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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 32 post(s) |
Sylvanium Orlenard
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
47
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Posted - 2014.04.28 16:32:00 -
[151] - Quote
LHA Tarawa wrote:CCP Nullarbor wrote: That's not why, but it is a nice side effect.
So, what is the why? You dislike corps being able to make BPOs available for all players to sue, without risk of theft, because they are locked down in corproate hanger? There is some "fun" aspect of the game that comes from us grinding out copies in 1-man alt-coprs to protect BPOs from corporate theft? Was there really a meeting where someone said "Let's destroy BPO lockdow!" and someone else replied "YEAH!! It will make the game WAY more fun if industrialists have to create one-man alt corps to create copies to protect their BPOs from corp theft!" Seriously?
Industry is currently one of the safest ISK making ventures you can do in EVE. With very few and relatively simple precautions you can currently make ISK hands over fist doing industry and not have to risk much if any of that ISK. (before you say station traders enjoy a risk free ISK making venture, well try doing a bad bet on your trading and see how fast your profits go down the drain :) )
CCP wants all ISK making activities to have an inherent amount of risk attached to it. In Industry they decided to create that risk by making blueprints have to be in the factory and not in some station under lock down.
Do I agree with it, NO, but I can understand why they would do that, even if I really really hate it. |
Querns
GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation
428
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Posted - 2014.04.28 16:35:00 -
[152] - Quote
LHA Tarawa wrote:CCP Nullarbor wrote: That's not why, but it is a nice side effect.
So, what is the why? You dislike corps being able to make BPOs available for all players to sue, without risk of theft, because they are locked down in corproate hanger? There is some "fun" aspect of the game that comes from us grinding out copies in 1-man alt-coprs to protect BPOs from corporate theft? Was there really a meeting where someone said "Let's destroy BPO lockdow!" and someone else replied "YEAH!! It will make the game WAY more fun if industrialists have to create one-man alt corps to create copies to protect their BPOs from corp theft!" Seriously? You can still lock down BPOs and use the infinitely available copy slots at a station to do exactly what you're doing now.
Alternatively, you should just not get into a situation where theft is a possibility. This may involve vetting potential recruits beyond the "paid attention to your ad in Recruitment." This post was crafted by a member of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay. |
LHA Tarawa
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
911
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Posted - 2014.04.28 16:36:00 -
[153] - Quote
Querns wrote: No. The removal of remote BPO copying was to make you have to actually endure risk to enjoy the benefits of POS research. It wasn't a mechanical workaround.
You clearly do not understand how industrialists operate.
RISK destroys profit potential.
We're not going to put tens or hundreds of billions of ISK worth of BPOs at risk. Not when the profit on a capital is maybe tens of millions. We have to build 1000 capitals to pay back the purchase price of BPOs. There is not room in that for the risk of BPOs being subjected to the irsk of corp theft becuase they can not be locked-down.
We will create an alt corp with large POS in high sec, with a gazillion hardeners, and a couple labs, and crank out the copies. Transport them to null in regular jump freighter runs, since the copies take up virtually no space.
It is not risk v. reward. It is goint pain in the donkey, for no game-play value.
Industrialists do NOT accept risk. We find ways around risk, usually by destroying profitability, which is why 70% of players stay in high sec. The stupid hoops we have to jump through to avoid attempts to force us to accept risk destroys profitability of doing anything else.
CCP admitted in the blog about this that NO ONE is going to be putting expensive BPOs into POS. |
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation Ineluctable.
439
|
Posted - 2014.04.28 16:37:00 -
[154] - Quote
Btw, where has the potential Profit part gone in your current final draft? That was something, which could really make the industry window a lot more informative about whether something is worth producing or not - without checking on 3rd party websites or personal spreadsheets. If would of course just give a rough value for the current region you produce in (which limits the usefulness if you don't produce in the region you want to sell your stuff in, naturally; unless you can set a specific sell place for the calculations), but at least you had an indicator on whether it's profitable at all or not. |
Querns
GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation
428
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Posted - 2014.04.28 16:39:00 -
[155] - Quote
LHA Tarawa wrote: Industrialists do NOT accept risk.
No, you mean YOU don't accept risk. You should be prepared to be outcompeted by those who do. This post was crafted by a member of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
21372
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Posted - 2014.04.28 16:43:00 -
[156] - Quote
LHA Tarawa wrote:RISK destroys profit potential. That's kind of the point. If you can afford the work-arounds, you can eliminate the risk; if you want the quick buck, you have to live with the risk.
Quote:Industrialists do NOT accept risk. Sure they do, in controlled doses. The point is that now there is an actual option where previously there were none. Whether or not people will use that option, and under what circumstances, remains to be seen. It's a bit premature to state what people will or won't do based solely on what they did when there was only one proper option available. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skill plan 2.1. |
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation Ineluctable.
439
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Posted - 2014.04.28 16:46:00 -
[157] - Quote
Querns wrote:LHA Tarawa wrote: Industrialists do NOT accept risk.
No, you mean YOU don't accept risk. You should be prepared to be outcompeted by those who do.
Thanks to people like you it's not going to be too many.
--
Also, are we going to be limited to 20 copies per copy process or can we create more than 20 copies in one go? |
LHA Tarawa
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
911
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Posted - 2014.04.28 16:50:00 -
[158] - Quote
Sylvanium Orlenard wrote:CCP wants all ISK making activities to have an inherent amount of risk attached to it. In Industry they decided to create that risk by making blueprints have to be in the factory and not in some station under lock down.
Do I agree with it, NO, but I can understand why they would do that, even if I really really hate it.
Then CCP is doomed to fail, because we do not accept risk. We accept lower profit to avoid risk, until the profit becomes too low, then we move back to high sec.
If CCP wants everyone in high sec, then they are on the right track. Just keep putting more hoops for null sec industrialists to have to jump though to stay safe.
This idea they can get us to accept significant risk is beyond ridiculous.
They need to stop listening to GOONS, have 3000 pilots online at any time. Their POV is NOT the POV of the other 30,000 pilots. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
21372
|
Posted - 2014.04.28 16:52:00 -
[159] - Quote
LHA Tarawa wrote:Then CCP is doomed to fail, because we do not accept risk. You keep using that word. As long as you keep using it, you will be inherently wrong.
Top tip: stop saying GÇ£weGÇ¥ when you mean GÇ£IGÇ¥. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skill plan 2.1. |
LHA Tarawa
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
913
|
Posted - 2014.04.28 16:53:00 -
[160] - Quote
Querns wrote:LHA Tarawa wrote: Industrialists do NOT accept risk.
No, you mean YOU don't accept risk. You should be prepared to be outcompeted by those who do.
So, join goonswarm where 3000 blues have your back, so I can oput compete those that don't have 3000 other players watching their back...
Spoken like a true goon.
CCP, seriously.... we're not all goons! Stop listening the their ideas that make the goons more profitable and drive everyone else out of the game.
This change to BPOs is just STUPID! |
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
21372
|
Posted - 2014.04.28 16:55:00 -
[161] - Quote
LHA Tarawa wrote:This change to BPOs is just STUPID! BPOs don't change in the slightest.
GǪor, well, they become faster to copy, but that's more GÇ£handyGÇ¥ than GÇ£stupidGÇ¥. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skill plan 2.1. |
Dorna Loone
Dark Star Demolition
26
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Posted - 2014.04.28 16:59:00 -
[162] - Quote
Liking very much what I've seen so far. Having everything I need to select or press on a single window, however big it becomes, instead of having to press buttons to open yet more windows (like selecting the factory slot) is a huge step in the right direction |
LHA Tarawa
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
913
|
Posted - 2014.04.28 16:59:00 -
[163] - Quote
Tippia wrote:LHA Tarawa wrote:Then CCP is doomed to fail, because we do not accept risk. You keep using that word. As long as you keep using it, you will be inherently wrong. Top tip: stop saying GÇ£weGÇ¥ when you mean GÇ£IGÇ¥.
Then why did CCP, in the blog where they announced the change, admit that no one is going to be puttiing 100 million+ ISK BPOs into POS?
I can't imagine that they actually thought this through, including the risk of corp theft from not being able to lock-down, and the ramifications of the total annoyance that is going to come from alt-corps that do nothing other than make BPCs.
Whoooo hoooo... fun game. Log in the alt, start a bunch of copies. Take the copies out. Create cotrract.
Talk about extra mindless mouse clicks with no game-play value. |
LHA Tarawa
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
913
|
Posted - 2014.04.28 17:00:00 -
[164] - Quote
Tippia wrote:LHA Tarawa wrote:This change to BPOs is just STUPID! BPOs don't change in the slightest. GǪor, well, they become faster to copy, but that's more GǣhandyGǥ than GǣstupidGǥ.
Semantics.
Sorry... left out the word "effecting".
|
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
21372
|
Posted - 2014.04.28 17:05:00 -
[165] - Quote
LHA Tarawa wrote:Then why did CCP, in the blog where they announced the change, admit that no one is going to be puttiing 100 million+ ISK BPOs into POS? Good news: there are other BPOs.
Quote:I can't imagine that they actually thought this through, including the risk of corp theft from not being able to lock-down, and the ramifications of the total annoyance that is going to come from alt-corps that do nothing other than make BPCs. Sounds like they thought it through fairly well: you can risk it or you can do the extra work. Two options as opposed to none. You have to choose which is worth more to you.
