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Liquidman
Perkone Caldari State
2
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Posted - 2014.07.04 18:34:00 -
[1] - Quote
travelling thru empire I notice I am constantly being cargo scanned. would it not be kewl if there was a module you could fit that would make a cargo scan an aggressive act? of course the scanner would be warned "this is an agressive act, do you wish to proceed" |
Saint Germain
Sekundu
20
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Posted - 2014.07.04 19:22:00 -
[2] - Quote
Maybe the whole system needs a rethink, possibly including the 'Black Market Trading' skill and drug smuggling as well.
How about this, cargo scanning becomes undetectable, except for a random chance. The chance of getting caught can be reduced by training up a skill. If you get caught scanning, that flags you as a suspect. |
Iain Cariaba
Veritas Theory
99
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Posted - 2014.07.04 19:37:00 -
[3] - Quote
Liquidman wrote:travelling thru empire I notice I am constantly being cargo scanned. would it not be kewl if there was a module you could fit that would make a cargo scan an aggressive act? of course the scanner would be warned "this is an agressive act, do you wish to proceed" So why should someone doing a scan, like they do in... I don't know... almost every single sci-fi story ever told, be considered an agressive act? That's like saying it should be a crime for me to look in the back of your truck whe you pull up beside me at a light, or to look in your shopping cart at the grocery store. Disclaimer: My opinion does not necessarily reflect that of my corp or alliance. My opinion is my own, and if you don't like, that is your problem. |
Paikis
Lycosa Syndicate Surely You're Joking
1250
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Posted - 2014.07.04 19:48:00 -
[4] - Quote
It would be nice if there were skills to train to make scanning more reliable, and then skills the freight pilots could train to make it harder to scan their cargo.
At present, a 30 second old throw-away alt can scan just as well as an all Vs character. The only difference being a few fractions of a second off the timer on their scanner, which matters not at all. |
Mag's
the united
17637
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Posted - 2014.07.04 19:54:00 -
[5] - Quote
Liquidman wrote:travelling thru empire I notice I am constantly being cargo scanned. would it not be kewl if there was a module you could fit that would make a cargo scan an aggressive act? of course the scanner would be warned "this is an agressive act, do you wish to proceed" Why?
Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the lions will ignore you in the savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless. |
Iain Cariaba
Veritas Theory
100
|
Posted - 2014.07.04 20:50:00 -
[6] - Quote
Paikis wrote:It would be nice if there were skills to train to make scanning more reliable, and then skills the freight pilots could train to make it harder to scan their cargo.
At present, a 30 second old throw-away alt can scan just as well as an all Vs character. The only difference being a few fractions of a second off the timer on their scanner, which matters not at all. rant
Why is it always this 'throw away alt' crap? Do you really think people make all these alts to do stuff that isn't punishable to begin with? If you're that afraid of getting ganked, perhaps you should read one of the multitudes of other nerf-ganking threads like this on and learn how to do it yourself.
"Whaaaa, the big bad ganker is going to get me!!!" You know what, you knew what you were getting into when you signed up for this game. If you can't handle it then you should go back to Hello Kitty Online rather than join the multitudes of other whiners crying for more and more nerfs on forums using ideas that have already been submitted hundreds if not thousands of times in this game's 11 year history.
/rant Disclaimer: My opinion does not necessarily reflect that of my corp or alliance. My opinion is my own, and if you don't like, that is your problem. |
Paikis
Lycosa Syndicate Surely You're Joking
1250
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Posted - 2014.07.04 21:07:00 -
[7] - Quote
Iain Cariaba wrote: rant
Why is it always this 'throw away alt' crap? Do you really think people make all these alts to do stuff that isn't punishable to begin with? If you're that afraid of getting ganked, perhaps you should read one of the multitudes of other nerf-ganking threads like this on and learn how to do it yourself.
"Whaaaa, the big bad ganker is going to get me!!!" You know what, you knew what you were getting into when you signed up for this game. If you can't handle it then you should go back to Hello Kitty Online rather than join the multitudes of other whiners crying for more and more nerfs on forums using ideas that have already been submitted hundreds if not thousands of times in this game's 11 year history.
/rant
Cool story bro, add some dragons next time. Did you find 20 bucks? |
Sigras
Conglomo
814
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Posted - 2014.07.04 22:59:00 -
[8] - Quote
What if you had containers that were immune to cargo scan... say 1,000 m^3 in volume but 300 m^3 in capacity? |
Arden Elenduil
Scary Devil Monastery
117
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Posted - 2014.07.04 23:58:00 -
[9] - Quote
Or how about you double wrap your packages, which effectively makes them immune to cargo scanning... Stop your crying and adapt to the situation you have. You already have the tools, USE THEM, don't rely on the devs to fix something for you that you can already easily do.
