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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 3 post(s) |
Anize Oramara
EVE Protection Agency Bloodline.
208
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Posted - 2014.08.06 04:25:00 -
[241] - Quote
It takes 16min give or take for a new player to get into a venture (I believe you get one free as one of the training mission rewards too)
However it takes over 18days to train into a T1 mining barge on a stock character, no implants. Not to mention the fact that mining barge can not be trained on trial accounts. Also from what I can remember from back when I started playing and knew nothing (had no one helping me) it took me over 10 days just to get 20mill.
Now when you have rewards like, what are you guys up to, 5 plex? people will do whatever it takes to win. Goons should be particularly familiar with that concept, doing everything possible within the game mechanics to win, and for that kind of prize(s) I can see people willing to toe/go over the line to win.
This means that while code is not directly saying that you should go into or around new player systems to get venture kills, that WOULD be a great place to run into ventures in the first place. specifically ventures that don't know to warp off so you don't have to worry about the built in warp core stabs either. Easy pickings.
See why I say code encourages EULA breaking? Now weather its consciously or not is not clear yet but the longer code encourages this behavior with this competition (and the lavish prizes that come with it) the longer it seems to point to a conscious effort from code's side.
That goes the same for CCP as well. The message will be pretty clear, CCP condones/allows new player griefing. |
Michael Ruckert
SECURE TRANSPORTS
172
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 04:29:00 -
[242] - Quote
Let me know when CODE has the steel balls for a Procurer/Skiff Kills Competition.
Oh wait. That would require skill and cognitive functions. "No matter how well you perform there's always somebody of intelligent opinion who thinks it's lousy." - Laurence Olivier |
Capt Starfox
Northstar Cabal Tactical Narcotics Team
748
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 05:25:00 -
[243] - Quote
Connor McNash wrote:As a new player who just subbed this week, and was killed in my Venture as a result of this competition, I want to let you know that I will be demanding a refund if CCP does not act on this competiton to grief new players. Ventures mining in Security 0.9 zones are not seasoned veterans. Some of my friends are also new players considering subscribing. I assure you, they are having second thoughts if this game sanctions griefing.
If you are a new player and you figured out these space forums even exist and you found the subtopic, then subthread that leads you to this wonderful player event, then you are on the right track, but you're probably an alt. Abandon all hope ye who x up in fleet
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~PsychoticMonkCSM9~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ |
Capt Starfox
Northstar Cabal Tactical Narcotics Team
748
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 05:28:00 -
[244] - Quote
Michael Ruckert wrote:Let me know when CODE has the steel balls for a Procurer/Skiff Kills Competition.
Oh wait. That would require skill and cognitive functions.
Trillions worth of dead Freighters isn't enough for you? Abandon all hope ye who x up in fleet
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~PsychoticMonkCSM9~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ |
TharOkha
0asis Group
904
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 06:25:00 -
[245] - Quote
Arkady Romanov wrote:Being shot in a game about shooting spaceships is not griefing. Welcome to Eve. I suggest you group up with your new friends and shoot back next time it happens.
Speaking about "groving up"...Im looking at hisec venture lossmails right now, Most of the victims are few days old characters with horrible fits (that means they are not experienced players bot alts, but true newbies)...
picking on newbies is serious "grow up" business i can say that . no wonder why EVE subs are decreasing among new players.
GOOD JOB *thumb up*
Next competition = rookie ships hunt..... YAY CODE. in a nutshell |
Anize Oramara
EVE Protection Agency Bloodline.
208
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 07:27:00 -
[246] - Quote
A quick check of zkillboard showed quite a few recent venture kills in rookie systems and at least one suicide gank (with an oracle of all things) of a few day old player in a rookie system. I did not check systems bordering rookie systems.
in many cases there were no or only isolated venture kills in rookie systems before this competition.
but i'm sure that has nothing to do with this, of course. |
Connor McNash
Light Force Rising Industries
0
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 08:05:00 -
[247] - Quote
Capt Starfox wrote:Connor McNash wrote:As a new player who just subbed this week, and was killed in my Venture as a result of this competition, I want to let you know that I will be demanding a refund if CCP does not act on this competiton to grief new players. Ventures mining in Security 0.9 zones are not seasoned veterans. Some of my friends are also new players considering subscribing. I assure you, they are having second thoughts if this game sanctions griefing.
