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Mag's
the united
17436
|
Posted - 2014.06.15 21:03:00 -
[391] - Quote
DrysonBennington wrote:There should be limit though of how many tags a - 10 Red is Dead Pilot should be able to sell to Concord within any given month. Why exactly?
I for one wouldn't use them because of A. The cost of overuse is prohibitive and B. There is no reason other than an end of piracy, to even use tags.
Neither case, would be affected by a limit. Or are you simply after some arbitrary nerf?
Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the lions will ignore you in the savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless. |
Tengu Grib
Normadiac Industrial And Security Solutions
160
|
Posted - 2014.06.15 21:04:00 -
[392] - Quote
DrysonBennington wrote:There should be limit though of how many tags a - 10 Red is Dead Pilot should be able to sell to Concord within any given month.
Tags cost a lot dude. A lot a lot. Sure you can technically buy as many as you want, but you'll quickly spend way more than you want to if you do. That's why most gank toons are dedicated gankers and the guys use alts who don't gank to actually fly around and fight. Tengu Grib > I agree. The distinct lack of quality spaceships makes RL the worst space sim ever. SolidX > i'm an alt IRL Guilty conscience? Buy a mining permit today. www.minerbumping.com |
baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
11945
|
Posted - 2014.06.15 22:19:00 -
[393] - Quote
DrysonBennington wrote:There should be limit though of how many tags a - 10 Red is Dead Pilot should be able to sell to Concord within any given month.
Near no gankers use them. Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship |
Kaerakh
Surprisingly Deep Hole
302
|
Posted - 2014.06.15 22:43:00 -
[394] - Quote
Iain Cariaba wrote:ShahFluffers wrote:Wall of brilliant text describing ways to not get ganked. The problem, Shah, is that while your's is the third or fourth time in 20 pages that this has been brought up, the carebears don't want to listen. They don't want to take these steps cause in their delusions of mediocrity it cuts down on how much isk they can make. They would rather have someone else fix their supposed problem, like small children do, then protect themselves. Somehow they think the devs at CCP are the mommy that's going to kiss their ganking boo-boo away. Then again, they could have all been raised on the prototype for America's Common Core educational system and truly think having to replace a 1.5 billion isk ship and 5-10 billion isk in cargo rather than take several trips to haul it is profitable.
As I've stated in other posts, a large part of it, I'm willing to bet, is due to the mentality players from other MMOs bring over. WoW is used as a typical example so I'll use that one. In WoW you have PVP zones and no-PVP zones. The average player first starting their career sees this as a parallel in highsec and assumes that's the intent and the design.
It's primarily a problem of misinformation started by false assumptions and further proliferated by highsec carebears in an area with easy access to new players(which results in further propagation of the misinformation(quite the perpetual problem)). Really, this is a failure on CCP's part to effectively communicate that no system is completely safe and that it is intended to be that way. Schrodinger's Hot Dropper |
Tengu Grib
Normadiac Industrial And Security Solutions
163
|
Posted - 2014.06.15 22:55:00 -
[395] - Quote
Kaerakh wrote: As I've stated in other posts, a large part of it, I'm willing to bet, is due to the mentality players from other MMOs bring over. WoW is used as a typical example so I'll use that one. In WoW you have PVP zones and no-PVP zones. The average player first starting their career sees this as a parallel in highsec and assumes that's the intent and the design.
It's primarily a problem of misinformation started by false assumptions and further proliferated by highsec carebears in an area with easy access to new players(which results in further propagation of the misinformation(quite the perpetual problem)). Really, this is a failure on CCP's part to effectively communicate that no system is completely safe and that it is intended to be that way.
CCP does actually state it, but they don't really reinforce it. That information ends up getting lost though with carebears talking about WH space, 0.0 and low sec where violence is allowed. They compare that to where Concorde will respond to any violence and assume that no one would be willing to lose their ship in order to shoot them and so violence won't happen unless the other person really wants to hurt you. They have no idea that ganking can be profitable if the targets are carrying enough cargo. Or if they are aware they certainly don't seem to think it will happen to them.
I agree that it would be beneficial to new players to be better made aware that violence can occur anywhere anytime, and is in fact quite likely to do so. This has a lot to do with corporations that recruit new players not really knowing much about the game and how things actually work. As was mentioned, misinformation end up compounding on more misinformation.
