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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 3 post(s) |
Omar Alharazaad
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
247
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Posted - 2014.07.26 16:00:00 -
[61] - Quote
The 'newbie' target was a toon that was nearly seven years old. While it's possible, even probable, that they were bought in the character bazaar.... that argument isn't going to hold much water.
Edit: Dammit Ralph, GTFO of my head. |
Sibyyl
Gallente Federation
4078
|
Posted - 2014.07.26 16:02:00 -
[62] - Quote
Kaaeliaa wrote:ITT: socially inept psychopaths defending other socially inept psychopaths.
/popcorn Haaai girrlie. Ya wanna go grab sum drinkks?? Leewwwl .. when everything else is gone .. |
Lucas Kell
Internet Terrorists SpaceMonkey's Alliance
3886
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Posted - 2014.07.26 16:03:00 -
[63] - Quote
Sibyyl wrote:Lucas Kell wrote:Yes, I'm sure the newbie target was not at all baited into attacking. Remember, Sohkar was not forced to go into the bonus room, he "chose to engage". And in both your examples, the victim alone is responsible for what's happening to them. I don't disagree, yet in one case Erotica 1 got banned. So it follows that if the rules are being enforced consistently that the aggressor should be banned in this case, as in both cases the intent was to upset the target.
The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog. Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list. Chrysus Industries - Savings made simple!
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Lucas Kell
Internet Terrorists SpaceMonkey's Alliance
3886
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Posted - 2014.07.26 16:05:00 -
[64] - Quote
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:Lucas Kell wrote:Ralph King-Griffin wrote:you are missing the part about this NOT being a gank, it was a limited engagement , the orca Pilot chose to engage. Yes, I'm sure the newbie target was not at all baited into attacking. Remember, Sohkar was not forced to go into the bonus room, he " chose to engage". that toon is from 2007.11.02 One could safely assume they were aware of the aggression mechanics. A 7 year old character with a years worth of SP. Clearly they didn't know the mechanics otherwise they wouldn't have engaged and wouldn't have wondered why they couldn't warp. Assumptions are the mother of all fuckups.
The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog. Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list. Chrysus Industries - Savings made simple!
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Maekchu
Black Rebel Rifter Club The Devil's Tattoo
41
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Posted - 2014.07.26 16:05:00 -
[65] - Quote
Kaaeliaa wrote:ITT: socially inept psychopaths defending other socially inept psychopaths.
/popcorn I'm upset and feel offended by this comment.
Guys, hold me back or I'll get this guy banned, cause I am incapable of ignoring the internet.
Is this how we play now?
Anyway, my opinion on the matter is still the same. I don't find the linked conversation in anyway abusive and should just be ignored.
I don't think this case was as extreme as the E1.
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Fer'isam K'ahn
None Of One
237
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Posted - 2014.07.26 16:05:00 -
[66] - Quote
Lucas Kell wrote: So it follows that if the rules are being enforced consistently that the aggressor should be banned in this case, as in both cases the intent was to upset the target.
Upseting a target is harassment and punishable ??? WOW, in PVP game ???
Are you sure your issues aren't elsewhere ?! |
Sibyyl
Gallente Federation
4078
|
Posted - 2014.07.26 16:08:00 -
[67] - Quote
Lucas Kell wrote:Sibyyl wrote:Lucas Kell wrote:Yes, I'm sure the newbie target was not at all baited into attacking. Remember, Sohkar was not forced to go into the bonus room, he "chose to engage". And in both your examples, the victim alone is responsible for what's happening to them. I don't disagree, yet in one case Erotica 1 got banned. So it follows that if the rules are being enforced consistently that the aggressor should be banned in this case, as in both cases the intent was to upset the target. Erotica 1 wasn't banned for in-game harassment.
Because of Ripard's blog and the firestorm it generated, E1 had become a perception liability for CCP. To use a political term, "the optics didn't look good on this one". The ban may have been positioned as a reprimand for harrassing behavior, but the truth is the whole affair made CCP look bad in the public eye.
I do think that within a company's purview they have a right to incise anything they perceive to be a threat to the brand or the company's future. E1 happened to be standing on the wrong side of this matter. .. when everything else is gone .. |
Sibyyl
Gallente Federation
4078
|
Posted - 2014.07.26 16:10:00 -
[68] - Quote
Lucas Kell wrote:A 7 year old character with a years worth of SP. Clearly they didn't know the mechanics otherwise they wouldn't have engaged and wouldn't have wondered why they couldn't warp. Assumptions are the mother of all fuckups.
