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Isaac Lobo
Tec-IV
0
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Posted - 2014.07.23 03:59:00 -
[1] - Quote
Self explainatory post subject.
Why to bother to wardec high sec corps if they will just move everybody to a alt corp? It seems a broken mechanic for me, or i just probably not seeing all sides of this.
I mean, if they are a medium/small size mining corp it's cheaper to suicide gank it to death. If they are a medium/small size hauling corp, suicide gank it. If they are a PVE corp with faction fancy fits, they all 'll just move to an alt corp. |
Riot Girl
You'll Cowards Don't Even Smoke Crack
3345
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Posted - 2014.07.23 04:02:00 -
[2] - Quote
CCP decided we needed our hands held because writing an Eve mail saying 'We're going to **** you' is too difficult. Oh god. |
Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari End of Life
2217
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Posted - 2014.07.23 04:02:00 -
[3] - Quote
Get out of highsec. No wardec necessary.
Problem solved.
However, there have been many threads on this subject and yes, I think the general consensus is that it is a broken mechanic that people can just drop Corp and move to an alt Corp/NPC Corp or just reform the same Corp again. Others think just being able to wardec any Corp is a broken mechanic too. So broken both ways I guess. Come Win At Eve - Join The Vendunari
. -á<- Argue this, not this ->-á( -í-¦ -£-û -í-¦) |
Cannibal Kane
Cannibal Empire
4119
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 04:25:00 -
[4] - Quote
So what you are saying is....
If I wardec your corp none of your members will leave or move to another corp.
Will test that soon. "Kane is the End Boss of Highsec." -Psychotic Monk |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
6251
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Posted - 2014.07.23 04:36:00 -
[5] - Quote
Must be their research pos.
Or perhaps now we should say compression pos? ^^ Delicious goon ((tech nerf, siphon, drone assist, supercap)) tears.
Taking a wrecking ball to the futile hopes and broken dreams of skillless blobbers. |
Isaac Lobo
Tec-IV
0
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Posted - 2014.07.23 04:38:00 -
[6] - Quote
Cannibal Kane wrote:So what you are saying is....
If I wardec your corp none of your members will leave or move to another corp.
Will test that soon.
That is the point, they 'll probably move because it has no cost to us and the aggressors 'll lose their dec isk. |
Isaac Lobo
Tec-IV
0
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Posted - 2014.07.23 04:46:00 -
[7] - Quote
Alavaria Fera wrote:Must be their research pos.
Or perhaps now we should say compression pos?
Hmm, it makes more sense now. So, the purpose of wardec is to destroy POSes?
CONS - They can turn it off and keep it in station until wardec is over.
PRO - They will lost the income from it until war is over
You made me think about the planetary stuff. There is a lot of ISK in it from taxes income of a good high sec manufacture planet. Maybe more isk than moon goo if you take into account that the slots to factories in planets are infinity. |
Solecist Project
Mew Age Outpaws
3439
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Posted - 2014.07.23 05:55:00 -
[8] - Quote
Isaac Lobo wrote:Cannibal Kane wrote:So what you are saying is....
If I wardec your corp none of your members will leave or move to another corp.
Will test that soon. That is the point, they 'll probably move because it has no cost to us and the aggressors 'll lose their dec isk. No........................
He's talking about *you*. http://residentoutlaw.tumblr.com - Sniping groups of small NPCs and gankers effectively. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
8087
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Posted - 2014.07.23 06:00:00 -
[9] - Quote
Isaac Lobo wrote:Cannibal Kane wrote:So what you are saying is....
If I wardec your corp none of your members will leave or move to another corp.
Will test that soon. That is the point, they 'll probably move because it has no cost to us and the aggressors 'll lose their dec isk.
Lol, no. He knows that full well already, being who he is and all.
What he meant is that he will be wardeccing you. Since it's Cannibal Kane, good luck with that. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Clean Up Local 2014.-á |
Isaac Lobo
Tec-IV
0
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Posted - 2014.07.23 06:29:00 -
[10] - Quote
Scipio Artelius wrote:Get out of highsec. No wardec necessary.
Problem solved.
However, there have been many threads on this subject and yes, I think the general consensus is that it is a broken mechanic that people can just drop Corp and move to an alt Corp/NPC Corp or just reform the same Corp again. Others think just being able to wardec any Corp is a broken mechanic too. So broken both ways I guess.
