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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Dave Stark
5300
|
Posted - 2014.05.05 21:32:00 -
[31] - Quote
mkint wrote:Would be interesting if the penalties reflected the crime more effectively. Maybe if a criminal flag's duration depended on the value of the target ganked. Not saying it would be a good idea, but it's an interesting one.
As it is, irl, they wouldn't send someone to prison for 20 years for drug possession and let a murderer out after 5. /irony
but the crime is always the same; you shot something with a spaceship. |
Pcr
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2014.05.05 21:35:00 -
[32] - Quote
Other than rather modest trolls, I see no reply about risk and reward. Catalyst ( risk ) - Freighter 1,3 bil+ cargo ( reward ). |
Slade Trillgon
Brutor Force Federated
2806
|
Posted - 2014.05.05 21:37:00 -
[33] - Quote
mkint wrote: As it is, irl, they wouldn't send someone to prison for 20 years for drug possession and let a murderer out after 5. /irony
I am sure we can find at least a few examples of this actually occurring
Here is a hard example but you can probably find 100's-1000's of cases, under the 3 strikes your out policy, where drug offenses get life when a first time murder can be out in less than 20. |
Dave Stark
5301
|
Posted - 2014.05.05 21:39:00 -
[34] - Quote
Pcr wrote:Other than rather modest trolls, I see no reply about risk and reward. Catalyst ( risk ) - Freighter 1,3 bil+ cargo ( reward ).
if you're blowing the freighter up, it's not a reward. not to mention, it's cargo/2 due to the 50% drop rate. |
Last Wolf
Umbra Wing
201
|
Posted - 2014.05.05 21:40:00 -
[35] - Quote
Pcr wrote:Other than rather modest trolls, I see no reply about risk and reward. Catalyst ( risk ) - Freighter 1,3 bil+ cargo ( reward ).
Tell me again how you suicide ganked a freighter with a single Catalyst.. Warning: Sarcasm Above. |
Pcr
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2014.05.05 21:41:00 -
[36] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:Pcr wrote:Other than rather modest trolls, I see no reply about risk and reward. Catalyst ( risk ) - Freighter 1,3 bil+ cargo ( reward ). if you're blowing the freighter up, it's not a reward.
Really ? You don't say...Nobody does it for the lulz, or grief, right ? Are you playing this game ? |
Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari End of Life
1451
|
Posted - 2014.05.05 21:42:00 -
[37] - Quote
Actually, opposite to your view that gankers should pay a heavier price; industrialists, mission runners, miners and other people that are ganked should be made to pay an additional tax proportionate to the value of their ship, fit and cargo.
Those that take valuable cargo in untanked ships, or min/max a mission ship with bling fit should have to pay a big levy to offset the risk that Concord will have to spawn on their behalf at some point.
Those that take small cargo in tanked ships, would of course pay less because of the lower risk of Concord intervention.
Why should people that fit and manage their security risk properly have to pay the same amount as someone who shows no regsrd for their own safety? Come Win At Eve - Join The Vendunari
. -á<- Argue this, not this ->-á( -í-¦ -£-û -í-¦) |
Dave Stark
5301
|
Posted - 2014.05.05 21:43:00 -
[38] - Quote
Pcr wrote:Dave Stark wrote:Pcr wrote:Other than rather modest trolls, I see no reply about risk and reward. Catalyst ( risk ) - Freighter 1,3 bil+ cargo ( reward ). if you're blowing the freighter up, it's not a reward. Really ? You don't say...Nobody does it for the lulz, or grief, right ? Are you playing this game ?
i don't know. are you? you're the one that just claimed it was a reward. see your post. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
5799
|
Posted - 2014.05.05 21:43:00 -
[39] - Quote
Pcr wrote:Dave Stark wrote:Pcr wrote:Other than rather modest trolls, I see no reply about risk and reward. Catalyst ( risk ) - Freighter 1,3 bil+ cargo ( reward ). if you're blowing the freighter up, it's not a reward. Really ? You don't say...Nobody does it for the lulz, or grief, right ? Are you playing this game ?
It's a sandbox game. No one needs a reason to blow anyone else up. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
-áPsychotic Monk for CSM9.
