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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 5 post(s) |
Phoenix Jones
Isogen 5
651
|
Posted - 2014.08.09 16:04:00 -
[241] - Quote
Rei Moon wrote:Yes, make it crittable but not collapsible, I see, i like it, but still, will this prevent blobs? Maybe make it crit with 30 frig jumps, then it will have delayed regen. meaning, if you jump your enyo fleet, you'll only retreat after 2 hours.
Is it possible for a frigate fleet of 200 to jump though in the current wormhole mechanics (even a c1 wormhole). Yes.
This is just something specific to frigates. Over the lifetime of the frig hole, you could potentially bring a frigate blob.
But you can also do that now.
Yaay!!!! |
Faren Shalni
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
19
|
Posted - 2014.08.09 16:43:00 -
[242] - Quote
Phoenix Jones wrote:Rei Moon wrote:Yes, make it crittable but not collapsible, I see, i like it, but still, will this prevent blobs? Maybe make it crit with 30 frig jumps, then it will have delayed regen. meaning, if you jump your enyo fleet, you'll only retreat after 2 hours. Is it possible for a frigate fleet of 200 to jump though in the current wormhole mechanics (even a c1 wormhole). Yes. This is just something specific to frigates. Over the lifetime of the frig hole, you could potentially bring a frigate blob. But you can also do that now.
W-Space just contracted Herpes's (or more specifically Harpy's) |
Launch Probe
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
1
|
Posted - 2014.08.09 18:11:00 -
[243] - Quote
Small frig only whs, could be interesting. Simular to c1 bc or lower whs. However unlimited mass is a bad idea. If you allow a null connection allow hs and ls as well. Other wise make it strickly wh to wh random spawns, that can only be accessed by frigs. Allowing heavy dictors is a bad idea, or else make it cruiser or lower wh instead.
Cruiser or lower good. Frig or lower good. heavy dictor plus frig bad. unlimited mass bad. wh to wh pluss null bad. wh to wh pluss hs, ls, null good. wh to wh only good. UNLIMITED MASS BAD defeats the whole purpose of whs.
|
Isidril
Homocidal Pacifists Unsuitable
0
|
Posted - 2014.08.09 18:17:00 -
[244] - Quote
After reading CCP Fozzie's long preamble about how they're not against WH residents, it seems most of the changes they're making are providing incentive for the majority WH residents to move out.
In general the changes they're attempting to make are targeted at increasing WH traffic and PVP. The uncloseable frig WH is a perfect example. As most folks noted above, this doesn't help the WH resident because they're not going to put their 1bil clone in a 50mil frig and even if they could swap clones, most WH residesnts are still unlikely to go frig roaming. It does however enable null corps to blob WH corps.
Before CCP introduces a series of changes that are generally intended to increase the opportunity for PVP encounters, they need to ask themselves who lives in WH space and why (assuming CCP in genuine in wanting to keep players in WH space).
Based on my several years of experience in WH space (I've lived in a C2, C3 & C5), I would argue that most WH corps are small corps who wanted a section of eve they could call their own. With the exception of a few large WH alliances (and I really mean only a few, most who live in WH space know who these large alliances are and have them watchlisted), the average WH corp is not a hardcore PVP corp. Many live in WH for the good PVE and industrial capabilities. That dosen't mean they don't enjoy PVP, they're just not looking for it 24/7. I would argue that for those who live in WH space, it provides the perfect balance of PVE & PVP. They can make decent isk in PVE with an acceptable level of risk and they get PVP on a fairly consistent basis as well.
The proposed changes throw this balance out of whack. None of the small WH corps (the vast majority) are going to mine or run anomalies with these nearly unlimited mass frig holes open (or can't safely close hostile holes). As it stands I almost never see miners in WH space anymore when I'm hunting due to the changes made to grav sigs a while back. Without a consistent flow of isk, these corps will be unable to fuel their POSs and hence will be forced to pack up their bags and leave.
