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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
11844
|
Posted - 2014.06.08 10:01:00 -
[271] - Quote
Rivr Luzade wrote:
Exactly! But most people don't want to pay professional rates for professional service, they just want the service. Often, it doesn't even work out. If you, for instance, need to move 5B of minerals a good number of jumps, paying a lot of reward reduces your margins quite considerably. So these high rewards currently only work with stuff that you want to use, not for reselling or further processing (and no, the majority of the people is not willing to pay more on the market due to your efforts - another saddening fact.
Greedy, lazy pilots are how we stay in business Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship |
Daichi Yamato
Xero Security and Technologies
1635
|
Posted - 2014.06.08 16:10:00 -
[272] - Quote
Rivr Luzade wrote: Exactly! But most people don't want to pay professional rates for professional service, they just want the service. Often, it doesn't even work out. If you, for instance, need to move 5B of minerals a good number of jumps, paying a lot of reward reduces your margins quite considerably. So these high rewards currently only work with stuff that you want to use, not for reselling or further processing (and no, the majority of the people is not willing to pay more on the market due to your efforts - another saddening fact.).
so rather than choose another item to haul or another market to sell at, u think the game should change so that, no matter what u choose to haul or what station u want to sell it at, it is easy, safe and cheap so that any idiot can do it?
because hauling as profession needs even less rewards right? EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY?No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided""So it will be up to a pilot to remain vigilant wherever they may be flying and be ready for anything at any time" |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6879
|
Posted - 2014.06.08 16:18:00 -
[273] - Quote
Daichi Yamato wrote:Rivr Luzade wrote: Exactly! But most people don't want to pay professional rates for professional service, they just want the service. Often, it doesn't even work out. If you, for instance, need to move 5B of minerals a good number of jumps, paying a lot of reward reduces your margins quite considerably. So these high rewards currently only work with stuff that you want to use, not for reselling or further processing (and no, the majority of the people is not willing to pay more on the market due to your efforts - another saddening fact.).
so rather than choose another item to haul or another market to sell at, u think the game should change so that, no matter what u choose to haul or what station u want to sell it at, it is easy, safe and cheap so that any idiot can do it? because hauling as profession needs even less rewards right?
Bingo. Making things more safe because bad players are doing badly just devalues the hard work of the smart, careful pilots. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
2213
|
Posted - 2014.06.08 17:04:00 -
[274] - Quote
Upon further consideration of the matter, I am thoroughly convinced that Chaosgrimm and others like him need to actually try a life of ganking before they attempt to provide insight as to what - if anything - should be done about it. |
Bethan Le Troix
Krusual Investigation Agency
122
|
Posted - 2014.06.08 17:22:00 -
[275] - Quote
Fragglewump wrote:I don't have and issue with ganking itself, but I feel that there is not enough of a punishment for it, they get a sec stat hit use tags to get it back, they get kill rights they use and alt to get rid of it or some one sets the kill rights to high for some one to want to activate it, even freighters with reinforced bulkheads only rakes 4 bc's and 18 destroyers to gank it. I my self think that is not what eve is about, my feeling with eve is there should be a counter for every thing in the game and giving 3 low slots is not a good enough counter. and even the police in they game is running on a skeleton crew, as more crimes happen in a system the police should ramp up and and as the system cools down the police protection should lower and if there are criminals in the area the system should become more protected making them use more tags.
The kill rights are admittedly not much of a deterrent as miners are not generally set up to use them. Invariably they 'time out' and are not used.
The sec status hit on the other hand is a major deterrent certainly for new gankers as the tags are difficult/rare to acquire by 'farming' them in low sec. The other method of buying them from other players, given that they are hard to source, is very expensive certainly to me. So I ration out ganking accept when my contracted targets will not listen to reason and extreme prejudice becomes the only option.
Probably the main problem is haulers filling T1 industrials, freighters, and Orcas with hundreds of millions or billions of ISK worth of cargo. They make it possible for significant profit plus the ability to purchase tags from sellers on the market. So the cycle continues.
