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Vexed Nova
Manu Fortius space weaponry and trade
122
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Posted - 2014.05.14 20:39:00 -
[31] - Quote
350125GO wrote:Major RoadAhead wrote:I am a solo industrial player. I'm a solo industrialist too, I've never relied on others to help with that aspect of my gaming, but I've always been in a corp. The changes, however, look like the solo industrialist/small group industrialists will have a harder time, unless the profit margins overall somehow increase as a result of these changes, which some ppl are predicting. At current profit margins, a lot of goods just went completely out of bounds for small builders.
Yep. Solo Indy is pretty easy and it doesn't mean you can't be in a corp.
Please check out my blog! EVE Industrialist Blog --áhttp://bit.ly/1m9Oegu |
Kazekage Dono
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
10
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Posted - 2014.05.14 21:28:00 -
[32] - Quote
Vexed Nova wrote:350125GO wrote:Major RoadAhead wrote:I am a solo industrial player. I'm a solo industrialist too, I've never relied on others to help with that aspect of my gaming, but I've always been in a corp. The changes, however, look like the solo industrialist/small group industrialists will have a harder time, unless the profit margins overall somehow increase as a result of these changes, which some ppl are predicting. At current profit margins, a lot of goods just went completely out of bounds for small builders. Yep. Solo Indy is pretty easy and it doesn't mean you can't be in a corp.
Uhuh solo industry. I'm talking 1 guy 5 accounts. Roughly 1000 t2 mods, 30 t2 frigs and 5 t2 cruisers a week. Around 2 to 3 capital ships a month depending on wich ones are build.
Is this the kind of solo industry you speak of or is it more the i run a bpo once or so every week? |
Anne Kingston
Frontiers United
7
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Posted - 2014.05.14 22:15:00 -
[33] - Quote
I'm very excited for the changes. The way they are doing it works well with my methods of distribution. The changes to research will significantly effect my industry for the better. Opening the slot system will increase my ability to manage T2 industry by at least 120%. Not having to invest in a POS for research alone will decrease the amount of headache in my logistics.
I am also now much less burdened to a single area and will be able to move my industry rather quickly if environmental changes occur.
I believe many of the fears people are talking about may very well be founded, there will be adjustments to markets, things will be in flux. A careful, clever, and oppurtunistic industrialist, however, will be able to make a fortune by riding the waves of confusion that will surely be circulating throughout many systems.
I see the changes as adding a certain dynamic hunter-gatherer / migratory quality to it. The oppurtunities for industrial - market PvP just went through the roof. |
Major RoadAhead
P.I.E.
5
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Posted - 2014.06.08 00:26:00 -
[34] - Quote
Kazekage Dono wrote:Mara Pahrdi wrote:Flex Carter wrote:Everyone luvGÇÖs new shinnies until implementation then its rabbleGǪrabbleGǪrabble. Put up the GÇ£Gone FishingGÇ¥ sign on your production-line until the dust settles then determine if you want to waste your time figuring out if you should take the red pill or the blue pillGǪ Pretty much this. I'm very busy in RL atm and this will go on for the rest of the year. Can't even attend my lab slots regularly. These changes come in a bad moment. I can't be bothered with the effort required to adapt right now. I will just take down my pos, unsub all my indy accounts for the time being and see if maybe it makes sense to get back into it this time next year. In the meantime I'll stick to the odd level 3 mission in my Vengeance every now and then. This, i too unsub my indy alts offline the pos. Every simpleton can now easely build research whatever he wants with minimal effort. But it's fine even eve has to crack under the pressure of mediocrity . In the last fanfest they said they don't like single players with allot of accounts to be able to do as much as they do. Their game so up to them to decide how they see it played i guess. All good things must come to an end. An hey, doesn't matter i made plenty stock of mods ships and isk during my 'highsec carebear' activities to fund my pvp for a loooooong time .
I think I will go with this and unsub my accounts too.
I don't have a physics degree..... nor do I have a doctorate in mathematics. Seems to me this is the only way anyone can understand Eve these days and what the upcoming changes mean to industry.
I'm a casual solo player, I log on 2 or 3 times a week... I might build some stuff, copy some stuff, move something around and occasionally get shot at by a big gang because that is their idea of PvP.
I don't have the time to read all the dev blogs no come to that allr the forum posts because half of them are just kids trying to sound clever so all I can understand is that after the next changes it will be a waste of time copying anything to sell as the copy times are so far reduced that every man and his dog will be doing it and building anything won't be worthwhile as I can't compete with the big alliances who can hire all the new 'work teams' at auction. Also I will have to log in at least twice a day since anyone can now set up a POS in high sec so it's far more likely someone will want it removed. I already stopped doing PI because as a solo player I can't defend a POCO.
