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SKIN KZ
Lock Stock Two Smoking Barrels
0
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Posted - 2014.07.12 12:17:00 -
[1] - Quote
Hi everyone! I'm russian player and sorry for my english before ;)
In current moment pvp in EVE is one of the other big problems in the gameplay. You need to jump 20-30 low-sec to find a target and you have no garanty to find it (I mean solo). The DEV's made us a gift - duels in hi-sec, but I think they are forgot something. In current topic I want to pay attention to few moments for make the duels more popullary and exclude the traps and deceptions.
What we need to make:
1. The player has entered into a duel can not dock to the station during the duel time. Now we see, that the pilot on T1 frig (for example) making the duel request, recive the accept, after then he doccing to station and undoccing on the battleship or other more powerful ship. We need to fix it.
2. The player has entered into a duel can not recive the gang bonuses during the duel time. Duel should be fair duel.
3. The player has entered into a duel can not recive the remote armor/shield transporters and energy transfers during the duel time. Like a 2-nd point - duel should be fair duel.
This 3 moment can change the duel mechanic and give us more fan with comfortable pvp events, exclude the traps, scam and deceptions and does not require more investments and time. So, what you think about this?...
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Gully Alex Foyle
Black Fox Marauders Repeat 0ffenders
1182
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Posted - 2014.07.12 13:18:00 -
[2] - Quote
I don't use the duel mechanic, but I agree on points 1 and 3. No point in having a duel mechanic if people can play silly games so easily.
Links are fine, imo, and can't you fleet up if both parties agree to rule them out? |
Joshua Milton Blahyi
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
9
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Posted - 2014.07.12 13:56:00 -
[3] - Quote
Gully Alex Foyle wrote:
Links are fine, imo, and can't you fleet up if both parties agree to rule them out?
Never dueled either, but if one side is getting boosts, it is no longer a duel by definition.
Maybe make the booster go suspect for interfering with gentlemanly conduct.
As long as their is a dueling mechanic it should offer just that, a 1 v 1. |
SKIN KZ
Lock Stock Two Smoking Barrels
1
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Posted - 2014.07.12 15:59:00 -
[4] - Quote
I think when I want to duel it's need to be a clear duel: no boosts, no support even if this causes a suspect, because it's again leads to trap. Only 1 vs 1 and nothing more... |
Sara Tosa
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
14
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Posted - 2014.07.12 17:28:00 -
[5] - Quote
Gully Alex Foyle wrote:I don't use the duel mechanic, but I agree on points 1 and 3. No point in having a duel mechanic if people can play silly games so easily.
Links are fine, imo, and can't you fleet up if both parties agree to rule them out? problem with links its that there's no way to know if somebody got them or not (other than judging their dps/speed and such). if they had some visible effect at least you would be able to judge if an engagement had be "fair" (in this case OP is talking about duels, so a consensual engagement based on some predetermined rules, not a random pvp encounter) |
Serendipity Lost
Repo Industries
288
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Posted - 2014.07.17 15:47:00 -
[6] - Quote
I like the visible effect idea. Anyone getting boosts gets a pretty graphic to alert other players that there is a booster about.
If you go into a duel (game sanctioned 1v1) and you're getting boosts - the graphic should be a downward bending weiner w/ no bun. It would add a bit of fun to the excitement. |
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed Agony Empire
4037
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Posted - 2014.07.17 16:18:00 -
[7] - Quote
1.) Duel mechanics are fine. I don't think ccp should try to prevent interference in the duel by third parties (RR, Links, Etc).
2.) Off grid boosters are the most broken mechanic in this game. The boosts are ridiculously powerful, which in itself isn't the problem. The problem is these game-breaking boosts are provided from a location beyond the influence of the standard combat zone, with no pragmatic counter. I fully advocate for creating an ongrid counter, moving them on grid, or nerfing their boosts.
3.) As suggested. Fleet up with your duel mate, and fight in a safe spot. This will limit some of the outside interference, although they can still drop fleet and betray you. Alternatively, have them move to a quiet system for the duel.
4.) Name and Shame anyone that violates the stipulations of your duel in the Crimes and Punishments forum section. Let people know they are not to be trusted.