I enjoy WH PVP. I want more of it. If anything, I need CCP to reduce the risk so that more people are willing to move into WH space and give me more targets to kill. As it stands today, it's not difficult to get a fight once you've found a target, the challenge is finding a target. The challenge of finding targets isn't due to a lack of connections (I usually have more in the chain than I have time to scan). It's due to a lack of active players. These changes will push most of the existing WH corps out of their system and there will not be a flood of PVP centric corps to fill the void. Hardcore PVP corps already have vast swaths of space in EVE (all of Nullsec & most of lowsec) and the challenges of living in WH space outweighs the benefits for these folks.
If CCP wants to increase the activity in WH space, I think they're going about it entirely the wrong way. Think about your target segment. Who are they? Why do they live in WH space? How do we entice even more like them to do the same? How do we increase their level of activity? |
epicurus ataraxia
Lazerhawks
971
|
Posted - 2014.08.09 23:33:00 -
[245] - Quote
Isidril wrote:After reading CCP Fozzie's long preamble about how they're not against WH residents, it seems most of the changes they're making are providing incentive for the majority WH residents to move out.
In general the changes they're attempting to make are targeted at increasing WH traffic and PVP. The uncloseable frig WH is a perfect example. As most folks noted above, this doesn't help the WH resident because they're not going to put their 1bil clone in a 50mil frig and even if they could swap clones, most WH residesnts are still unlikely to go frig roaming. It does however enable null corps to blob WH corps.
Before CCP introduces a series of changes that are generally intended to increase the opportunity for PVP encounters, they need to ask themselves who lives in WH space and why (assuming CCP in genuine in wanting to keep players in WH space).
Based on my several years of experience in WH space (I've lived in a C2, C3 & C5), I would argue that most WH corps are small corps who wanted a section of eve they could call their own. With the exception of a few large WH alliances (and I really mean only a few, most who live in WH space know who these large alliances are and have them watchlisted), the average WH corp is not a hardcore PVP corp. Many live in WH for the good PVE and industrial capabilities. That dosen't mean they don't enjoy PVP, they're just not looking for it 24/7. I would argue that for those who live in WH space, it provides the perfect balance of PVE & PVP. They can make decent isk in PVE with an acceptable level of risk and they get PVP on a fairly consistent basis as well.
The proposed changes throw this balance out of whack. None of the small WH corps (the vast majority) are going to mine or run anomalies with these nearly unlimited mass frig holes open (or can't safely close hostile holes). As it stands I almost never see miners in WH space anymore when I'm hunting due to the changes made to grav sigs a while back. Without a consistent flow of isk, these corps will be unable to fuel their POSs and hence will be forced to pack up their bags and leave.
I enjoy WH PVP. I want more of it. If anything, I need CCP to reduce the risk so that more people are willing to move into WH space and give me more targets to kill. As it stands today, it's not difficult to get a fight once you've found a target, the challenge is finding a target. The challenge of finding targets isn't due to a lack of connections (I usually have more in the chain than I have time to scan). It's due to a lack of active players. These changes will push most of the existing WH corps out of their system and there will not be a flood of PVP centric corps to fill the void. Hardcore PVP corps already have vast swaths of space in EVE (all of Nullsec & most of lowsec) and the challenges of living in WH space outweighs the benefits for these folks.
If CCP wants to increase the activity in WH space, I think they're going about it entirely the wrong way. Think about your target segment. Who are they? Why do they live in WH space? How do we entice even more like them to do the same? How do we increase their level of activity? There is a lot of sense in what you say. I do not share you view that things will be as black as you believe, but you have hit one concept square on the head. PVP is only a viable activity in a Vibrant space, If people are not encouraged to be there, then there is no life.
The philosophy of trying to make it so that PVE players are easier to kill so that PVP players stay around and roam, and maybe meet each other only works If PVE players are willing to sit around and be victims.
That does not actually work beyond the first sugar rush, and each attempt leads to less and less life and vibrancy.
