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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Ireland VonVicious
Vicious Trading Company
305
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Posted - 2014.04.17 03:35:00 -
[1] - Quote
I'll admit I got all excited as the rest of the Rattlesnake people about the up comming changes.
Then I crunched the numbers.
First using only 2 drones sucks. It way sucks. Atleast us drone guys got the news we will be having lots of sp refunded.
The bonus changes alone gave less DPS.
The addition of a 5th launcher is the only reason it improves max possible DPS at all.
I've been hearing some overly inflated numbers going around too.
The short version is we lose a utility slot in the highs for a gain of 57 dps. (( Implant effects not included )) There goes my heavy NOS. There goes my L4 omni tank. I already have 1241 dps. I want to keep my tank keep the lame DPS boost.
Yes drones will see lots of improvements finally. But that helps all ships. It sure won't be helping rattlesnakes like it would have. The % of drone v.s. missile damage is going to change a ton.
It's a better ship now compared to what it will be in the near future. I'be been watching the price rises too due to speculation that it's an improvement. I can't wait to dump all mine.
The Moment when you realize training a ship and every mod to L5 was a big waste of time.
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Lucine Delacourt
The Covenant of Blood
144
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Posted - 2014.04.17 03:36:00 -
[2] - Quote
If only there was a thread specifically for feedback on the proposed changes... |
Sabriz Adoudel
Mission BLITZ
2621
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Posted - 2014.04.17 03:37:00 -
[3] - Quote
The market disagrees with you.
I bought a lot of Rattlesnakes before the changes, when noone wanted the hull at all and you could get the BPC for 250m.
Now, my stockpile has almost doubled in price. Buy orders on the hull went from 360m to 570m.
So clearly, the majority of Rattlesnake owners and prospective owners consider it significantly stronger now. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=326497 --áPsychotic Monk for CSM! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=238931 - an idea for a new form of hybrid PVE/PVP content. If you want to mine in highsec, read www.minerbumping.com. |
Aerie Evingod
Midwest Miners LLC
19
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Posted - 2014.04.17 03:38:00 -
[4] - Quote
0/10
No you wont get any refunded SP.
Drone damage is the same, 2 heavies or 2 sentries will do the same damage after the patch as they do now. 7.5 effective drones now, 7.5 effective drones in the future.
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Zarnak Wulf
In Exile. Imperial Outlaws.
1647
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Posted - 2014.04.17 03:51:00 -
[5] - Quote
It doesn't matter what CCP does, someone has to threaten to quit. I can't wait till we get to capitals. |
Canthan Rogue
Perkone Caldari State
13
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Posted - 2014.04.17 04:38:00 -
[6] - Quote
If you do some very basic math, you will see that the new rattlesnake has the same drone dps as the old one. The main change is that it's losing the useless missile velocity bonus for a missile damage bonus and an extra hardpoint, which is going to drastically increase overall dps. This comes at the cost of having reduced drone capacity and and loss of damage bonuses for light and medium drones. I think it's a fantastic change that will bring the rattlesnake up to par with the other pirate battleships. |
Luwc
Biohazard. WINMATAR.
102
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Posted - 2014.04.17 06:51:00 -
[7] - Quote
liek if u cri everytiem |
Camper101
Mind Games. Suddenly Spaceships.
978
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Posted - 2014.04.17 07:05:00 -
[8] - Quote
Market Situation implies that you are the only one disagreeing with the changes. Also: Why is having 2 drones that as much damage as your bonused 5 before a bad thing? 2013.03.01 13:30:58 notify For participating in the General Discussion Forum Section your trustworthiness has been adjusted by -2.5000.
My name is Hans. The "L" stands for danger. |
Kadar Yassavi
24th Imperial Crusade Amarr Empire
9
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Posted - 2014.04.17 08:36:00 -
[9] - Quote
We need a downvote feature in this forum. |
Elena Thiesant
Sun Micro Systems
1324
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Posted - 2014.04.17 08:58:00 -
[10] - Quote
Ireland VonVicious wrote:Atleast us drone guys got the news we will be having lots of sp refunded.
No drone skills are being refunded. If you're referring to the drone skill changes, then...
Quote:We are also splitting the current Combat Drone Operation skill into two new skills, Light Drone Operation and Medium Drone Operation. This means that all light combat drones will now be unlocked and bonused from the Light Drone Operation skill, and medium combat drones will be unlocked and bonused from the Medium Drone Operation skill. During the patch downtime, existing players with the Combat Drone Operation skill trained will receive both new skills trained to the same level that their Combat Drone Operation skill was trained to. |
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Adrie Atticus
The Shadow Plague Fidelas Constans
69
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Posted - 2014.04.17 09:10:00 -
[11] - Quote
Ireland VonVicious wrote:The bonus changes alone gave less DPS.