Alternatively, you can use a Blockade Runner, who are IMMUNE to cargo scanning. Honestly, what is with people these days... |
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
1409
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 00:24:00 -
[10] - Quote
Arden Elenduil wrote:Or how about you double wrap your packages, which effectively makes them immune to cargo scanning... Stop your crying and adapt to the situation you have. You already have the tools, USE THEM, don't rely on the devs to fix something for you that you can already easily do.
Alternatively, you can use a Blockade Runner, who are IMMUNE to cargo scanning. Honestly, what is with people these days... Doubling wrapping is incredibly tedious to do under the current mechanics, and requires a lot of tooing and froing, so isn't a good 'solution' currently. Nor is he asking for his entire hold to be immune.
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DJentropy Ovaert
The Conference Elite CODE.
632
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Posted - 2014.07.05 00:26:00 -
[11] - Quote
Arden Elenduil wrote:Or how about you double wrap your packages, which effectively makes them immune to cargo scanning... Stop your crying and adapt to the situation you have. You already have the tools, USE THEM, don't rely on the devs to fix something for you that you can already easily do.
Alternatively, you can use a Blockade Runner, who are IMMUNE to cargo scanning. Honestly, what is with people these days...
Arden, you can now just drop the mic and walk away - you totally nailed it.
Asking for a counter measure to something when there is already a valid and effective counter-measure to it = daft.
OP, you have the tools you need to make sure your cargo is never scanned. Use them. |
Kaerakh
Surprisingly Deep Hole
360
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 00:37:00 -
[12] - Quote
Liquidman wrote:travelling thru empire I notice I am constantly being cargo scanned. would it not be kewl if there was a module you could fit that would make a cargo scan an aggressive act? of course the scanner would be warned "this is an agressive act, do you wish to proceed"
No.
Paikis wrote:Iain Cariaba wrote: -snip-
Cool story bro, add some dragons next time. Did you find 20 bucks?
Couldn't agree more. EVE is a game with mechanics designed around characters, not accounts. Throw away alts are an abuse of that architecture.
Getting back to cargo/ship scanners. I couldn't agree more that this need more fleshing out. Currently it's retardedly easy and simple to scan almost any ship in the game. Schrodinger's Hot Dropper - The Fate of Forum Alts - Click me! Click me! |
Arden Elenduil
Scary Devil Monastery
119
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Posted - 2014.07.05 00:41:00 -
[13] - Quote
DJentropy Ovaert wrote:Arden Elenduil wrote:Or how about you double wrap your packages, which effectively makes them immune to cargo scanning... Stop your crying and adapt to the situation you have. You already have the tools, USE THEM, don't rely on the devs to fix something for you that you can already easily do.
Alternatively, you can use a Blockade Runner, who are IMMUNE to cargo scanning. Honestly, what is with people these days... Arden, you can now just drop the mic and walk away - you totally nailed it. Asking for a counter measure to something when there is already a valid and effective counter-measure to it = daft. OP, you have the tools you need to make sure your cargo is never scanned. Use them.
"Drops Mic" |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
7579
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 02:04:00 -
[14] - Quote
Liquidman wrote:travelling thru empire I notice I am constantly being cargo scanned. would it not be kewl if there was a module you could fit that would make a cargo scan an aggressive act? of course the scanner would be warned "this is an agressive act, do you wish to proceed"
Or we can *not* break the game, and you can just learn to double wrap instead.
Yeesh. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Clean Up Local 2014.-á |
Danika Princip
Freelance Economics Astrological resources Tactical Narcotics Team
2787
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 10:31:00 -
[15] - Quote
Aren't blockade runners immune to scans?
there's your solution OP. |
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Hello-There
592
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 10:59:00 -
[16] - Quote
I'm open to cargo scanning someone being a suspect activity though, consider if someone walked up to your car at the lights and looked in your boot and windows...
ed: Having said that it makes ganking yet more difficult although only one shp goes suspect and in hisec who is likely to engage you? |
Kaerakh
Surprisingly Deep Hole
360
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 11:06:00 -
[17] - Quote
Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote:I'm open to cargo scanning someone being a suspect activity though, consider if someone walked up to your car at the lights and looked in your boot and windows...
ed: Having said that it makes ganking yet more difficult although only one shp goes suspect and in hisec who is likely to engage you?
CONCORD is a peace keeping force that responds to violations with violent retribution. They're not a civil defense force concerned with petty crime. As I just said they're peace keepers original set up to beat ass on the empires if the decided to pull a fast one on each other. Capsuleer regulation was an after thought.