The actual effect that works, Is build good PVE and the Players come, the reward is worth the risk if it is not made unrealistic for PVE players and you have more life, and PVP follows.
Good PVE= Good PVP
But each time you increase the risk, without increasing the benefit the opposite happens and PVP dies.
I know that EVE is at it's core a PVP game, but those who wish to make it more and more hard and less and less enjoyable for PVE players are just going to end up with empty space.
I am sure there are many in CCP that understand this and look beyond Giving PVP players a quick short term rush.
There is one EvE. Many people. Many lifestyles. WE are EvE |
Lyron-Baktos
Hard Knocks Inc.
455
|
Posted - 2014.08.10 03:04:00 -
[246] - Quote
Not looking forward to Frigate Online making its way to WHs How the **** do you remove a signature? |
Siege Torpedo
Brave Newbies Inc. Brave Collective
4
|
Posted - 2014.08.10 06:13:00 -
[247] - Quote
You know that it's only a matter of time now before every wormhole from the lowliest C1 to Polaris is overrun by a thousand meta0 fit atrons, don't you? |
Bibosikus
Flowery Twats
195
|
Posted - 2014.08.10 10:11:00 -
[248] - Quote
While the main concern is about the new low mass limit holes for frigs, I'd like to point out from the dev blog..
"We will be significantly increasing the spawn rate of all the existing wormholes that originate in W-space, as well as adding a whole new class of random wormholes with unique properties."
I'd very much like to know just how significantly please, since this change more than any other has the potential to turn the current wh meta on its head.
Eagles may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines.
|
Phoenix Jones
Isogen 5
661
|
Posted - 2014.08.10 12:17:00 -
[249] - Quote
Siege Torpedo wrote:You know that it's only a matter of time now before every wormhole from the lowliest C1 to Polaris is overrun by a thousand meta0 fit atrons, don't you?
I get the fear, I'm also looking at the masses currently.
Current max amount of frigate and destroyer ships that can enter a c1, 250 (yes you can fit 250 combat fit frigates and destroyers into a c1) Current max amount of frigates and destroyers that can enter a c6 null, 2,000 (its a 3 bil hole)
The issue is flow / flood control. Yaay!!!! |
Kireitsugu Secheh
Les chips electriques
13
|
Posted - 2014.08.10 15:12:00 -
[250] - Quote
Bibosikus wrote:While the main concern is about the new low mass limit holes for frigs, I'd like to point out from the dev blog..
"We will be significantly increasing the spawn rate of all the existing wormholes that originate in W-space, as well as adding a whole new class of random wormholes with unique properties."
I'd very much like to know just how significantly please, since this change more than any other has the potential to turn the current wh meta on its head.
significantly Like this : http://i.imgur.com/HllCqZL.png How to clone swap in worm holes |
|
Legion40k
Boa Innovations Brothers of Tangra
82
|
Posted - 2014.08.10 16:25:00 -
[251] - Quote
Kireitsugu Secheh wrote:Bibosikus wrote:While the main concern is about the new low mass limit holes for frigs, I'd like to point out from the dev blog..
"We will be significantly increasing the spawn rate of all the existing wormholes that originate in W-space, as well as adding a whole new class of random wormholes with unique properties."
I'd very much like to know just how significantly please, since this change more than any other has the potential to turn the current wh meta on its head.
significantly Like this : http://i.imgur.com/HllCqZL.png
Lol. um, well I've been scanning chains the past few days and haven't seen any increase of random wh spawns at all. Obviously there's no K162's around and I'm not scanning a huge sample but all I've seen is static after static. Starting in C5 > c5 > c5 > c5 > c6 > c6 > c6 got nothing except a lowsec today. |
Agatir Solenth
Servants of the Throne Worlds
13
|
Posted - 2014.08.10 17:02:00 -
[252] - Quote
As an EvE player since 2005, and a long time denizen of wormholes that: 1.Was one of the first pilots, that move into a wormhole when they were introduced; 2.Was part of an experienced wormhole corp that got evicted by a much larger corp/alliance; 3.Was part of a small alliance that tried to rent from one of the larger ones, only to be evicted by yet again another larger force; 4.Moved back to wormhole space, and flew with one of the larger PvP alliances, that evicted other wormhole groups from space, only to watch the alliance crumble due to drama; 5.Left the larger groups to start up my own smaller band of wormhole dwellers; and 6.Currently inhabits a C2 with a band of close friends.
