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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 25 post(s) |
Ramona McCandless
The McCandless Clan
5987
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Posted - 2014.07.07 15:50:00 -
[2131] - Quote
Tippia wrote: The simple fact is: there is no gank epidemic. It's a myth. A lie. A complete non-issue that only exists because people are stupid and/or don't take precautions...... All the precautions you scoff at work. They have worked for years and they work now. The reason we know they work is because they don't show up on the killboards in any volume and because ganking is ridiculously low as it becomes harder and harder to gank, requiring the gankers to pick easer and easier targets in order to actually by successful.
This. A thousand times this in letters ten feet tall all around the Governor's Palace.
I KNOW this is true because I have alts and friends and slaves who all "carebear".
And they haven't lost a ship in MONTHS
Why?
Because they DONT make themselves VICTIMS
They aren't cows and sheep
They are elephants and hippos and anklyosaurs "Many have joined the battle, many have survived the tests and trials, but countless have fallen because they weren't the sharpest, the fastest thinking, the most devious, the most ruthless or most intelligent. -áLog in and Compete!"-á- CCP Falcon
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Kal Murmur
Lazortits
0
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Posted - 2014.07.07 15:51:00 -
[2132] - Quote
Ramona McCandless wrote:Yup, RPing is clearly not to be tolerated in an MMORPG
Personally I think it should be an executable offense, but hey ho.
Ramona McCandless wrote:Two factors;
1) Because "a load of low skill plebs" continously are able to think around the difficulties (or lack of them) presented by the terrible CONCORD mechanics.
No, a couple of people find the way around the obstacles and then a load of low skill plebs copy them.
Ramona McCandless wrote:Either way, neither are evidence of your "ganking epidemic". Its pretty telling that you need these things explained to you.
Please go and check zkillboard as suggested above, and then come back and admit that suicide ganking has absolutely exploded in popularity over the last 2-3 years. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
22957
|
Posted - 2014.07.07 15:54:00 -
[2133] - Quote
Kal Murmur wrote:Please go and check zkillboard as suggested above, and then come back and admit that suicide ganking has absolutely exploded in popularity over the last 2-3 years. Suicide ganking has been absolutely imploded over the last 2GÇô3 years. Some systems that saw multiple specific ganks daily now see as many kills in a month.
Explosions tend to go in the opposite direction. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skillplan 2.2. |
Ramona McCandless
The McCandless Clan
5987
|
Posted - 2014.07.07 15:57:00 -
[2134] - Quote
Kal Murmur wrote:Ramona McCandless wrote:Yup, RPing is clearly not to be tolerated in an MMORPG Personally I think it should be an executable offense, but hey ho.
So....
You'd be happier then if the game was the "Number Increasing Slowly Game" where a counter which once represented ore clicks up and then that changes into another number, which once represented Isk.
Because I hate to break it to you sister, your spaceship isnt real
And you are RPing a miner, you dont actually go to space.
So execute yourself for it while you decry everyone else who actual plays a game according to its rules and genre. "Many have joined the battle, many have survived the tests and trials, but countless have fallen because they weren't the sharpest, the fastest thinking, the most devious, the most ruthless or most intelligent. -áLog in and Compete!"-á- CCP Falcon
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Kal Murmur
Lazortits
0
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Posted - 2014.07.07 15:58:00 -
[2135] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Kal Murmur wrote:Please go and check zkillboard as suggested above, and then come back and admit that suicide ganking has absolutely exploded in popularity over the last 2-3 years. Suicide ganking has been absolutely imploded over the last 2GÇô3 years. Some systems that saw multiple specific ganks daily now see as many kills in a month. Explosions tend to go in the opposite direction.
Go zkillboard, search CONCORD, stats tab, monthly history.
Watch in wonder at the numbers that suddenly rocket upwards in the last 2-3 years. Then come back and tell me about the rise in ganking being a myth.