I'm not 100%, but I'm pretty sure that's a lore accurate description. Now if you're arguing this from a pure mechanics perspective that's a different case, but I just wanted to make sure you didn't think CONCORD was the same as a country's local law enforcement. Schrodinger's Hot Dropper - The Fate of Forum Alts - Click me! Click me! |
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Hello-There
593
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Posted - 2014.07.05 12:23:00 -
[18] - Quote
Kaerakh wrote:Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote:I'm open to cargo scanning someone being a suspect activity though, consider if someone walked up to your car at the lights and looked in your boot and windows...
ed: Having said that it makes ganking yet more difficult although only one shp goes suspect and in hisec who is likely to engage you? CONCORD is a peace keeping force that responds to violations with violent retribution. They're not a civil defense force concerned with petty crime. As I just said they're peace keepers original set up to beat ass on the empires if the decided to pull a fast one on each other. Capsuleer regulation was an after thought. I'm not 100%, but I'm pretty sure that's a lore accurate description. Now if you're arguing this from a pure mechanics perspective that's a different case, but I just wanted to make sure you didn't think CONCORD was the same as a country's local law enforcement.
I never mentioned CONCORD, I simply said that rifling through someones cargo manifest without asking first is pretty damn suspicious... |
Abrazzar
Vardaugas Family
4030
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 12:39:00 -
[19] - Quote
So let's change the mechanics: Add a scanner strength to the cargo scanners Add a module that adds scanning resistance. Every cycle has a chance to successfully scan the ship depending on strength/resistance somewhat similar to ECM. Add a Serpentis hauler with a role bonus to scanning resistance. Give customs a scan strength depending on the security level of the system and if it's a border gate or not. Add a skill that increases scan resistance against customs. Sovereignty and Population New Mining Mechanics |
Gully Alex Foyle
Black Fox Marauders Repeat 0ffenders
986
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 12:44:00 -
[20] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Liquidman wrote:travelling thru empire I notice I am constantly being cargo scanned. would it not be kewl if there was a module you could fit that would make a cargo scan an aggressive act? of course the scanner would be warned "this is an agressive act, do you wish to proceed" Why? Exactly, why?
It wouldn't deter anybody from cargo scanning.
It would hardly 'warn' you about being scanned. Many people just don't pay attention to anything, and those who do couldn't really know if the guy just went suspect for any other reason.
In any case, it wouldn't give you any valuable intel. If your cargo is scannable, just assume it will always get scanned, and fly accordingly. |
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Corraidhin Farsaidh
Hello-There
593
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Posted - 2014.07.05 12:51:00 -
[21] - Quote
Gully Alex Foyle wrote:Mag's wrote:Liquidman wrote:travelling thru empire I notice I am constantly being cargo scanned. would it not be kewl if there was a module you could fit that would make a cargo scan an aggressive act? of course the scanner would be warned "this is an agressive act, do you wish to proceed" Why? Exactly, why? It wouldn't deter anybody from cargo scanning. It would hardly 'warn' you about being scanned. Many people just don't pay attention to anything, and those who do couldn't really know if the guy just went suspect for any other reason. In any case, it wouldn't give you any valuable intel. If your cargo is scannable, just assume it will always get scanned, and fly accordingly.
Agree with this, as mentioned previously if you don't want to be scanned fly a BR otherwise plan to deal with being scanned |
Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
2304
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 14:40:00 -
[22] - Quote
Liquidman wrote:travelling thru empire I notice I am constantly being cargo scanned. would it not be kewl if there was a module you could fit that would make a cargo scan an aggressive act? of course the scanner would be warned "this is an agressive act, do you wish to proceed"
Or you could HTFU. Everyone gets scanned on the trade routes. |
afkalt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
176
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Posted - 2014.07.05 19:42:00 -
[23] - Quote
Suspect works for me, more targets is always a nice thing. |
Tengu Grib
Simple Inc Simple Group
201
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 21:59:00 -
[24] - Quote
Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote:I'm open to cargo scanning someone being a suspect activity though, consider if someone walked up to your car at the lights and looked in your boot and windows...
ed: Having said that it makes ganking yet more difficult although only one shp goes suspect and in hisec who is likely to engage you?
The real world equivalent of this would be that if someone does look in the back of your truck at a light, a pedestrian walking past can shoot the guy dead and it's totally cool cause he looked in the back of your truck. Seriously if people are going to make analogies between eve and real life at least make them well.