If you are a new player and you figured out these space forums even exist and you found the subtopic, then subthread that leads you to this wonderful player event, then you are on the right track, but you're probably an alt.
Being new to a game does not mean I am new to gaming, or browsing forums for that matter. I AM new to EVE and am not an alt. I have friends who are experienced players, and they are guiding me to a degree, but they did not tell me what to do when a flashing red ship warps in and 2-shots me. There was absolutely no time for me to warp away if I even knew to...
I found the thread because someone in local chat made me aware of the competition and gave me a link.
What is the objective of this competition if not to deter new players from subscribing? You think this makes people excited to play? "Oh, I got killed by a player in a more powerful ship after I've been mining for the last 15 minutes, and lost half the stuff I had. Lets do that again! Yay! SO MUCH FUN FOR ME!" I promise you, that is not anyone's thought process...
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Anal Canal
The Conference Elite CODE.
12
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Posted - 2014.08.06 08:35:00 -
[248] - Quote
Connor McNash wrote:As a new player who just subbed this week, and was killed in my Venture as a result of this competition, I want to let you know that I will be demanding a refund if CCP does not act on this competiton to grief new players. Ventures mining in Security 0.9 zones are not seasoned veterans. Some of my friends are also new players considering subscribing. I assure you, they are having second thoughts if this game sanctions griefing.
Have you considered going the other direction and attempting to win the prize perchance? First place I am sure will easily pay for you and friend for a couple months. |
Anal Canal
The Conference Elite CODE.
12
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 08:42:00 -
[249] - Quote
Anize Oramara wrote:A quick check of zkillboard showed quite a few recent venture kills in rookie systems and at least one suicide gank (with an oracle of all things) of a few day old player in a rookie system. I did not check systems bordering rookie systems.
in many cases there were no or only isolated venture kills in rookie systems before this competition.
but i'm sure that has nothing to do with this, of course.
This logic is moot after the PLEX hauling venture, the 50Mill Scram Venture, and the random other faction Venture... Yeah I am sure you will say blah blah rookie system, but as the rules have been stated, we are not accepting that. The top runners as of now have 0 kills in (and I am almost willing to bet the vague 'around') so all I can say is TALLY-HO!
Also does anyone else like Ice Soccer?
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Connor McNash
Light Force Rising Industries
0
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Posted - 2014.08.06 08:48:00 -
[250] - Quote
Anal Canal wrote:Connor McNash wrote:As a new player who just subbed this week, and was killed in my Venture as a result of this competition, I want to let you know that I will be demanding a refund if CCP does not act on this competiton to grief new players. Ventures mining in Security 0.9 zones are not seasoned veterans. Some of my friends are also new players considering subscribing. I assure you, they are having second thoughts if this game sanctions griefing.
Have you considered going the other direction and attempting to win the prize perchance? First place I am sure will easily pay for you and friend for a couple months.
I don't see the point. Why would I want to pick fights with ships that have zero chance to defend themselves? What kind of player versus player environment is that? There is zero skill involved and is a competition to grief the most players!
It's like taking a gun to a martial arts tournament and killing the competition with bullets. Sure, they could have been better martial artists and worn bullet proof vests, but who plans for that? You are no better than a gunman in an elementary school! |
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Arkady Romanov
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
458
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 08:59:00 -
[251] - Quote
Connor McNash wrote:I don't see the point. Why would I want to pick fights with ships that have zero chance to defend themselves? What kind of player versus player environment is that? There is zero skill involved and is a competition to grief the most players!
It's like taking a gun to a martial arts tournament and killing the competition with bullets. Sure, they could have been better martial artists and worn bullet proof vests, but who plans for that? You are no better than a gunman in an elementary school!
You are laboring under the misunderstanding that the intended combat is supposed to be fair (fair in this case having the very narrow meaning of; being aware that they are being targetted, and in ships of roughly equal combat ability).
The vast majority of EVE combat is not "fair," regardless of whether the target is armed or not. If it is "fair," you've done something wrong.