CCP does state that no space is completely safe anywhere ever. Tengu Grib > I agree. The distinct lack of quality spaceships makes RL the worst space sim ever. SolidX > i'm an alt IRL Guilty conscience? Buy a mining permit today. www.minerbumping.com |
Kaerakh
Surprisingly Deep Hole
303
|
Posted - 2014.06.15 23:05:00 -
[396] - Quote
Tengu Grib wrote:Kaerakh wrote: As I've stated in other posts, a large part of it, I'm willing to bet, is due to the mentality players from other MMOs bring over. WoW is used as a typical example so I'll use that one. In WoW you have PVP zones and no-PVP zones. The average player first starting their career sees this as a parallel in highsec and assumes that's the intent and the design.
It's primarily a problem of misinformation started by false assumptions and further proliferated by highsec carebears in an area with easy access to new players(which results in further propagation of the misinformation(quite the perpetual problem)). Really, this is a failure on CCP's part to effectively communicate that no system is completely safe and that it is intended to be that way. CCP does actually state it, but they don't really reinforce it. That information ends up getting lost though with carebears talking about WH space, 0.0 and low sec where violence is allowed. They compare that to where Concorde will respond to any violence and assume that no one would be willing to lose their ship in order to shoot them and so violence won't happen unless the other person really wants to hurt you. They have no idea that ganking can be profitable if the targets are carrying enough cargo. Or if they are aware they certainly don't seem to think it will happen to them. I agree that it would be beneficial to new players to be better made aware that violence can occur anywhere anytime, and is in fact quite likely to do so. This has a lot to do with corporations that recruit new players not really knowing much about the game and how things actually work. As was mentioned, misinformation end up compounding on more misinformation. CCP does state that no space is completely safe anywhere ever.
Sure, I never denied that, but it's quickly glazed over and forgotten. The statement isn't very firmly reinforced, which results in it being lost. For example the new player FAQ states it about 2/3rds of the way through the pdf. I would be willing to bet a an exceedingly small number of players have actually ever read the document.
I'm not saying a big red wall of text needs to be placed on your screen every time you log in, but the tutorial could use a firmer stance to help dissuade the incorrect ideals that are commonly passed around in highsec. Schrodinger's Hot Dropper |
Tengu Grib
Normadiac Industrial And Security Solutions
163
|
Posted - 2014.06.15 23:11:00 -
[397] - Quote
Kaerakh wrote:
Sure, I never denied that, but it's quickly glazed over and forgotten. The statement isn't very firmly reinforced, which results in it being lost. For example the new player FAQ states it about 2/3rds of the way through the pdf. I would be willing to bet a an exceedingly small number of players have actually ever read the document.
I'm not saying a big red wall of text needs to be placed on your screen every time you log in, but the tutorial could use a firmer stance to help dissuade the incorrect ideals that are commonly passed around in highsec.
I fully agree with all of that. How about a training mission that sends you to Jita, then flags you all of a sudden for no reason. (whoops did the mission description forget to mention that, now you're actually dead.) Or something along those lines. Make it clear that other players will violence you if given the opportunity, or a reason. Tengu Grib > I agree. The distinct lack of quality spaceships makes RL the worst space sim ever. SolidX > i'm an alt IRL Guilty conscience? Buy a mining permit today. www.minerbumping.com |
Kaerakh
Surprisingly Deep Hole
303
|
Posted - 2014.06.15 23:16:00 -
[398] - Quote
Tengu Grib wrote:Kaerakh wrote:
Sure, I never denied that, but it's quickly glazed over and forgotten. The statement isn't very firmly reinforced, which results in it being lost. For example the new player FAQ states it about 2/3rds of the way through the pdf. I would be willing to bet a an exceedingly small number of players have actually ever read the document.
I'm not saying a big red wall of text needs to be placed on your screen every time you log in, but the tutorial could use a firmer stance to help dissuade the incorrect ideals that are commonly passed around in highsec.
I fully agree with all of that. How about a training mission that sends you to Jita, then flags you all of a sudden for no reason. (whoops did the mission description forget to mention that, now you're actually dead.) Or something along those lines. Make it clear that other players will violence you if given the opportunity, or a reason.