No. It's just sloppiness and bad argumentation on your part. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skill plan 2.1. |
TheButcherPete
Incompertus INC Fatal Ascension
417
|
Posted - 2014.04.28 17:05:00 -
[166] - Quote
LHA Tarawa wrote:Sylvanium Orlenard wrote:CCP wants all ISK making activities to have an inherent amount of risk attached to it. In Industry they decided to create that risk by making blueprints have to be in the factory and not in some station under lock down.
Do I agree with it, NO, but I can understand why they would do that, even if I really really hate it. Then CCP is doomed to fail, because we do not accept risk. We accept lower profit to avoid risk, until the profit becomes too low, then we move back to high sec. If CCP wants everyone in high sec, then they are on the right track. Just keep putting more hoops for null sec industrialists to have to jump though to stay safe. This idea they can get us to accept significant risk is beyond ridiculous. They need to stop listening to GOONS, have 3000 pilots online at any time. Their POV is NOT the POV of the other 30,000 pilots.
Please, post with your main.
Or did Dinsdale get banned, and subsequently drunk? That would explain your utterly terrible posting. THE KING OF EVE RADIO
ElQuirko is my son |
asteroidjas
Rothschild's Sewage and Septic Sucking Services The Possum Lodge
41
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Posted - 2014.04.28 17:08:00 -
[167] - Quote
So....from the looks of it, i'll be able to see a maximum of 9 (NINE) blueprints at any given time on your attempt to push the Unified Inventory's "one window to replace them all" mentality. Is this correct?
If so, i ask that you re-think that idea, it just seems horrible.
Also, once this comes out on the test server, PLEASE for the love of all that is good in this world LISTEN to the ppl giving you feedback. Though i will not likely waste my time given that CCP basically said they didn't believe any of the players feedback for two whole months, about the Unified Inventory (more or less the same thing, but this is your attempt to do it with Industry). |
Celgar Thurn
Department 10
150
|
Posted - 2014.04.28 17:11:00 -
[168] - Quote
At first glance the new UI seems more complicated and not user friendly. I will have to read it again a few times. |
Bagrat Skalski
Poseidaon
1344
|
Posted - 2014.04.28 17:12:00 -
[169] - Quote
Is there maybe an option to add minigame to the industry window, teams could be more efficient if you will point them many things as a overseer and in 10 minutes span you could take a look what they are doing and shout: "get back to work!" if they are drinking coffe or chatting.
Or maybe developing new, optimized code will be apropriate one time per job in the beginning. When weapons, technology, and economies mature faster than the leadership culture entrusted with them, disaster ensues. |
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation Ineluctable.
439
|
Posted - 2014.04.28 17:13:00 -
[170] - Quote
Tippia wrote:LHA Tarawa wrote:Then CCP is doomed to fail, because we do not accept risk. You keep using that word. As long as you keep using it, you will be inherently wrong. Top tip: stop saying GÇ£weGÇ¥ when you mean GÇ£IGÇ¥.
Expert tip: Don't try to put too many in the same pot by implying that your approach was any better than his. |
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TheSmokingHertog
TALIBAN EXPRESS
222
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Posted - 2014.04.28 17:14:00 -
[171] - Quote
CCP RubberBAND wrote:Peter Powers wrote:ok, so now it is shiny and better looking and all, but uhm, it still seems to lack (or i did misread the post) one feature that i know me (and others) have been asking for in the past.
What about bulk-creating-jobs?
when i have 10 Scorch M BPC, then doing the same clicking (well i guess dragging now) etc 10 times is *extremly* annoying, so can we please have an option to clone jobs? can this dragging, clicking thing please be a template, and we can create 10 jobs without doing the same stuff over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again?
regards, PP The idea is that the system will remember all settings for a blueprint, so if you set up 1 Scorch M BPC, all subsequent blueprints of this type will default to the last submitted job settings. So you set up the first blueprint, then just hit submit on the subsequent BPCs because everything is set to go.
Maybe make a right click menu option to force this from the menu ;)... |
Tora Hamaji
Republic University Minmatar Republic
28
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Posted - 2014.04.28 17:15:00 -
[172] - Quote
As a t2 manufacturer I can say this is impressive progress from the current indy, however
You're missing some VERY important things:
- the ability to stack or batch run multiple BPCs of the same type.
- Queuing jobs up to 24 or 48 hours. (there is nothing like having to put new jobs every 1h 40 mins for those t2 small items)
- Seeing the total materials missing for components (think t2 bs construction. need 1k engines and 2k sensors, what are the total mats i am missing for those?)
- Saving Job Plans
- Make Job Plans updatable. (say you decide to build 3 kronos, over the next days you bought 1k sensors but acquired new t2 mats, what do you need now?)