CCP has this obsession with getting players to work together in groups without making any allowance for those who simply don't want to follow this template. So where to go from here? I really don't know. I feel like I'm being forced into a group just to carry on playing so I probably won't bother. Yes you can have my stuff, no problem.
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Scarlett LaBlanc
Midnight Savran Industries
100
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Posted - 2014.06.08 00:55:00 -
[35] - Quote
You made the decision to quit (or spout about it) before you ever started this thread.
There is nothing happening in the next patch should make you feel like your being pushed out.
8 members of my corp are solo industrialists. Those eight rarely take part in group activites or PvP. They log in, build stuff and haul to market. They are, to a man, EXCITED about the changes to come.
The only difference I can see between you and them, is they bothered to READ about what is changing. By your own admission you did not. Now you come here complaining about changes you have not taken the time to understand.
Don't blame CCP, this is all on you. |
Ekaterina 'Ghetto' Thurn
Department 10
157
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Posted - 2014.06.08 09:29:00 -
[36] - Quote
Major RoadAhead wrote:Kazekage Dono wrote:Mara Pahrdi wrote:Flex Carter wrote:Everyone luvGÇÖs new shinnies until implementation then its rabbleGǪrabbleGǪrabble. Put up the GÇ£Gone FishingGÇ¥ sign on your production-line until the dust settles then determine if you want to waste your time figuring out if you should take the red pill or the blue pillGǪ Pretty much this. I'm very busy in RL atm and this will go on for the rest of the year. Can't even attend my lab slots regularly. These changes come in a bad moment. I can't be bothered with the effort required to adapt right now. I will just take down my pos, unsub all my indy accounts for the time being and see if maybe it makes sense to get back into it this time next year. In the meantime I'll stick to the odd level 3 mission in my Vengeance every now and then. This, i too unsub my indy alts offline the pos. Every simpleton can now easely build research whatever he wants with minimal effort. But it's fine even eve has to crack under the pressure of mediocrity . In the last fanfest they said they don't like single players with allot of accounts to be able to do as much as they do. Their game so up to them to decide how they see it played i guess. All good things must come to an end. An hey, doesn't matter i made plenty stock of mods ships and isk during my 'highsec carebear' activities to fund my pvp for a loooooong time . I think I will go with this and unsub my accounts too. I don't have a physics degree..... nor do I have a doctorate in mathematics. Seems to me this is the only way anyone can understand Eve these days and what the upcoming changes mean to industry. I'm a casual solo player, I log on 2 or 3 times a week... I might build some stuff, copy some stuff, move something around and occasionally get shot at by a big gang because that is their idea of PvP. I don't have the time to read all the dev blogs no come to that allr the forum posts because half of them are just kids trying to sound clever so all I can understand is that after the next changes it will be a waste of time copying anything to sell as the copy times are so far reduced that every man and his dog will be doing it and building anything won't be worthwhile as I can't compete with the big alliances who can hire all the new 'work teams' at auction. Also I will have to log in at least twice a day since anyone can now set up a POS in high sec so it's far more likely someone will want it removed. I already stopped doing PI because as a solo player I can't defend a POCO. CCP has this obsession with getting players to work together in groups without making any allowance for those who simply don't want to follow this template. So where to go from here? I really don't know. I feel like I'm being forced into a group just to carry on playing so I probably won't bother. Yes you can have my stuff, no problem.
I see where you're coming from now regarding groups versus solo players doing industry. But atm we can still only speculate what will happen and no one can say with any certainty what will happen post 22nd July. CCP still has NO IDEA whatsoever on how POSes will be used for science & manufacturing jobs as regards any bonuses to material waste and/or taxes. We still have no firm idea as to the economics and whether jobs will be better performed at NPC stations or at POSes. Anything in the dev blogs can be changed at any time before release - just ask the guys who started getting ready for rig slots on Freighters.
Regarding the 'teams' everyone will be able to access information on failed and successful bids and where the 'teams' are currently working. So if you wanted to then depending on location & logistics you could move to where the 'teams' are to get further bonuses. That is obviously going to happen.
We also stopped doing PI shortly after the high sec changes and a short foray into POCO setups. Widespread ownership by entities like Obsidian Front etc with 70%+ taxes made it less favourable. It should have been obvious to CCP that this would happen as well. Dependant on how efficient POS use is after the changes you should expect placeholder small towers to be put up everywhere by similar entities as well.
Until the roles & permissions are fixed solo industry will still be the safest way to go for most industrialists so you shouldn't worry too much. I don't expect it will end up as bad as you might fear in the end.
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Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
3401
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Posted - 2014.06.08 17:59:00 -
[37] - Quote
Industry will not require a POS.
A POS will be beneficial, however, as it will reduce your costs, when means you'll make more on marginal profits.