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Tengu Grib
Simple Inc Simple Group
225
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Posted - 2014.07.17 17:34:00 -
[8] - Quote
I agree with everything the OP says. You can already avoid neutral boosts if you insist on being in fleet with the person you are dueling, but this is not an intuitive mechanic. Points 1 and 3 are very very valid though. Tengu Grib > I agree. The distinct lack of quality spaceships makes RL the worst space sim ever. SolidX > i'm an alt IRL Guilty conscience? Buy a mining permit today. www.minerbumping.com |
Tengu Grib
Simple Inc Simple Group
225
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Posted - 2014.07.17 17:38:00 -
[9] - Quote
Serendipity Lost wrote:I like the visible effect idea. Anyone getting boosts gets a pretty graphic to alert other players that there is a booster about.
If you go into a duel (game sanctioned 1v1) and you're getting boosts - the graphic should be a downward bending weiner w/ no bun. It would add a bit of fun to the excitement.
Problem I could see with that right away would be soul crushing lag generated during larger fights. I think it's a cool idea, but if it were to be implemented it would have to be something you can switch off. Full fleets for instance assume their opponents have boosts, and don't need a graphic display adding strain to their GPU to tell them that. For HS and LS though it could be pretty cool and good to know. Tengu Grib > I agree. The distinct lack of quality spaceships makes RL the worst space sim ever. SolidX > i'm an alt IRL Guilty conscience? Buy a mining permit today. www.minerbumping.com |
Serendipity Lost
Repo Industries
289
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Posted - 2014.07.17 18:29:00 -
[10] - Quote
Tengu Grib wrote:Serendipity Lost wrote:I like the visible effect idea. Anyone getting boosts gets a pretty graphic to alert other players that there is a booster about.
If you go into a duel (game sanctioned 1v1) and you're getting boosts - the graphic should be a downward bending weiner w/ no bun. It would add a bit of fun to the excitement. Problem I could see with that right away would be soul crushing lag generated during larger fights. I think it's a cool idea, but if it were to be implemented it would have to be something you can switch off. Full fleets for instance assume their opponents have boosts, and don't need a graphic display adding strain to their GPU to tell them that. For HS and LS though it could be pretty cool and good to know.
for large fights - who cares. When you enter the duel - the little limpy wiener shows up on those that deserve it. I'm not a fan of boosted solo folks, but I can see the difference between entering a duel and engaging a 'solo' guy outside of the dueling option. If they can lock out RR assistance then I'm pretty sure they can float a little weiner above a ship. |
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Bastion Arzi
Dat Tax
109
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Posted - 2014.07.22 14:23:00 -
[11] - Quote
i dont know why so many people are averse to dueling honestly. sometimes i sit for hours outside a popular station trying to get a fight usually with no luck.
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Thanatos Marathon
Black Fox Marauders Repeat 0ffenders
250
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Posted - 2014.07.22 14:53:00 -
[12] - Quote
Bastion Arzi wrote:i dont know why so many people are averse to dueling honestly. sometimes i sit for hours outside a popular station trying to get a fight usually with no luck.
Come to FW lowsec. BLFOX is currently recruiting |
Bastion Arzi
Dat Tax
109
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Posted - 2014.07.22 18:32:00 -
[13] - Quote
i just might do that |
SKIN KZ
Lock Stock Two Smoking Barrels
5
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Posted - 2014.07.24 05:13:00 -
[14] - Quote
Bastion Arzi wrote:i dont know why so many people are averse to dueling honestly. sometimes i sit for hours outside a popular station trying to get a fight usually with no luck.
Yap,
because everybody scary. You don't know have the opponent some fleet bonuses and which ship he will use after biginning the fight...
I'm repeat, I can start the duel with the atron (without any fleet bonuses, if you speaking about visual effects), docking, creat a fleet with my alt on command ship, undocking on the megatron and kill my opponent. Profit.
So where is the DUel here?... |
SKIN KZ
Lock Stock Two Smoking Barrels
5
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Posted - 2014.07.24 05:17:00 -
[15] - Quote
Thanatos Marathon wrote: Come to FW lowsec.