I dont think 0.0 or low sec is necessarily dangerous than high sec. There are places in 0.0 that people will never gonna see someone that is not blue to them. All this discussion about "get out of high sec" is just stupid. People of both sides needs to understand that null, low, and high sec are different in many ways and each one of them has it particularities. For example, who is in most dangerous situation? Someone hauling 5bi in assets through dodixie - jita pipe, or a big alliance hauling the same assets through their empty-blue space?
I think that people that try to compare null, low and high are having a tremendously wrong perspective. I lived in null for enough time to get tired of it, it gets too freaking boring after a year and half. Now i'm trying to understand high sec mechanics, and it's huge and different.
About war decs, i think that the goon girl made me think it straight. The POCOs can provide more ISK through taxes than some low null sec moon goo. |
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Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
6253
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Posted - 2014.07.23 06:34:00 -
[11] - Quote
Isaac Lobo wrote:Now i'm trying to understand high sec mechanics, and it's huge and different.
About war decs, i think that the goon girl made me think it straight. The POCOs can provide more ISK through taxes than some low null sec moon goo. In highsec, you have to deal with RvB blobs instead of pandemic legion blobs, though.
Should be interesting... the pocos are a decent contribution to their income I think ^^ Delicious goon ((tech nerf, siphon, drone assist, supercap)) tears.
Taking a wrecking ball to the futile hopes and broken dreams of skillless blobbers. |
Don Purple
327
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Posted - 2014.07.23 08:34:00 -
[12] - Quote
Why not :D I am just here to snuggle. |
Ramona McCandless
The McCandless Clan
6352
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Posted - 2014.07.23 08:43:00 -
[13] - Quote
To avoid CONCORD involvement
That is the only reason Wardecs exist "Many have joined the battle, many have survived the tests and trials, but countless have fallen because they weren't the sharpest, the fastest thinking, the most devious, the most ruthless or most intelligent. -áLog in and Compete!"-á- CCP Falcon
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J'Poll
CDG Playgrounds
4167
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Posted - 2014.07.23 08:59:00 -
[14] - Quote
No need to suicide, just go on a safari Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy
Ever wanted to PvP but can't find people to fly with. Look no further and this chat: Redemption Road |
Adrie Atticus
The Shadow Plague The Bastion
174
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Posted - 2014.07.23 09:24:00 -
[15] - Quote
Cannibal Kane wrote:So what you are saying is....
If I wardec your corp none of your members will leave or move to another corp.
Will test that soon.
This gon be guud. |
Dally Lama
Republic University Minmatar Republic
91
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Posted - 2014.07.23 12:42:00 -
[16] - Quote
There is a thread open right now about restricting the ability to post with NPC alts.
This thread is pretty much why that will never happen. New Fitting Window | Distances above 10km | Maximums for buy orders |
Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari End of Life
2221
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 12:46:00 -
[17] - Quote
Isaac Lobo wrote:I dont think 0.0 or low sec is necessarily dangerous than high sec. I wasn't discussing the danger (or otherwise) or low and null either.
You are whining about wardec mechanics and complaining that you can't effectively agress a Corp.
That's only a highsec problem. If you want to agress a Corp and not have to worry about wardec mechanics, get out of highsec. Come Win At Eve - Join The Vendunari
. -á<- Argue this, not this ->-á( -í-¦ -£-û -í-¦) |
Solecist Project
Mew Age Outpaws
3524
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Posted - 2014.07.23 12:56:00 -
[18] - Quote
Scipio Artelius wrote:Isaac Lobo wrote:I dont think 0.0 or low sec is necessarily dangerous than high sec. I wasn't discussing the danger (or otherwise) or low and null either. You are whining about wardec mechanics and complaining that you can't effectively agress a Corp. That's only a highsec problem. If you want to agress a Corp and not have to worry about wardec mechanics, get out of highsec. Listen to this handsome man... :)
http://residentoutlaw.tumblr.com - Sniping groups of small NPCs and gankers effectively. |
Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari End of Life
2221
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 13:03:00 -
[19] - Quote
Dally Lama wrote:There is a thread open right now about restricting the ability to post with NPC alts. This thread is pretty much why that will never happen. Nah. I post stupid comments all the time and happily do it on my main.
Other than my reputation, nothing else has disappeared as a result. Come Win At Eve - Join The Vendunari
. -á<- Argue this, not this ->-á( -í-¦ -£-û -í-¦) |
Isaac Lobo
Tec-IV
1
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 13:20:00 -
[20] - Quote
Scipio Artelius wrote:Isaac Lobo wrote:I dont think 0.0 or low sec is necessarily dangerous than high sec. I wasn't discussing the danger (or otherwise) or low and null either. You are whining about wardec mechanics and complaining that you can't effectively agress a Corp. That's only a highsec problem. If you want to agress a Corp and not have to worry about wardec mechanics, get out of highsec.
