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CALDARI CITIZEN 14330909
The Conference Elite CODE.
418
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Posted - 2014.09.18 13:11:00 -
[121] - Quote
I thought I was in a Bonus Room last night. But then I realized it was just a chamber of secrets. The Artist Formerly Known As AC.-á The-áterminal end of the digestive system.-á |
Anal Canal
The Conference Elite CODE.
428
|
Posted - 2014.09.18 13:11:00 -
[122] - Quote
I thought I was in a Bonus Room last night. But then I realized it was just a chamber of secrets. The Artist Formerly Known As AC.-á The-áterminal end of the digestive system.-á |
Sibyyl
Gallente Federation
14238
|
Posted - 2014.09.18 15:48:00 -
[123] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote:
If someone violates your civil rights and you do not prosecute them legally , that does nto exclude my rights to prosecute that person legally when later he/she violate my own rights.
When you are doing something wrong, the fact taht other people in past did not care is not a license that makes it suddenly less wrong on future instances.
Read this again.
There is a difference between being wronged and being offended for somebody else who doesn't want you white knighting them.
Your statement doesn't reflect anything that actually happened.
I'm sorry Peps ~ And when the seasons change, will you stand by me? ~ |
Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness
1639
|
Posted - 2014.09.19 09:55:00 -
[124] - Quote
Sibyyl wrote:Kagura Nikon wrote:
If someone violates your civil rights and you do not prosecute them legally , that does nto exclude my rights to prosecute that person legally when later he/she violate my own rights.
When you are doing something wrong, the fact taht other people in past did not care is not a license that makes it suddenly less wrong on future instances.
Read this again.There is a difference between being wronged and being offended for somebody else who doesn't want you white knighting them. Your statement doesn't reflect anything that actually happened.
The definition of civil rights change from culture to culture. Where I live, the recordings of that event, and Yes I heard a good bit of it, not all but enough, would be enough for you to get legal prosecution if the other part was living in the same country. Blackmailing someone into an humiliation is specifically stated as violation of civil rights were I live. So some people WILL get offended and will demand what they see as justice. The world is not a tiny sphere where everybody think the same.
If you are wise you shall be extra careful when dealing with people from other cultures because their definition of OK might not be the same as yours. "If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!" |
Mike Adoulin
Adolescent Radioactive Pirate Hamsters
872
|
Posted - 2014.09.19 12:26:00 -
[125] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote:stupid garbage
No one cares.
As for where you live, no one cares.
tldr no one cares
Everything in EVE is a trap. And if it isn't, it's your job to make it a trap...:) You want to know what immorality in EVE Online looks like? Look no further than Ripard "Jester" Teg.
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Haedonism Bot
Revolutionary Front
1378
|
Posted - 2014.09.19 12:48:00 -
[126] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote: The definition of civil rights change from culture to culture. Where I live, the recordings of that event, and Yes I heard a good bit of it, not all but enough, would be enough for you to get legal prosecution if the other part was living in the same country. Blackmailing someone into an humiliation is specifically stated as violation of civil rights were I live. So some people WILL get offended and will demand what they see as justice. The world is not a tiny sphere where everybody think the same.
If you are wise you shall be extra careful when dealing with people from other cultures because their definition of OK might not be the same as yours.
I don't think that anything that happened in the bonus room would qualify as blackmail in any court of law in any country except perhaps for a country like Cameroon, where you can simply pay the judge for the verdict you want. Blackmail generally only is considered to have occurred in situations where the people involved know each other's identities and where more is at stake than imaginary video game property and virtual bragging rights in anonymous internet chat rooms.
I accept the possibility that there may be some oddball country in the world where this situation may have violated some law. There are a lot of countries in the world, after all, and some of them have legal codes which seem bizarre to those of us who love in North America or Europe. However, you can't really consult the laws of every country on earth before you open your mouth on your private TS server or an EVE Online chat channel, nor should you.