And find the blob... |
Bastion Arzi
Dat Tax
109
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Posted - 2014.07.24 08:48:00 -
[16] - Quote
u can always ask to fleet up together. so u can be sure that noone is recieveing fleet boosts and you dont have to fight on the station. |
SKIN KZ
Lock Stock Two Smoking Barrels
6
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Posted - 2014.07.24 11:00:00 -
[17] - Quote
Bastion Arzi wrote:u can always ask to fleet up together. so u can be sure that noone is recieveing fleet boosts and you dont have to fight on the station.
DEV maked the easy mechanism to start the duel with one clik, so what the problem to make it completly fair... just 3 step, that I described above. |
Serendipity Lost
Repo Industries
306
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Posted - 2014.07.24 12:10:00 -
[18] - Quote
Bastion Arzi wrote:i dont know why so many people are averse to dueling honestly. sometimes i sit for hours outside a popular station trying to get a fight usually with no luck.
Try getting off a station. There are a lot of guys that like to pvp. There are only a few l33t guys that like to pvp on a station.
If you offer a duel and it's just you and me in system and the ship match up is reasonable - I'll take it. If you offer me a duel on the Jita undock - I'll close it out w/out even thinking.
SO... the closer you are to the first example - the more likely I will accept and the closer you are to the latter - the more likely it gets closed w/out thought.
I have a couple of characters. Things I've observed to be true about duel offers:
Being in a freighter - you get a lot of duel requests. Being in a hauler - you get a lot of duel requests. My newer characters get a lot more duel requests than may older ones.
I'm not calling you out personally (I have no idea who you offer duels to), but my experience w/ duel requests kind of points to guys trying to womp up on mostly defensless or 'easy' targets. It's a good system, but just like station trade windows.... usually not a good idea. |
Kin-Dza-Dza Ecilopp
Mon-oO-cle
2
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Posted - 2014.07.24 12:24:00 -
[19] - Quote
+1 up. it's time to change duels |
Bastion Arzi
Dat Tax
109
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Posted - 2014.07.24 13:15:00 -
[20] - Quote
i usually offer duels to people in combat ships. i wouldnt even bother with a non combat ship wats the point?
but yeah i wholeheartedly agree if ccp can do somehting to make dueling more popular/viable/fair then they should. |
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JAF Anders
Quantum Cats Syndicate Repeat 0ffenders
266
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Posted - 2014.07.24 16:08:00 -
[21] - Quote
The game could automatically make a fleet of the two participants in the duel upon agreeing to it. Participants who are already in a fleet would receive a message saying that they would need to leave fleet in order to duel.
When the duel starts, the game could immediately give each participant a weapons timer, which would keep them from docking. The game could also use a similar flag for Triage, Siege, and Bastion, disallowing remote assistance for those participants. The new flag would need to allow for all the conventional bells and whistles, like webs and tracking disruptors, but keep reps, cap, and remote ewar assistance from landing.
I assume that at this point, people will simply have their buddies bump the crap out of the other duelist, but that's another story ready to be written. The pursuit of excellence and stabbed plexing alts. |
Baron' Soontir Fel
Justified Chaos
226
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Posted - 2014.07.24 17:43:00 -
[22] - Quote
+1.
They should make it so if you leave the grid, the duel is over. So you can't fly to a safe, re-ship in a pos/empty ship and come back. |
SKIN KZ
Lock Stock Two Smoking Barrels
11
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Posted - 2014.07.25 03:22:00 -
[23] - Quote
JAF Anders wrote:The game could automatically make a fleet of the two participants in the duel upon agreeing to it. Participants who are already in a fleet would receive a message saying that they would need to leave fleet in order to duel.
When the duel starts, the game could immediately give each participant a weapons timer, which would keep them from docking. The game could also use a similar flag for Triage, Siege, and Bastion, disallowing remote assistance for those participants. The new flag would need to allow for all the conventional bells and whistles, like webs and tracking disruptors, but keep reps, cap, and remote ewar assistance from landing.
I assume that at this point, people will simply have their buddies bump the crap out of the other duelist, but that's another story ready to be written.
Accepts as option! Good idea. |
The Bandid
Justice Legion. Guardians.