I came to the conclusion that the problem is not the war dec system, but what i was expecting from it. High Sec Wardec is a mechanic focused in structures and control of the slots of those structures, not in ship vs ship pew pew. What i was doing, and most of people are, is trying to use a spoon to cut an orange, so everybody thinks it's broken when it's not.
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Ramona McCandless
The McCandless Clan
6363
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Posted - 2014.07.23 13:29:00 -
[21] - Quote
Isaac Lobo wrote:What i was doing, and most of people are, is trying to use a spoon to cut an orange, so everybody thinks it's broken when it's not.
Tenille: Tell me, young man, what do you want out of life? [While Tenille was speaking, Homer was busy trying to reach a bowl of peas from the center of the table.] Homer: I want peas! Tenille: We all want peace! But it's always just out of reach. Homer: [moans] Uh huh? Tenille: So, what's the best way to get peace? Homer: With the knife! Tenille: Exactly! Not with the olive branch, but the bayonet! Ha, ha, Simpson, you're like the son I never had. Homer: And you're like the father I never visit. "Many have joined the battle, many have survived the tests and trials, but countless have fallen because they weren't the sharpest, the fastest thinking, the most devious, the most ruthless or most intelligent. -áLog in and Compete!"-á- CCP Falcon
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Schmata Bastanold
Black Rebel Rifter Club The Devil's Tattoo
2272
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Posted - 2014.07.23 13:45:00 -
[22] - Quote
Wardecs are not focused on structures, they are simply bribes for Concord to not get involved with you shooting people. And wardecs happen also in lowsec when somebody flaps their mouth too laud while humping undocks under protection of station sentries. And wardecs happen also to null/wh corps in order to mess with their logistic chains in empire space. Not to mention pure inconvenience of having to constantly change corps if aggressor happens to have deep pockets and just wants to frakk with you for sh!ts and giggles.
You apparently expected targeted corp to obediently undock and give you fights you wanted. People rarely do what you want them to do unless you force them. Eve Online Overview Wizard: Forum thread Homepage
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Ramona McCandless
The McCandless Clan
6363
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Posted - 2014.07.23 13:47:00 -
[23] - Quote
Schmata Bastanold wrote:Wardecs are not focused on structures, they are simply bribes for Concord to not get involved with you shooting people. And wardecs happen also in lowsec when somebody flaps their mouth too laud while humping undocks under protection of station sentries. And wardecs happen also to null/wh corps in order to mess with their logistic chains in empire space. Not to mention pure inconvenience of having to constantly change corps if aggressor happens to have deep pockets and just wants to frakk with you for sh!ts and giggles.
You apparently expected targeted corp to obediently undock and give you fights you wanted. People rarely do what you want them to do unless you force them.
All of this, plus if you are lucky, you can WD a corp with a lot of members whose CEO hasnt seen fit to educate them as to why mining during a war is beyond imbecilic. "Many have joined the battle, many have survived the tests and trials, but countless have fallen because they weren't the sharpest, the fastest thinking, the most devious, the most ruthless or most intelligent. -áLog in and Compete!"-á- CCP Falcon
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Velicitia
Arma Artificer
2422
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Posted - 2014.07.23 13:53:00 -
[24] - Quote
Ramona McCandless wrote:Schmata Bastanold wrote:Wardecs are not focused on structures, they are simply bribes for Concord to not get involved with you shooting people. And wardecs happen also in lowsec when somebody flaps their mouth too laud while humping undocks under protection of station sentries. And wardecs happen also to null/wh corps in order to mess with their logistic chains in empire space. Not to mention pure inconvenience of having to constantly change corps if aggressor happens to have deep pockets and just wants to frakk with you for sh!ts and giggles.
You apparently expected targeted corp to obediently undock and give you fights you wanted. People rarely do what you want them to do unless you force them. All of this, plus if you are lucky, you can WD a corp with a lot of members whose CEO hasnt seen fit to educate them as to why mining during a war is beyond imbecilic.
or an alliance of the same, whose XO kicks out the "loudmouths" who're telling the afore-mentioned carebears why they're beyond daft for doing that ... while said "loudmouth" is being bitched out for not "saving" the carebear when the enemy gang was overpowering even before you added in their (non-neutral) logi.
edit -- yeah, I really can spell. One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia |
Malcolm Shinhwa
Northstar Cabal Tactical Narcotics Team
2699
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Posted - 2014.07.23 15:13:00 -
[25] - Quote
Isaac Lobo wrote: I dont think 0.0 or low sec is necessarily dangerous than high sec. There are places in 0.0 that people will never gonna see someone that is not blue to them.