I think that's a little extreme. Plus, suddenly ripping the rug out from under the player is pretty questionable game design. You don't want the player to feel betrayed by the game mechanics. Schrodinger's Hot Dropper |
Tengu Grib
Normadiac Industrial And Security Solutions
163
|
Posted - 2014.06.15 23:34:00 -
[399] - Quote
Kaerakh wrote:Tengu Grib wrote:Kaerakh wrote:
Sure, I never denied that, but it's quickly glazed over and forgotten. The statement isn't very firmly reinforced, which results in it being lost. For example the new player FAQ states it about 2/3rds of the way through the pdf. I would be willing to bet a an exceedingly small number of players have actually ever read the document.
I'm not saying a big red wall of text needs to be placed on your screen every time you log in, but the tutorial could use a firmer stance to help dissuade the incorrect ideals that are commonly passed around in highsec.
I fully agree with all of that. How about a training mission that sends you to Jita, then flags you all of a sudden for no reason. (whoops did the mission description forget to mention that, now you're actually dead.) Or something along those lines. Make it clear that other players will violence you if given the opportunity, or a reason. I think that's a little extreme. Plus, suddenly ripping the rug out from under the player is pretty questionable game design. You don't want the player to feel betrayed by the game mechanics.
Fair enough. There should be something that indicates to them that these things happen and you need to plan for them though. Tengu Grib > I agree. The distinct lack of quality spaceships makes RL the worst space sim ever. SolidX > i'm an alt IRL Guilty conscience? Buy a mining permit today. www.minerbumping.com |
baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
11949
|
Posted - 2014.06.16 12:10:00 -
[400] - Quote
Tengu Grib wrote:
Fair enough. There should be something that indicates to them that these things happen and you need to plan for them though.
Every time EVE is brought up in any other game it is generally followed by people ranting how we are the scum of the universe. On top of that you have widespread reviews, mainstream news, many EVE related sites. If new players don't know about what happens in EVE its their own fault for simply not looking before they jump. Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship |
|
afkalt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
136
|
Posted - 2014.06.16 12:20:00 -
[401] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Tengu Grib wrote:
Fair enough. There should be something that indicates to them that these things happen and you need to plan for them though.
Every time EVE is brought up in any other game it is generally followed by people ranting how we are the scum of the universe. On top of that you have widespread reviews, mainstream news, many EVE related sites. If new players don't know about what happens in EVE its their own fault for simply not looking before they jump.
I agree with many of your posts, but I think we should consider looking after newbies a little better. Especially given how warm and fuzzy the tutorials are.
It doesnt need to be a full blown hand hold, but I think it would be better to trade a few potential loot pinyatas for better newbie retention. I find it hard to agree that people should do full blow research before firing a game up - over time, certainly - but I do think there is a place for it in the tutorial. A simple masked "courier" mission where you're blasted to bits without warning would do fine. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
7062
|
Posted - 2014.06.16 12:45:00 -
[402] - Quote
afkalt wrote: I agree with many of your posts, but I think we should consider looking after newbies a little better. Especially given how warm and fuzzy the tutorials are.
It doesnt need to be a full blown hand hold, but I think it would be better to trade a few potential loot pinyatas for better newbie retention. I find it hard to agree that people should do full blow research before firing a game up - over time, certainly - but I do think there is a place for it in the tutorial. A simple masked "courier" mission where you're blasted to bits without warning would do fine.
How? Seriously, how do you "look after newbies a little better"?
Because bubble wrapping them is just going to make the eventual fall even harder. And it's already against the rules to screw with them in newbie systems or during the SoE arc, and who knows how much else.
I mean, yes I agree that the tutorials could better explain the realities of the game, but the rest of the game is still out there once those are done with. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Iain Cariaba
In Over Our Heads
50
|
Posted - 2014.06.16 12:56:00 -
[403] - Quote
afkalt wrote:I agree with many of your posts, but I think we should consider looking after newbies a little better. Especially given how warm and fuzzy the tutorials are.
