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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 29 post(s) |
Arline Kley
PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
293
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Posted - 2014.05.17 17:49:00 -
[91] - Quote
I shall join Tippia on the "I told you so" bus, however with a slight difference:
This is another major issue I have had with the ship changes over the last 18 months or so. They are proposed, people state that they are not welcome whilst giving clear and valid reasons why and.... nothing. Complete ignorance. Then months later "oh dear, we're sorry, we're gonna change the ++insert ship type here++ because of XYZ issues that were actually pointed out to us, but we failed to listen to the people that play the ships day in day out."
Yet the smaller minority that go "yes I wholeheartedly approve of this product and/or service" get their way, with some truly hideous changes getting put into game.
Still, I'm holding out on a proper ship rebalancing effort to be done what with the shorter times between deployments of releases... Blessed are those that carry the Empress' Light; with it they destroy the shadows |
Dave Stark
5666
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Posted - 2014.05.17 17:50:00 -
[92] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:I warned you bears this would happen if rigs became a thing on freighters. you did indeed. |
Poke InTheEye
Anti-BoB Flash Mob
1
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Posted - 2014.05.17 17:51:00 -
[93] - Quote
This is really dumb. These changes seem like they are being made just for the sake of change. Seriously, what's the point here? |
Dave Stark
5666
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Posted - 2014.05.17 17:52:00 -
[94] - Quote
Poke InTheEye wrote:Seriously, what's the point here? to teach people a harsh and valuable lesson; you repeatedly ask for bad ideas to be implemented, you get bad changes. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
21793
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Posted - 2014.05.17 17:52:00 -
[95] - Quote
Because people asked for this nerf. We tried to tell them that it was going to be a nerf, but they wanted it anyway because the prospect of more m-¦ suppressed all rational thought. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skill plan 2.1. |
B33R
Specter Syndicate Tactical Narcotics Team
0
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Posted - 2014.05.17 17:52:00 -
[96] - Quote
i was hoping for the JF ability to move an ihub, guess not. If the fuel change really goes thru with this, it is going to be bad. the t1 rigs should make it equal the previous m3 amount. |
Daichi Yamato
Xero Security and Technologies
1503
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Posted - 2014.05.17 17:53:00 -
[97] - Quote
TheButcherPete wrote:They still have the velocity bonus.... which is *mostly* useless.
oh yay my Freighter goes 100m/s. Yay. Totally could use that bonus over say, an agility or mass bonus to make FLYING a freighter less than soul crushingly boring.
I was excited for these changes, and then suddenly I was not. :(
really? cause if u read the hull rig thread u see ppl saying 'please dnt make hull rigs penalize velocity. my afk freighter will cry' EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY?No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided""So it will be up to a pilot to remain vigilant wherever they may be flying and be ready for anything at any time" |
Petya Gladiator
Enlightened Industries Goonswarm Federation
12
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Posted - 2014.05.17 17:54:00 -
[98] - Quote
Miniluv sends their regards... |
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation Ineluctable.
502
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Posted - 2014.05.17 17:54:00 -
[99] - Quote
Poke InTheEye wrote:This is really dumb. These changes seem like they are being made just for the sake of change. Seriously, what's the point here?
Make all non-PVP activities less viable and ease the access to low-level PVP. Welcome to EVE Online in the age where you need to appeal to Angry Birds players instead of real players. |
Aliath Sunstrike
Aviation Professionals for EVE
48
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Posted - 2014.05.17 17:55:00 -
[100] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Because people asked for this nerf. We tried to tell them that it was going to be a nerf, but they wanted it anyway because the prospect of more m-¦ suppressed all rational thought. Poke InTheEye wrote:This is really dumb. These changes seem like they are being made just for the sake of change. Seriously, what's the point here? The point here is to give people something they've been asking for for a very long time. They asked for something dumb, so they got something dumb. Go figure.
