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Graabeerd Khagah
ImaNicePirate.com Ideal Society
135
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Posted - 2014.04.17 18:04:00 -
[1] - Quote
Sincere question, can someone direct me to where I can find the pirate code of honor?? I am sure for those of you who been around for a few years may know if there is such as one, thanks |
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
903
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Posted - 2014.04.17 18:26:00 -
[2] - Quote
I don't think such a thing exists, and if it did it would be one person or groups interpretation of the 'sandbox' you now find yourself in....
Some honor ransoms. Some pod without mercy. Some re-imburse partial losses for good fights & attitude. Some shoot even the newest players in the face. (cough).
There are three high level EvE axioms however that may help you define your own code...
1) Never undock something you are afraid to lose 2) Never trust anyone 3) if in doubt refer to the first and second laws.
F
Would you like to know more? |
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
17918
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Posted - 2014.04.17 19:10:00 -
[3] - Quote
The Pirate Code
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Tengu Grib
Maniacal Laughter Ltd.
43
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Posted - 2014.04.17 19:58:00 -
[4] - Quote
Best possible response.
But OP, as Feyd said, no one has setup a comprehensive set of guidelines for pirates, primarily because everyone has their own opinions and interpretation.
For myself, if I fight you I will kill you and try to pod you. That being said, if you convo me and ask how much for a ransom, my response would depend on your offer. A good offer will likely be met with mercy, and the ransom offered. A bad offer will get you killed with no further opportunities to save yourself because of the insult. I won't convo you and offer a ransom though.
Others however feel differently. Some will never accept ransoms, others will accept then kill you anyways, others still will accept and honor it, and a select few will accept, honor the ransom, and make sure you get to where you need to be safely. Those last ones are rare though.
Beyond responses to ransoms, I'm not really sure what you would be looking for in a pirate code of behaviour. I know that several of the larger merc and pirate corps have mutual non-aggression pacts. The nature of those are more or less speculation though. (When's the last time marmite and Noir fought for instance?)
Not sure what else you would be expecting to find in such a code. Tengu Grib > I agree. The distinct lack of quality spaceships makes RL the worst space sim ever.
SolidX > i'm an alt IRL |
Graabeerd Khagah
ImaNicePirate.com Ideal Society
135
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Posted - 2014.04.17 20:25:00 -
[5] - Quote
Thank you gentlemen, I really appreciate the efforts you made to answer my question and this pretty well settles it. Thanks again. |
Psychotic Monk
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
2008
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Posted - 2014.04.18 00:12:00 -
[6] - Quote
For me my most common behaviours that you might look at as 'honour' are to never **** over a professional peer and to spread the knowledge to anyone who asks.
That's about it. Belligerent Undesirables Selling Griefer Immunity |
Tengu Grib
Maniacal Laughter Ltd.
43
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Posted - 2014.04.18 00:27:00 -
[7] - Quote
Psychotic Monk wrote:For me my most common behaviours that you might look at as 'honour' are to never **** over a professional peer and to spread the knowledge to anyone who asks.
That's about it.
I fully agree with both those rules, and realize that I've already been following them without putting them in words. Tengu Grib > I agree. The distinct lack of quality spaceships makes RL the worst space sim ever.
SolidX > i'm an alt IRL |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
4938
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Posted - 2014.04.18 00:45:00 -
[8] - Quote
Much like with real life Ye Olde Pyrates, it really depends on who you are dealing with.
I honor ransoms, every time. But that's me (and my various alts), and I don't speak for anyone. If you're considering skullduggery as an activity (which I highly encourage), then decide for yourself how you will operate. Or don't, play everything by ear. Whatever suits you. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
-áPsychotic Monk for CSM9.
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Tara Read
The Generic Pirate Corporation Shadow Cartel
688
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Posted - 2014.04.18 06:31:00 -
[9] - Quote
There really is no "code" but the roots of Piracy ethics in Eve can be traced back to the early days when ransoming was still a viable and lucrative profession. Low Sec thrived, sites were worth running, and before the age of the Jump Freighter many goods and items were transported through Low Sec.
So naturally Piracy was as just a valid profession as any. Nowadays word is valued above all eve isk. Why? Look at examples such as Chribba who is an exemplary member of the Community. Now while Chribba my not Don the skull and crossbones he does have one very valuable asset: trust.