Therefore the victim is actually bringing all this pain on themselves. Either, in my victims case, by mining unsustainably, or in the others by the haulers transporting loot pi+¦atas. Don't ya just love that thing on top of the n. |
Bethan Le Troix
Krusual Investigation Agency
122
|
Posted - 2014.06.08 17:27:00 -
[276] - Quote
That is the victims fault for not engaging with the community via the official forum, other good sites such The Mittani's blogsite, in-game chat channels, and player run corporations. If you live in cave you won't know what is going on outside. |
Phoenix22
The Empire Nation
2
|
Posted - 2014.06.08 20:59:00 -
[277] - Quote
I think the bounty hunters shot have more access to the LAW like hacking mod that will allowed to hack in to the players that is dock at station low ore hige sec to force him to undock and kiil him + pod with no penalty mod shot only worck on negative Players (-1 to -10)
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Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6887
|
Posted - 2014.06.08 21:12:00 -
[278] - Quote
Phoenix22 wrote:I think the bounty hunters shot have more access to the LAW like hacking mod that will allowed to hack in to the players that is dock at station low ore hige sec to force him to undock and kiil him + pod with no penalty mod shot only worck on negative Players (-1 to -10)
Lol wow.
Not only is that a dumb idea, because I thought of a way around it in about ten seconds, but it's also incredibly game breaking as a concept.
I don't know how to say "Hell no!" in enough languages to adequately express just how bad of an idea that is. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Phoenix22
The Empire Nation
2
|
Posted - 2014.06.08 21:47:00 -
[279] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Phoenix22 wrote:I think the bounty hunters shot have more access to the LAW like hacking mod that will allowed to hack in to the players that is dock at station low ore hige sec to force him to undock and kiil him + pod with no penalty mod shot only worck on negative Players (-1 to -10)
Lol wow. Not only is that a dumb idea, because I thought of a way around it in about ten seconds, but it's also incredibly game breaking as a concept. I don't know how to say "Hell no!" in enough languages to adequately express just how bad of an idea that is.
no it is not a dumb idea it is like real police break in (SWAT) you think the Police will stay out side and do noting no they will break in sooner or later and come to get ya same goes for EVE fund the (-) Player force him out and boom 20% ore more GANKING fix the we will see haw much (-) Players will gank when there is tru LAW in the EVE |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6889
|
Posted - 2014.06.08 21:52:00 -
[280] - Quote
Phoenix22 wrote: no it is not a dumb idea it is like real police break in (SWAT) you think the Police will stay out side and do noting no they will break in sooner or later and come to get ya same goes for EVE fund the (-) Player force him out and boom 20% ore more GANKING fix the we will see haw much (-) Players will gank when there is tru LAW in the EVE
Yeah, it is a dumb idea. Because like I said, I thought of a way around it in about ten seconds. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
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Daichi Yamato
Xero Security and Technologies
1640
|
Posted - 2014.06.08 22:02:00 -
[281] - Quote
not sure if phoenix is troll or the most self serving, anti-criminal carebear to come to the forums. EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY?No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided""So it will be up to a pilot to remain vigilant wherever they may be flying and be ready for anything at any time" |
Phoenix22
The Empire Nation
2
|
Posted - 2014.06.08 22:08:00 -
[282] - Quote
Daichi Yamato wrote:not sure if phoenix is troll or the most self serving, anti-criminal carebear to come to the forums.
you can call me a troll ore what ever when you are in force like me for 20 years then talk and yes i am anti-criminal that what i do for living not like you no work kid and with no brain |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6890
|
Posted - 2014.06.08 22:10:00 -
[283] - Quote
Phoenix22 wrote:Daichi Yamato wrote:not sure if phoenix is troll or the most self serving, anti-criminal carebear to come to the forums. you can call me a troll ore what ever when you are in force like me for 20 years then talk and yes i am anti-criminal that what i do for living not like you no work kid and with no brain
You do realize this a videogame? "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaerakh
Surprisingly Deep Hole
283
|
Posted - 2014.06.08 22:18:00 -
[284] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Phoenix22 wrote:Daichi Yamato wrote:not sure if phoenix is troll or the most self serving, anti-criminal carebear to come to the forums. you can call me a troll ore what ever when you are in force like me for 20 years then talk and yes i am anti-criminal that what i do for living not like you no work kid and with no brain You do realize this a videogame?