The point being - whatever you may think of the practice of bonusrooming, or of any bonus room in particular, the argument that it is illegal is a huge stretch from reality. You may not like it, CCP obviously doesn't like it, but that doesn't make it a literal crime. www.everevolutionaryfront.blogspot.com
Psychotic Monk for CSM9 |
Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
58
|
Posted - 2014.09.19 13:09:00 -
[127] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote: The definition of civil rights change from culture to culture. Where I live, the recordings of that event, and Yes I heard a good bit of it, not all but enough, would be enough for you to get legal prosecution if the other part was living in the same country. Blackmailing someone into an humiliation is specifically stated as violation of civil rights were I live. So some people WILL get offended and will demand what they see as justice. The world is not a tiny sphere where everybody think the same.
If you are wise you shall be extra careful when dealing with people from other cultures because their definition of OK might not be the same as yours.
I have no idea where you live, but I can comfortably say that asking a person to sing songs and read from Wikipedia or the minerbumping web site is not going to result in "legal prosecution" anywhere in the free world, especially when the "victim" is on record as saying he did not feel harassed or tortured.
Further, if such a place exists, there is no onus on me to be "extra careful" because some tiny jurisdiction I have never heard of or visited decides something is a crime - I only should be reasonably required to understand the laws of where I live, and perhaps Iceland in this case. It would be crazy to expect me to know all the laws of every place on the planet, much like it is crazy for CCP to expect everyone to magically know what their definition of "real-life harassment" is without telling us. |
Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness
1642
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Posted - 2014.09.19 14:50:00 -
[128] - Quote
Black Pedro wrote:Kagura Nikon wrote: The definition of civil rights change from culture to culture. Where I live, the recordings of that event, and Yes I heard a good bit of it, not all but enough, would be enough for you to get legal prosecution if the other part was living in the same country. Blackmailing someone into an humiliation is specifically stated as violation of civil rights were I live. So some people WILL get offended and will demand what they see as justice. The world is not a tiny sphere where everybody think the same.
If you are wise you shall be extra careful when dealing with people from other cultures because their definition of OK might not be the same as yours.
I have no idea where you live, but I can comfortably say that asking a person to sing songs and read from Wikipedia or the minerbumping web site is not going to result in "legal prosecution" anywhere in the free world, especially when the "victim" is on record as saying he did not feel harassed or tortured. Further, if such a place exists, there is no onus on me to be "extra careful" because some tiny jurisdiction I have never heard of or visited decides something is a crime - I only should be reasonably required to understand the laws of where I live, and perhaps Iceland in this case. It would be crazy to expect me to know all the laws of every place on the planet, much like it is crazy for CCP to expect everyone to magically know what their definition of "real-life harassment" is without telling us.
you are VERY mistaken. There is similar cases (not on games, but on social networks) that were went to court here and the offending part was forced to pay restitution. In some countries humiliation is considered as damaging as physical damage. "If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!" |
Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
59
|
Posted - 2014.09.19 15:55:00 -
[129] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote: you are VERY mistaken. There is similar cases (not on games, but on social networks) that were went to court here and the offending part was forced to pay restitution. In some countries humiliation is considered as damaging as physical damage.
I am pretty sure I am not. I never said that there weren't harassment laws on the books of many countries. What I am saying is that there is no country where you would face legal prosecution for asking an adult to do silly things on an internet group chat for in-game virtual items, where the "victim" says he did not feel bullied, harassed, tortured or blackmailed, and where the "victim's" real identity remains anonymous.
There is no criminal prosecutor that would pursue a case with those facts by choice anywhere on the planet, presumably including the jurisdiction in which you live. |
La Rynx
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
63
|
Posted - 2014.09.20 09:48:00 -
[130] - Quote
Sibyyl wrote: I think a lot of people didn't actually listen to the whole recording and instead went with Ripard's abbreviated take on the matter.
Of course want want to think this. But you have no prove that this is true. I petitioned it before Ripard mentioned it on his blog and a lot of people that usually dont care for the forums, came and asked for actions of CCP.