Back in the early days you were isolated from many Pirate groups if you broke your word because really it was just bad for business. The actions of your "comrades" not only effected themselves but your wallet too! Dishonor a ransom and the well dried up.
So a very practical method was to just honor ransoms. Eventually word spreads, and for a small convo the wallet blinks. How does this translate to modern Eve Piracy? The basic principle is the same but on a wider scale.
Take Shadow Cartel for example. We have very simple rules:
1. Honor all ransoms.
2. Honor all 1v1.
3. Your word is your bond.
Now why are these three points critical? Because word travels. Persons in our Alliance have spent years building our reputation and reliability. Because of our strict "code" many opportunities not afforded to other groups become available to us. Big fights, Major kills, the spoils of being a predator when called upon.
See reputation and word makes you valued as well as feared. Do not throw such things away on a cheap pump and dump kill or a cheap laugh. You could be costing yourself quite alot in the end. Just be truthful and honor your word even as a Pirate.
I warn you though being an honest Pirate drunk with power is loads of fun... Visit my blog for all the latest in jeers and tears as well as news at http://hoistthecolors.org |
Ohm's Law's
Convicts and Savages Shadow Cartel
4
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Posted - 2014.04.18 08:37:00 -
[10] - Quote
Probably the best known source of a written Pirates Code is to be found on the Tuskers website (haven't actually looked for awhile so not sure if still there or not). Wen I first became a pirate i based my piracy of this code. As to offering ransoms or not, i don't see much point offering ransoms for stuff like frigs and cruisers, however my standard procedure is to kill the ship and if i get hold of the pod then i quite often offer a ransom for tht based on the toon age and wat they were doing. On the other hand, if i catch your nice shiny mission ship, again the chance of ransom is low cuz i want tht loot and the KM, so as stated above, open convo and make it known u will pay. Alot of ppl say tth these days you should never pay a ransom cuz pirates are just griefers tht will kill u anyway, sure some ppl do this but in my experience most pirates will honour ransoms and 1v1 agreements. |
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General Lemming
Darwins Lemmings Holding Darwins Lemmings
171
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Posted - 2014.04.18 09:47:00 -
[11] - Quote
Can someone also point me to the Devils Charity for Ship-less Miners guidelines ? |
Subject 4927
The United Nations
40
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Posted - 2014.04.18 15:48:00 -
[12] - Quote
Respect those who share the same passion as you.
Everything else is dependent on your own morals. |
Sabriz Adoudel
Mission BLITZ
2647
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Posted - 2014.04.18 23:00:00 -
[13] - Quote
Shoot everyone, sort out the mess later.
That said I will honour ransom except where I hold a personal grudge against the mark or someone linked to them. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=326497 --áPsychotic Monk for CSM! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=238931 - an idea for a new form of hybrid PVE/PVP content. If you want to mine in highsec, read www.minerbumping.com. |
Narcotic Gryffin
Anoikis Vergence
27
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Posted - 2014.04.19 06:09:00 -
[14] - Quote
Aside from this there is no 1 answer. Everyone has their own honor code based on what kind of pirate they see themselves to be. http://www.sortius-is-a-geek.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/history-channel-hd-aliens-thumb.jpg |
Valleria Darkmoon
Convicts and Savages Shadow Cartel
227
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Posted - 2014.04.19 08:02:00 -
[15] - Quote
I once refunded a billion ISK ransom from a Legion pod because after he paid I said "let him go" and a fleet mate heard "light him up" apparently. I suppose more accurately the trigger happy fleet member who wasn't paying attention refunded the 1 bil ransom. The Legion pilot was still out his high-grade slave pod but at least it wasn't the pod + 1 billion.
I also refunded 550 mil from a Tempest Fleet Issue that paid my fleet to live and although we did let him go he wasn't able to warp before the rats finished him. Technically I might have been able to argue that we did let him go and rats killed him or that he should have been aligned so I wasn't at fault. But the payment was for survival and my reputation is worth more than 550 million.
If I'm not prepared to let you go for what you offer to pay I will say so and won't take your money, just your ship and I'm more likely to ransom a pod than a ship because pods can not be looted. Reputation is everything and all I'm worried about is that people know they can believe any promise I offer which comes in very handy when you occasionally fleet up with reds to fight a common enemy. It pays to be able to have each fleet trust the other not to turn on them the second the common enemy is dead, lack of trust weakens the co-operation and jeopardizes the chances the op will succeed. Even if you don't really like the group you are red to and fleeting with then for the duration of the op there is one commandment: Thou shalt swallow thy animosity. |
Pubbie Spy
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1
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Posted - 2014.04.19 11:14:00 -
[16] - Quote
As a representative of the most excellent and virtuous space guilde known as Goonswarm, I can confirm that honour is the most important aspect in capsuleer-capsuleer interactions. |
Tarojan
Tarojan Corporation
102
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Posted - 2014.04.19 12:56:00 -
[17] - Quote
Valleria Darkmoon wrote:I once refunded a billion ISK ransom from a Legion pod because after he paid I said "let him go" and a fleet mate heard "light him up" apparently. I suppose more accurately the trigger happy fleet member who wasn't paying attention refunded the 1 bil ransom. The Legion pilot was still out his high-grade slave pod but at least it wasn't the pod + 1 billion.
I also refunded 550 mil from a Tempest Fleet Issue that paid my fleet to live and although we did let him go he wasn't able to warp before the rats finished him. Technically I might have been able to argue that we did let him go and rats killed him or that he should have been aligned so I wasn't at fault. But the payment was for survival and my reputation is worth more than 550 million.
If I'm not prepared to let you go for what you offer to pay I will say so and won't take your money, just your ship and I'm more likely to ransom a pod than a ship because pods can not be looted. Reputation is everything and all I'm worried about is that people know they can believe any promise I offer which comes in very handy when you occasionally fleet up with reds to fight a common enemy. It pays to be able to have each fleet trust the other not to turn on them the second the common enemy is dead, lack of trust weakens the co-operation and jeopardizes the chances the op will succeed. Even if you don't really like the group you are red to and fleeting with then for the duration of the op there is one commandment: Thou shalt swallow thy animosity.
That logic only applies when you think/know people will remember you. Whereas I commonly deal with people who had ransoms not honoured and dont trust them. Also the chances of me meeting the same guy twice are slim, so the incentive to honour a ransom really isnt there. It makes more sense to take the ransom then blow him away and loot the wreck, then to play at e honour. Its not like I lose out by doing so. I will only make an exception to this if theres a genuine need to leave them alive, otherwise what can I hope to gain? some warm fuzzy feelings? Erotica 1: "I would create a massive pyramid scheme in Eve to show you what it is, but I'm an honest business person, so you'll just have to find education elsewhere. Start with the wiki link that was linked by a person who didn't even read what he linked." Theres a reason I play eve XD |
Valleria Darkmoon
Convicts and Savages Shadow Cartel
231
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Posted - 2014.04.20 04:10:00 -
[18] - Quote
Tarojan wrote:That logic only applies when you think/know people will remember you. Whereas I commonly deal with people who had ransoms not honoured and dont trust them. Also the chances of me meeting the same guy twice are slim, so the incentive to honour a ransom really isnt there. It makes more sense to take the ransom then blow him away and loot the wreck, then to play at e honour. Its not like I lose out by doing so. I will only make an exception to this if theres a genuine need to leave them alive, otherwise what can I hope to gain? some warm fuzzy feelings? I'm not only concerned about myself here, screwing someone over on a paid ransom or killing a fleet mate after the common target is down reflects poorly on my corp and alliance as well. So if you want to take the full on self-interest route then it's non-emotional and very simple. I want to stay in my corp and my corp insists that ransoms/temp blue status is honored. Therefore I follow the rules to stay in corp. |
Oshia Launay
Galactic Fringe Inc
21
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Posted - 2014.04.20 19:50:00 -
[19] - Quote
Maybe it was different years ago, but your average player/corps/alliance that call themselves pirates seem to be nothing but gankers looking to pad their killmails with easy no-risk kills at lowsec gate camps. No code, no honour. |
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
18029
|
Posted - 2014.04.20 20:02:00 -
[20] - Quote
Oshia Launay wrote:Maybe it was different years ago, but your average player/corps/alliance that call themselves pirates seem to be nothing but gankers looking to pad their killmails with easy no-risk kills at lowsec gate camps. No code, no honour. You do realise that traditional piracy usually consisted of attacking lightly/ unarmed vessels, as in no to low risk, for profit don't you? Eve piracy is fairly consistent with the traditional form of piracy.
Pirates rarely attacked anything they didn't outgun, and would run if confronted with heavily armed vessels. The romantic hollywood image of pirates is utter horseshit.