I play EVE because I love the sandbox. I love to feel that I can control my destiny in this game. I love solo to mid-sized gang pvp (1-30 pilots each side). That is why I keep going back to wormhole space.
Now let me explain why I greatly DISAGREE with the proposed changes (Creating more random wormholes & adding special small ship un-collapsible wormholes):
#1 The proposed changes ONLY benefit larger corps/alliances.
#2 The proposed changes significantly increase the risk to small corps/alliances, with NO increase or reward.
#3 These changes combined with the proposed change to the mass-based-spawn-distance-after-wormhole-jumps amplify the risk and diminishes the feeling of control for small corps/alliances.
One of the greatest benefits of wormhole space is knowing the mechanics, and having the ability to use those mechanics to ones advantage. This advantage is directly related to being able to collapse a wormhole, or put enough mass through so that it diminishes the likely hood of someone else (or more pilots) coming through. This gives smaller groups a feeling that they can have some control of their space. It allows them feel that they can control the level of risk. That is precisely what brought them from High-Sec to W-Space (more risk, but more reward).
By increasing the amount of wormholes that can spawn, only increases the risk. For larger groups especially those in higher class wormholes (many of which are PvP corps/alliances) the level of risk is insignificant. They have the numbers to quickly and safely crash any connection they donGÇÖt want. If they sustain any losses they generally have the ability to easily support ship replacements programs, or individually generate the ISK in higher level sites to cover any losses. Smaller groups will now be required to spend more time collapsing wormholes than engaging in the activities that they came to W-space to take part in. If they feel that increase in risk is too great, they will either log off, or move out of W-space (neither a good option for the W-space game). Having 3-4 wormhole connections in my C2 are more common than you think. Why would a small corp/alliance want or need more? Or is it because you want the larger PvP corps/alliances to be happy? How happy are they going be with less targets in W-space? Additionally larger groups already have the ability to rage roll and flood a chain with scouts grants them ability to look for fights, they donGÇÖt need to create another chain to be scouted (they create them at will).
By having wormholes that only allow smaller signature ships, with little to no possibility of collapse only benefits those corps/alliances with the greater numbers. This totally removes a wormhole dwellers feeling of being able to mitigate the risk. (Notice I keep say feeling, because it isnGÇÖt reality) If I was a tinfoil wearing type, IGÇÖd have to think that this is the one proposed change that CCP is taking money from the Goons to make happen. This change would allow them the ability to grief all wormhole residents. All they would need is to seed one scanning alt into any wormhole alliances home, and wait for this new wormhole to open into null. Once found it would become BURN [Insert J-Signature Here] DAY. This kind of stupidity that cause players to log off! Less people online = less fun. Granting the ability to use null-sec tactics (blobing) in wormhole space is NOT the kind of changes that will make wormhole space better. It takes away the uniqueness of the W-space, that we who live & play thereGǪ Enjoy!
|
Kuya Third
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
2
|
Posted - 2014.08.10 17:34:00 -
[253] - Quote
More random wormholes? Uh .. as if there arent enough yet. Small corps will not have the time anymore to do PvE, or do you really think they are so stupid and field their shiny PvE ships connections in any directions anyway? In combination with the new k-162 mechanic its gank haven ;D If you implement those frigatte wormholes to stress us little guys, could ya plz also implement uncloseables for the big ones?? I don't get it. Why is it the intention to kick the small corps out? |
Chicken Exroofer
Regional Assault and Recon
24
|
Posted - 2014.08.11 00:43:00 -
[254] - Quote
Kuya Third wrote:More random wormholes? .................................................................................... I don't get it. Why is it the intention to kick the small corps out?