I would love to know where that is. Or did you just make that up because you saw someone else say something like that in GD?
If we're not supposed to shoot pods in hisec, why are they filled with meat? |
Anne Dieu-le-veut
Natl Assn for the Advancement of Criminal People
139
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Posted - 2014.07.23 15:24:00 -
[26] - Quote
Dally Lama wrote:There is a thread open right now about restricting the ability to post with NPC alts. This thread is pretty much why that will never happen.
I don't think it would be much of a big deal for dedicated forum warrior alts that never undock to spend 1.6M ISK to make a corp to continue shiptosting. |
Vol Arm'OOO
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
265
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Posted - 2014.07.23 15:36:00 -
[27] - Quote
Scipio Artelius wrote:Get out of highsec. No wardec necessary.
Problem solved.
However, there have been many threads on this subject and yes, I think the general consensus is that it is a broken mechanic that people can just drop Corp and move to an alt Corp/NPC Corp or just reform the same Corp again. Others think just being able to wardec any Corp is a broken mechanic too. So broken both ways I guess.
War decs are certainly broken, but not for the reason that people can dodge the dec. CCP cant force people to fight, just the way they cant force people to play. If CCP made it so you couldnt drop corp during a dec, etc. . ., all people would do to avoid the dec if they dont want to fight is to not undock and play on an alt or worse from ccp's standpoint, not log in at all and play something else.
The basic problem with war decs is that there is no incentive involved in the dec for the defender to actually fight. Unless the defending corp has poco's or pos'es (which they dont wish to take down) there is simply no reason for them to engage in the dec. If you want war decs to be effective in high sec, there has to be game mechanics for corp's to actually be able to own and control things which can then be destroyed by other corporations. Poco's were a step in the right direction, but to correct the deficiencies of the war dec mechanics more needs to be done.
I don't play, I just fourm warrior. |
Isaac Lobo
Tec-IV
2
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Posted - 2014.07.23 15:38:00 -
[28] - Quote
Vol Arm'OOO wrote:Scipio Artelius wrote:Get out of highsec. No wardec necessary.
Problem solved.
However, there have been many threads on this subject and yes, I think the general consensus is that it is a broken mechanic that people can just drop Corp and move to an alt Corp/NPC Corp or just reform the same Corp again. Others think just being able to wardec any Corp is a broken mechanic too. So broken both ways I guess. War decs are certainly broken, but not for the reason that people can dodge the dec. CCP cant force people to fight, just the way they cant force people to play. If CCP made it so you couldnt drop corp during a dec, etc. . ., all people would do to avoid the dec if they dont want to fight is to not undock and play on an alt or worse from ccp's standpoint, not log in at all and play something else. The basic problem with war decs is that there is no incentive involved in the dec for the defender to actually fight. Unless the defending corp has poco's or pos'es (which they dont wish to take down) there is simply no reason for them to engage in the dec. If you want war decs to be effective in high sec, there has to be game mechanics for corp's to actually be able to own and control things which can then be destroyed by other corporations. Poco's were a step in the right direction, but to correct the deficiencies of the war dec mechanics more needs to be done.
i agree with you sir |
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
5631
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Posted - 2014.07.23 18:21:00 -
[29] - Quote
The odd time I log in on Mr Epeen I find that I have been in a number of wars.
Definitely something wrong with the mechanic (or maybe the dumb asses deccing forum alts).
Mr Epeen There are 86,400 seconds in a day. You just saved one of them by typing 'u' instead of 'you'.-á Congratulations, dumbass! |
J'Poll
CDG Playgrounds
4169
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 19:43:00 -
[30] - Quote
Malcolm Shinhwa wrote:Isaac Lobo wrote: I dont think 0.0 or low sec is necessarily dangerous than high sec. There are places in 0.0 that people will never gonna see someone that is not blue to them.
I would love to know where that is. Or did you just make that up because you saw someone else say something like that in GD?
That's easy:
Polaris. Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy
Ever wanted to PvP but can't find people to fly with. Look no further and this chat: Redemption Road |
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