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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 3 post(s) |
Karbowiak
4M-CORP Mordus Angels
183
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Posted - 2014.06.02 19:49:00 -
[1] - Quote
Hi.
Earlier today on IRC, we were discussing the speed and usage of the CCP image server, that everyone uses, and came to the conclution that it's not exactly the fastest thing in the world. Plus it's located in a single location, so it's not even CDN based, further bottlenecking it.
FoxFour did however mention that CCP has a CDN, where the images are stored, http://images.cdn1.eveonline.com/ But it doesn't support https.
I don't have specific metrics showcasing the slowness of the CCP Image server, but for EVE-KILL.net / zKillboard.com we ran an image proxy some months ago, which greatly increased the load time of the images (By using cloudflare's network to cache and serve the images, using spdy over ssl)
If there is a chance CCP can do the same, it will greatly increase the speed of the image server as a whole, which will lead to faster load times for our websites, and to happier people.
tl;dr: image server slow, make cdn with http/https (and preferably spdy support) |
Squizz Caphinator
Woopatang
162
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Posted - 2014.06.02 19:53:00 -
[2] - Quote
This morning, GMT-5 time, the image server was unavailable for unknown reasons. Images that I didn't have cached in my browser would not load. Having a true CDN will help alleviate this issue. Various projects I enjoy putting my time into: http://zkillboard.com | http://evewho.com | http://eve-kill.net | http://evechatter.com | http://skillq.net |
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CCP FoxFour
C C P C C P Alliance
3280
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Posted - 2014.06.02 20:03:00 -
[3] - Quote
Any chance someone, you guys or otherwise, can post some metrics? What kind of speed do you see from it and what would you expect? CCP FoxFour // Game Designer // @regnerba
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Karbowiak
4M-CORP Mordus Angels
183
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Posted - 2014.06.03 21:07:00 -
[4] - Quote
CCP FoxFour wrote:Any chance someone, you guys or otherwise, can post some metrics? What kind of speed do you see from it and what would you expect?
This was with no cache, and from Denmark, and no https.
The normal image server: http://files.karbowiak.dk/2014-06-03_22-52-33.png CCP CDN: http://files.karbowiak.dk/2014-06-03_22-54-35.png (This was after 50 or so attempts at making receiving go down) Rackspace CDN: http://files.karbowiak.dk/2014-06-03_22-55-49.png (Node is in the US, hence the +110ms waiting) Fastly CDN: http://files.karbowiak.dk/2014-06-03_23-02-17.png (EU node (Amsterdam by my guesstimates))
I wanted to test it out with cloudflare aswell using both https (with spdy) and with regular http. SPDY can GREATLY accelerate a websites loading time when it comes to multiple images, because regular http and https create a new connection pr. image, where SPDY reuses the already opened connection.
But as you can see, Fastly CDN using regular http, is far superior to both the normal image server CCP hosts, and to the CCP CDN itself.
Also there is the issue of the current image server, being located in England, so it's extremely slow for people in Australia, Asia and not extremely slow, but slow for those in the US aswell. |
Wollari
Dirt Nap Squad Dirt Nap Squad.
73
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Posted - 2014.06.05 00:14:00 -
[5] - Quote
I guess that's why other companies create additional main domains for static content like twimg.com so they don't have to share their main ssl certificate with the CDN Provider DOTLAN EveMaps-á| Your out-of-game map, navigation toolset, sov database, etc. since 2008 |
Dragonaire
Here there be Dragons
54
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Posted - 2014.06.05 18:34:00 -
[6] - Quote
Maybe just me but got to say it. Why is everybody think it's so important while getting a few PNG files to use https to start with Do you really think there's a group out there that will hijack some server and poison the DNS servers just so they can send you bad PNGs I'm sure they have better things to do like some gov site or fortune 1000 company instead. Anyway back to stuff that really matters. Finds camping stations from the inside much easier. Designer of Yapeal-á for Eve API. Check out the Yapeal PHP Library thread for more information. |
Soban Vuex
Silentread Logistics Space Warriors
1
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Posted - 2014.06.05 20:09:00 -
[7] - Quote
As you ask why do you care about some "bad" pngs or using https in the first place -
I ask you why would you NOT use TLS on any service. Security boosts the confidence of consumers. Security boosts your data safety. Recent software releases (spdy) boosts the performance of TLS to speeds better than regular HTTP.
WHY WOULD YOU NOT USE HTTPS?
Not using/providing TLS limits both you and any other entity relying on your service. |
Hel O'Ween
Men On A Mission
80
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Posted - 2014.06.06 10:31:00 -
[8] - Quote
What Soban said.
Also: mixing HTTPS/HTTP in one page throws ugly browser warnings. EVEWalletAware - an offline wallet manager. |
Karbowiak
4M-CORP Mordus Angels
184
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Posted - 2014.06.06 19:21:00 -
[9] - Quote
Dragonaire wrote:Maybe just me but got to say it. Why is everybody think it's so important while getting a few PNG files to use https to start with Do you really think there's a group out there that will hijack some server and poison the DNS servers just so they can send you bad PNGs I'm sure they have better things to do like some gov site or fortune 1000 company instead. Anyway back to stuff that really matters.
1. HTTPS websites expect everything to be coming from HTTPS, otherwise you get nasty warnings, in some cases you might even get nothing at all. Since the browser actively refuses to download anything from the non HTTPS address.
2. HTTPS is a hot topic atm, plus there is the whole "It's not detrimental to your experience, it's infact boosting your experience by making you feel safer". So, why not use https?
3. There are things like SPDY, that can infact speed up your browsing experience by doing cool stuff that regular HTTP doesn't do. And SPDY uses HTTPS to do it, so, yet another upside
So all in all, please stop talking about stuff when you clearly have zero idea why it's being talked about in the first place.
In other news, Soban and myself have begun work on something that will most likely be rather beneficial for everyone, atleast till CCP gets their thumbs out of their ass, and does it instead |
Ydnari
Estrale Frontiers Project Wildfire
331
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Posted - 2014.06.06 20:27:00 -
[10] - Quote
Firefox recently strengthened their non-HTTPS-on-HTTPS-site warnings. If you mix it, you get blocked, or at least a warning.
If you want to do HTTPS you need every asset on HTTPS. my teapot is ready |
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Dragonaire
Here there be Dragons
54
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Posted - 2014.06.07 02:33:00 -
[11] - Quote
First off this was uncalled for
Quote:So all in all, please stop talking about stuff when you clearly have zero idea why it's being talked about in the first place.
I might also remind you to read the forum rules as well in this case.
The reason I asked the question is nothing I saw said you were directing your site users to the image server. In that case even have things coming from a different domain get flagged in the browser depending on the user settings so I see that as a non-issue in that I would always have them served from my domain to start with instead. In that case it's my backend doing the call to CCP if it's not cached so doesn't matter to my users really what the connection is because they never see it.
Finds camping stations from the inside much easier. Designer of Yapeal-á for Eve API. Check out the Yapeal PHP Library thread for more information. |
Karbowiak
4M-CORP Mordus Angels
184
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Posted - 2014.06.07 14:28:00 -
[12] - Quote
Dragonaire wrote:First off this was uncalled for Quote:So all in all, please stop talking about stuff when you clearly have zero idea why it's being talked about in the first place. I might also remind you to read the forum rules as well in this case. The reason I asked the question is nothing I saw said you were directing your site users to the image server. In that case even have things coming from a different domain get flagged in the browser depending on the user settings so I see that as a non-issue in that I would always have them served from my domain to start with instead. In that case it's my backend doing the call to CCP if it's not cached so doesn't matter to my users really what the connection is because they never see it.
Forum rules? what do they have to do with anything..
But i wonder what dialect of english you're writing, because what you wrote, made zero sense. It's so bad, i don't even want to try and answer |
Dragonaire
Here there be Dragons
54
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Posted - 2014.06.07 16:49:00 -
[13] - Quote
Rules of Conduct: 2. Be respectful toward others at all times. 4. Personal attacks are prohibited.
I see the comment you made as break both those rules that I quoted.
Additional you last post would fall into this as well IMHO anyway. 5. Trolling is prohibited. Finds camping stations from the inside much easier. Designer of Yapeal-á for Eve API. Check out the Yapeal PHP Library thread for more information. |
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CCP FoxFour
C C P C C P Alliance
3289
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Posted - 2014.06.07 21:13:00 -
[14] - Quote
Before I go asking ISD to clean this thread or something how about we just move on and go back to discussing the OP. The image server clearly has poor performance, the CDN in front of it does not do so well either, and it's all just not so great. If anyone else has anything to add I will continue to monitor the thread, but I am passing this information on to others who actually handle the image server. CCP FoxFour // Game Designer // @regnerba
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CCP Phantom
C C P C C P Alliance
4434
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Posted - 2014.06.12 16:08:00 -
[15] - Quote
Off topic parts got removed. Please stay on topic, follow the forum rules and be polite, thank you! CCP Phantom - Senior Community Representative - Volunteer Manager |
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T'amber Demaleon
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
69
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Posted - 2014.06.17 12:31:00 -
[16] - Quote
On the topic of the CDN, there are some CORS issues still - I can still not load a large majority of the files hosted in webgl and have to use a mirror. :(
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BigSako
Burning Napalm Northern Coalition.
105
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Posted - 2014.06.26 09:27:00 -
[17] - Quote
the use of a CDN for the image servers would greatly improve load time on images. I can recommend AKAMAI for CDN stuff, they have a large network and servers all over the world (literally everywhere).
For the sites I am maintaining, I've implemented a "php proxy" which stores the images locally, and only updates them like once a week when the image gets requested again. Works flawless and transparent. I can upload the code if anyone is interested.
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Green Gambit
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
61
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Posted - 2014.06.26 22:23:00 -
[18] - Quote
Karbowiak wrote:SPDY can GREATLY accelerate a websites loading time when it comes to multiple images, because regular http and https create a new connection pr. image, where SPDY reuses the already opened connection.
This isn't true, HTTP has supported multiple requests over a single connection since the late 90s, all browsers since IE4 support it, and it's the default for any sane web server.
Unfortunately at the time, web servers for busy sites just couldn't handle the number of lingering connections that browsers left open (to be ready for further requests) and so disabling the feature on the server-side became a "performance tip", that still persists to this day.
PS: images.cdn1.eveonline.com has this feature turned on. |
Karbowiak
Superior Mass
184
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Posted - 2014.07.03 16:55:00 -
[19] - Quote
Green Gambit wrote:Karbowiak wrote:SPDY can GREATLY accelerate a websites loading time when it comes to multiple images, because regular http and https create a new connection pr. image, where SPDY reuses the already opened connection.
This isn't true, HTTP has supported multiple requests over a single connection since the late 90s, all browsers since IE4 support it, and it's the default for any sane web server. Unfortunately at the time, web servers for busy sites just couldn't handle the number of lingering connections that browsers left open (to be ready for further requests) and so disabling the feature on the server-side became a "performance tip", that still persists to this day. PS: images.cdn1.eveonline.com has this feature turned on.
images.cdn1.eveonline.com has no https tho, so the idea of using that goes out the window real fast. As for SPDY / HTTP multiplexing, SPDY can do it much faster than regular HTTP can, since HTTP does pipelining, and it will max open 4-16 pipes, depending on the browser/browser settings. SPDY however requests multiple assets over the same connection, sometimes 2 sometimes over 50 - all depends on the speed.
Plus the HTTP pipelining has to negotiate a new connection pr. pipeline, adding to the overhead, it's really bad with https for example. Where SPDY only has to negotiate once |
Indalecia
171
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Posted - 2014.07.03 18:17:00 -
[20] - Quote
Big +1 for Karbo. Osmium is also quite heavy on the image server and the page load time could greatly benefit from a faster one. https://o.smium.org/ GÇö v0.13.0 GÇö A browser-based fitting tool and loadout sharing platform |
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Karbowiak
Superior Mass
187
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Posted - 2014.07.05 17:28:00 -
[21] - Quote
Updated the first post with links to currently usable CDNs (There's only one atm, but i'm sure more will be added) |
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