0
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Posted - 2014.07.25 10:28:00 -
[24] - Quote
+1 Duel mechanics must be improoved And i think when somebody offer to me duel i must know what is his ship. I dont see this information in Duel Panel, and i have only 30 second to find opponent in overview and decide to accept or decline duel offer |
SKIN KZ
Lock Stock Two Smoking Barrels
12
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Posted - 2014.07.25 11:29:00 -
[25] - Quote
The Bandid wrote: i must know what is type of his ship. I dont see this information in Duel Panel, and i have only 30 second to find opponent in overview and decide to accept or decline duel offer.
Yea, bro, more information in Duel Panel! What about a special duel statistics, guys? This information can be show in Duel Panel too.
About concord killing sapport ships... I don't know... In my opinion, a ban on support seems more acceptable. |
GaRaMaGaDa
Wiedzmin corporate The Gorgon Spawn
2
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Posted - 2014.07.25 15:16:00 -
[26] - Quote
Nonsense! Duels should be removed. http://forum.eve-ru.com/index.php?showtopic=107065 |
The Bandid
Justice Legion. Guardians.
0
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Posted - 2014.07.25 16:53:00 -
[27] - Quote
SKIN KZ wrote: I don't know... In my opinion, a ban on support seems more acceptable.
CONCORD is fast and cheep way. You dont need write tickets or petitions, it dont spend time of CCP support team |
Serendipity Lost
Repo Industries
310
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Posted - 2014.07.25 18:48:00 -
[28] - Quote
The Bandid wrote:SKIN KZ wrote: I don't know... In my opinion, a ban on support seems more acceptable.
CONCORD is fast and cheep way. You dont need write tickets or petitions, it dont spend time of CCP support team If we want stay fleet duels it must be way to see in Duel Panel how much pilots in enemy fleet and after start of duel sistem must reject any attempts of join the "duel fleet" except those pilots who was disconnected during duel
you don't need a disconnect exception. if you're pointed you'll get popped before you log in. if you ewarp, just start over w/ a new duel.
If you point the guy, it matters not wether he disconnects. |
Christopher Mabata
Dominion Tenebrarum Reverberation Project
39
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Posted - 2014.07.26 17:24:00 -
[29] - Quote
The point of duels is to evoke a limited engagement timer, if somebody screws up and accepts a duel i see no reason why they shouldn't be able to dock or on the flip side accepts a duel and swaps ships in a bait and swap maneuver.
Now yes station games are annoying, not a lot of us like / enjoy them unless your one of the ones with god knows how many nuetral logi and such and thats the only PVP you know ( god forbid ) but duels shouldn't circumvent an applied game mechanic working within its boundaries. In fact i think its a fine system for the most part, the not warning about poding might need to be fixed but thats it. ( and thats if it hasnt already )
also 20+ jumps into low just means your hunting in a bad spot, Molden Heath, Derelik, and Domain have all provided good fights solo and in small gangs for me for quite some time. and people i know. Is it bad if your friend says "that was a Metaphor" and you say "Meta 4? Get Tech II or faction" ?I love the sound of silent explosions in Space.-á |
Christopher Mabata
Dominion Tenebrarum Reverberation Project
39
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Posted - 2014.07.26 17:26:00 -
[30] - Quote
JAF Anders wrote:The game could automatically make a fleet of the two participants in the duel upon agreeing to it. Participants who are already in a fleet would receive a message saying that they would need to leave fleet in order to duel.
When the duel starts, the game could immediately give each participant a weapons timer, which would keep them from docking. The game could also use a similar flag for Triage, Siege, and Bastion, disallowing remote assistance for those participants. The new flag would need to allow for all the conventional bells and whistles, like webs and tracking disruptors, but keep reps, cap, and remote ewar assistance from landing.
I assume that at this point, people will simply have their buddies bump the crap out of the other duelist, but that's another story ready to be written.
Thats not dueling, that is just remove all the odds that someone could use applied and legal mechanics to beat me, lesson for eve life #1
There is no such thing as fair in eve If something seems fair in eve its a trap Is it bad if your friend says "that was a Metaphor" and you say "Meta 4? Get Tech II or faction" ?I love the sound of silent explosions in Space.-á |
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