The "intention" isn't to kick the small corps out, but that is one thing that will happen.
The intention is to let bored blue donut folks IN. Same as big spawn distances if you try to collapse normal holes. To feed easy kills to people.
Although the appeal of parking a cloaky scan alt in every nulsec I get a connection to and leaving him there for 16 hours has appeal. If by some miracle he got blown up, a no-implant alt in a heron is no big loss, They can't be collapsed so you could just go to work or whatever and take them home at the end of the day.
If they can come in, we can go out. |
Andiedeath
Sefem Velox Swift Angels Alliance
268
|
Posted - 2014.08.11 04:40:00 -
[255] - Quote
These new WHs sound like awesome fun. Cant wait for the first one to spawn between us an a W-R... Ooooo The pretty explosions.... I can see them now... Director Swift Angels Alliance https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3247397#post3247397 INGAME CHANNEL: Sefem Public |
ISK Lord
Negative Density No Response
11
|
Posted - 2014.08.11 07:27:00 -
[256] - Quote
Excellent idea - anything that promotes more PvP with ship classes other than T3 gangs is good for W-Space.
SHIP CLASS FIGHT ISSUE...
Problem:
I think the only flaw in the proposed model is the fact that there is nothing to stop those on the other end of these new small holes bringing what they like to the fight (as has been pointed out by several people). i.e. a handful of T3s with a few logi will melt a big frig/destroyer gang.
Solution:
I'd suggest that these small holes are only warpable by frigates and destroyers (I'd prevent HICs as well as will be OP). This way you have a grid either side of the hole where only your little ships can play. Of course they can warp off from this grid and be engaged elsewhere in any given system. |
Elyas Crux
Sefem Velox Swift Angels Alliance
0
|
Posted - 2014.08.11 07:32:00 -
[257] - Quote
+1 This should be interesting and will open up new gameplay. |
Okropniak
Zabijaki i Pijaki YARRR and CO
1
|
Posted - 2014.08.11 09:07:00 -
[258] - Quote
Agatir Solenth wrote:As an EvE player since 2005, and a long time denizen of wormholes that: 1.Was one of the first pilots, that move into a wormhole when they were introduced; 2.Was part of an experienced wormhole corp that got evicted by a much larger corp/alliance; 3.Was part of a small alliance that tried to rent from one of the larger ones, only to be evicted by yet again another larger force; 4.Moved back to wormhole space, and flew with one of the larger PvP alliances, that evicted other wormhole groups from space, only to watch the alliance crumble due to drama; 5.Left the larger groups to start up my own smaller band of wormhole dwellers; and 6.Currently inhabits a C2 with a band of close friends.
I play EVE because I love the sandbox. I love to feel that I can control my destiny in this game. I love solo to mid-sized gang pvp (1-30 pilots each side). That is why I keep going back to wormhole space.
Now let me explain why I greatly DISAGREE with the proposed changes (Creating more random wormholes & adding special small ship un-collapsible wormholes):
#1 The proposed changes ONLY benefit larger corps/alliances.
#2 The proposed changes significantly increase the risk to small corps/alliances, with NO increase or reward.
#3 These changes combined with the proposed change to the mass-based-spawn-distance-after-wormhole-jumps amplify the risk and diminishes the feeling of control for small corps/alliances.
One of the greatest benefits of wormhole space is knowing the mechanics, and having the ability to use those mechanics to ones advantage. This advantage is directly related to being able to collapse a wormhole, or put enough mass through so that it diminishes the likely hood of someone else (or more pilots) coming through. This gives smaller groups a feeling that they can have some control of their space. It allows them feel that they can control the level of risk. That is precisely what brought them from High-Sec to W-Space (more risk, but more reward).