For example:
June 2014 - 23,323 kills June 2013 -15,715 kills June 2012 - 7,725 kills June 2011 - 1,751 kills June 2010 - 1,078 kills June 2009 - 596 kills
Yeah, a real implosion we're seeing there.
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
22958
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Posted - 2014.07.07 16:03:00 -
[2136] - Quote
Kal Murmur wrote:Go zkillboard, search CONCORD, stats tab, monthly history.
Watch in wonder at the numbers that suddenly rocket upwards in the last 2-3 years. Then come back and tell me about the rise in ganking being a myth. The rise in ganking is a myth, and your chosen method demonstrates this with ample clarity.
What you're seeing is people being forced into using more and more small ships as it becomes more and more difficult to get a kill. Oh, and if you think for a second that only 1750 ganks were attempted in 2012, you need to have your head examined, so that shows how much the data is worthGǪ GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skillplan 2.2. |
Benny Ohu
Chaotic Tranquility
3546
|
Posted - 2014.07.07 16:03:00 -
[2137] - Quote
Antihrist Pripravnik wrote:Quote:please demonstrate the rise of deaths by suicide gank. i'll accept data sourced from zkill or eve-kill. Linking killboards is prohibited on General Discussion, but you are free to go to zkillboard and enter "CONCORD" in the search bar, then click on "Stats" tab and scroll down to monthly history. I'm not picking a side in this argument and I'm not saying that I'm on the same page as your quoted player, but some things are just too obvious and information is freely available. i did not ask her to link to a killboard. please read more carefully.
Ramona McCandless wrote:They are elephants and hippos and anklyosaurs please do not make up creatures
elephants are ridiculous and obviously not real |
Benny Ohu
Chaotic Tranquility
3546
|
Posted - 2014.07.07 16:05:00 -
[2138] - Quote
wait, ankylosaurs are real? i thought you were making up the name of a creature for a joke |
Kal Murmur
Lazortits
0
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Posted - 2014.07.07 16:06:00 -
[2139] - Quote
Tippia wrote:What you're seeing is people being forced into using more and more small ships as it becomes more and more difficult to get a kill. Oh, and if you think for a second that only 1750 ganks were attempted in 2012, you need to have your head examined, so that shows how much the data is worthGǪ
Ah so we've moved from 'Show me the data!' to 'The data is obviously wrong!'. Ok then.. |
Ramona McCandless
The McCandless Clan
5990
|
Posted - 2014.07.07 16:06:00 -
[2140] - Quote
Benny Ohu wrote:Ramona McCandless wrote:They are elephants and hippos and anklyosaurs please do not make up creatures elephants are ridiculous and obviously not real
Sorry, that should have read "heffalumps" "Many have joined the battle, many have survived the tests and trials, but countless have fallen because they weren't the sharpest, the fastest thinking, the most devious, the most ruthless or most intelligent. -áLog in and Compete!"-á- CCP Falcon
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Ramona McCandless
The McCandless Clan
5990
|
Posted - 2014.07.07 16:07:00 -
[2141] - Quote
Yahbro, an Ankylosaur will mess you up funtime
They had armour tanking sorted millions of years before a Nano was ever dreamed of "Many have joined the battle, many have survived the tests and trials, but countless have fallen because they weren't the sharpest, the fastest thinking, the most devious, the most ruthless or most intelligent. -áLog in and Compete!"-á- CCP Falcon
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Ramona McCandless
The McCandless Clan
5990
|
Posted - 2014.07.07 16:08:00 -
[2142] - Quote
Kal Murmur wrote:Tippia wrote:What you're seeing is people being forced into using more and more small ships as it becomes more and more difficult to get a kill. Oh, and if you think for a second that only 1750 ganks were attempted in 2012, you need to have your head examined, so that shows how much the data is worthGǪ Ah so we've moved from 'Show me the data!' to 'The data is obviously wrong!'. Ok then..