It doesnt need to be a full blown hand hold, but I think it would be better to trade a few potential loot pinyatas for better newbie retention. I find it hard to agree that people should do full blow research before firing a game up - over time, certainly - but I do think there is a place for it in the tutorial. A simple masked "courier" mission where you're blasted to bits without warning would do fine. One of the primary reasons I've played this game as long as I have, and keep coming back to it over and over after it pisses me off and I stop playing, is because it emphasizes something sorely lacking in the real world... Personal Responsibility.
You are personally responsible for deciding what you want to do in Eve, rather than be forced along racial or class roles. Rolled and Amarr toon but hate lasers, you can train something else.
You are personally responsible for finding something to do to occupy your time. Sure alliances and corps have ops at designated times, but if you're not there at that time you can't blame anyone but yourself that you missed it.
Following the trail of brain crumbs to it's logical conclusion, it is your personal responsibility to ensure your own safety. I will state again for all you carebears: Concorde is not a crime prevention branch. Their only existence is to punish those who break their laws. This is Concorde,
Yes, newbies should be warned of the dangers in Eve, and in fact they already are for anyone who takes the personal responsibility to do even the slightest bit of research into a game they are thinking of spending money on. Do not hand hold newbies with more repetitive missions where they'll still think that they're safe from players because they got ganked by NPCs. Yes, they will think this.
Furthermore, CCP needs to stop hand holding the highsec carebears who continually cry for more and more nerfs of ganking when they refuse to take even the slightest personal responsibility for their own safety.
For the record, I too am a carebear. I mine, rat in null, engage in the occasional pvp roam, and have hauler alts roaming through highsec. I protect my assets. Now that I can tank my freighter, you'd better believe it's tanked, as are all my mining barges. I've had one mining barge ganked out of four accounts spanning the last 7 years with this attitude.
Final word to CCP: There's no problem with ganking. The problem is with those being ganked.
Final word to everyone else: I apologize for the long rant, but these whining highsec carebears are giving carebears an even worse reputation than we already had. If I agreed with you, we'd both be wrong. |
afkalt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
136
|
Posted - 2014.06.16 13:51:00 -
[404] - Quote
For goodness sakes, I'm talking about new players. Introducing them to the REALITY of the game in a controlled manner isn't going to be a bad thing.
So, to take the example I gave - they are given an impossible courier contract - the entire point being that you WILL die, not everything will go your way. That this is NOT hello kitty online.
It is not about carebearing - it is about education of new blood.
Look, I get it, people here are all bitter vets and nothing is more fun than smashing a newbie to bits and naturally it is all their fault as they should have reserched/read blogs/studied for a game - except MOST people wont do that, not at first (it's a game, not a job) - so a minor nod to it in the tutorial would be useful I think. Will it help everyone? Probably not - will it help some - undoubtedly.
You catch more flies with jam than you do with vinegar, and CCP tends to agree seeing as they are running NPE etc. So, setting aside the word "carebear" and tell my why you think making an essentially trivial effort to educate new players is a bad move.
Nothing wrong with ganking, but I disagree that new blood should be expected to scour forums etc fo terms they wont even have heard of before they start playing. Hell, let's take it to it's logical conclusion - get rid of rookie help channel - people can study, right? Get rid of newbie systems, screw them - they should learn the hard way, right?
EVE has a chronic newbie retention problem and measures to help that can't be a bad thing.
To be 100% clear - I believe ganking should be unchanged, I just think that newbies should have it mentioned in the tutorial. |
Bohneik Itohn
Amarrian Salvage Gnomes and Associates
257
|
Posted - 2014.06.16 14:14:00 -
[405] - Quote
afkalt wrote:For goodness sakes, I'm talking about new players. Introducing them to the REALITY of the game in a controlled manner isn't going to be a bad thing.
So, to take the example I gave - they are given an impossible courier contract - the entire point being that you WILL die, not everything will go your way. That this is NOT hello kitty online.
It is not about carebearing - it is about education of new blood.
Look, I get it, people here are all bitter vets and nothing is more fun than smashing a newbie to bits and naturally it is all their fault as they should have reserched/read blogs/studied for a game - except MOST people wont do that, not at first (it's a game, not a job) - so a minor nod to it in the tutorial would be useful I think. Will it help everyone? Probably not - will it help some - undoubtedly.
You catch more flies with jam than you do with vinegar, and CCP tends to agree seeing as they are running NPE etc. So, setting aside the word "carebear" and tell my why you think making an essentially trivial effort to educate new players is a bad move.
Nothing wrong with ganking, but I disagree that new blood should be expected to scour forums etc fo terms they wont even have heard of before they start playing. Hell, let's take it to it's logical conclusion - get rid of rookie help channel - people can study, right? Get rid of newbie systems, screw them - they should learn the hard way, right?
EVE has a chronic newbie retention problem and measures to help that can't be a bad thing.
To be 100% clear - I believe ganking should be unchanged, I just think that newbies should have it mentioned in the tutorial.
I'd say take a step back from impossible and simply make it very hard. Sending them deep into faction warfare in an industry ship would be a suicide run but any player that succeeds should feel like they've accomplished something, and not have to ask in the new player help channel "Why can't I complete this mission? I've dropped off the cargo to the right spot." only to be told. "Oh, you were supposed to fail, undock and self-destruct your ship."
A lot of the problem I perceive new players have with coming to terms with ganking is that the progression of ship affordability is in no ways clear to a new player. In any other MMO if you can afford it you are encouraged to upgrade immediately, whereas in Eve if you can afford it you should in no way spend all of your isk on it, because you are then risking everything.
Getting out of the old spending habits other MMO's have drilled into us for decades is a hard process, and you can't make a tutorial for Risk vs. Reward because that balance can only be judged on an individual basis. Some people like to gamble big, some small. Wait, CCP kills kittens now too?!-á - Freyya
Are you a forum alt? Have you ever wondered why your experience on the forums is always so frustrating and unrewarding? This may help. |
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Hello-There
569
|
Posted - 2014.06.16 14:15:00 -
[406] - Quote
afkalt wrote:
EVE has a chronic newbie retention problem and measures to help that can't be a bad thing.
To be 100% clear - I believe ganking should be unchanged, I just think that newbies should have it mentioned in the tutorial.
Does it? I thought a 50% retention beyond 1 month would be pretty good. I wonder what the retention is beyond 3 months, 6 months etc.
Agreed on turotial changes though, or some mentoring scheme where older players can offer help to newbs in a constructive way. |
Bohneik Itohn
Amarrian Salvage Gnomes and Associates
257
|
Posted - 2014.06.16 14:18:00 -
[407] - Quote
Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote:afkalt wrote:
EVE has a chronic newbie retention problem and measures to help that can't be a bad thing.
To be 100% clear - I believe ganking should be unchanged, I just think that newbies should have it mentioned in the tutorial.
Does it? I thought a 50% retention beyond 1 month would be pretty good. I wonder what the retention is beyond 3 months, 6 months etc. Agreed on turotial changes though, or some mentoring scheme where older players can offer help to newbs in a constructive way.
2 months: 10%. It's pretty damn awful, especially for a game with so much content that people 2, 3 or 6 months into the game are just scratching the surface and have no idea what they're saying no to when they unsubscribe. Wait, CCP kills kittens now too?!-á - Freyya
Are you a forum alt? Have you ever wondered why your experience on the forums is always so frustrating and unrewarding? This may help. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
7064
|
Posted - 2014.06.16 14:38:00 -
[408] - Quote
Bohneik Itohn wrote: 2 months: 10%. It's pretty damn awful, especially for a game with so much content that people 2, 3 or 6 months into the game are just scratching the surface and have no idea what they're saying no to when they unsubscribe.
You hit it on the head with your earlier post.
It's all the dumbass bad habits that other MMOs have drilled into people. That's the only reason why EVE is considered to have a high learning curve, for that matter. It's because everything else is so dumbed down and has no consequences whatsoever.
To someone that played Ultima Online, this isn't that bad. To someone that played TOR, or WoW, or God help them ESO? It's a nightmare. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Bohneik Itohn
Amarrian Salvage Gnomes and Associates
257
|
Posted - 2014.06.16 15:44:00 -
[409] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Bohneik Itohn wrote: 2 months: 10%. It's pretty damn awful, especially for a game with so much content that people 2, 3 or 6 months into the game are just scratching the surface and have no idea what they're saying no to when they unsubscribe.