Dude, don't you see the trailers? EVE is reeeeeal man. Schrodinger's Hot Dropper |
Phoenix22
The Empire Nation
2
|
Posted - 2014.06.08 22:21:00 -
[285] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Phoenix22 wrote:Daichi Yamato wrote:not sure if phoenix is troll or the most self serving, anti-criminal carebear to come to the forums. you can call me a troll ore what ever when you are in force like me for 20 years then talk and yes i am anti-criminal that what i do for living not like you no work kid and with no brain You do realize this a videogame?
Yes i now this is a videogame i was merely suggesting ideas against criminals not fight on the Forum |
Gospadin
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
154
|
Posted - 2014.06.08 22:29:00 -
[286] - Quote
Rivr Luzade wrote:baltec1 wrote:Rivr Luzade wrote:baltec1 wrote:Its always fun to see people with no idea about ganking flapping about on the forums blaiming everything but themselves and demanding nerfs to the single most punished activity in EVE. For a second I thought you wanted to tell us that ganking, an illegal activity, should be less punished and more rewarding. It would be nice to go a year without yet another nerf to protect people from themselves. Reward wise, we are at the mercy of peoples stupidity and lazyness. Why do you bother with these people? They are in High sec, an area of space where they don't affect you in any way, shape or form (or should not if you'd take your sov serious) and where you shouldn't be anyways as you have Sov (your home and area where you are supposed to live and shape and create your content). As for the "stupidity and lazyness[sic]"; considering your alliance's, your coalitions and other 00 sec dwellers war histories with certain entities, there's endless amounts of these two attributes floating around in space anyways. So, calling that being "at the mercy" is not exactly warranted.
For every hisec carebear that gets blown up, prices in jita go up by another 0.01 isk, padding the wallets of industrial captains.
Every carebear should be happy when other carebears blow up. Less competition, more industry volume, etc. |
Ellendras Silver
My second corp
142
|
Posted - 2014.06.08 22:35:00 -
[287] - Quote
Fragglewump wrote:I don't have and issue with ganking itself, but I feel that there is not enough of a punishment for it, they get a sec stat hit use tags to get it back, they get kill rights they use and alt to get rid of it or some one sets the kill rights to high for some one to want to activate it, even freighters with reinforced bulkheads only rakes 4 bc's and 18 destroyers to gank it. I my self think that is not what eve is about, my feeling with eve is there should be a counter for every thing in the game and giving 3 low slots is not a good enough counter. and even the police in they game is running on a skeleton crew, as more crimes happen in a system the police should ramp up and and as the system cools down the police protection should lower and if there are criminals in the area the system should become more protected making them use more tags.
implants, boosting friends, webbing friends all options to make it harder for gankers, but it will always be possible you could ofc make loads not too valuable but that is often defended with tears about the empty room etc. Carpe noctem |
Hakaari Inkuran
State War Academy Caldari State
11
|
Posted - 2014.06.08 22:46:00 -
[288] - Quote
chaosgrimm wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:chaosgrimm wrote: No. for the hauler: By choosing lower valued goods, they are hit with opportunity cost By choosing a more valuable haul, the are risking getting ganked and taking an actual capital loss.
for the ganker: their net losses are generally limited to opportunity costs
The haulers have that choice. They are literally the only ones who determine the risk/reward ratio of hauling. Not the gankers. They have all the advantage in this regard because their choice can, if they choose correctly, almost completely mitigate the options of the potential gankers. If you fit sensibly and don't over stuff your cargo hold, you will almost never die. If you don't autopilot into the bargain, the chance of dying gets even lower. I agree with almost everything you have said in your reply. haulers make risk / reward decisions. And these decisions are not relative to the actual threat posed by gankers, as the haulers path could potential be gank fleet free. Where is the ganker's risk / reward decision? They have an idea of the ehp of a target they can take, the rough value of said target, they know their penalties in advance, they handpick a target. They have nearly a complete picture of their risks. What if gankers had a few unknowns to deal with as well? such as not knowing the cargo value of their target.