You get kicked out of "Rookie Help" after 30 days. I think after 30 days anything and everything inside the game mechanics is fair play. .. when everything else is gone .. |
Lucas Kell
Internet Terrorists SpaceMonkey's Alliance
3886
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Posted - 2014.07.26 16:12:00 -
[69] - Quote
Fer'isam K'ahn wrote:Lucas Kell wrote: So it follows that if the rules are being enforced consistently that the aggressor should be banned in this case, as in both cases the intent was to upset the target. Upseting a target is harassment and punishable ??? WOW, in PVP game ??? Upsetting someone isn't, but purposely trying to upset someone that is already upset is. CCP made it pretty clear that if someone is clearly upset you should back off, not purposely push them further over the edge.
The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog. Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list. Chrysus Industries - Savings made simple!
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Lucas Kell
Internet Terrorists SpaceMonkey's Alliance
3886
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Posted - 2014.07.26 16:15:00 -
[70] - Quote
Sibyyl wrote:Erotica 1 wasn't banned for in-game harassment. It was in character, the only difference was the method of communication. If it had happened on EVE-voice it would have been treated the same. They drew the line on this one and they need to consistently enforce that. Or will this only get looked at if someone starts posting it to major news sites? The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog. Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list. Chrysus Industries - Savings made simple!
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Lucas Kell
Internet Terrorists SpaceMonkey's Alliance
3886
|
Posted - 2014.07.26 16:17:00 -
[71] - Quote
Sibyyl wrote:Lucas Kell wrote:A 7 year old character with a years worth of SP. Clearly they didn't know the mechanics otherwise they wouldn't have engaged and wouldn't have wondered why they couldn't warp. Assumptions are the mother of all fuckups.
You get kicked out of "Rookie Help" after 30 days. I think after 30 days anything and everything inside the game mechanics is fair play. So after 30 days, I can follow you around, ganking bumping and insulting you for all eternity? No matter how upset you get? I think you'll find CCP rules don't simply stop once you hit the 30 day mark. You can't even repeatedly follow someone around and bump them in loads of different systems, so you damn well can't hunt someone down to attack them simply because you know they are upset in real life and want to upset them more. The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog. Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list. Chrysus Industries - Savings made simple!
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Riot Girl
You'll Cowards Don't Even Smoke Crack
3368
|
Posted - 2014.07.26 16:17:00 -
[72] - Quote
Kaaeliaa wrote:ITT: socially inept psychopaths defending other socially inept psychopaths.
/popcorn
Why can't you sympathise with psychopaths? Are you a hypocrite?
Oh god. |
Ralph King-Griffin
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
3227
|
Posted - 2014.07.26 16:17:00 -
[73] - Quote
Lucas Kell wrote:Fer'isam K'ahn wrote:Lucas Kell wrote: So it follows that if the rules are being enforced consistently that the aggressor should be banned in this case, as in both cases the intent was to upset the target. Upseting a target is harassment and punishable ??? WOW, in PVP game ??? Upsetting someone isn't, but purposely trying to upset someone that is already upset is. CCP made it pretty clear that if someone is clearly upset you should back off, not purposely push them further over the edge. Distressed was the word used Lucas,distressed is covered under harassment. Upset is covered with HTFU. "Confirming EVE is hot, batshit crazy, and puts out." -Omar Alharazaad "CAKE CANNOT HOLD UP TO BEING A CHARACTER DAMNIT." --áUnsuccessful At Everything |
Riot Girl
You'll Cowards Don't Even Smoke Crack
3368
|
Posted - 2014.07.26 16:18:00 -
[74] - Quote
Lucas Kell wrote:Sibyyl wrote:Erotica 1 wasn't banned for in-game harassment. It was in character, the only difference was the method of communication. If it had happened on EVE-voice it would have been treated the same. They drew the line on this one and they need to consistently enforce that. Or will this only get looked at if someone starts posting it to major news sites? You clearly don't know what Erotica 1 was banned for.
Oh god. |
Sibyyl
Gallente Federation
4090
|
Posted - 2014.07.26 16:18:00 -
[75] - Quote
Lucas Kell wrote:Sibyyl wrote:Erotica 1 wasn't banned for in-game harassment. It was in character, the only difference was the method of communication. If it had happened on EVE-voice it would have been treated the same. They drew the line on this one and they need to consistently enforce that. Or will this only get looked at if someone starts posting it to major news sites? The bolded part of your post is the damage that Ripard did, in my opinion, to the community. Making news articles as a CSM member should never have been used (or vindicated) as a platform for pursuing an account ban. .. when everything else is gone .. |
Maekchu
Black Rebel Rifter Club The Devil's Tattoo
42
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Posted - 2014.07.26 16:20:00 -
[76] - Quote
Lucas Kell wrote:Sibyyl wrote:Erotica 1 wasn't banned for in-game harassment. It was in character, the only difference was the method of communication. If it had happened on EVE-voice it would have been treated the same. They drew the line on this one and they need to consistently enforce that. Or will this only get looked at if someone starts posting it to major news sites? It's true, that we need to draw a line in the sand at some point. In personally, I didn't mind E1 getting banned, since I thought that was maybe past the line.