You hit it on the head with your earlier post. It's all the dumbass bad habits that other MMOs have drilled into people. That's the only reason why EVE is considered to have a high learning curve, for that matter. It's because everything else is so dumbed down and has no consequences whatsoever. To someone that played Ultima Online, this isn't that bad. To someone that played TOR, or WoW, or God help them ESO? It's a nightmare.
First time I got ganked in UO and came back to find the parts of my butchered corpse scattered amongst the bushes with I was crushed, and UO suddenly became scary... Over the next few weeks I may have randomly attacked about a dozen people who I thought were acting suspicious.... Wait, CCP kills kittens now too?!-á - Freyya
Are you a forum alt? Have you ever wondered why your experience on the forums is always so frustrating and unrewarding? This may help. |
Tengu Grib
Normadiac Industrial And Security Solutions
168
|
Posted - 2014.06.16 16:05:00 -
[410] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Tengu Grib wrote:
Fair enough. There should be something that indicates to them that these things happen and you need to plan for them though.
Every time EVE is brought up in any other game it is generally followed by people ranting how we are the scum of the universe. On top of that you have widespread reviews, mainstream news, many EVE related sites. If new players don't know about what happens in EVE its their own fault for simply not looking before they jump.
Yeah I don't think I've once seen a news story about how awesome and nice some people are despite living in a world of violence, treachery and thievery. You're right, if they come in expecting a nice safe peaceful experience till they get used to the game, they are playing the wrong game. Tengu Grib > I agree. The distinct lack of quality spaceships makes RL the worst space sim ever. SolidX > i'm an alt IRL Guilty conscience? Buy a mining permit today. www.minerbumping.com |
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Tengu Grib
Normadiac Industrial And Security Solutions
168
|
Posted - 2014.06.16 16:18:00 -
[411] - Quote
Iain Cariaba wrote:Elegant Prose
This. That was well said.
Tengu Grib > I agree. The distinct lack of quality spaceships makes RL the worst space sim ever. SolidX > i'm an alt IRL Guilty conscience? Buy a mining permit today. www.minerbumping.com |
baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
11953
|
Posted - 2014.06.16 17:09:00 -
[412] - Quote
Tengu Grib wrote:
Yeah I don't think I've once seen a news story about how awesome and nice some people are despite living in a world of violence, treachery and thievery. You're right, if they come in expecting a nice safe peaceful experience till they get used to the game, they are playing the wrong game.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/8132547.stm This is a good one. Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship |
Tengu Grib
Normadiac Industrial And Security Solutions
168
|
Posted - 2014.06.16 17:22:00 -
[413] - Quote
"The game revolves around trade, mining asteroids and the efforts of different player-controlled corporations to take control of swathes of virtual space."
This doesn't really help matters. : / In Eve you're either a miner, a trader or you're involved in Sov warfare. Um, no.
But overall, yes, news stories like that should really prepare people for what they are getting into. It's a game were you fly spaceships, and there is violence. Lots of violence. Tengu Grib > I agree. The distinct lack of quality spaceships makes RL the worst space sim ever. SolidX > i'm an alt IRL Guilty conscience? Buy a mining permit today. www.minerbumping.com |
baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
11953
|
Posted - 2014.06.16 17:32:00 -
[414] - Quote
Tengu Grib wrote:"The game revolves around trade, mining asteroids and the efforts of different player-controlled corporations to take control of swathes of virtual space." This doesn't really help matters. : / In Eve you're either a miner, a trader or you're involved in Sov warfare. Um, no. But overall, yes, news stories like that should really prepare people for what they are getting into. It's a game were you fly spaceships, and there is violence. Lots of violence.
The story is about someone stealing billions, which kinda gives away the fact the EVE is not like other games.
Simple fact here is that no matter what you do to the tutorials you will not get most people to stay. This game isn't for most people, its for the minority. Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship |
Daichi Yamato
Xero Security and Technologies
1689
|
Posted - 2014.06.16 17:49:00 -
[415] - Quote
Bohneik Itohn wrote:Over the next few weeks I may have randomly attacked about a dozen people who I thought were acting suspicious....