You dont do much statistical analysis in life. Ok then.... "Many have joined the battle, many have survived the tests and trials, but countless have fallen because they weren't the sharpest, the fastest thinking, the most devious, the most ruthless or most intelligent. -áLog in and Compete!"-á- CCP Falcon
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Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
7643
|
Posted - 2014.07.07 16:09:00 -
[2143] - Quote
Kal Murmur wrote:For example: June 2014 - 23,323 kills June 2013 -15,715 kills June 2012 - 7,725 kills June 2011 - 1,751 kills June 2010 - 1,078 kills June 2009 - 596 kills Yeah, a real implosion we're seeing there.
Is it hard to be that obtuse? Or do you just suck at deductive reasoning?
People use more smaller ships BECAUSE ganking has been nerfed. More smaller ships = more CONCORD kills. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Clean Up Local 2014.-á |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
7643
|
Posted - 2014.07.07 16:10:00 -
[2144] - Quote
Kal Murmur wrote:Tippia wrote:What you're seeing is people being forced into using more and more small ships as it becomes more and more difficult to get a kill. Oh, and if you think for a second that only 1750 ganks were attempted in 2012, you need to have your head examined, so that shows how much the data is worthGǪ Ah so we've moved from 'Show me the data!' to 'The data is obviously wrong!'. Ok then..
No, it's cherrypicked and deliberately misleading. When asked to provide proof, you instead tried to rig the numbers. This shows beyond doubt that you have no proof. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Clean Up Local 2014.-á |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
22960
|
Posted - 2014.07.07 16:11:00 -
[2145] - Quote
Kal Murmur wrote:Ah so we've moved from 'Show me the data!' to 'The data is obviously wrong!'. Ok then.. No. We've moved from Gǣlearn to interpret the dataGǥ to GǣGǪalso, make sure you understand the gaps in the dataGǥ.
Again, if you think that 2012 shows 1,751 losses to CONCORD because (at most) 1,751 ganks happened in that year GÇö i.e. less than 5 in a day GÇö rather than because a) other killboards were in use, b) people didn't post CONCORD losses on their boards, c) ganks required fewer ships, d) all of the above, you still need to have your head examined and need to stay away from any kind of attempted data analysis until you do. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skillplan 2.2. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
7645
|
Posted - 2014.07.07 16:17:00 -
[2146] - Quote
Tippia mentioned it above, but I'd like to chime in on this as well.
Killboard unification didn't even really get started until mid 2012. Any numbers from before then, that don't come from CCP themselves, are worthless. For crying out loud in 2010 I think the most used killboard was still Battleclinic. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Clean Up Local 2014.-á |
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
19512
|
Posted - 2014.07.07 16:21:00 -
[2147] - Quote
Kal Murmur wrote:Tippia wrote:What you're seeing is people being forced into using more and more small ships as it becomes more and more difficult to get a kill. Oh, and if you think for a second that only 1750 ganks were attempted in 2012, you need to have your head examined, so that shows how much the data is worthGǪ Ah so we've moved from 'Show me the data!' to 'The data is obviously wrong!'. Ok then.. Nope, when looking at the data you need to take into account that it inherently has errors caused by the fact not all Concord kills are down to suicide ganking, and not all Concord kills are recorded by Zkill. EveKill shows very different numbers BTW.
The problem is with your interpretation of that data, you're failing to take into account that in late 2011 insurance ceased to be paid out on ships that died to Concord, which logically would lead to gankers user smaller ships than before, and requiring more of those ships to achieve the same goal; thus more kills by Concord for every gank.
More kills by Concord != more people getting suicide ganked. It only shows that more people die to Concord because more gankers are required to carry out the ganks.