Never go full Ripard |
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Valleria Darkmoon
Convicts and Savages Shadow Cartel
231
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Posted - 2014.04.20 21:09:00 -
[21] - Quote
Oshia Launay wrote:Maybe it was different years ago, but your average player/corps/alliance that call themselves pirates seem to be nothing but gankers looking to pad their killmails with easy no-risk kills at lowsec gate camps. No code, no honour. This is exactly the kind of behavior to be expected from EVERYONE in EVE. If you expect different then you have not yet figured out the mentality it takes to play this game. Security status is a reflection of how aggressive you are at starting fights in low sec and how little ratting you do (not even that so much anymore) and literally nothing else. It's not as if null sec gate camping isn't a thing, you just don't lose sec status for it and other than bubbles there is literally no difference between the two. I even gave you the reason why I ransom pods more than ships and it should make perfect sense. I want killboard stats and I want your ship loot, pods are worth very little on a killboard and anything in it can't be looted, so often I would prefer a payout to some paltry stats and no loot.
I always chuckle a bit whenever someone refuses to pay on the basis that my sec status makes me untrustworthy, as if being an outlaw makes you untrustworthy. At least pirate players trust each other, as I pointed out earlier I fleet with reds sometimes and they trust me not to take advantage of them making themselves vulnerable to me and I trust them to do the same even though we would be fighting at any other time. Think about business men either in game or real life. They don't trust each other at all, they assume that the other guy is trying to screw them over from day one making their primary goal to screw the other guy over a little bit faster and a little bit harder to increase his own bottom line. In EVE and IRL these people are your real slime and they operate within the bounds of the law.
Pirates may want your ship and killmail, many EVE players want your assets tab.
A mugger may want your wallet, a business man wants your house. |
Oshia Launay
Galactic Fringe Inc
21
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Posted - 2014.04.20 21:41:00 -
[22] - Quote
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:Oshia Launay wrote:Maybe it was different years ago, but your average player/corps/alliance that call themselves pirates seem to be nothing but gankers looking to pad their killmails with easy no-risk kills at lowsec gate camps. No code, no honour. You do realise that traditional piracy usually consisted of attacking lightly/ unarmed vessels, as in no to low risk, for profit don't you? Eve piracy is fairly consistent with the traditional form of piracy. 'Traditional' piracy did not consist in camping harbors opening fire on and sinking fishing boats for entertainment and bragging rights. Pirates were in it for the profit indeed, and to run a profitable operation, they had to pick profitable targets, be true to their word, and honour ransoms. No crew would surrender their cargo to pirates that would slaughter them afterwards, no ransom would be paid to pirates were captives not released.
Gankers, they just shoot whatever comes through the gates, many seem perfectly happy to camp lowsec gateways closest to rookie systems for the steady stream of worthless rookie ships and ventures flying through, others like to camp with 15 which can't leave much money after they divide it, they lose half the cargo blowing up ships, shoot pods without asking a ransom. Kill-padding is what it's about. Shooting things indiscriminately, I don't call piracy is all. |
Oshia Launay
Galactic Fringe Inc
21
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Posted - 2014.04.20 21:45:00 -
[23] - Quote
Quote:This is exactly the kind of behavior to be expected from EVERYONE in EVE. If you expect different then you have not yet figured out the mentality it takes to play this game. Oh I figured that out alright two days into my trial account, was a bit disappointed to find out that there was very little actual piracy going on though. |
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
18049
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Posted - 2014.04.20 22:16:00 -
[24] - Quote
Oshia Launay wrote:Jonah Gravenstein wrote:Oshia Launay wrote:Maybe it was different years ago, but your average player/corps/alliance that call themselves pirates seem to be nothing but gankers looking to pad their killmails with easy no-risk kills at lowsec gate camps. No code, no honour. You do realise that traditional piracy usually consisted of attacking lightly/ unarmed vessels, as in no to low risk, for profit don't you? Eve piracy is fairly consistent with the traditional form of piracy. 'Traditional' piracy did not consist in camping harbors opening fire on and sinking fishing boats for entertainment and bragging rights. Pirates were in it for the profit indeed, and to run a profitable operation, they had to pick profitable targets, be true to their word, and honour ransoms. No crew would surrender their cargo to pirates that would slaughter them afterwards, no ransom would be paid to pirates were captives not released afterwards. Gankers, they just shoot whatever comes through the gates, many seem perfectly happy to camp lowsec gateways closest to rookie systems for the steady stream of worthless rookie ships and ventures flying through, others like to camp with 15 which can't leave much money after they divide it, they lose half the cargo blowing up ships, shoot pods without asking a ransom. Kill-padding is what it's about. Shooting things indiscriminately, I don't call piracy is all. Wrong. The Vikings were pirates who terrorised Europe, as were the Sea Peoples who terrorised the Eastern Mediterranean, both indiscriminately attacked anything that moved for entertainment as well as profit.