By increasing the amount of wormholes that can spawn, only increases the risk. For larger groups especially those in higher class wormholes (many of which are PvP corps/alliances) the level of risk is insignificant. They have the numbers to quickly and safely crash any connection they donGÇÖt want. If they sustain any losses they generally have the ability to easily support ship replacements programs, or individually generate the ISK in higher level sites to cover any losses. Smaller groups will now be required to spend more time collapsing wormholes than engaging in the activities that they came to W-space to take part in. If they feel that increase in risk is too great, they will either log off, or move out of W-space (neither a good option for the W-space game). Having 3-4 wormhole connections in my C2 are more common than you think. Why would a small corp/alliance want or need more? Or is it because you want the larger PvP corps/alliances to be happy? How happy are they going be with less targets in W-space? Additionally larger groups already have the ability to rage roll and flood a chain with scouts grants them ability to look for fights, they donGÇÖt need to create another chain to be scouted (they create them at will).
By having wormholes that only allow smaller signature ships, with little to no possibility of collapse only benefits those corps/alliances with the greater numbers. This totally removes a wormhole dwellers feeling of being able to mitigate the risk. (Notice I keep say feeling, because it isnGÇÖt reality) If I was a tinfoil wearing type, IGÇÖd have to think that this is the one proposed change that CCP is taking money from the Goons to make happen. This change would allow them the ability to grief all wormhole residents. All they would need is to seed one scanning alt into any wormhole alliances home, and wait for this new wormhole to open into null. Once found it would become BURN [Insert J-Signature Here] DAY. This kind of stupidity that cause players to log off! Less people online = less fun. Granting the ability to use null-sec tactics (blobing) in wormhole space is NOT the kind of changes that will make wormhole space better. It takes away the uniqueness of the W-space, that we who live & play thereGǪ Enjoy!
Totally agree. Just waiting for end of sub and going to suspend account till time they'll add something good for small gangs. |
Aureus Ahishatsu
Deadspace Knights
16
|
Posted - 2014.08.11 14:58:00 -
[259] - Quote
Isidril wrote:
I enjoy WH PVP. I want more of it. If anything, I need CCP to reduce the risk so that more people are willing to move into WH space and give me more targets to kill. As it stands today, it's not difficult to get a fight once you've found a target, the challenge is finding a target. The challenge of finding targets isn't due to a lack of connections (I usually have more in the chain than I have time to scan). It's due to a lack of active players. These changes will push most of the existing WH corps out of their system and there will not be a flood of PVP centric corps to fill the void. Hardcore PVP corps already have vast swaths of space in EVE (all of Nullsec & most of lowsec) and the challenges of living in WH space outweighs the benefits for these folks.
If CCP wants to increase the activity in WH space, I think they're going about it entirely the wrong way. Think about your target segment. Who are they? Why do they live in WH space? How do we entice even more like them to do the same? How do we increase their level of activity?
I had never thought about that but you are ultimately correct. The more PVE'ers are made vulnerable the less likely they are to present any target worth while.
Overall I don't understand this change. It doesn't really seem to have any benefit for WH dwellers at all. maybe if the wormholes had an exception to industry ships for hauling. then you could move stuff through wormholes without mass restrictions and carry frigate escorts. however a frigate only wormholes seems like something that only the mass number null sec corps will be able to utilize. most wormhole corps with 20 or less simultaneous players are not going to bother doing much with a frigate only wormhole. |
Gospadin
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
186
|
Posted - 2014.08.11 15:49:00 -
[260] - Quote
The frigate blob will not get used by a wormhole corp wanting to roam null, but it will get used by the nullsec blob who wants to get a thousand frigates or destroyers into a wormhole, knowing that it's impossible for them to get trapped.