Also, please don't compare the non consensual explosion of imaginary spaceships to the very real tragedy of school shootings. It is disgraceful. |
Connor McNash
Light Force Rising Industries
0
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 09:23:00 -
[252] - Quote
Arkady Romanov wrote:
Also, please don't compare the non consensual explosion of imaginary spaceships to the very real tragedy of school shootings. It is disgraceful.
Perhaps I did step out of line with that comparison and my intention was not to downplay the tragedy of such an event.
Nontheless, this sort of competition plays on a situation where a vulnerable mining frigate piloted by an inexperience player falls prey to an experienced pilot in an advanced gunship.
Arkady Romanov wrote:
You are laboring under the misunderstanding that the intended combat is supposed to be fair (fair in this case having the very narrow meaning of; being aware that they are being targetted, and in ships of roughly equal combat ability).
The vast majority of EVE combat is not "fair," regardless of whether the target is armed or not. If it is "fair," you've done something wrong.
So enlighten me. What should new players do in this situation? If it were you, and you had no idea what EVE was about, only to be targeted multiple times by gunboats and lose ISK... What would you do?
I am supposed to join them in the competition to grief new players? My only other options are to put off mining for a month until this competition ends (which is actually a reason for a lot of players come to EVE), or to quit.
What is this competition trying to prove? Who the best griefer is? I hope the winner comes complete with 3.5 billion ISK ban stick. |
Arkady Romanov
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
458
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 09:33:00 -
[253] - Quote
Connor McNash wrote:So enlighten me. What should new players do in this situation? If it were you, and you had no idea what EVE was about, only to be targeted multiple times by gunboats and lose ISK... What would you do?
I am supposed to join them in the competition to grief new players? My only other options are to put off mining for a month until this competition ends (which is actually a reason for a lot of players come to EVE), or to quit.
What is this competition trying to prove? Who the best griefer is? I hope the winner comes complete with 3.5 billion ISK ban stick.
There are many things you can do;
1. Learn the difference between non consensual PVP and griefing as CCP defines it under the TOS and EULA. Insisting this event is griefing only makes you look whiny and ignorant.
2. Learn who are likely to be targeting you (Hint; anybody in CODE. is a good start) and make sure that if they are in the same system as you, you leave.
3. Learn how to use d-scan. If there is a catalyst on short range scan; warp off somewhere else.
4. Learn to use the map to identify where ships have been destroyed and don't be there when you want to mine.
5. Don't be predictable. There are many systems you can mine in. Don't go to the same one every time
6. Avoid any systems that are on the "shortest" route on the map between the major trade centres.
7. If a ship appears in your belt, see if a little laser shoots from it, to you. They are scanning your ship, and people with guns will be along shortly. Run.
8. Lay a trap. Sit in a cheap, disposable ship. Wait for a ganker to come and blow you up. When he appears, shoot him (if he has very bad standings, and he probably will; you'll be able to legally shoot him even before he starts shooting you).
9. Fly with friends to help you do the above, or act as scouts.
10. Share information with your friends. If you know that a ganker is in a certain system, share that information with them, and ask them to do the same.
11. Find other means of earning ISK. Have you tried running missions? You will specifically not be targetted under this Venture venture (ho ho!) and if another type of ganker comes along, at least you'll be armed.
12. Make friends with a large corporation who you can mine in a group with, who know how to mine with appropriate defense systems in place.
There you go. Literally a dozen things you could do in this situation. |
Anize Oramara
EVE Protection Agency Bloodline.
208
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 09:46:00 -
[254] - Quote
Griefing new players is against the eula. that is all there is to it. You're kinda sol when ccp doesnt seem to care though. im sure their numbers show its better financially to keep the players that grief over getting new players to stay in the game long enough to learn the dozens of things needed to perform the simplest of actions without dieing to suicide gankers; mine in a rookie system. |
Arkady Romanov
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
458
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 09:48:00 -
[255] - Quote
Anize Oramara wrote:Griefing new players is against the eula. that is all there is to it. You're kinda sol when ccp doesnt seem to care though. im sure their numbers show its better financially to keep the players that grief over getting new players to stay in the game long enough to become real eve players.