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Dirk Magnum
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
330
|
Posted - 2014.05.05 21:44:00 -
[40] - Quote
Also, we do pay a penalty to CONCORD for this sort of thing, equal to whatever the insurance payout of our suicide ship was. Wasn't all that long ago that insurance still paid out when a ship was killed by CONCORD.
I too would like to hear how one can suicide a freighter with a Catalyst though. "LIVE FAST DIE."- traditional Minmatar ethos [citation needed] |
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Petrus Blackshell
Derelict Rifter Enterprise
3129
|
Posted - 2014.05.05 21:46:00 -
[41] - Quote
Things a ganker risks/loses:
- His ship(s) (all the ships involved in the gank)
- 15 minutes of relentless CONCORD-chasing
- Kill rights grants his victim potential to retaliate if ganker lives in hisec
- Loot fairy fail
- Gank fails, ganker still dies
- In other words, risk of completely wasting time, money, and sec status for no outcome
Things a freighter can do to stay alive:
- Do not haul stuff worth 2x more than the ships it takes to gank the freighter.
- Do not haul stuff if you know there are people around who hate / have a grudge / have non-financial reasons to kill you.
Whine on the forums NO! This encourages (2) above.
That is literally everything a freighter has to do to avoid most ganks. Here, I even made a tool for maths-challenged freighter pilots to know when they're flying a loot pi+¦ata. Made it a while back so the prices might be a bit off, but it's still a good reference tool. For instance, are you flying 10 billion ISK worth of stuff in a Fenrir? 8 Tornados ganking you are looking at about 4 billion ISK in profit. You have a "gank me" sign on your back.
HTFU, L2P, etc. Don't go crying to the forums because you can't figure out basic math to keep you safe, though.
(edited because the Eve forum is **** at URLs with "&" in them) Rifterlings - newbie-friendly swashbuckling corp ("weflyrifters" in-game channel). Join today! www.rifterlings.com
Accidentally The Whole Frigate (blog) - Learning how to pew pew, one loss at a time - www.thewholefrigate.com |
Pcr
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2014.05.05 21:48:00 -
[42] - Quote
Dirk Magnum wrote:Also, we do pay a penalty to CONCORD for this sort of thing, equal to whatever the insurance payout of our suicide ship was. Wasn't all that long ago that insurance still paid out when a ship was killed by CONCORD.
I too would like to hear how one can suicide a freighter with a Catalyst though.
I said your penalty is too small in my opinion. If you kill a ship in high sec you should pay more than that. That's all I'm saying. I'm not saying not to do it. Do it but ( really ) pay for it. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
5803
|
Posted - 2014.05.05 21:49:00 -
[43] - Quote
Pcr wrote:Dirk Magnum wrote:Also, we do pay a penalty to CONCORD for this sort of thing, equal to whatever the insurance payout of our suicide ship was. Wasn't all that long ago that insurance still paid out when a ship was killed by CONCORD.
I too would like to hear how one can suicide a freighter with a Catalyst though. I said your penalty is too small in my opinion. If you kill a ship in high sec you should pay more than that. That's all I'm saying. I'm not saying not to do it. Do it but ( really ) pay for it.
Nope. Ganking has been nerfed too many times as it is. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
-áPsychotic Monk for CSM9.
|
Lady Areola Fappington
new order logistics CODE.
1745
|
Posted - 2014.05.05 21:49:00 -
[44] - Quote
Adding a longer CONCORD criminal timer will just require longer amounts of time docked. This would detract from conflict, and CCP does not like taking conflict out of the game.
If you want a longer suspect style free-shoot timer, well...after -5.0 it doesn't matter, outlaws are perma suspect. Set right, a killright gives a 30 day "suspect flag" as is. The risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built and we want to keep that (infact, this is much more representative of the consensus opinion within CCP). |
Pcr
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2014.05.05 21:58:00 -
[45] - Quote
Petrus Blackshell wrote:Things a ganker risks/loses:
- His ship(s) (all the ships involved in the gank)
- 15 minutes of relentless CONCORD-chasing
- Kill rights grants his victim potential to retaliate if ganker lives in hisec
- Loot fairy fail
- Gank fails, ganker still dies
- In other words, risk of completely wasting time, money, and sec status for no outcome
Things a freighter can do to stay alive:
- Do not haul stuff worth 2x more than the ships it takes to gank the freighter.