Overall scanning making you suspect is a really terrible idea. I do agree that maybe there could be a skill which makes it harder to scan your cargo, that would be cool. Blockade runners are immune to scans though, so in the meantime, just use that. Tengu Grib > I agree. The distinct lack of quality spaceships makes RL the worst space sim ever. SolidX > i'm an alt IRL Guilty conscience? Buy a mining permit today. www.minerbumping.com |
Kaerakh
Surprisingly Deep Hole
361
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 22:05:00 -
[25] - Quote
Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote:Kaerakh wrote:Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote:I'm open to cargo scanning someone being a suspect activity though, consider if someone walked up to your car at the lights and looked in your boot and windows...
ed: Having said that it makes ganking yet more difficult although only one shp goes suspect and in hisec who is likely to engage you? CONCORD is a peace keeping force that responds to violations with violent retribution. They're not a civil defense force concerned with petty crime. As I just said they're peace keepers original set up to beat ass on the empires if the decided to pull a fast one on each other. Capsuleer regulation was an after thought. I'm not 100%, but I'm pretty sure that's a lore accurate description. Now if you're arguing this from a pure mechanics perspective that's a different case, but I just wanted to make sure you didn't think CONCORD was the same as a country's local law enforcement. I never mentioned CONCORD, I simply said that rifling through someones cargo manifest without asking first is pretty damn suspicious... You're right, you didn't but crimewatch has the greatest functionality in highsec and highsec is called highsec because of the degree of retributive force that CONCORD will bring down upon you for committing unwarranted hostile acts. A flag that lets you shoot another player would be a condoned killing by CONCORD, or at the very least warns you of a player's intent is a little too close to a police force for my tastes. Schrodinger's Hot Dropper - The Fate of Forum Alts - Click me! Click me! |
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Hello-There
595
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 22:10:00 -
[26] - Quote
Kaerakh wrote:Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote:Kaerakh wrote:Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote:I'm open to cargo scanning someone being a suspect activity though, consider if someone walked up to your car at the lights and looked in your boot and windows...
ed: Having said that it makes ganking yet more difficult although only one shp goes suspect and in hisec who is likely to engage you? CONCORD is a peace keeping force that responds to violations with violent retribution. They're not a civil defense force concerned with petty crime. As I just said they're peace keepers original set up to beat ass on the empires if the decided to pull a fast one on each other. Capsuleer regulation was an after thought. I'm not 100%, but I'm pretty sure that's a lore accurate description. Now if you're arguing this from a pure mechanics perspective that's a different case, but I just wanted to make sure you didn't think CONCORD was the same as a country's local law enforcement. I never mentioned CONCORD, I simply said that rifling through someones cargo manifest without asking first is pretty damn suspicious... You're right, you didn't but crimewatch has the greatest functionality in highsec and highsec is called highsec because of the degree of retributive force that CONCORD will bring down upon you for committing unwarranted hostile acts. A flag that lets you shoot another player would be a condoned killing by CONCORD, or at the very least warns you of a player's intent is a little too close to a police force for my tastes.
True enough and that was the reason behind my reservations...I wouldn't be adverse to a suspect flag as scanning is inherently suspicious but there are already simple enough ways to avoid scanning or the consequences if you wish. On that basis I would be against any changes regarding scanning. |
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Hello-There
595
|
Posted - 2014.07.05 22:11:00 -
[27] - Quote
Tengu Grib wrote:Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote:I'm open to cargo scanning someone being a suspect activity though, consider if someone walked up to your car at the lights and looked in your boot and windows...
ed: Having said that it makes ganking yet more difficult although only one shp goes suspect and in hisec who is likely to engage you? The real world equivalent of this would be that if someone does look in the back of your truck at a light, a pedestrian walking past can shoot the guy dead and it's totally cool cause he looked in the back of your truck. Seriously if people are going to make analogies between eve and real life at least make them well. Overall scanning making you suspect is a really terrible idea. I do agree that maybe there could be a skill which makes it harder to scan your cargo, that would be cool. Blockade runners are immune to scans though, so in the meantime, just use that.
See above, I agree with you on further reflection a suspect flag would be too heavy handed given the answer to the OP's suggestion already exists |
Mole Guy
Band of Builders Inc. Firmus Ixion
435
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 04:08:00 -
[28] - Quote
we have made several comments towards cargo scanners being considered an act of aggression.
then we could shoot the alt scanners. haulers started complaining that it would lead to random shootings again.
catch 22.
i want it an aggressive act. when it becomes costly to sit and scan, itll slow down.
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Sentamon
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
1937
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 04:35:00 -
[29] - Quote
+1 to suspect flags for scanning mods and cargo.
Just cause the risk averse gankbears that hate PvP don't want it. ~ Professional Forum Alt -á~ |
Lugia3
Intentionally Dense Easily Excited
1000
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 08:02:00 -
[30] - Quote
Sigras wrote:What if you had containers that were immune to cargo scan... say 1,000 m^3 in volume but 300 m^3 in capacity?
We already do, it's called a double wrap.
And it exponentially increases your chance of being ganked. "CCP Dolan is full of ****." - CCP Bettik |
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