There's one big unknown: whether the desired loot will actually drop when the ship pops. |
Daichi Yamato
Xero Security and Technologies
1640
|
Posted - 2014.06.08 22:53:00 -
[289] - Quote
Phoenix22 wrote:Daichi Yamato wrote:not sure if phoenix is troll or the most self serving, anti-criminal carebear to come to the forums. you can call me a troll ore what ever when you are in force like me for 20 years then talk and yes i am anti-criminal that what i do for living not like you no work kid and with no brain
lol before u question my work ethic perhaps u should read more of my posts.
where as ur posts are most certainly self serving.
Phoenix22 wrote:
i agree shot be better to remove the t2 crystals and add t2 strip
and the hulk shot have a roll Bonus maybe 20% 30% mining yield ore extra cargo hold.
lemme guess which ship u like to fly. EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY?No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided""So it will be up to a pilot to remain vigilant wherever they may be flying and be ready for anything at any time" |
Mag's
the united
17365
|
Posted - 2014.06.09 00:13:00 -
[290] - Quote
Daichi Yamato wrote:Phoenix22 wrote:Daichi Yamato wrote:not sure if phoenix is troll or the most self serving, anti-criminal carebear to come to the forums. you can call me a troll ore what ever when you are in force like me for 20 years then talk and yes i am anti-criminal that what i do for living not like you no work kid and with no brain lol before u question my work ethic perhaps u should read more of my posts. where as ur posts are most certainly self serving. Phoenix22 wrote:
i agree shot be better to remove the t2 crystals and add t2 strip
and the hulk shot have a roll Bonus maybe 20% 30% mining yield ore extra cargo hold.
lemme guess which ship u like to fly. Fit that puppy for max yield, would also be my guess.
Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the lions will ignore you in the savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless. |
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Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
2217
|
Posted - 2014.06.09 02:17:00 -
[291] - Quote
Phoenix22 wrote:Daichi Yamato wrote:not sure if phoenix is troll or the most self serving, anti-criminal carebear to come to the forums. you can call me a troll ore what ever when you are in force like me for 20 years then talk and yes i am anti-criminal that what i do for living not like you no work kid and with no brain
Why did you even come to EVE in the first place? This isn't the game for anti-criminals. |
Jane Mountain
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
1
|
Posted - 2014.06.09 03:12:00 -
[292] - Quote
Okay, how in the **** can anyone complain about being suicide ganked post Kronos?
I see we are discussing freighter runs now. I'm unwilling to read back more than one page so I'll (perhaps incorrectly) assume we are discussing the prospect of hiring BlueFrog as a means of preventing one's self from being suicide ganked with their own goods. You do not need to hire out for safety. You should be hiring out for convenience.
The Impel and the Ark are borderline ungankable. I don't want to mention the stats on the forums, in fear of them being nerfed. As such I will ask you do it yourself:
Impel: 800mm plate. T2 Trimarks. Overheated deadspace armor resists in the remaining lows. Ark: Creatively figure out how to increase armor resistance using the slots available. Both: Use a Slave set. Use other implants to supplement armor and hull HP. Use max links.
Now, plug that all into EFT or your favorite fitting tool. Do you see what I see?
Exactly. Never complain about ganking in high-sec again. It's always your fault now.
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Adira Nictor
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
69
|
Posted - 2014.06.09 03:28:00 -
[293] - Quote
Jane Mountain wrote:Okay, how in the **** can anyone complain about being suicide ganked post Kronos?
I see we are discussing freighter runs now. I'm unwilling to read back more than one page so I'll (perhaps incorrectly) assume we are discussing the prospect of hiring BlueFrog as a means of preventing one's self from being suicide ganked with their own goods. You do not need to hire out for safety. You should be hiring out for convenience.
The Impel and the Ark are borderline ungankable. I don't want to mention the stats on the forums, in fear of them being nerfed. As such I will ask you do it yourself:
Impel: 800mm plate. T2 Trimarks. Overheated deadspace armor resists in the remaining lows. Ark: Creatively figure out how to increase armor resistance using the slots available. Both: Use a Slave set. Use other implants to supplement armor and hull HP. Use max links.