Seems like another nerf for w-space corps to me.
|
|
Gospadin
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
186
|
Posted - 2014.08.11 15:50:00 -
[261] - Quote
Aureus Ahishatsu wrote:Isidril wrote:
I enjoy WH PVP. I want more of it. If anything, I need CCP to reduce the risk so that more people are willing to move into WH space and give me more targets to kill. As it stands today, it's not difficult to get a fight once you've found a target, the challenge is finding a target. The challenge of finding targets isn't due to a lack of connections (I usually have more in the chain than I have time to scan). It's due to a lack of active players. These changes will push most of the existing WH corps out of their system and there will not be a flood of PVP centric corps to fill the void. Hardcore PVP corps already have vast swaths of space in EVE (all of Nullsec & most of lowsec) and the challenges of living in WH space outweighs the benefits for these folks.
If CCP wants to increase the activity in WH space, I think they're going about it entirely the wrong way. Think about your target segment. Who are they? Why do they live in WH space? How do we entice even more like them to do the same? How do we increase their level of activity?
I had never thought about that but you are ultimately correct. The more PVE'ers are made vulnerable the less likely they are to present any target worth while. Overall I don't understand this change. It doesn't really seem to have any benefit for WH dwellers at all. maybe if the wormholes had an exception to industry ships for hauling. then you could move stuff through wormholes without mass restrictions and carry frigate escorts. however a frigate only wormholes seems like something that only the mass number null sec corps will be able to utilize. most wormhole corps with 20 or less simultaneous players are not going to bother doing much with a frigate only wormhole.
Especially since they originate in w-space, and K162s don't appear on warp anymore, no w-space corp will ever open their frigate pipe. Useless feature. |
Penny Ibramovic
Wormhole Engineers Greater Realms
160
|
Posted - 2014.08.11 16:12:00 -
[262] - Quote
Let's assume these new tiny-mass wormholes are introduced. Considering the severe restrictions on mass allowance in a single jump, will there be an obvious way to distinguish these wormholes from others that aren't so restrictive?
Most identification is currently achieved, I assume, by colour. C5/C6 wormholes will allow capitals, C4/C3/C2 allow up to Orcas, C1 won't allow battleships. This is fairly standard knowledge, able to be learnt quite quickly. I also assume that the new wormholes won't differ from the current ones in the way they are coloured.
Naturally, the new wormholes will get new designations. Will these differ from standard designations in a way that is suitably obvious, perhaps by breaking the one-letter/three-number designation? Perhaps two numbers instead, or all prefixed with an 'F'? How about the K162 side? Will these wormholes get a dedicated designation for their exit side?
Will the information screen give specific information about the mass restrictions on the new wormholes? The current wormholes don't include this information, and having to open the info panel for every K162 will get frustrating.
I understand that none of this information is available strictly within the client for current wormholes, but it is easily determined, learnt, and remembered. The new tiny-mass wormholes are significantly more restrictive, to the point where not even T3 scouts can pass through. Will it be a matter of continually bouncing off wormholes, to the point where it becomes frustrating, or will we eventually be able to determine the highly limited nature of these new wormholes from information we can see? |
epicurus ataraxia
Lazerhawks
985
|
Posted - 2014.08.11 16:28:00 -
[263] - Quote
Penny Ibramovic wrote:Let's assume these new tiny-mass wormholes are introduced. Considering the severe restrictions on mass allowance in a single jump, will there be an obvious way to distinguish these wormholes from others that aren't so restrictive?
Most identification is currently achieved, I assume, by colour. C5/C6 wormholes will allow capitals, C4/C3/C2 allow up to Orcas, C1 won't allow battleships. This is fairly standard knowledge, able to be learnt quite quickly. I also assume that the new wormholes won't differ from the current ones in the way they are coloured.
Naturally, the new wormholes will get new designations. Will these differ from standard designations in a way that is suitably obvious, perhaps by breaking the one-letter/three-number designation? Perhaps two numbers instead, or all prefixed with an 'F'? How about the K162 side? Will these wormholes get a dedicated designation for their exit side?
Will the information screen give specific information about the mass restrictions on the new wormholes? The current wormholes don't include this information, and having to open the info panel for every K162 will get frustrating.