And my question to Fozzie is....why make it a nerf!? Can't this be a "power creep" buff all across the board and just ADD rigs. Why does it have to be #$@#@ $ painful. |
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Regan Rotineque
Arch Angels Assault Force The Kadeshi
321
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Posted - 2014.05.17 17:55:00 -
[101] - Quote
Batolemaeus wrote:Regan Rotineque wrote: Yes we will be making more things there How exactly? Am I supposed to extract non-local isotopes from my behind? Will non-local T2 materials into being? Found a praying circle to wish for a divine delivery of non-local rig parts? Perform a summoning of faction modules? Sacrifice a newbie in hopes for plentiful datacore harvest? Wish for decryptors?
Point taken - you are correct - i can see more basic needs being met in null - on the t1/ammo side but anything that requires the luxuries that ONLY exist in high sec markets is going to take its toll - and be more expensive.
Why would I ever do research or anything in null ? Its going to cost me more to stay in null when i can just set up my pos in some ass backwards part of high sec and let my alts toil there.
I can move t2 products around high sec much more efficiently and cheaply so t2 production stays in and around high sec.
And we still end up exporting to null - just costing us more in jump fuel - which in turn ends up being paid by the line grunt - who may or may not see any point in fleeting up anymore since his bomber now costs 100m isk. (im being sarcastic now)
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
21797
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Posted - 2014.05.17 17:55:00 -
[102] - Quote
Told you so.
e: Dammit!! Missed by one post again. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skill plan 2.1. |
Nightingale Actault
Divided Unity The Night Crew Alliance
25
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Posted - 2014.05.17 17:55:00 -
[103] - Quote
Excellent changes.
Freighter pilots now have to choose between tank, time into warp, or warp speed. If you were filling your cargo full before you were likely doing it wrong anyways creating a giant gank target, and by going max cargo after the changes you are doing the same. Choosing to cut short time from your align or massive combined time from your warp speed is another choice that freighter pilots will need to ask themselves. With the changes to warp speed affecting freighters the way they have, I definitely like the option of choosing a safe amount of materials to transport at a faster warp speed for less total transport time. |
Dave Stark
5666
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Posted - 2014.05.17 17:56:00 -
[104] - Quote
Aliath Sunstrike wrote:Can't this be a "power creep" buff all across the board and just ADD rigs. Why does it have to be #$@#@ $ painful. no, power creeps are bad. |
Powers Sa
1356
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Posted - 2014.05.17 17:56:00 -
[105] - Quote
Kat Ayclism wrote:These changes are ******* stupid. Can you stop just changing things to change things? It does not validate your work to be screwing up the things that are right when there's other ships that actually need the rebalancing efforts.
Also, again these changes are at cross odds with the supposed intent to make localized production more possible in null- YOU STILL WILL ALWAYS HAVE TO IMPORT/EXPORT.
So your solution? LOL EVERYTHING USES MORE FUEL AND ALL THE JFS CAN HOLD LESS AND ARE LESS AGILE
Stop swinging around like a 5yo in the dark with a baseball bat. This isn't quality balancing, it's dogshit lmao lol |
Sigras
Conglomo
765
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Posted - 2014.05.17 17:58:00 -
[106] - Quote
Abrazzar wrote:Batolemaeus wrote:Abrazzar wrote:So, what's better: Resistance rigs or trimarks for my Providence? Kinetic or thermal or explosive? Decisions, decisions. Hull rigs (if released) and implants. It's a no-brainer, really. Has always been. But my hull hitpoints just got nerfed while my armor got boosted. Makes no sense to stick with hull when I can't have the benefit of resistances with it. There are no hull resist rigs. it doesnt matter, on the most armor tanky freighter (the ark) your resist profile gives you 71,820 armor EHP while you still have 111,000 hull (before skills)
This means that a T2 trimark will give you 14,364 extra EHP, and a T2 hull HP rig will give you 27,750 EHP
The only time I can see trimarks being better would be if you had a damnation follow you around with links on. |
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation Ineluctable.