Nil mortifi sine lucre |
Kal Murmur
Lazortits
0
|
Posted - 2014.07.07 16:22:00 -
[2148] - Quote
Charon kills in High-Sec
Jun-14:70 Jun-13:44 Jun-12:8 Jun-11:11 Jun-10:9
Please explain how this data is also wrong. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
22964
|
Posted - 2014.07.07 16:23:00 -
[2149] - Quote
Kal Murmur wrote:Charon kills in High-Sec
Jun-14:70 Jun-13:44 Jun-12:8 Jun-11:11 Jun-10:9
Please explain how this data is also wrong. Please show us the source. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skillplan 2.2. |
Kal Murmur
Lazortits
0
|
Posted - 2014.07.07 16:27:00 -
[2150] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Kal Murmur wrote:Charon kills in High-Sec
Jun-14:70 Jun-13:44 Jun-12:8 Jun-11:11 Jun-10:9
Please explain how this data is also wrong. Please show us the source.
Source is zkillboard. Search Charon, Losses, page back to the relevant dates. |
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Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
19513
|
Posted - 2014.07.07 16:37:00 -
[2151] - Quote
Kal Murmur wrote:Tippia wrote:Kal Murmur wrote:Charon kills in High-Sec
Jun-14:70 Jun-13:44 Jun-12:8 Jun-11:11 Jun-10:9
Please explain how this data is also wrong. Please show us the source. Source is zkillboard. Search Charon, Losses, page back to the relevant dates. Your data is misleading due to the fact that A: it is incomplete, as per above killboard unification didn't occur until mid 2012; B: you don't know how many of those particular Charon's died due to wardecs, as opposed to suicide gankers.
For your data to be accurate you'd need to check every other killboard for Charon kills for June 2010-14 and eliminate any duplicates and kills that didn't involve Concord.
Nil mortifi sine lucre |
Ramona McCandless
The McCandless Clan
5998
|
Posted - 2014.07.07 16:37:00 -
[2152] - Quote
Interesting....
According to the same KB Red Frog hasnt lost a single freighter in that time frame
Which is odd, as statistically you think that as high users of them, they would be garunteed to have lost at least one
Hmm perhaps theres something amiss here... "Many have joined the battle, many have survived the tests and trials, but countless have fallen because they weren't the sharpest, the fastest thinking, the most devious, the most ruthless or most intelligent. -áLog in and Compete!"-á- CCP Falcon
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Kal Murmur
Lazortits
0
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Posted - 2014.07.07 16:40:00 -
[2153] - Quote
Ramona McCandless wrote:Interesting....
According to the same KB Red Frog hasnt lost a single freighter in that time frame
Which is odd, as statistically you think that as high users of them, they would be garunteed to have lost at least one
Hmm perhaps theres something amiss here...
Hmm, I also looked at Red Frog as a corp to see their freighter losses. They lost one in a June, in 2013. June 29th to be precise but it was a Fenrir which is why it won't have showed up on the Charon search.
As a corp (according to zkillboard) they lost..
2 in 2011 4 in 2012 8 in 2013 and 6 to present in 2014. That would seem to represent the same kind of increase the other figures showed. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
22966
|
Posted - 2014.07.07 16:42:00 -
[2154] - Quote
Kal Murmur wrote:Source is zkillboard. You mean the killboard that has no accurate stats for 2012 and earlier and which very obviously includes lots of non-ganks? GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skillplan 2.2. |
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
19513
|
Posted - 2014.07.07 16:44:00 -
[2155] - Quote
Ramona McCandless wrote:Interesting....
According to the same KB Red Frog hasnt lost a single freighter in that time frame
Which is odd, as statistically you think that as high users of them, they would be garunteed to have lost at least one
Hmm perhaps theres something amiss here... Redfrog, if Eve has an underground volcano lair, it's their head office muhahaha...
Or they're doing it right.....
Nil mortifi sine lucre |
Ramona McCandless
The McCandless Clan
5998
|
Posted - 2014.07.07 16:44:00 -
[2156] - Quote
Kal Murmur wrote:Ramona McCandless wrote:Interesting....