In one ear, and out the other. |
Derrick Miles
EVENumbers
656
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 10:38:00 -
[256] - Quote
So I was bored today and out of a morbid sense of curiosity decided to look up how many new pilots have been killed by this event. Turns out it took a lot longer than I expected. Since the start of the event a total of 136 venture pilots under two weeks old have been killed in high sec.
There is a clear statement in this thread that CCP is against the griefing of rookies. And yet, many would say that actions speak louder than words and so far CODE. has been griefing new players and CCP has done nothing. |
Arkady Romanov
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
458
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 10:45:00 -
[257] - Quote
How many were killed monthly over the last 6 months, and what was their average age, just for comparison's sake? |
Anize Oramara
EVE Protection Agency Bloodline.
208
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 10:57:00 -
[258] - Quote
Arkady Romanov wrote:How many were killed monthly over the last 6 months, and what was their average age, just for comparison's sake? That's comparing apples to oranges. What you should be asking is how many ventures were killed in the same amount of time (taking the starting point as the beginning of each month if you want multiple data points) that were piloted by 2week old or younger pilots.
Gotta keep things consistent or you're just trying to redirect, deflect and divert. |
Arkady Romanov
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
458
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 11:00:00 -
[259] - Quote
If it wasn't clear that I was interested in their average age *at the time of their death* then I apologize for my vagueness. |
Derrick Miles
EVENumbers
664
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 11:04:00 -
[260] - Quote
Arkady Romanov wrote:How many were killed monthly over the last 6 months, and what was their average age, just for comparison's sake? Going through 6 days of data alone was mind-numbing so I'm not sure I have it in me to look through 6 months. Just a casual browse through seems to show a lot less kills overall per day, not even accounting for the age of the pilot though. |
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TharOkha
0asis Group
904
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 12:36:00 -
[261] - Quote
Anal Canal wrote:Connor McNash wrote:As a new player who just subbed this week, and was killed in my Venture as a result of this competition, I want to let you know that I will be demanding a refund if CCP does not act on this competiton to grief new players. Ventures mining in Security 0.9 zones are not seasoned veterans. Some of my friends are also new players considering subscribing. I assure you, they are having second thoughts if this game sanctions griefing.
Have you considered going the other direction and attempting to win the prize perchance? First place I am sure will easily pay for you and friend for a couple months.
Maybe he doesn't want to be a bottom feeder of EVE?
CODE. in a nutshell |
Owen Levanth
Sagittarius Unlimited Exploration
227
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 12:44:00 -
[262] - Quote
TharOkha wrote:Anal Canal wrote:Connor McNash wrote:As a new player who just subbed this week, and was killed in my Venture as a result of this competition, I want to let you know that I will be demanding a refund if CCP does not act on this competiton to grief new players. Ventures mining in Security 0.9 zones are not seasoned veterans. Some of my friends are also new players considering subscribing. I assure you, they are having second thoughts if this game sanctions griefing.
Have you considered going the other direction and attempting to win the prize perchance? First place I am sure will easily pay for you and friend for a couple months. Maybe he doesn't want to be a bottom feeder of EVE?
If he is mining, then he already is. |
TharOkha
0asis Group
904
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 13:10:00 -
[263] - Quote
Owen Levanth wrote:TharOkha wrote:Anal Canal wrote:Connor McNash wrote:As a new player who just subbed this week, and was killed in my Venture as a result of this competition, I want to let you know that I will be demanding a refund if CCP does not act on this competiton to grief new players. Ventures mining in Security 0.9 zones are not seasoned veterans. Some of my friends are also new players considering subscribing. I assure you, they are having second thoughts if this game sanctions griefing.
Have you considered going the other direction and attempting to win the prize perchance? First place I am sure will easily pay for you and friend for a couple months. Maybe he doesn't want to be a bottom feeder of EVE? If he is mining, then he already is.
If he will be mining after one year of subscription then yes, he will be a bottom-feeder.