That sokhar says he wasn't tortured, may be. Still the audio exists and proofs, that he was humiliated over and over. I do not say this was the "silent majority" but still more people were upset over that, than people where OK, with it.
The "Ripard" case is some propaganda that what made up, to project the "guilt" to someone else than e1. E1 was hit by the ban-hammer and is gone for good. Not many people are crying after him.
However, that still does not change anything for the OP. Falling for this "bonus room" is quite stupid and shows that one throws all caution and common sense over board cause of greed. I do not expect a special warning of this bonus room, since there are times, when all inner alert bells have to ring on 1000 dezibel. If the "friend" can not proof that he was humiliated, there is no chance ever for actions of CCP.
It does not matter what some griefers whined a short time ago, CCP does NOT swing the ban-hammer lightly.
Your friend has to HTFU. Forum Main |
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La Rynx
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
63
|
Posted - 2014.09.20 09:53:00 -
[131] - Quote
Black Pedro wrote:I am pretty sure I am not. I never said that there weren't harassment laws on the books of many countries. What I am saying is that there is no country
German Grundgesetz
Quote:Die W++rde des Menschen ist unantastbar. Sie zu achten und zu sch++tzen ist Verpflichtung aller staatlichen Gewalt.
Quote:The dignity of man is inviolable. To respect and protect it shall be the duty of all public authority.
Artikel 1 des Grundgesetzes f++r die Bundesrepublik Deutschland
Its not even "some law whatever", its the very first Articel of the the German GG / the german constitution. Put this Audio on Radio or TV and you will see.
Everything will be on account, even the decission that the victime came into the his own will, but that will not set the perpetraitors free of guilt.
All democratic countries will have laws against harrasment, since you could harras anyone to give you all his stuff. Effecting psychological stress and hurt on people is profen, to have similar effect to physical pain. Reason enough not to humiliate strangers on the internet. Forum Main |
La Rynx
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
63
|
Posted - 2014.09.20 11:13:00 -
[132] - Quote
Haedonism Bot wrote: I don't think that anything that happened in the bonus room would qualify as blackmail in any court of law in any country ...SNIP... The point being - whatever you may think of the practice of bonusrooming, or of any bonus room in particular, the argument that it is illegal is a huge stretch from reality. You may not like it, CCP obviously doesn't like it, but that doesn't make it a literal crime.
The point is, that you are wrong.
The "bonus room" was not the problem, it was the continuing humiliation in public. For that you can get sued. It has not happend YET, but that can change faster then you think. Forum Main |
Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
59
|
Posted - 2014.09.20 11:52:00 -
[133] - Quote
La Rynx wrote:Haedonism Bot wrote: I don't think that anything that happened in the bonus room would qualify as blackmail in any court of law in any country ...SNIP... The point being - whatever you may think of the practice of bonusrooming, or of any bonus room in particular, the argument that it is illegal is a huge stretch from reality. You may not like it, CCP obviously doesn't like it, but that doesn't make it a literal crime.
The point is, that you are wrong. The "bonus room" was not the problem, it was the continuing humiliation in public. For that you can get sued. It has not happend YET, but that can change faster then you think.
Again, yes, there are harassment laws on the books in many countries. And again, the facts around the Sokhar bonus room would not qualify as criminal harassment in any of these countries (including Germany), most evidently because he says he didn't feel harassed. So no, we are not wrong.
I am confused, what is "the continuing humiliation in public" you are referring to? There is a single bonus room recording with Sokhar that was released after the event and as far as I am aware, Sokhar and the Bonus Room participants never interacted directly again. Are you claiming that Erotica 1 is somehow responsible for the all the attention Ripard Teg brought to the situation months after the recording was released, barely noticed, and then forgotten by the public? It seem to me by your definition it is Ripard Teg who should be sued for "continuing humiliation in public" by exposing the Sokhar recording to thousands of his blog readers after it had been forgotten.
Your scaremongering is also not helpful. You, like CCP, unreasonably seem to think people should be responsible for predicting future changes in policy or law by the authorities. That is not a healthy way to live your life or to run your game.