502
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Posted - 2014.05.17 17:58:00 -
[107] - Quote
Nightingale Actault wrote:Excellent changes.
Freighter pilots now have to choose between tank, time into warp, or warp speed. If you were filling your cargo full before you were likely doing it wrong anyways creating a giant gank target, and by going max cargo after the changes you are doing the same. Choosing to cut short time from your align or massive combined time from your warp speed is another choice that freighter pilots will need to ask themselves. With the changes to warp speed affecting freighters the way they have, I definitely like the option of choosing a safe amount of materials to transport at a faster warp speed for less total transport time.
Filling your freighter with Tritanium worth 400M makes you a big gank target? Please give me something from your mushrooms. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
21797
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Posted - 2014.05.17 17:59:00 -
[108] - Quote
Aliath Sunstrike wrote:And my question to Fozzie is....why make it a nerf!? Can't this be a "power creep" buff all across the board and just ADD rigs. Why does it have to be #$@#@ $ painful. Because it wouldn't be GÇ£power creepGÇ¥ GÇö it would be a ridiculously overpowered mega-buff. Counter-balancing the potential bonuses from rigs with nerfs to ensure that the end results were not insane was inevitable.
GǪoh, and power creep itself is bad, especially for a ship class that didn't particularly need any buffs. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skill plan 2.1. |
Nightingale Actault
Divided Unity The Night Crew Alliance
25
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Posted - 2014.05.17 18:01:00 -
[109] - Quote
Rivr Luzade wrote:Nightingale Actault wrote:Excellent changes.
Freighter pilots now have to choose between tank, time into warp, or warp speed. If you were filling your cargo full before you were likely doing it wrong anyways creating a giant gank target, and by going max cargo after the changes you are doing the same. Choosing to cut short time from your align or massive combined time from your warp speed is another choice that freighter pilots will need to ask themselves. With the changes to warp speed affecting freighters the way they have, I definitely like the option of choosing a safe amount of materials to transport at a faster warp speed for less total transport time. Filling your freighter with Tritanium worth 400M makes you a big gank target? Please give me something from your mushrooms.
Choosing one of the cheapest materials you would be transporting is a great way to counter my point, however I don't believe that a majority of the items being transported are going to be along these same lines.
Additionally, and off that topic, I believe these changes are also a great way to increase the viability of localized nullsec manufacturing. If less items are being JF into nullsec it will give greater opportunity for those items to be created locally at profitable levels. |
Dr Drugs
Never Ignorant Gettin' Goals Accomplished
0
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Posted - 2014.05.17 18:01:00 -
[110] - Quote
CCP Fozzie wrote:Tippia wrote:SeeGǪ there was a reason why I was against rigs on freighters from the very startGǪ T2 capital rigs and a significant reduction in survivability requried and/or speed to get them back to where they were. Gee thanks. T1 rigs are easily enough to bring normal freighters above their current cargo values.
what about drawback on cargo rigs ?
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l0rd carlos
Friends Of Harassment The Camel Empire
931
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Posted - 2014.05.17 18:01:00 -
[111] - Quote
As a non freighter Pilot I like those changes. Now people have to decide if they want max cargo, max agility or max tank.
It adds a choice to the game :) German blog about smallscale lowsec pvp: http://friendsofharassment.wordpress.com |
Cardano Firesnake
Les chevaliers de l'ordre Goonswarm Federation
150
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Posted - 2014.05.17 18:02:00 -
[112] - Quote
So I will have to rig my Fenrir with capital rigs to have the same cargohold or to make it more tanky but so slow that it will be a pain to transport anything. As if it was not already horrible to transport things with a freighter.... |
T-N-T
Elite-crew corporation Jokers.