- Do not haul stuff if you know there are people around who hate / have a grudge / have non-financial reasons to kill you.
Whine on the forums NO! This encourages (2) above.
That is literally everything a freighter has to do to avoid most ganks. Here, I even made a tool for maths-challenged freighter pilots to know when they're flying a loot pi+¦ata. Made it a while back so the prices might be a bit off, but it's still a good reference tool. For instance, are you flying 10 billion ISK worth of stuff in a Fenrir? 8 Tornados ganking you are looking at about 4 billion ISK in profit. You have a "gank me" sign on your back. HTFU, L2P, etc. Don't go crying to the forums because you can't figure out basic math to keep you safe, though. (edited because the Eve forum is **** at URLs with "&" in them)
http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=23302805
http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=23302851
http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=23302868
Your wall of text is useless in these 3 kills. Some guys killed 3 freighters with no cargo.
They have minimal loss and a bucket of tears as a reward perhaps.
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Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
5805
|
Posted - 2014.05.05 22:03:00 -
[46] - Quote
Pcr wrote:
Your wall of text is useless in these 3 kills. Some guys killed 3 freighters with no cargo.
They have minimal loss and a bucket of tears as a reward perhaps.
Please show me the section of the EULA that forbids me from killing someone if I don't stand to profit off of it.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
-áPsychotic Monk for CSM9.
|
Lady Areola Fappington
new order logistics CODE.
1745
|
Posted - 2014.05.05 22:05:00 -
[47] - Quote
Here's your reason why. One or more of those gankers has an alt that somehow, directly or indirectly, via an unknown number of steps, supports someone with materials needed to build freighters. They most likely don't even know who this person is.
By killing the freighter, they drive up demand for that ship, which drives up demand for the materials (via said unknown number of steps), thereby increasing the ganker's profits. The risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built and we want to keep that (infact, this is much more representative of the consensus opinion within CCP). |
Pcr
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2014.05.05 22:09:00 -
[48] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Pcr wrote:
Your wall of text is useless in these 3 kills. Some guys killed 3 freighters with no cargo.
They have minimal loss and a bucket of tears as a reward perhaps.
Please show me the section of the EULA that forbids me from killing someone if I don't stand to profit off of it.
You miss my point. Kill them. All of them ! But pay more in high sec. How much more? I don't know, more flagged time, a fine to Concord, whatever. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
5806
|
Posted - 2014.05.05 22:14:00 -
[49] - Quote
Pcr wrote: You miss my point. Kill them. All of them ! But pay more in high sec. How much more? I don't know, more flagged time, a fine to Concord, whatever.
Why? "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
-áPsychotic Monk for CSM9.
|
Velicitia
Emergent Avionics
2162
|
Posted - 2014.05.05 22:21:00 -
[50] - Quote
Scipio Artelius wrote:Actually, opposite to your view that gankers should pay a heavier price; industrialists, mission runners, miners and other people that are ganked should be made to pay an additional tax proportionate to the value of their ship, fit and cargo.
Those that take valuable cargo in untanked ships, or min/max a mission ship with bling fit should have to pay a big levy to offset the risk that Concord will have to spawn on their behalf at some point.
Those that take small cargo in tanked ships, would of course pay less because of the lower risk of Concord intervention.
Why should people that fit and manage their security risk properly have to pay the same amount as someone who shows no regard for their own safety?
Sure, so long as there is a "srsly CONCORD, I know what I'm doing and have a fleet with me" payoff so they don't tax me anything? Corp HQ in lowsec maybe?
One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia |
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Velicitia
Emergent Avionics
2162
|
Posted - 2014.05.05 22:24:00 -
[51] - Quote
Petrus Blackshell wrote:Things a ganker risks/loses:
- His ship(s) (all the ships involved in the gank)
- 15 minutes of relentless CONCORD-chasing
- Kill rights grants his victim potential to retaliate if ganker lives in hisec
- Loot fairy fail
- Gank fails, ganker still dies
- In other words, risk of completely wasting time, money, and sec status for no outcome
Things a freighter can do to stay alive:
- Do not haul stuff worth 2x more than the ships it takes to gank the freighter.
