
Posted - 2014.05.03 09:41:00 -
[2630] - Quote
Giullare wrote:Rattlesnake is still a little behind other pirate battleships. It can use a minor boost like +1 high slot (not even missile hardpoint). You know it already has the same number of slots as half the pirate BS's. Only Mach & Vindi have more. |
|
Mournful Conciousness
Embers Children TOHA Conglomerate
745
|
Posted - 2014.05.03 09:56:00 -
[2631] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Mournful Conciousness wrote:
You mean like a vindicator, bhaalgorn and machariel?
Notice how none of those 3 have bonused small or medium signature radius guns?
The don't need to be.
Vindicator's web bonus means frigates are blapped in 1 shot bhaalgorn's neuts and web range means that frigates are blapped in 1 shot machariel neuts, moves away and blaps in one shot.
Embers Children is recruiting carefully selected pilots who like wormholes, green killboards and the sweet taste of tears. You can convo me in game or join the chat "TOHA Lounge".
|
KaDa en Bauldry
Aliastra Gallente Federation
22
|
Posted - 2014.05.03 10:01:00 -
[2632] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Mournful Conciousness wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:There is a good reason. The fact that it would make the ship into an all powerful frigate muncher, and wouldn't give cruisers much chance either. You mean like a vindicator, bhaalgorn and machariel? Notice how none of those 3 have bonused small or medium signature radius guns?
The day a Vindi has troubles against a frig will be the day CCP takes away it's web bonus.
And that is not this balancing round. Don't forget about ship insurance before undocking. Don't forget about copy-paste saving before posting. |
epicurus ataraxia
Z3R0 Return Mining Inc. Illusion of Solitude
741
|
Posted - 2014.05.03 10:14:00 -
[2633] - Quote
KaDa en Bauldry wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Mournful Conciousness wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:There is a good reason. The fact that it would make the ship into an all powerful frigate muncher, and wouldn't give cruisers much chance either. You mean like a vindicator, bhaalgorn and machariel? Notice how none of those 3 have bonused small or medium signature radius guns? The day a Vindi has troubles against a frig will be the day CCP takes away it's web bonus. And that is not this balancing round.
These are all effective Pirate battleships.
So what is the Rattlesnake then? No special bonus, Does stuff less well than other ships.
That does not sound like a good outcome.
Honestly while not trying to criticise, The idea that:-
Fit RHML > ???? >Super Pirate Ship
Sounds like collect underpants > ???? >Profit!
So what is stage two? Possibly fix drones? There is one EvE. Many people. Many lifestyles. WE are EvE |
KaDa en Bauldry
Aliastra Gallente Federation
22
|
Posted - 2014.05.03 10:25:00 -
[2634] - Quote
Drone ships do many things less well or differently than other ships.
This is a ship balancing thread sadly, not the one droneophiles are waiting for since so many years.
Now, I'm all too aware, that balancing a ship is impossible without taking it's weapon system into account.
I'm also aware how the Rattlesnake's drone focus is getting chopped up.
I don't like that one bit.
But I'm willing to give the ship a try on the test servers, with Cruise Missiles or RHMLs, I might have better mission competition times than before the way I play.
How should I know, without trying?
I mean, I didn't have any medium drones in my drone bay for over a year, and the small ones I use very-very rarely since the LMJD. I didn't fit 3 BCU a TP and 3 Rigors before, now I will, and shall see for myself. Sounds interesting, all things said.
Might be worse than I think, might be better.
Only one thing is sure: I will need better missile skills! Don't forget about ship insurance before undocking. Don't forget about copy-paste saving before posting. |
epicurus ataraxia
Z3R0 Return Mining Inc. Illusion of Solitude
741
|
Posted - 2014.05.03 10:40:00 -
[2635] - Quote
KaDa en Bauldry wrote:Drone ships do many things less well or differently than other ships.
This is a ship balancing thread sadly, not the one droneophiles are waiting for since so many years.
Now, I'm all too aware, that balancing a ship is impossible without taking it's weapon system into account.
I'm also aware how the Rattlesnake's drone focus is getting chopped up.
I don't like that one bit.
But I'm willing to give the ship a try on the test servers, with Cruise Missiles or RHMLs, I might have better mission competition times than before the way I play.
How should I know, without trying?
I mean, I didn't have any medium drones in my drone bay for over a year, and the small ones I use very-very rarely since the LMJD. I didn't fit 3 BCU a TP and 3 Rigors before, now I will, and shall see for myself. Sounds interesting, all things said.
Might be worse than I think, might be better.
Only one thing is sure: I will need better missile skills!