7.5 effective drones == 7.5 effective drones. |
Bertrand Butler
Cras es Noster
314
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Posted - 2014.04.17 09:39:00 -
[12] - Quote
Ireland VonVicious wrote:Then I crunched the numbers.
Crunch harder. The RS has the same heavy/sentry DPS, while getting a whopping 87.5% more missile DPS for ALL types of kinetic/thermal missiles (lights included). |
Last Wolf
Umbra Wing
134
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Posted - 2014.04.17 11:47:00 -
[13] - Quote
Ireland VonVicious wrote: The short version is we lose a utility slot in the highs for a gain of 57 dps. (( Implant effects not included )) There goes my heavy NOS. There goes my L4 omni tank. I already have 1241 dps. I want to keep my tank keep the lame DPS boost.
How were you only doing ~65 dps with your missiles and ~1180 dps with your drones?
The new changes nearly DOUBLE your missile dps (87.5% increase, 4 launchers to 7.5 effective launchers) and you keep the exact same drone dps for heavy/sentry drones. Vacuums suck. |
Gregor Parud
433
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Posted - 2014.04.17 12:31:00 -
[14] - Quote
OP is being clueless, that's all there is to say really. |
Noxisia Arkana
Deadspace Knights
326
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Posted - 2014.04.17 13:42:00 -
[15] - Quote
There's already a pirate battleship discussion where you can vent your spleen and there's probably a Dev somewhere that is forced to read our bitching.
Posting in ships and modules is just going to get you ridiculed by the majority of people that think actually having one single platform for heavy drones is pretty boss.
For some obscene reason I want a brawling rattle so bad. |
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc Shadow Cartel
2060
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Posted - 2014.04.17 14:10:00 -
[16] - Quote
Dude. Learn to math. BYDI recruitment closed-ish |
Jeanne-Luise Argenau
Cruis3r's Cr3w Inc. Constructive. Criticism.
88
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Posted - 2014.04.17 14:29:00 -
[17] - Quote
the only thing worse on the rattle now is that u have to watch your drones more.
now for the math
rattle has 5 missiles now with bs 5 it has effective 7.5 launchers to current 4. rattle has now 5 sentries and 50% damage which means 7.5 sentries and coming summer it will have 2 sentries * 3.75 = 7.5 effective drones. both together would give me 280 dps more in the eft fit i used.
Now for me i personally dont like the rattle, but that has more to do with my playstyle. |
Last Wolf
Umbra Wing
137
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Posted - 2014.04.17 16:44:00 -
[18] - Quote
I'm thinking a RHML + Orges + 7 mids for webs/scrams = Dead anything that gets within range.
Till the RHML have to re-load It will be the second highest dps battleship in the game. Just ballparking it I'm going to guestimate 1550-1750 dps before overloading. It also can probably get the highest EHP of any battleship. For fleets, if the Rattle can get buy on not fitting any e-war and relying on his fleet to do the tackling the snake will be a PITA to kill (so bad for pirmarying) but also be a big mistake to NOT try and kill first due it its massive DPS. Cruise + Sentries mean the ship's dps is also practically e-war proof and won't do you much good to jam/neut/damp it.
Vacuums suck. |
Flaming Forum Spammer
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
7
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Posted - 2014.04.17 17:53:00 -
[19] - Quote
waaah... +- 100 dps when you're talking 1000+ dps which mulches anything. I've got a Geddon setup that's usually running 3 links, mjd, omni 1, sb II and 3 damage mods, it pulps L4's and what it doesn't my Legion does.
Just be content that the rattler isn't being turned into a gunboat instead of missile floater. |
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc Shadow Cartel
2060
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Posted - 2014.04.17 18:20:00 -
[20] - Quote
Flaming Forum Spammer wrote:waaah... +- 100 dps when you're talking 1000+ dps which mulches anything. I've got a Geddon setup that's usually running 3 links, mjd, omni 1, sb II and 3 damage mods, it pulps L4's and what it doesn't my Legion does.
Just be content that the rattler isn't being turned into a gunboat instead of missile floater.
Noone gives a flying **** about your missions. BYDI recruitment closed-ish |
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Topher Basquette Dusch-shur
Montana Freedom Fighters
6
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Posted - 2014.04.17 18:34:00 -
[21] - Quote
Sabriz Adoudel wrote:The market disagrees with you.