Now, plug that all into EFT or your favorite fitting tool. Do you see what I see?
Exactly. Never complain about ganking in high-sec again. It's always your fault now.
You can't use rigs on freighters, but honestly looking at a normal providence with a bc wingmate and good armor warfare skills you can push upwards of 644k ehp with just 1 DCU II and 2 hull upgrades. |
Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
2218
|
Posted - 2014.06.09 03:32:00 -
[294] - Quote
How do you propose to put a DCU onto a freighter? |
Astroniomix
Cryptic Meta-4
861
|
Posted - 2014.06.09 03:48:00 -
[295] - Quote
Alvatore DiMarco wrote:How do you propose to put a DCU onto a freighter? Magic. |
Mag's
the united
17368
|
Posted - 2014.06.09 09:14:00 -
[296] - Quote
Facepalm.
Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the lions will ignore you in the savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless. |
Velicitia
Arma Artificer
2358
|
Posted - 2014.06.09 11:31:00 -
[297] - Quote
Alvatore DiMarco wrote:How do you propose to put a DCU onto a freighter?
L2forum ... there's a reason there are a metric f**kton of posts here with [Kronos] tags.
Because I just finished coffee, i'm feeling nice ...
CCP Fozzie wrote: we are making the significant change of providing the goal of customizability through low slots rather than rig slots
from here
One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia |
afkalt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
108
|
Posted - 2014.06.09 11:35:00 -
[298] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Phoenix22 wrote:I think the bounty hunters shot have more access to the LAW like hacking mod that will allowed to hack in to the players that is dock at station low ore hige sec to force him to undock and kiil him + pod with no penalty mod shot only worck on negative Players (-1 to -10)
Lol wow. Not only is that a dumb idea, because I thought of a way around it in about ten seconds, but it's also incredibly game breaking as a concept. I don't know how to say "Hell no!" in enough languages to adequately express just how bad of an idea that is.
This do you?
No Nej +ä+º jo geen +++¦ he+º bir ez aª¿aª+ ne -+-¦ Dili neniu ei hindi aucun non -î-ç+¦ ßâÉßâáßâÉßâáßâÿßâí a¬òa½ïa¬ê Pa gen Ba +£+É añ¿añ¦aÑÇañé tsis mba tidak Uimh Nei püäpüäpüê Ana +º+Ö+Ö+ƒ a¦ça¦¦a¦ìa¦¦ ßPé߃ÆßPÿßP¦ßPô µùá täí 8òädïê ne a¦Üa+ìa+êa¦ía¦¦ N-ô kwete Nru añ¿añ+añ¦aÑÇ
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Corraidhin Farsaidh
Hello-There
538
|
Posted - 2014.06.09 11:36:00 -
[299] - Quote
afkalt wrote: No Nej +ä+º jo geen +++¦ he+º bir ez aª¿aª+ ne -+-¦ Dili neniu ei hindi aucun non -î-ç+¦ ßâÉßâáßâÉßâáßâÿßâí a¬òa½ïa¬ê Pa gen Ba +£+É añ¿añ¦aÑÇañé tsis mba tidak Uimh Nei püäpüäpüê Ana +º+Ö+Ö+ƒ a¦ça¦¦a¦ìa¦¦ ßPé߃ÆßPÿßP¦ßPô µùá täí 8òädïê ne a¦Üa+ìa+êa¦ía¦¦ N-ô kwete Nru añ¿añ+añ¦aÑÇ
That needs to be added into the sticky F&I rules post for copy and paste reuse and credited to the original poster |
afkalt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
108
|
Posted - 2014.06.09 11:38:00 -
[300] - Quote
Velicitia wrote:Alvatore DiMarco wrote:How do you propose to put a DCU onto a freighter? L2forum ... there's a reason there are a metric f**kton of posts here with [Kronos] tags. Because I just finished coffee, i'm feeling nice ... CCP Fozzie wrote: we are making the significant change of providing the goal of customizability through low slots rather than rig slots from here
Now go look at the CPU they have..... |
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