Yes, the ship is definately more missile based, not neccesarily a bad thing. The only concern is that once it goes to the test server, it will be three years before it gets looked at again. Let's not kid ourself, there is no way that changes of this magnitude get undone after going to test. A tweak here or there possibly.
It has to be 90% right before it goes there, and it is no way near that at the moment.
There is one EvE. Many people. Many lifestyles. WE are EvE |
KaDa en Bauldry
Aliastra Gallente Federation
22
|
Posted - 2014.05.03 12:37:00 -
[2636] - Quote
epicurus ataraxia wrote:Sure more paper DPS, but why on earth bother with it, without flying it one can see just how management heavy it has become.
Dunno, I always tried to fly my Rattlesnake with as much gank and as little gank as possible. Based on my previous times with a CNR, it shouldn't be really worse. TP is now 5 seconds, and we have the LMJD.
Heck, for a time I had a mission alt, ran a CNR with the Rattlesnake (back when there was no microdrive and Tp was 10 seconds), this will be much easier!
Now FITTING it properly, that will be a game of tradeoffs... ...that I - in my masochistic ways - am almost looking forward to! Though I would like to do so without a CPU rig/module. Don't forget about ship insurance before undocking. Don't forget about copy-paste saving before posting. |
Barton Breau
University of Caille Gallente Federation
20
|
Posted - 2014.05.03 13:03:00 -
[2637] - Quote
KaDa en Bauldry wrote:epicurus ataraxia wrote:Sure more paper DPS, but why on earth bother with it, without flying it one can see just how management heavy it has become. Dunno, I always tried to fly my Rattlesnake with as much gank and as little gank as possible. Based on my previous times with a CNR, it shouldn't be really worse. TP is now 5 seconds, and we have the LMJD. Heck, for a time I had a mission alt, ran a CNR with the Rattlesnake (back when there was no microdrive and Tp was 10 seconds), this will be much easier! Now FITTING it properly, that will be a game of tradeoffs... ...that I - in my masochistic ways - am almost looking forward to! Though I would like to do so without a CPU rig/module.
Hmm, tradeoffs, if we assume just cruise sniping and just bs, how many tp, radius, and exp velocity stuff would one need? |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
5698
|
Posted - 2014.05.03 13:16:00 -
[2638] - Quote
"Management heavy" is the new complaint now?
"Grr, I have to pay attention to what I'm doing". "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
-áPsychotic Monk for CSM9.
|
KaDa en Bauldry
Aliastra Gallente Federation
23
|
Posted - 2014.05.03 13:28:00 -
[2639] - Quote
Forum ate my post, remembering my signature FTW!Barton Breau wrote:KaDa en Bauldry wrote:epicurus ataraxia wrote:Sure more paper DPS, but why on earth bother with it, without flying it one can see just how management heavy it has become. Dunno, I always tried to fly my Rattlesnake with as much gank and as little gank as possible. Based on my previous times with a CNR, it shouldn't be really worse. TP is now 5 seconds, and we have the LMJD. Heck, for a time I had a mission alt, ran a CNR with the Rattlesnake (back when there was no microdrive and Tp was 10 seconds), this will be much easier! Now FITTING it properly, that will be a game of tradeoffs... ...that I - in my masochistic ways - am almost looking forward to! Though I would like to do so without a CPU rig/module. Hmm, tradeoffs, if we assume just cruise sniping and just bs, how many tp, radius, and exp velocity stuff would one need? Let's see... Fast and dirty napkin math, that's probably slightly off... Serpentis Battleships die easy enough to tripple rigors even when burning towards you. BC: Orbiting ones are easy, but one Faction is slightly below what you need when they burn towards you. Cruisers : Orbiters need at least one TP (some even two?), incoming ones you won't apply full damage to even with two faction TP. Frigs should be blapped by Sentries all the time.
I always considered low-sig Elite Cruisers the most annoying in missions, some of the Arch Gistums for instance are just too small and fast.
Implants, as always help, as there aren't any for drones anyway. Zainou Deadeye GP-8 and TN-9. Don't forget about ship insurance before undocking. Don't forget about copy-paste saving before posting. |
Silvetica Dian
Manson Family Advent of Fate
1003
|
Posted - 2014.05.03 13:29:00 -
[2640] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:"Management heavy" is the new complaint now?
"Grr, I have to pay attention to what I'm doing".
Yeah it sure is management heavy. I saw someone a few pages back complaining they would have to use scrams and or webs in PVP!!!! Crazy times. How will we deal with such complexity? Money at its root is a form of rationing. When the richest 85 people have as much wealth as the poorest 3.5 billion (50% of humanity) it is clear where the source of poverty is. http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jan/20/trickle-down-economics-broken-promise-richest-85 |
|
|
|
|
Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 20 30 40 50 60 70 80 90 100 .. 171 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |