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Tendall Antollare
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
1
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Posted - 2014.04.17 17:30:00 -
[1] - Quote
I've experimented a little bit, and right now I'm running most of my missions out of a level 5 security system and a single Gallente Corp (Chemal Tech). Based on my limited experimentation it seemed like I was getting better rewards and loot and the system I was running from seemed to have pretty good market values for salvaged loot.
Obviously, it's desirable to focus missions on one, or at least a small number of corps/entities, in order to get the best bang for the buck with LPs
But I'm wondering if there are any traps by just doing Chemal Tech - does anyone have any warnings on the consequences of this very narrow strategy I am currently employing?
My plan on ships is to specialize in Drones and armor tank (and secondarily on rail guns) so it seems like focusing on Gallente ships (and getting LP in a Gallente corp) in the long term should be ok, but there's a whole lot I don't know yet, so I'm nervous about where I might be painting myself into a corner.
I'll probably spend most of my time on PVE, but I want to also do some FW and experience PVP at some point. |
Sieges
56
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Posted - 2014.04.17 17:42:00 -
[2] - Quote
If you want to work towards having a Jump Clone then make sure to look for a Corp that also has medical facilities. |
Ezra Blade Blade
Springfield 417
6
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Posted - 2014.04.17 17:51:00 -
[3] - Quote
Something I wish someone had told me before I started the LP race. That different corps have different rewards. A LARGE % of the rewards are the same across the board, but some of the distinct rewards are relevant to the faction you are doing missions for. So take a look at the LP store in advance. =fly reckless |
Thomas Builder
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
468
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Posted - 2014.04.17 19:12:00 -
[4] - Quote
What Ezra said.
And it's those distinct rewards where the real money is. While the common rewards usually yield 800-1000 ISK/LP, you can get up to 3k/LP for some of the distinct rewards. So yes, the corp matters. But those prices fluctuate. If you chose the best "LP to ISK ratio" now, well, others might be grinding standing towards that corp too and by the time you can run lvl 4s with them the ratio might have dropped due to higher supply.
Always check the volume too. A 5k ISK/LP ratio isn't all that useful if it's for an item which only sells once a month. Be careful if it's more than 2k/LP and anything over 3k/LP is almost guaranteed to have a serious catch. |
Noxisia Arkana
Deadspace Knights
329
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Posted - 2014.04.17 19:30:00 -
[5] - Quote
LP Matters a lot. Different LP stores sell different items.
One of the CSM candidates has a great resource to tell you what the most profitable LP sinks are in various corporations. It can help you make a decision: https://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/ |
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
3469
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Posted - 2014.04.17 19:36:00 -
[6] - Quote
Agent Location: I like lowest security hisec systems furthest from lowsec / nulsec. http://eve-agents.com/
Facilities: I like corps with stations in all four racial parts of space, and with 50% reprocessing facilities. Medical is nice too. http://eve-online.itemdrop.net/eve_db/universe/station_search/
LP Store: I'm very un-picky about LP. I'm too lazy to try to maximize earnings, and just use LP to buy implants and ammo as I need it. http://www.ellatha.com/eve/LP_Stores.asp https://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/lpstore/
I also favour corps that are required for the epic arcs like: * Caldari - Penumbra - Expert Distribution * Amarr - Right To Rule - Ministry of internal Order and corps that have security agents for all levels. |
Lost Greybeard
Drunken Yordles
531
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Posted - 2014.04.18 03:45:00 -
[7] - Quote
While there are some definite advantages to picking which specific corp you're earning LP for (since the stores sell different things), it's not that urgent to level up that corp first, necessarily.
Because of the way reputation gain works, grinding a second corp in the same empire is a lot faster... essentially, you'll usually be able to start with L3 missions instead of L1 missions after you've leveled a couple up to where you can run L4s.
Mission running isn't remotely my primary activity, and just by messing around with the same factions for a couple years and paying attention (not trying to level faction in every corp at once) at this point I can walk into any Gallente corp I want and pick up L4s to start grinding LP. It's not a huge deal and picking "wrong" initially won't necessarily screw you... jsut stick with what you're doing until you're doing (or can get) L4s, then swap to whichever you've researched that has what you want in the LP store. |
Tendall Antollare
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
2
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Posted - 2014.04.18 04:34:00 -
[8] - Quote
Thanks for the replies, this is helpful. Also really helpful to have the 3P references (a real testament to Eve that such deep references exist!)
Here's a question that marks me for the noob that I am, but why is the ISK/LP ratio quoted so often?
I would think that you would want to maximize both ISK and LP, but the fact that this is so often quoted maybe implies that LP tends to be relatively constant (at least at a given Sec level, and maybe some other variables ...) while maybe ISK fluctuates according to some type of market conditions?
Or maybe I'm just missing the mark altogether. |
Bandero Enderas
State War Academy Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2014.04.18 07:36:00 -
[9] - Quote
LP/Isk ratio is basically time/isk ratio. That is why it is so important. The best from what I've heard is by Sisters of Eve due to high prices of core probe launcher they give. Or their top implantants.
With Chemal tech (one of the best Gal. corp, though there are better corp like navy or intellegence) you will struggle to find good place to go through L3 security missions. They are in low sec gallente or high sec amarr. So you betray your race or get often killed by freaks, who get their twisted fun by shooting ppl, who do not fight back.
I am not sure if the reward gets higher if you do same missions with same standings in 0.5 or 0.9 space, but if you mine sometimes or do other activities, like exploration, then it is better to be in 0.5 systems. Like Apanake, for example.
On the other hand more popular systems are also more dangerous, you will have to pay more attention not to let kids kill your mobile tractor unit, for example. |
Balshem Rozenzweig
Akademia Milicyjna The North is Coming
48
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Posted - 2014.04.18 08:25:00 -
[10] - Quote
I don't have much experience in missions (did only l3s for amarr) but I can tell you right away that you should avoid selling items that overlap with FW militia LP stores. This means that most navy corporations are a no-no. Factional Warfare guys generate tons of LPs (pretty much the only source of income tbh) and competing with them is going to kill you isk/time unit ratio. You may find it insignificant for now but believe me - you will start to notice the difference, and there's no reason to go along this path, since other corps offer pretty much the same security missions.
Prolly there are people knowing better than me, but if I was to start doing missions right now I'd go with a minmatar/amarr industrial corp. I'd put all these money into nexus chips and cash in on their high (but decreasing) Amarr nexus chips or moderate (but prone to increase) minmatar nexus chips. "NUTS!!!" - general McAuliffe |
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Tendall Antollare
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
2
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Posted - 2014.04.20 02:20:00 -
[11] - Quote
Great post, Tau, lots of specifics.
Makes sense, that's exactly what I'm trying to do.
This may be the wrong place to ask, but I found it difficult to use this tool. It seems like you have to have a pretty good idea of what you're looking for to start with. Or maybe you just need to pin it down to a few regions - but that butts up against my learning curve, since I don't have a good knowledge of New Eden geography.
Quote: LP Store: I'm very un-picky about LP. I'm too lazy to try to maximize earnings, and just use LP to buy implants and ammo as I need it.
This is an interesting comment - I like the idea of not doing deep dive analysis around every choice I make in Eve. But I thought that a big point of LP in Eve was to get nice ships or items that were hard to get otherwise.
Are you basically saying that you can get all the ships / items you want with isk because players end up reselling them anyhow? Or is it more the case that the ships / items that you get from Loyalty stores are not as interesting as what you can get elsewhere?
If it's the former, then I can see how (at least in the long run) you can just simplify your decisions by focusing on ISK (generally using LP to reduce ISK spend) rather than some balance/tradeoff between isk & LP.
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Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
3480
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Posted - 2014.04.20 02:20:00 -
[12] - Quote
Bandero Enderas wrote:LP/Isk ratio is basically time/isk ratio. That is why it is so important. The best from what I've heard is by Sisters of Eve due to high prices of core probe launcher they give. Or their top implantants. It is only important if you do missions as a source of income, and want to maximize that income for the time spent.
Personally, I try to maximize my fun at the expense of my income (which, to be honest, isn't such a great loss, because as an industrialist I earn billions from manufacturing regardless of what other activity I'm engaged in).
Example: I like to do missions, especially with under-classed ships, like using a destroyer in level 3 missions. However, I can pilot nearly every ship in EVE (excluding titans and transports), so I don't have to do this. |
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
3480
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Posted - 2014.04.20 02:32:00 -
[13] - Quote
Tendall Antollare wrote:This may be the wrong place to ask, but I found it difficult to use this tool. It seems like you have to have a pretty good idea of what you're looking for to start with. Or maybe you just need to pin it down to a few regions - but that butts up against my learning curve, since I don't have a good knowledge of New Eden geography. Basically: * Pick a corp, look at where there offices are, and not their facilities. * Pick a region, and see what corps are available.
The more you fiddle with various tools, the more you will grow to like them.
Tendall Antollare wrote:Tau Cabalander wrote:LP Store: I'm very un-picky about LP. I'm too lazy to try to maximize earnings, and just use LP to buy implants and ammo as I need it. This is an interesting comment - I like the idea of not doing deep dive analysis around every choice I make in Eve. But I thought that a big point of LP in Eve was to get nice ships or items that were hard to get otherwise. Are you basically saying that you can get all the ships / items you want with isk because players end up reselling them anyhow? Or is it more the case that the ships / items that you get from Loyalty stores are not as interesting as what you can get elsewhere? If it's the former, then I can see how (at least in the long run) you can just simplify your decisions by focusing on ISK (generally using LP to reduce ISK spend) rather than some balance/tradeoff between isk & LP. I've learned that there are many ways to earn ISK in EVE. I like to do the ones I find fun.
I don't find min-maxing LP store payouts and blitzing missions fun. So I don't do that.
Sure I could earn more if I did, but it just would be too expensive fun-wise.
Don't do anything in EVE you find un-fun, or you are "doing it wrong". |
Tendall Antollare
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
2
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Posted - 2014.04.20 02:40:00 -
[14] - Quote
Yeah, I'm starting to get the picture here.
For the benefit of other noobs that may be reading, I think it's the case that the ISK/LP ratio assumes that you resell everything that you can buy in a Loyalty store. That gives you a good measure of the productivity your mission running activity since it translates all of your rewards into a single measure.
But also makes sense to optimize for fun rather than ISK, it is a game after all.
At the same time, I guess that players that have been playing for just a month or two might care more about productivity since we've typically got near term goals that are often ISK constrained (skill constrained happens too, but in this case I guess I mainly just have to wait).
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Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
3480
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Posted - 2014.04.20 02:46:00 -
[15] - Quote
Tendall Antollare wrote:Yeah, I'm starting to get the picture here.
For the benefit of other noobs that may be reading, I think it's the case that the ISK/LP ratio assumes that you resell everything that you can buy in a Loyalty store. That gives you a good measure of the productivity your mission running activity since it translates all of your rewards into a single measure.
But also makes sense to optimize for fun rather than ISK, it is a game after all.
At the same time, I guess that players that have been playing for just a month or two might care more about productivity since we've typically got near term goals that are often ISK constrained (skill constrained happens too, but in this case I guess I mainly just have to wait). I agree with everything you stated EXCEPT "skill constrained".
I strongly urge you to remove that from your EVE vocabulary. |
Cassandra Aurilien
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
41
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Posted - 2014.04.20 03:00:00 -
[16] - Quote
When I was starting out I first ran up my rep with a local corp with Medical facilities. (To get jump clones) After that, I picked a corp that had a nearby level 4 agent, then another & so on. After 2 1/2 years of occasional mission running, I have a lot of choices.
Different agents give access to different pools of missions, so if you plan to run missions a lot, there is no reason not to give yourself a bit of variety. I tend to do it when I don't have time for WH life, or am just in the mood to relax.
How busy the system is can be another factor. If you are in the mood for a bit of player interaction, a system with 100+ people in it has a much larger chance of that then a system with 4 people in it.