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Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
9857
|
Posted - 2014.09.20 11:55:00 -
[134] - Quote
La Rynx wrote: The "bonus room" was not the problem, it was the continuing humiliation in public.
It was not by any stretch of the imagination public until Riptard tried to exploit it to further his carebear agenda.
Quote: For that you can get sued.
No, you can't.
If you think I'm wrong, try it. Go find a law firm and tell them you want to sue a business in a different country because someone stole your video game money, tricked you into singing a Disney song, and laughed at you while you raged out and spewed hateful offensive language.
You won't have to tell me that you tried, by the way, I'll be able to hear the laughter from here. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs. |
La Rynx
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
63
|
Posted - 2014.09.20 12:32:00 -
[135] - Quote
Black Pedro wrote: I am confused, what is "the continuing humiliation in public" you are referring to? There is a single bonus room recording with Sokhar that was released after the event and as far as I am aware, Sokhar and the Bonus Room participants never interacted directly again.
The continuing haarasment in that recording.
Forum Main |
La Rynx
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
63
|
Posted - 2014.09.20 12:40:00 -
[136] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:La Rynx wrote: The "bonus room" was not the problem, it was the continuing humiliation in public.
It was not by any stretch of the imagination public until Riptard tried to exploit it to further his carebear agenda. The code was posted on a website called minerbuming.com which can reached by anyone who wants to. Not much imagination needed, thats public.
Quote: If you think I'm wrong, try it. Go find a law firm and tell them you want to sue a business in a different country because someone stole your video game money, tricked you into singing a Disney song, and laughed at you while you raged out and spewed hateful offensive language.
You won't have to tell me that you tried, by the way, I'll be able to hear the laughter from here.
Now what? Now it can not be sued, because its in a different country. This is not the same, as "it can not be sued".
Whining over Ripard Tek is what you do, when the problem was the bonus room and those guys who where so "smart" posting it on their webseite. Your denial fo common sense will not help you. You just hop excuses. What happened, why it happend, what was taken, it was all properly discussed. Dont come with comparisons, when the original case is good enough.
But everything that guys like you have in common is, that you want to scale down the case into "it was not so bad", "others did worse" , "the so called victim was racist" and more. Forum Main |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
9860
|
Posted - 2014.09.20 13:44:00 -
[137] - Quote
La Rynx wrote: Now it can not be sued, because its in a different country. This is not the same, as "it can not be sued".
And that's not what I said. You have a big problem with making things up.
The entire premise is laughable, by pretty much any measure. Attempting to do so internationally is an equal part of that.
Quote: But everything that guys like you have in common is, that you want to scale down the case into "it was not so bad", "others did worse" , "the so called victim was racist", "it was not a problem until Ripard Tek made it one..." and more.
Oh, so racist epithets and real life threats are ok with you, then? Or is only if the person is mad about losing their pixels first? "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs. |
La Rynx
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
63
|
Posted - 2014.09.20 17:01:00 -
[138] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:La Rynx wrote: Now it can not be sued, because its in a different country. This is not the same, as "it can not be sued".
And that's not what I said. You have a big problem with making things up.
No, not really.
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:The entire premise is laughable, by pretty much any measure. Attempting to do so internationally is an equal part of that. Quote: But everything that guys like you have in common is, that you want to scale down the case into "it was not so bad", "others did worse" , "the so called victim was racist", "it was not a problem until Ripard Tek made it one..." and more.
Oh, so racist epithets and real life threats are ok with you, then? Or is only if the person is mad about losing their pixels first?
Just remember: Case closed erotica1 ban-hammered! End of Story.
"racist epithets" are not OK, but still this guy was *heavily* provoked and with that has one valid explanation.
This "international" stuff works in favor for e1 and his roomies, since it is hard to sue people over country borders. There are countries where you can have law suits AND there already have been suits over virtual worlds. This are not video game pixels, this are MMO pixels , a whole different level. Oh and drop this "pixel" nonsense, its all DATABASE stuff.