Industry will not require you to form a group to bid on teams. If you're in a busy system, any bid you put in will be merged with the bids from other players for the same system. The team will be available to all within that system, with no queue to use them.
Yes, there will be more knobs to twiddle, and levers to throw, but that makes industry more interesting to me. No longer push butan, receive bacon. Woo! CSM 9! http://fuzzwork.enterprises/ Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter |
Scarlett LaBlanc
Midnight Savran Industries
107
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Posted - 2014.06.08 18:24:00 -
[38] - Quote
Steve Ronuken wrote: . No longer push butan, receive bacon.
And this is a good thing. I do not want to push a button to get bacon.
I prefer to make my bacon the old fashioned way! |
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
3717
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Posted - 2014.06.09 00:08:00 -
[39] - Quote
Steve Ronuken wrote:A POS will be beneficial, however, as it will reduce your costs, when means you'll make more on marginal profits. Are you sure? 'cause I'm not!
I do know that the BPC business that used to pay my fuel bills has been totally wiped-out. I'm struggling to sell the last few BPC, and I don't see a future in that anymore.
There has also been a massive collapse of all capital production, from freighter on-up; I snapped-up several researched BPO for my collection at below NPC value.
When I look at the markets, almost everything has been in decline for at least the last three months, including all materials other than Tritanium. I'm taking a gamble, and invested 16 billion into one market; so far it looks promising, but could collapse after Crius. The only thing I could find that was stable, is an old favorite of mine with continual demand, and it just isn't enough to base a living off of.
The line costs in my system are likely to soar given its location. I don't want to move. I've not decided if I'll keep my POSes yet. I may want to downsize; oh what fun that won't be!
"The future is in lowsec manufacturing!", I'm told, but I'm really not interested. Right now I'm of the mind to just abandon industry, and move to nulsec. I've shutdown all my manufacturing, and I am waiting on the last few jobs to complete.
If it sounds bleak to you, you are not alone with that opinion.
I admit I'm a paranoid pessimist, but one good thing about being a pessimist is never being disappointed. |
Steve Celeste
Overdogs
290
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Posted - 2014.06.09 07:38:00 -
[40] - Quote
Keep the tears coming please.
Lazy players getting wrecked by Crius is beautiful to see.
It is truly becoming the Cry-us expansion. Thank you CCP |
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Victoria Sin
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
651
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Posted - 2014.06.09 11:22:00 -
[41] - Quote
Not sure how a POS reduces costs Steve. There will be a small material modifier but you must offset this against the cost of the POS fuel, which for a large POS can be considerable. It isn't clear to me what the break-even point will be for anything I do. Indeed that's part of the problem with these industry changes. They're going to need an even more complicated spreadsheet or piece of software to work everything out. |
Loraine Gess
Confedeferate Union of Tax Legalists
369
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Posted - 2014.06.09 11:42:00 -
[42] - Quote
Victoria Sin wrote:Not sure how a POS reduces costs Steve. There will be a small material modifier but you must offset this against the cost of the POS fuel, which for a large POS can be considerable. It isn't clear to me what the break-even point will be for anything I do. Indeed that's part of the problem with these industry changes. They're going to need an even more complicated spreadsheet or piece of software to work everything out.
You're also saving ~10% of the total labor fees. And 2% ME is amazingly huge. Seriously look at your blueprints for a second and think of what you can do with a 2% edge on some... |
Major RoadAhead
P.I.E.
5
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Posted - 2014.06.09 15:27:00 -
[43] - Quote
Loraine Gess wrote:Victoria Sin wrote:Not sure how a POS reduces costs Steve. There will be a small material modifier but you must offset this against the cost of the POS fuel, which for a large POS can be considerable. It isn't clear to me what the break-even point will be for anything I do. Indeed that's part of the problem with these industry changes. They're going to need an even more complicated spreadsheet or piece of software to work everything out. You're also saving ~10% of the total labor fees. And 2% ME is amazingly huge. Seriously look at your blueprints for a second and think of what you can do with a 2% edge on some...
Nobody seems to know yet what the costs will be when manufacturing at a POS.
As for the teams, as I understand it there will be good teams who give a significant advantage to manufacturing and rubbish ones that give a small advantage. or you can manufacture without a team at all. They are all for sale by auction and they last 28 days.
Now does anyone seriously think that solo players or small Corps are going to bid on the decent teams? Especially when you get no extra advantage for doing so? In theory if enough small players bid on a team for their system then they would win the auction but that simply isn't going to happen.
The way it will work is that the large alliances will organise their corps to bid on teams for systems that they control. This will give them a significant manufacturing advantage and stop anyone else 'piggy backing' on their team.
It's a clever way for CCP to get people into large groups and out of high sec, that seeming to be the one and only reason they make any changes these days.
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