But the case in the OP, is not even close to the whole E1 incident. At least, that is my assessment. |
Omar Alharazaad
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
249
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Posted - 2014.07.26 16:20:00 -
[77] - Quote
Eveboard has them at over 22mil sp. that's far more than a year's worth. I don't have any personal grudges in here, but speaking as someone who has been blapped for a goodly chunk of their net worth in the past, and subsequently ragequit... then came back for more, I find the arguments against this activity hollow. Sorry, but Faylee didn't force the target to open fire. They had a wide range of options available to them, yet they chose violence and it ended poorly for them. That sucks, but it's EVE.
7 out of 8 bears run like hell when they see someone go suspect near them. The alleged 'victim' here chose to be the 1 in 8 that opens fire. Their choice, their consequences. This happened over two hours after the initial tear-filled thread was started... plenty of time for the 'victim' to either take a chill pill, get laid, log out, or all of the above. |
Dave Stark
6673
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Posted - 2014.07.26 16:21:00 -
[78] - Quote
after reading the short and uneventful pastebin.
i have no idea how you even thought it was anywhere near harassment. although xenodc should really be banned, i'm pretty sure "given a healthy dose of radiator in head and crotch" is basically a real life threat? |
Belt Scout
Thread Lockaholics Anonymous
568
|
Posted - 2014.07.26 16:21:00 -
[79] - Quote
Omar Alharazaad wrote:Edit: Dammit Ralph, GTFO of my head.
That's an uncanny gift Ralph has.
.
They say most of your brain shuts down on the EvE forums. All but the impatient side, and the sarcastic side. No wonder I'm still awake. |
Sibyyl
Gallente Federation
4090
|
Posted - 2014.07.26 16:22:00 -
[80] - Quote
Lucas Kell wrote:So after 30 days, I can follow you around, ganking bumping and insulting you for all eternity? No matter how upset you get? I think you'll find CCP rules don't simply stop once you hit the 30 day mark. You can't even repeatedly follow someone around and bump them in loads of different systems, so you damn well can't hunt someone down to attack them simply because you know they are upset in real life and want to upset them more. Yes, CCP provides Locator Agents in game so you can find somebody. The situation you mention in OP doesn't indicate that Faylee had repeatedly followed the so-called victim. Bumping someone is CCP endorsed game play (I don't think I need to link you Falcon's official statement on it, do I?).
The last part of your statement. I think it would be impossible for you to prove that Faylee is attacking the so-called victim for the reasons you state. .. when everything else is gone .. |
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Lucas Kell
Internet Terrorists SpaceMonkey's Alliance
3886
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Posted - 2014.07.26 16:23:00 -
[81] - Quote
Riot Girl wrote:Lucas Kell wrote:Sibyyl wrote:Erotica 1 wasn't banned for in-game harassment. It was in character, the only difference was the method of communication. If it had happened on EVE-voice it would have been treated the same. They drew the line on this one and they need to consistently enforce that. Or will this only get looked at if someone starts posting it to major news sites? You clearly don't know what Erotica 1 was banned for. Sure I do. E1 was banned for making Ripard Teg all mad by scamming people and asking them to sing songs. The way it was then presented by CCP is that E1 scammed him, he got upset, then instead of stopping E1 continued to push for more until the target got irate. In this case the aggressor saw the clearly upset player and then decided to specifically hunt them down and push them more until they got irate.
The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog. Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list. Chrysus Industries - Savings made simple!
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Kaaeliaa
Nighthawk Exploration Anoikis Ronin
6144
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Posted - 2014.07.26 16:24:00 -
[82] - Quote
Riot Girl wrote:Kaaeliaa wrote:ITT: socially inept psychopaths defending other socially inept psychopaths.
/popcorn Why can't you sympathise with psychopaths? Are you a hypocrite?
I sympathize with them.
People that get this much pleasure out of ruining someone else's day need psychological help, and I am perfectly happy to see my taxes go to making treatment available.
What these people DON'T need is a sanctioned outlet for their personality disorders. Adopted Dusette, Khanid Babe For you, LAGL: http://imgur.com/WZjoZbs Princess of Sibyyl's pillow fort: http://imgur.com/hqSYgUi My real portrait, courtesy of Queen Sibyyl: http://i.imgur.com/FyIjZyX.jpg |
Riot Girl
You'll Cowards Don't Even Smoke Crack
3370
|
Posted - 2014.07.26 16:26:00 -
[83] - Quote
Kaaeliaa wrote:People that get this much pleasure out of ruining someone else's day need psychological help. No they don't, you know absolutely **** all.
Oh god. |
Riot Girl
You'll Cowards Don't Even Smoke Crack
3370
|
Posted - 2014.07.26 16:27:00 -
[84] - Quote
Lucas Kell wrote:the aggressor saw the clearly upset player and then decided to specifically hunt them down and push them more until they got irate. Ah. Lucky the lawyers didn't get involved then. Oh god. |
Lucas Kell
Internet Terrorists SpaceMonkey's Alliance
3886
|
Posted - 2014.07.26 16:27:00 -
[85] - Quote
Sibyyl wrote:Lucas Kell wrote:So after 30 days, I can follow you around, ganking bumping and insulting you for all eternity? No matter how upset you get? I think you'll find CCP rules don't simply stop once you hit the 30 day mark. You can't even repeatedly follow someone around and bump them in loads of different systems, so you damn well can't hunt someone down to attack them simply because you know they are upset in real life and want to upset them more. Yes, CCP provides Locator Agents in game so you can find somebody. The situation you mention in OP doesn't indicate that Faylee had repeatedly followed the so-called victim. Bumping someone is CCP endorsed game play (I don't think I need to link you Falcon's official statement on it, do I?). You can go ahead and link Falcon's post if you want, but it would be better just to quote directly from the sticky in C&P:
Quote:However, persistent targeting of a player with bumping by following them around after they have made an effort to move on to another location can be classified as harassment, and this will be judged on a case by case basis.
Sibyyl wrote:The last part of your statement. I think it would be impossible for you to prove that Faylee is attacking the so-called victim for the reasons you state. The linked chatlog posted by Faylee, and the post it was originally linked on in C&P would seem to be proof enough.
The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog. Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list. Chrysus Industries - Savings made simple!
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Maekchu
Black Rebel Rifter Club The Devil's Tattoo
42
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Posted - 2014.07.26 16:28:00 -
[86] - Quote
Kaaeliaa wrote:Riot Girl wrote:Kaaeliaa wrote:ITT: socially inept psychopaths defending other socially inept psychopaths.
/popcorn Why can't you sympathise with psychopaths? Are you a hypocrite? I sympathize with them. People that get this much pleasure out of ruining someone else's day need psychological help, and I am perfectly happy to see my taxes go to making treatment available. What these people DON'T need is a sanctioned outlet for their personality disorders. I totally fap to tears.
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Kaaeliaa
Nighthawk Exploration Anoikis Ronin
6144
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Posted - 2014.07.26 16:28:00 -
[87] - Quote
Riot Girl wrote:Kaaeliaa wrote:People that get this much pleasure out of ruining someone else's day need psychological help. No they don't, you know absolutely **** all.
You should really see someone.
There's no shame in admitting you have a problem. Getting defensive about it isn't going to help anyone. Adopted Dusette, Khanid Babe For you, LAGL: http://imgur.com/WZjoZbs Princess of Sibyyl's pillow fort: http://imgur.com/hqSYgUi My real portrait, courtesy of Queen Sibyyl: http://i.imgur.com/FyIjZyX.jpg |
Riot Girl
You'll Cowards Don't Even Smoke Crack
3370
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Posted - 2014.07.26 16:29:00 -
[88] - Quote
Kaaeliaa wrote:You should really see someone.
There's no shame in admitting you have a problem. Getting defensive about it isn't going to help anyone. There is great shame in admitting you have an antisocial disorder. Society will shun you.
Oh god. |
Lucas Kell
Internet Terrorists SpaceMonkey's Alliance
3886
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Posted - 2014.07.26 16:30:00 -
[89] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:after reading the short and uneventful pastebin.
i have no idea how you even thought it was anywhere near harassment. although xenodc should really be banned, i'm pretty sure "given a healthy dose of radiator in head and crotch" is basically a real life threat? I'm pretty sure the ban would be ineffective. Since XenoDC was already clearly upset and then further pushed, I'd be surprised if he continue playing. But who needs the ACU count to go up right? We all love games filled with nobody but bots and trolls, they always go well.
The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog. Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list. Chrysus Industries - Savings made simple!
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Kaaeliaa
Nighthawk Exploration Anoikis Ronin
6144
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Posted - 2014.07.26 16:32:00 -
[90] - Quote
Riot Girl wrote:Kaaeliaa wrote:You should really see someone.
There's no shame in admitting you have a problem. Getting defensive about it isn't going to help anyone. There is great shame in admitting you have an antisocial disorder. Society will shun you.
Which is absolutely wrong and makes it extremely difficult for people that need help to get it.
When I said I had empathy for people with psychological disorders, I wasn't kidding, and there's a good reason for it. Adopted Dusette, Khanid Babe For you, LAGL: http://imgur.com/WZjoZbs Princess of Sibyyl's pillow fort: http://imgur.com/hqSYgUi My real portrait, courtesy of Queen Sibyyl: http://i.imgur.com/FyIjZyX.jpg |
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