Doing it right EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY?No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided""So it will be up to a pilot to remain vigilant wherever they may be flying and be ready for anything at any time" |
Kaerakh
Surprisingly Deep Hole
309
|
Posted - 2014.06.16 18:05:00 -
[416] - Quote
afkalt wrote:
To be 100% clear - I believe ganking should be unchanged, I just think that newbies should have it mentioned in the tutorial.
I completely agree. I think it's unrealistic to expect a new player to research external documents(outside of the game client) to receive answers about the game in their initial foray into to New Eden. The tutorial is the best way to inform them that this is a world where you're expected to HTFU, anyone out there will club you over the head and take your stuff if given the chance, and that you need to take precautions accordingly. Aside from that, there's really nothing else to convey to the player. Schrodinger's Hot Dropper |
Tengu Grib
Normadiac Industrial And Security Solutions
168
|
Posted - 2014.06.16 18:06:00 -
[417] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:The story is about someone stealing billions, which kinda gives away the fact the EVE is not like other games.
Simple fact here is that no matter what you do to the tutorials you will not get most people to stay. This game isn't for most people, its for the minority.
I fully agree with you. It's the reason I'm still around. I used to try and convince my friends to play it, but now I'm comfortable knowing that not everyone can enjoy Eve's glories. (and love it despite it's flaws.)
Tengu Grib > I agree. The distinct lack of quality spaceships makes RL the worst space sim ever. SolidX > i'm an alt IRL Guilty conscience? Buy a mining permit today. www.minerbumping.com |
Gabriel Dube
Notorious Legion
9
|
Posted - 2014.06.16 18:18:00 -
[418] - Quote
Olivia Berett wrote:Every thread about crime&punishment in hisec can be answered with one simple idea, think about it:
EVE online has a feature designed exactly to allow people to bring unwanted heat over other people in hisec. A tool that only serves to be used as means to allow people not be able to escape sucessfully any form of combat, and it is almost everytime used to the sole intention of harassing non threatening people: wardec.
You really think that the ppl who designed the wardec feature want anything else in eve than a sociopathic environment ?
There is no reason beyond that scope for a civilized empire to allow people fight off their grudges under their most secure systems, the same systems with innocent and non combative ppl that still can also be victms of that just cuz they are trying to build a corporation.
No mechanics will make ganking less of a general douchebaggery unpunished while those mechanics still based on a douchebaggery inviting philosophy.
You speak the truth, but with the wrong words. Douchebag is not a synonym for sociopath.
It's entirely possible to endulge in the wanton ransom or destruction of spacefaring cargo vessels and still be a gentleman about it. |
Tengu Grib
Normadiac Industrial And Security Solutions
168
|
Posted - 2014.06.16 18:23:00 -
[419] - Quote
Gabriel Dube wrote:You speak the truth, but with the wrong words. Douchebag is not a synonym for sociopath.
It's entirely possible to endulge in the wanton ransom or destruction of spacefaring cargo vessels and still be a gentleman about it.
Indeed. Even when I'm being a jerk, I am nothing if not polite. Tengu Grib > I agree. The distinct lack of quality spaceships makes RL the worst space sim ever. SolidX > i'm an alt IRL Guilty conscience? Buy a mining permit today. www.minerbumping.com |
Dig Mangeiri
3
|
Posted - 2014.06.19 03:32:00 -
[420] - Quote
There is no punishment and there never will be. You have to understand EVE is not an "experiment of humanity," since no one dies in the game. In the real world you steal from me I beat you physically and you are done. In EVE everything is anonymous and hidden and you never lose anything if you're a simple "ganker." I shouldn't say that literally, you might lose five minutes of in game currency if you spend a good bit, but I am sure you get the point.
Realize also that this will never change because the destruction of expensive ships is a huge part of what keeps this game profitable to the company. If you didn't lose ships in high sec you could actually choose to NEVER lose any ships, and no one would pay $ for PLEX. Sure, sure, everyone talks about ISK per hour mining, missioning, ganking, or trading they earn and yadda yadda but the truth is PLEX is the money making process.
Ganking keeps this company alive, like it or not. Just get a third party bot to mine for you and buy PLEX with in game currency, THAT is the only real statement you can make to the company short of quitting. |
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