But mining in early days of EVE is not, as it is giving you a substantial amount of isk income (from the newbie point of view)
On the other hand..... Shooting few weeks old newbies in rookie mining ships is bottom feeding at its full glory
So... enjoy this "special Olympics of EVE" contest
CODE. in a nutshell |
Arkady Romanov
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
458
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 13:13:00 -
[264] - Quote
I strongly discourage new players from mining because that is time spent training into skills that do not translate into spaceships exploding, which is far more entertaining and exciting for new (and old) players.
TharOkha wrote:So... enjoy this "special Olympics of EVE" contest
This is stupid and offensive and demeans the achievements of people who spend their lives training to compete in sporting endeavours. How many Olympic medals have you won? |
TharOkha
0asis Group
904
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 13:23:00 -
[265] - Quote
Arkady Romanov wrote:I strongly discourage new players from mining because that is time spent training into skills that do not translate into spaceships exploding, which is far more entertaining and exciting for new (and old) players. TharOkha wrote:So... enjoy this "special Olympics of EVE" contest This is a stupid and offensive slur against Olympians and demeans the achievements of people who spend their lives training to compete in sporting endeavours. How many Olympic medals have you won?
Its hilarious to read such pathetic words from person who is bottom feeding on newbies
CODE. in a nutshell |
Lan Wang
Coreli Corporation Ineluctable.
62
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 13:27:00 -
[266] - Quote
Arkady Romanov wrote:I strongly discourage new players from mining because that is time spent training into skills that do not translate into spaceships exploding, which is far more entertaining and exciting for new (and old) players. TharOkha wrote:So... enjoy this "special Olympics of EVE" contest This is stupid and offensive and demeans the achievements of people who spend their lives training to compete in sporting endeavours. How many Olympic medals have you won?
yeah because killing a week old venture pilot sounds real exciting and great encouragement for new players to even want to pvp, all i see this doing is killing any new players encouragement to even subscribe to the game, so great work you sound like your a l33t pvper
EVEALON Creative --áLogo Design | Killboard Banners | -áWeb Design | Website Graphics -á
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Derrick Miles
EVENumbers
684
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 13:28:00 -
[267] - Quote
TharOkha wrote:Arkady Romanov wrote:I strongly discourage new players from mining because that is time spent training into skills that do not translate into spaceships exploding, which is far more entertaining and exciting for new (and old) players. TharOkha wrote:So... enjoy this "special Olympics of EVE" contest This is a stupid and offensive slur against Olympians and demeans the achievements of people who spend their lives training to compete in sporting endeavours. How many Olympic medals have you won? Its hilarious to read such pathetic words from person who is bottom feeding on newbies I'm not sure which words you're referring to, but as someone who has volunteered with the Special Olympics I can say I have a great deal of respect for the kids who compete in it. If you find their effort funny instead of admirable then it's your loss. |
admiral root
Red Galaxy
1510
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 13:33:00 -
[268] - Quote
TharOkha wrote:Its hilarious to read such pathetic words from person who is bottom feeding on newbies
LMFAO. I think he's got you there, Arkady. It's not like you belong to one of the most newbie-friendly groups in Eve or anything. No, your rights end in optimal+2*falloff |
TharOkha
0asis Group
905
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 13:39:00 -
[269] - Quote
Derrick Miles wrote: I'm not sure which words you're referring to, but as someone who has volunteered with the Special Olympics I can say I have a great deal of respect for the kids who compete in it. If you find their effort funny instead of admirable then it's your loss.
If im comparing this EVE contest to "special Olympics" and its contestants to "mentally disabled persons", that doesn't mean that i making fun of RL disabled persons.
its like saying that i hate kids just because i said to someone that he is acting like a kid.
Please stop spinning my posts ok?
CODE. in a nutshell |
Anize Oramara
EVE Protection Agency Bloodline.
208
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 14:55:00 -
[270] - Quote
goons are experts at spinning posts and diverting. when facts and numbers are shown they will grasp at any post they can to divert attention. that is why it is best to stay away from emotion filled posts and especially not to use metaphors or similes as they are particularly easy to turn negatively (as per the special Olympics topic, rather low even for a goon :/ )
if you want to make a point, post numbers and facts and first hand experiences, not easily corrupted metaphors or opinions. |
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