10
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Posted - 2014.05.17 18:02:00 -
[113] - Quote
So many carebears tears! |
Dirk MacGirk
Specter Syndicate Tactical Narcotics Team
32
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Posted - 2014.05.17 18:03:00 -
[114] - Quote
Keep your rigs. If you're going to go full popsicle with the changes to compensate, I'm just not sure any of it was worth it. Drawbacks on rigs are one thing, but seriously, nothing good has come of this.
Those cheers you heard at FanFest? Silenced, as if millions of voices suddenly cried out in utter fricken disbelief. I fear something terrible has happened. |
Qoi
Exert Force
3
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Posted - 2014.05.17 18:03:00 -
[115] - Quote
To offset a 30% nerf, you need a 43% increase with rigs. T1 Rigs only give you 36.6% more and 2xT2+1xT1 Rigs (you can't use three T2 rigs because of Calibration) only gives you a 46% increase.
So you need to buy two Tech II capital rigs for your freighter to offset the nerf, you get marginally more cargo space (A bit more than two percent on a Charon).
So you have a ship that costs twice as much, doesn't carry more goods, aligns slower and has lower EHP. Also don't forget that cargo rigs remove armor hit points and some of these ships are now armor tankers, and the fact that freighter warp speed just got nerved with the change in the warp mechanics. |
Zebs Clone
Zebra Corp Gentlemen's Agreement
23
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Posted - 2014.05.17 18:05:00 -
[116] - Quote
l0rd carlos wrote:As a non freighter Pilot I like those changes. Now people have to decide if they want max cargo, max agility or max tank.
It adds a choice to the game :)
in a way yes. I now need 2 jf's and 2 freighters. one for cargo and one for everything else. so that's one expensive choice.
better to just leave them as they are and cancel the rig changes for them imo |
Batolemaeus
Free-Space-Ranger Nulli Secunda
66
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Posted - 2014.05.17 18:05:00 -
[117] - Quote
Nightingale Actault wrote: Additionally, and off that topic, I believe these changes are also a great way to increase the viability of localized nullsec manufacturing. If less items are being JF into nullsec it will give greater opportunity for those items to be created locally at profitable levels.
I did a short look through my "shipping manifests" in recent times. About 10% of my cargo could have been produced in 0.0. Mostly ships and some ammo.
So...how exactly is this supposed to improve 0.0 manufacturing? |
Dave Stark
5666
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Posted - 2014.05.17 18:05:00 -
[118] - Quote
Dirk MacGirk wrote:Those cheers you heard at FanFest? Silenced, as if millions of voices suddenly cried out in utter fricken disbelief. I fear something terrible has happened.
what disbelief? you've been told for a long time that this would happen. |
T-N-T
Elite-crew corporation Jokers.
10
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Posted - 2014.05.17 18:06:00 -
[119] - Quote
funny thing what only nulli goons and pl doesnt like these changes))others fine with them |
Vivi Udan
Multiplex Gaming Li3 Federation
15
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Posted - 2014.05.17 18:08:00 -
[120] - Quote
CCP Fozzie wrote: Because Jump Freighters only have two rig slots their maximum cargo is only going to be about 4% higher than current (with T2 rigs) and with T1 cargo rigs their cargo holds will be between 4 and 7% smaller than current. ... Let us know what you think!
Call me crazy but I don't want to spend $7,000,000,000+ isk on a Jump Freighter anymore. The only rigs that seem to be viable on a JF are cargo rigs and if T1 rigs are going to REDUCE the overall cargo compacity [T2 cargo rigs only cost $732,949,999.98 isk in Jita right now] than what was the point of adding rig slots in the first place?
The only reason [I can think of] to but something other than cargo rigs on a JF is if you plan on flying it into High Sec...where you you might as well use a normal Freighter/Red Frog.
I am confused by this proposition for Jump Freighters. The Mittani of House GoonWaffe,-áFirst of His name, King of the Goons and VFK,-áMaster of griefing,-áLord of the CFC, Warden of the West,-áand Protector of Deklein. |
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