- Automatic component job installation! This is something that you CCP said were interested in doing!
- Need more corp hangar divisions!
- New pos modules for large operations, with large numbers of slots.
- unified pos hangars, so that all facilities can be operated from 1 storage hangar instead of having to search through 20 labs for that BPC.
- Security issues for indy corps
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Weaselior
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
7092
|
Posted - 2014.04.28 17:17:00 -
[173] - Quote
LHA Tarawa wrote: Then CCP is doomed to fail, because we do not accept risk. We accept lower profit to avoid risk, until the profit becomes too low, then we move back to high sec.
i accept risk and i'm going to beat your brains out in whatever market i choose to as long as i can get rewarded for my risk-taking
now, i understand npc alts don't like risk but they're barely human Head of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal Pubbie Management and Exploitation Division. |
Cheng Chai
Random Awesome Holding Corp
3
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Posted - 2014.04.28 17:26:00 -
[174] - Quote
I don't like that you call 'Volume' what should be 'Quantity' on this one http://content.eveonline.com/www/newssystem/media/66065/1/Blueprints_ShowInfo_Industry.png
It is misleading. |
LHA Tarawa
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
913
|
Posted - 2014.04.28 17:28:00 -
[175] - Quote
Weaselior wrote:LHA Tarawa wrote: Then CCP is doomed to fail, because we do not accept risk. We accept lower profit to avoid risk, until the profit becomes too low, then we move back to high sec.
i accept risk and i'm going to beat your brains out in whatever market i choose to as long as i can get rewarded for my risk-taking now, i understand npc alts don't like risk but they're barely human
You hide too. You hide in goonswarm. Come out and try being in a ten man corp with 30 total toons.
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
21376
|
Posted - 2014.04.28 17:36:00 -
[176] - Quote
LHA Tarawa wrote:You hide too. You hide in goonswarm. Come out and try being in a ten man corp with 30 total toons. 30? Blob moar. Also, post in the other thread since your whinging has nothing to do with the UI. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skill plan 2.1. |
Little Dragon Khamez
Guardians of the Underworld White Mountain Coalition
1331
|
Posted - 2014.04.28 17:37:00 -
[177] - Quote
on balance they look like nice changes, we might even see the cost of some T2 stuff falling which might be welcome. we'll have to wait and see I suppose, but the new user interfaces look serviceable, functional and fun, so well done CCP. Dumbing down of Eve Online will result in it's destruction... |
Alekseyev Karrde
Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group
1437
|
Posted - 2014.04.28 17:38:00 -
[178] - Quote
Rivr Luzade wrote:Btw, where has the potential Profit part gone in your current final draft? That was something, which could really make the industry window a lot more informative about whether something is worth producing or not - without checking on 3rd party websites or personal spreadsheets. If would of course just give a rough value for the current region you produce in (which limits the usefulness if you don't produce in the region you want to sell your stuff in, naturally; unless you can set a specific sell place for the calculations), but at least you had an indicator on whether it's profitable at all or not. It would be awful nice not to require 3rd party spread sheets just to determine the production cost of something you're making. It'd make the system much more friendly to casual players "Alekseyev Karrde: mercenary of my heart." -Arydanika, Voices from the Void
Hero of the CSM Noir./Noir. Academy Recruiting: www.noirmercs.com |
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation Ineluctable.
440
|
Posted - 2014.04.28 17:40:00 -
[179] - Quote
Little Dragon Khamez wrote:on balance they look like nice changes, we might even see the cost of some T2 stuff falling which might be welcome. we'll have to wait and see I suppose, but the new user interfaces look serviceable, functional and fun, so well done CCP.
I hope they don't fall even further. It's already pointless to produce many HAC, Logi are hard, Cov Ops borderline and Command Ships completely pointless. |
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CCP Nullarbor
C C P C C P Alliance
659
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Posted - 2014.04.28 17:42:00 -
[180] - Quote
Alekseyev Karrde wrote:Rivr Luzade wrote:Btw, where has the potential Profit part gone in your current final draft? That was something, which could really make the industry window a lot more informative about whether something is worth producing or not - without checking on 3rd party websites or personal spreadsheets. If would of course just give a rough value for the current region you produce in (which limits the usefulness if you don't produce in the region you want to sell your stuff in, naturally; unless you can set a specific sell place for the calculations), but at least you had an indicator on whether it's profitable at all or not. It would be awful nice not to require 3rd party spread sheets just to determine the production cost of something you're making. It'd make the system much more friendly to casual players
The plan is to move the estimated input cost into a tooltip.
We felt having multiple ISK values on the screen ran the risk of people accidentally assuming it was a cost that needed to be paid. CCP Nullarbor //-áExotic Dancer-á// DEVGIFS |
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