Forum Main |
Himnos Altar
An Errant Venture
456
|
Posted - 2014.09.20 17:22:00 -
[139] - Quote
BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie wrote:De'Veldrin wrote:How did they get him to lose skill points and hack the game so Concord will kill him based on his sec status?
I'm starting to think your "friend" isn't the only idiot here. I'm thinking our OP doesn't know what "Faction Police" are.
Huh.For some reason I read that as "Fashion" Police.
heh. |
Moonlit Raid
State War Academy Caldari State
204
|
Posted - 2014.09.20 18:25:00 -
[140] - Quote
I can't be the only one who hasn't a clue what the "bonus room" scam is. Anyone care to enlighten me? If brute force isn't working, you're just not using enough. |
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Herr Wilkus
Aggressive Salvage Services LLC
1163
|
Posted - 2014.09.25 05:40:00 -
[141] - Quote
This thread smells like......victory. |
RomeStar
Brave Newbies Inc. Brave Collective
527
|
Posted - 2014.09.26 19:58:00 -
[142] - Quote
If your truly his friend you want to help out a new bro then give him all your stuff lesson learned.......Bro Signatured removed, CCP Phantom |
Gallowmere Rorschach
Enlightened Industries Goonswarm Federation
784
|
Posted - 2014.09.27 03:59:00 -
[143] - Quote
La Rynx wrote: Just remember: Case closed erotica1 ban-hammered! End of Story.
I almost wish that people who stick to this kind of mindless line-toeing would catch the banhammer for some arbitrary crap that was perfectly legitimate yesterday...almost. In all reality, I wish CCP would stop with arbitrary enforcement of grey rules.
La Rynx wrote: "racist epithets" are not OK, but still this guy was *heavily* provoked and with that has one valid explanation.
Note to self: minorities should be more understanding if I call them racial slurs when they provoke me heavily...like cutting me off in traffic and then giving me the finger.
La Rynx wrote: This "international" stuff works in favor for e1 and his roomies, since it is hard to sue people over country borders. There are countries where you can have law suits AND there already have been suits over virtual worlds. This are not video game pixels, this are MMO pixels , a whole different level. Oh and drop this "pixel" nonsense, its all DATABASE stuff.
Yeah, and I can sue you for calling me a pompous doodyhead. That doesn't mean that I'll win, as opposed to being laughed out of court.
La Rynx wrote: Why did this guy make "racist epithets"? For what reasons where they made? Answer: they where meant to hurt! So: This guy was emotinaly so hurt, that he tried to hurt back.
See my response to quote two. |
Mike Adoulin
Adolescent Radioactive Pirate Hamsters
890
|
Posted - 2014.09.27 12:42:00 -
[144] - Quote
Moonlit Raid wrote:I can't be the only one who hasn't a clue what the "bonus room" scam is. Anyone care to enlighten me?
Its where you get the mark (aka, victim aka 'contestant'...) to give away all his stuff because he thinks he's playing a 'game show' style game on Teamspeak/Mumble/etc in the hopes that he will win A Grand Prize (some ungodly amount of ISK).
At some point the 'contestant' either breaks a 'rule' or realizes that it is, indeed, a scam, and he has lost most if not all his stuffs.
Some actually lost Skill Points by getting podded in Alpha clones voluntarily.
Anyway, net result is usually tears, rage, and various racial slurs, plus IRL death threats.
You are welcome.
Everything in EVE is a trap. And if it isn't, it's your job to make it a trap...:) You want to know what immorality in EVE Online looks like? Look no further than Ripard "Jester" Teg.
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Steppa Musana
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
149
|
Posted - 2014.09.27 19:08:00 -
[145] - Quote
Gallowmere Rorschach wrote: Note to self: minorities should be more understanding if I call them racial slurs when they provoke me heavily...like cutting me off in traffic and then giving me the finger.
Your alliance promotes calling them racial slurs when they don't provoke you at all, just some food for thought.