According to the same KB Red Frog hasnt lost a single freighter in that time frame
Which is odd, as statistically you think that as high users of them, they would be garunteed to have lost at least one
Hmm perhaps theres something amiss here... Hmm, I also looked at Red Frog as a corp to see their freighter losses. They lost one in a June, in 2013. June 29th to be precise but it was a Fenrir which is why it won't have showed up on the Charon search. As a corp (according to zkillboard) they lost.. 2 in 2011 4 in 2012 8 in 2013 and 6 to present in 2014. That would seem to represent the same kind of increase the other figures showed.
But none in the time period you posted
Which I presume you posted to show some kind of increase in losses
But in that time they lost none
So....
Are they statistically wierd?
Also, here's a point Im not sure anyone has raised...
Have player numbers reamined more or less the same since 2011? "Many have joined the battle, many have survived the tests and trials, but countless have fallen because they weren't the sharpest, the fastest thinking, the most devious, the most ruthless or most intelligent. -áLog in and Compete!"-á- CCP Falcon
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Kal Murmur
Lazortits
0
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Posted - 2014.07.07 16:48:00 -
[2157] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Kal Murmur wrote:Source is zkillboard. You mean the killboard that has no accurate stats for 2012 and earlier and which very obviously includes lots of non-ganks?
I was asked to provide data from zkillboard or eve kill, I did so. If you can suggest a more reliable killboard we can use, then feel free to do so.
Ramona McCandless wrote:But none in the time period you posted
Which I presume you posted to show some kind of increase in losses
But in that time they lost none
So....
Are they statistically wierd?
Red Frog don't lose many freighters. Given that we were looking at the numbers for only the Charon, it's hardly that surprising that they didn't lose any during the month of June, given how low their total losses are. |
Ramona McCandless
The McCandless Clan
5998
|
Posted - 2014.07.07 16:50:00 -
[2158] - Quote
Kal Murmur wrote:
Red Frog don't lose many freighters. Given that we were looking at the numbers for only the Charon, it's hardly that surprising that they didn't lose any during the month of June, given how low their total losses are.
So why are they immune from your Ganking Epidemic? "Many have joined the battle, many have survived the tests and trials, but countless have fallen because they weren't the sharpest, the fastest thinking, the most devious, the most ruthless or most intelligent. -áLog in and Compete!"-á- CCP Falcon
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
22966
|
Posted - 2014.07.07 16:52:00 -
[2159] - Quote
Kal Murmur wrote:I was asked to provide data from zkillboard or eve kill, I did so. If you can suggest a more reliable killboard we can use, then feel free to do so. GǪand you asked me to point out the problem(s) with your data. If you want some from 2012 or earlier, you have to ask CCP, reallyGǪ
Quote:Red Frog don't lose many freighters. Given that we were looking at the numbers for only the Charon, it's hardly that surprising that they didn't lose any during the month of June, given how low their total losses are. EhmGǪ are we looking at the same Red Frog? GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skillplan 2.2. |
De'Veldrin
Black Serpent Technologies The Unthinkables
2474
|
Posted - 2014.07.07 16:57:00 -
[2160] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Kal Murmur wrote:I was asked to provide data from zkillboard or eve kill, I did so. If you can suggest a more reliable killboard we can use, then feel free to do so. GǪand you asked me to point out the problem(s) with your data. If you want some from 2012 or earlier, you have to ask CCP, reallyGǪ Quote:Red Frog don't lose many freighters. Given that we were looking at the numbers for only the Charon, it's hardly that surprising that they didn't lose any during the month of June, given how low their total losses are. EhmGǪ are we looking at the same Red Frog?
Honestly, I was under the impression that all of Red Frog's Freighters were NPC alts anyway (to avoid war dec issues). So the kill board wouldn't be an accurate place to asess those numbers - you'd need to look at their internal reimbursement numbers. MAMBA is recruiting. -áWhen other folks are whining about a lack of content, we go out and create it. The case of Shrodinger's Hotdropper |
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