Once again Eve piracy seems to fit in fairly well with the pirates of old.
Never go full Ripard |
Cassandra Aurilien
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
53
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Posted - 2014.04.21 01:24:00 -
[25] - Quote
Jonah Gravenstein wrote: Wrong. The Vikings were pirates who terrorised Europe, as were the Sea Peoples who terrorised the Eastern Mediterranean, both indiscriminately attacked anything that moved for entertainment as well as profit.
Once again Eve piracy seems to fit in fairly well with the pirates of old.
In fairness to the Vikings, they generally tried to trade first. If a city was unwilling to conduct trade, then they attacked anything that moves.
Don't forget that some of those same Viking Raider captains had spent time guarding the Emperors of Byzantium, and were considered to be the most trustworthy troops the Empire commanded. (They kept their oaths.)
Sea Peoples, though. Yes, quite true. |
Syds Sinclair
Aliastra Gallente Federation
222
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Posted - 2014.04.21 18:05:00 -
[26] - Quote
Psychotic Monk wrote:For me my most common behaviours that you might look at as 'honour' are to never **** over a professional peer and to spread the knowledge to anyone who asks.
That's about it.
..I one hundred percent agree.
Expanding on other forms of piracy code of honor, I personally do not like honoring ship or pod ransoms. If I can get you to contract me an Obelisk I'll still kill your Golem.
That does change if I'm pirating with a group of fellows who do prefer to honor ransoms. In that case I'll play with the code that my wingmen have agreed on.
As for severance packages from a corp I've just AWOXed, I will take a medal and ~200m and leave the corp. ..HighSec Mischief and Market Advice - http://rhapsodyvice.blogspot.com/ -Latest entry - 4/10/14 -http://rhapsodyvice.blogspot.com/2014/04/spheres-of-explosions-part-two.html? |
Xylorn Hasher
Sumiyoshi-Kai
125
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Posted - 2014.04.21 22:52:00 -
[27] - Quote
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:Oshia Launay wrote:Maybe it was different years ago, but your average player/corps/alliance that call themselves pirates seem to be nothing but gankers looking to pad their killmails with easy no-risk kills at lowsec gate camps. No code, no honour. You do realise that traditional piracy usually consisted of attacking lightly/ unarmed vessels, as in no to low risk, for profit don't you? Eve piracy is fairly consistent with the traditional form of piracy. Pirates rarely attacked anything they didn't outgun, and would run if confronted with heavily armed vessels. The romantic hollywood image of pirates is utter horseshit.
Exacly, We are here to make money, not fair fights!
Like this.
All my posts are made shortly after Marihuana-áconsumption. |
Famine Aligher'ri
V i L e
6
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Posted - 2014.04.22 02:47:00 -
[28] - Quote
Been in piracy since almost the beginning.
From my extensive experience, different pirates have different code of honor. It slightly changes over the years depending on who is active in the trade. Obviously, this could include a code of honor that most would agree with, but other times, it seems as if no code exists at all.
For me, I have no code of honor among outsiders. If I find you, I will try to kill you. I do this to profit off your death either by ransoming your ship, selling your modules or both because I never honor ransoms.
Call it cheap, degrading, whatever. I feed only on the weak, never the strong. Famine Aligher'ri Master Pirate |
Luwc
Biohazard. WINMATAR.
114
|
Posted - 2014.04.22 07:18:00 -
[29] - Quote
Graabeerd Khagah wrote:Sincere question, can someone direct me to where I can find the pirate code of honor?? I am sure for those of you who been around for a few years may know if there is such as one, thanks
**** Your Roleplaying ****.
dishonor ransom. Scam Pod Fight unfair.
Seriously.
who gives a ****.
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Kristalll
Valkyrie Professional Resources R.E.S.P.A.W.N.
200
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Posted - 2014.04.22 07:46:00 -
[30] - Quote
The only code that matters: die trying. GÇ£Die tryingGÇ¥ is the proudest human thing. |
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