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Moonlit Raid
State War Academy Caldari State
204
|
Posted - 2014.09.28 15:29:00 -
[146] - Quote
Mike Adoulin wrote:Moonlit Raid wrote:I can't be the only one who hasn't a clue what the "bonus room" scam is. Anyone care to enlighten me? Its where you get the mark (aka, victim aka 'contestant'...) to give away all his stuff because he thinks he's playing a 'game show' style game on Teamspeak/Mumble/etc in the hopes that he will win A Grand Prize (some ungodly amount of ISK). At some point the 'contestant' either breaks a 'rule' or realizes that it is, indeed, a scam, and he has lost most if not all his stuffs. Some actually lost Skill Points by getting podded in Alpha clones voluntarily. Anyway, net result is usually tears, rage, and various racial slurs, plus IRL death threats. You are welcome. Sounds like something I'd never be so stupid as to fall for. If brute force isn't working, you're just not using enough. |
Mallak Azaria
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
6256
|
Posted - 2014.09.28 16:59:00 -
[147] - Quote
Moonlit Raid wrote:Mike Adoulin wrote:Moonlit Raid wrote:I can't be the only one who hasn't a clue what the "bonus room" scam is. Anyone care to enlighten me? Its where you get the mark (aka, victim aka 'contestant'...) to give away all his stuff because he thinks he's playing a 'game show' style game on Teamspeak/Mumble/etc in the hopes that he will win A Grand Prize (some ungodly amount of ISK). At some point the 'contestant' either breaks a 'rule' or realizes that it is, indeed, a scam, and he has lost most if not all his stuffs. Some actually lost Skill Points by getting podded in Alpha clones voluntarily. Anyway, net result is usually tears, rage, and various racial slurs, plus IRL death threats. You are welcome. Sounds like something I'd never be so stupid as to fall for.
Yeah but for every person like you, there's 10 more that will give their money away because they're greedy. This post was lovingly crafted by a member of the Goonwaffe Posting Cabal, proud member of the popular gay hookup site somethingawful.com, Spelling Bee, Grammar Gestapo & #1 Official Gevlon Goblin Fanclub member.
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Tengu Grib
Happy Fun times
427
|
Posted - 2014.09.28 20:08:00 -
[148] - Quote
Logan PewPew wrote:EvE is like PvP+ Even your own corp-mates (to an extent) are playing against you. Trust is a seriously rare commodity. If you don't know the address/phone number of someone you play with then you better use caution when interacting with them. God won't help you his KB is terrible. I learned recently that even being RL friends with someone apparently doesn't mean you can trust them. Go figure. Tengu Grib> I read that as "Suddenly Noobships" and it made me want to hot drop someone with noobships. Buhhdust Princess> You have set us a challenge..We will try and do it!!!!!!!!!!! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GEeBnYi5bG0&feature=youtu.be |
Tengu Grib
Happy Fun times
427
|
Posted - 2014.09.28 20:57:00 -
[149] - Quote
Charax Bouclier wrote:Oh man. I just listened to the last part of that bonus room soundboard. XD
I am not surprised that some of them were Canadian. All this "please" and " thank you" stuff we do everyday IRL takes its toll and we tend to let off our steam on the internet. See a nasty/evil troll? Good chance he's Canadian!
It's like that episode on the Simpsons where Ned Flanders finally loses his cool after his politeness was taken advantage.
Summary: excessive "please" and "thank yous" comes with a grave, subsequent cost. Case in point: I may or may not be Canadian. Tengu Grib> I read that as "Suddenly Noobships" and it made me want to hot drop someone with noobships. Buhhdust Princess> You have set us a challenge..We will try and do it!!!!!!!!!!! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GEeBnYi5bG0&feature=youtu.be |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
9921
|
Posted - 2014.09.28 22:59:00 -
[150] - Quote
La Rynx wrote: So: This guy was emotinaly so hurt, that he tried to hurt back.
Looks like I got my answer, then.
Death threats and racist epithets *are* ok to La Rynx so long as someone lost their pixels.
Well, you know what category you go in now. (irredeemable scumbag, btw) "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs. |
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