Fun is the most important factor... |
Tendall Antollare
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
2
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Posted - 2014.04.20 03:11:00 -
[17] - Quote
So I just tried out my first L3 mission. I'm intending to specialize in drones (because it seems fun, so far), and so I've got Vexor, which my first attempt at L3 taught me was not so well fit. I know I need just a little bit higher rate of damage to defeat the battleships I encountered. Now actually, the mission was a success, but my goal was to toast that battleship, because that would've been fun.
I have no doubt that there are dozens of ways for a player with 1 month experience to win this encounter, but right now I'm 2 days away from finishing Drones L5, and a few minutes after that I can pick up Heavy Drone Operation and then buy my first Ogre I. I'm pretty sure would tip the balance in the encounter I just had.
Is that not a legitimate case of being skill constrained?
There could be something I can do to improve my fit to get better use out of my railguns (which I haven't ignored), but it seems more fun, and more in line with my long term goals, to succeed through improved effectiveness of my drones.
I gather that there may be some new players that conclude that they're characters are wimps because they lack years worth of training that some vets have, and give up on Eve without having even really given it a decent try. But that's not me. A lot of the fun of being a noob is imagining my path for being a carrier pilot in some complex PVP fleet action. I don't know that I'll really end up doing that, but working through both ISK and skill planning towards long term ambitions is the fun of this game (at least for now - I can imagine that might well change as I work through my learning curve). |
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
3480
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Posted - 2014.04.20 03:36:00 -
[18] - Quote
Tendall Antollare wrote:Is that not a legitimate case of being skill constrained? No. You completed it despite your skills. I'm betting you found it fun and maybe even challenging.
You also did the harder way, using a Vexor instead of a Myrmidon.
General mission recommendations: Level 1: Frigate or destroyer. Level 2: Cruiser. Level 3: Battlecruiser. Level 4: Battleship. These are only recommendations, not written-in-stone rules.
People that are "skill constrained" tend to play the skill queue rather than the game. They focus on all they cannot do, rather than what they can do. They don't try anything or experiment for fear of failure. They don't use their imagination, or try to learn about their ship's limits and capabilities, nor their own. They hope someday they will have fun, rather than having fun now.
Skills help you do better at what you already do. Don't think of them as enablers / blockers.
Kudos for going beyond your skills. |
Karl Jerr
Herzack Unit
17
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Posted - 2014.04.20 18:17:00 -
[19] - Quote
Doing missions beyond beyond you comfort zone is really fun. I use a navy cruiser for L3s, and today I began the 10th mission of a story security L3 where my primary objective was to destroy a blood raider chapel. By arriving in the last room I found multiple Apocalypse style BS . I managed to destroy one but wasn't able to cope with 3 other ones who were pretty pissed so I just ran toward the chapel and destroyed it to complete the mission and ran away afterward .
LP/isk ratio doesn't make it all indeed. |
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor Cosmic Consortium
5220
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Posted - 2014.04.22 12:56:00 -
[20] - Quote
Tendall Antollare wrote:I have no doubt that there are dozens of ways for a player with 1 month experience to win this encounter, but right now I'm 2 days away from finishing Drones L5, and a few minutes after that I can pick up Heavy Drone Operation and then buy my first Ogre I. I'm pretty sure would tip the balance in the encounter I just had.
Is that not a legitimate case of being skill constrained?
First: Heavy drones are never the answer to any question. Sentry Drones on the other hand, are the only answer you ever need to any question. I may be exaggerating a teensy bit.
Heavy drones are slow. NPCs love shooting drones. When you see the NPCs start shooting your heavy drones, it's too late to save them.
Sentry drones don't move. But they don't need to. They reach out and deliver your loving word of thermal/kinetic/EM/explosive damage to your choice of blessed target every four seconds.
Second: if more DPS would have solved your problem, the easiest way to double your DPS is to bring a friend. Friends are much more valuable than ISK, Skill Points or even player skill.
Make friends, that's what this game is really about.
Day 0 advice for new players: Day 0 Advice for New Players |
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