I bought a lot of Rattlesnakes before the changes, when noone wanted the hull at all and you could get the BPC for 250m.
Now, my stockpile has almost doubled in price. Buy orders on the hull went from 360m to 570m.
So clearly, the majority of Rattlesnake owners and prospective owners consider it significantly stronger now.
I disagree with what the OP is saying, but you cannot use market speculation from station traders as a way to show the value a ship has to players. This isn't people buying the new Rattle, this is people trying to make some fast isk. Use the market data a couple months after the ship is out, then your point might be considered valid. The prospective owners haven't decided anything yet, and the current owners can be found in the correct thread read that one if you are going to make assumptions about their opinions, at least then they will have some kind of useful information behind them.. |
Loraine Gess
Confedeferate Union of Tax Legalists
218
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Posted - 2014.04.17 19:11:00 -
[22] - Quote
Topher Basquette Dusch-shur wrote:Sabriz Adoudel wrote:The market disagrees with you.
I bought a lot of Rattlesnakes before the changes, when noone wanted the hull at all and you could get the BPC for 250m.
Now, my stockpile has almost doubled in price. Buy orders on the hull went from 360m to 570m.
So clearly, the majority of Rattlesnake owners and prospective owners consider it significantly stronger now. I disagree with what the OP is saying, but you cannot use market speculation from station traders as a way to show the value a ship has to players. This isn't people buying the new Rattle, this is people trying to make some fast isk. Use the market data a couple months after the ship is out, then your point might be considered valid. The prospective owners haven't decided anything yet, and the current owners can be found in the correct thread read that one if you are going to make assumptions about their opinions, at least then they will have some kind of useful information behind them..
Everyone thinks it is the bees knees, but hey, don't pay them any attention...
A++ economic advice right here |
Chris Winter
Zephyr Corp V.A.S.T.
379
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Posted - 2014.04.17 19:32:00 -
[23] - Quote
Unfortunately, a lot of people aren't realizing that you can't really make use of a 5th launcher, since then you'd lose a drone link augmenter and be down 24k drone control range. A T2 drone rig only gets you back 20k of that, and using two rigs for it will negatively impact your applied missile DPS due to loss of rigors.
It's still a 50% damage buff (as long as you use kinetic or thermal), so I'm not crying. |
Topher Basquette Dusch-shur
Montana Freedom Fighters
7
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Posted - 2014.04.17 20:36:00 -
[24] - Quote
Loraine Gess wrote:
Everyone thinks it is the bees knees, but hey, don't pay them any attention...
A++ economic advice right here
I am very excited about the new ship, after all I did say I disagree with the OP. Then again I am the only one I fly with who likes to have RHML on the thing anyway. This is a complete buff to my play style. Completely agree that this ship is going to be the "Bees Knees", but "everyone" is a very gross exaggeration.
Chris Winter wrote: Unfortunately, a lot of people aren't realizing that you can't really make use of a 5th launcher, since then you'd lose a drone link augmenter and be down 24k drone control range. A T2 drone rig only gets you back 20k of that, and using two rigs for it will negatively impact your applied missile DPS due to loss of rigors.
It's still a 50% damage buff (as long as you use kinetic or thermal), so I'm not crying.
About half of the people in the actual thread are making this argument. I think you have it backwards. You CAN and SHOULD make use of the 5th launcher. Someone correct this if you can, but you get 24km from a DLA on top of 58k(?) with your range skills. That is 82k for your bouncers and wardens. If they are further than that why not MJD right to them and be 18k from them? or make an obtuse triangle to be any distance you want?
If I've learned anything from the Marauder rebalanced it is that the rebalanced ideas are not going to change. They might offer something worse and then revert it, but Chris Winter has the best way of dealing with this.
Chris Winter wrote: It's still a 50% damage buff (as long as you use kinetic or thermal), so I'm not crying.
Silver lining baby. |
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ISD Ezwal
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
1161
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Posted - 2014.04.17 22:55:00 -
[25] - Quote
As there is already a thread on the same topic, this one gets a lock.
The rules: 16. Redundant and re-posted threads will be locked.
As a courtesy to other forum users, please search to see if there is a thread already open on the topic you wish to discuss. If so, please place your comments there instead. Multiple threads on the same subject clutter up the forums needlessly, causing good feedback and ideas to be lost. Please keep discussions regarding a topic to a single thread. ISD Ezwal Captain Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department |
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