- Do not haul stuff if you know there are people around who hate / have a grudge / have non-financial reasons to kill you.
Whine on the forums NO! This encourages (2) above. Friendly webber - Gang links/boosters for siege/skirmish/armoured warfare (any one, or all three).
That is literally everything a freighter has to do to avoid most ganks. Here, I even made a tool for maths-challenged freighter pilots to know when they're flying a loot pi+¦ata. Made it a while back so the prices might be a bit off, but it's still a good reference tool. For instance, are you flying 10 billion ISK worth of stuff in a Fenrir? 8 Tornados ganking you are looking at about 4 billion ISK in profit. You have a "gank me" sign on your back. HTFU, L2P, etc. Don't go crying to the forums because you can't figure out basic math to keep you safe, though. (edited because the Eve forum is **** at URLs with "&" in them)
You missed a couple. Fixed
One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia |
Solecist Project
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
994
|
Posted - 2014.05.05 22:28:00 -
[52] - Quote
Why not find friends who protect you? https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4492860 Killmails for Wrecks!! Ganker tears, best tears! And how do I put text as links into signatures?? |
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
13212
|
Posted - 2014.05.05 22:33:00 -
[53] - Quote
Solecist Project wrote:Why not find friends who protect you?
Because being friends in highsec was considered to OP by the people of highsec, so they refuse to engage in friendship until it is nerfed by CCP.
Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings? |
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
18205
|
Posted - 2014.05.05 22:36:00 -
[54] - Quote
Pcr wrote:Other than rather modest trolls, I see no reply about risk and reward. Catalyst ( risk ) - Freighter 1,3 bil+ cargo ( reward ). So you believe in ISK tanking?
GTFO
Solecist Project wrote:Why not find friends who protect you? Requires friends
Never go full Ripard |
Maxpie
MUSE Buy-n-Large Metaphysical Utopian Society Enterprises
420
|
Posted - 2014.05.05 22:41:00 -
[55] - Quote
Get rid of disposable, recyclable alts. Better yet, get rid of alts entirely. Otherwise no changes needed.
No good deed goes unpunished |
Solecist Project
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
994
|
Posted - 2014.05.05 22:43:00 -
[56] - Quote
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:Pcr wrote:Other than rather modest trolls, I see no reply about risk and reward. Catalyst ( risk ) - Freighter 1,3 bil+ cargo ( reward ). So you believe in ISK tanking? GTFO Solecist Project wrote:Why not find friends who protect you? Requires friends I'd be his friend. :D I'd be your friend too!
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4492860 Killmails for Wrecks!! Ganker tears, best tears! And how do I put text as links into signatures?? |
PotatoOverdose
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
1745
|
Posted - 2014.05.05 22:44:00 -
[57] - Quote
Only total and utter morons loose freighters in hisec. |
Solecist Project's Alt
Wildly Inept Pacifists
55
|
Posted - 2014.05.05 22:44:00 -
[58] - Quote
Maxpie wrote:Get rid of disposable, recyclable alts. Better yet, get rid of alts entirely. Otherwise no changes needed. I hope that I don't count.
That'd suck a lot. lol
PotatoOverdose wrote:Only total and utter morons loose freighters in hisec. lose*
Irony* |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
5808
|
Posted - 2014.05.05 22:44:00 -
[59] - Quote
Maxpie wrote:Get rid of disposable, recyclable alts. Better yet, get rid of alts entirely. Otherwise no changes needed.
It's a bannable offense to recycle alts already.
It's also the next best thing to an urban legend that it happens in the first place. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
-áPsychotic Monk for CSM9.
|
PotatoOverdose
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
1746
|
Posted - 2014.05.05 22:46:00 -
[60] - Quote
Solecist Project's Alt wrote:Maxpie wrote:Get rid of disposable, recyclable alts. Better yet, get rid of alts entirely. Otherwise no changes needed. I hope that I don't count. That'd suck a lot. lol PotatoOverdose wrote:Only total and utter morons loose freighters in hisec. lose* Irony* Fix'd. Also, nevr sed I spel gud. |
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