I understand that none of this information is available strictly within the client for current wormholes, but it is easily determined, learnt, and remembered. The new tiny-mass wormholes are significantly more restrictive, to the point where not even T3 scouts can pass through. Will it be a matter of continually bouncing off wormholes, to the point where it becomes frustrating, or will we eventually be able to determine the highly limited nature of these new wormholes from information we can see?
All extremely good questions, I hope we get those answers soon. There is a good argument for making them all a new colour, because they are so very different. with a flash or stripe of the underlying class. A deep imperial purple would work as it is unlike any other, and dark enough to display the secondary colours. purple is also the shorter end of the visual spectrum, so would have a tenuous sort of link to lightweight wormholes. Just a thought. Hope it helps. There is one EvE. Many people. Many lifestyles. WE are EvE |
Jon Hellguard
X-COM
13
|
Posted - 2014.08.11 17:44:00 -
[264] - Quote
An additional way for scouts, okay - sounds good to me. But...
Frigs, destroyers and HICs. Well, i don't know. When I take my fleet out for hunting we look for other pvp'ers, casual victims, or fancy ships while they go against sleepers. For our fleet size, frigs and destroyers wont do the trick. So we can't really hunt the fishes. I know what a destroyer fleet can put out in terms of damage, but you are not speaking small gang anymore. And considering these wormholes to be almost un-closeable - I'm not looking forward to large frig/destryoer fleets that hunt.
W-Space has been a fun environment for my fleet as we often encounter similar sized fleets and solid prices ships would make some people cry seeing them blown up. We won't enjoy a faction-warfared w-space, so please CCP, consider these connections carefully.
In this topic as well as the c4 2nd static topic: is there no way you implement mechanics for you to slowly script your way to the right balance of spawning and wormhole attributes? Basically keep what we have and have dev-tools to tweak on tranquility week by week without deploying hard-mechanics? |
Lenroc Elisav
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
26
|
Posted - 2014.08.12 14:39:00 -
[265] - Quote
Was on the fence about this "feature" , small "uncollapsable" WHs I mean. I couldn't quite figure out why HICtors. Then it hit me, escalation farming fleets meet AF nullbear blobs with HICtors. Sturdy enough not to be killed by carrier drones the HICtor is a great addition to any AF blobby doctrine for killing WH capitals and not only while farming. Well played guys, well played!!!
P.S. Am I close? Common let me know if I'm at least worm . |
Ghaustyl Kathix
Rising Thunder
11
|
Posted - 2014.08.12 16:42:00 -
[266] - Quote
Adding my two cents, I don't agree with these regenerating, small-ship wormholes. They seem like a direct penalty to smaller wormhole groups in C1s through C3s. A 20-man wormhole corp living in a C2 won't be able to counter 30 interceptors from some null-sec alliance deciding to go on a roam to screw over some wormhole dwellers.
Changes like this make wormhole space more and more blobby. |
Kynric
Sky Fighters
152
|
Posted - 2014.08.12 17:06:00 -
[267] - Quote
Gospadin wrote: Especially since they originate in w-space, and K162s don't appear on warp anymore, no w-space corp will ever open their frigate pipe. Useless feature.
I will open these and hope that they will be fairly common. I am very much looking forward to trying out some new fleet concepts. |
Rek Seven
Probe Patrol Ixtab.
1723
|
Posted - 2014.08.12 18:23:00 -
[268] - Quote
How do frigate only wormholes allow you to try new fleet concepts out? +1 |
Kynric
Sky Fighters
152
|
Posted - 2014.08.12 18:44:00 -
[269] - Quote
Rek Seven wrote:How do frigate only wormholes allow you to try new fleet concepts out?
Seems rather obvious but if the existing fleet doesn't fit through the door a new fleet is on order even if it is not the same one I would normally call for. More opportunities to hunt, fight and roam are appreciated. Perhaps the other side will even fight occasionally since they will have a hull size flexibility which the attacker does not. |
Rek Seven
Probe Patrol Ixtab.
1723
|
Posted - 2014.08.12 18:58:00 -
[270] - Quote
Exactly. It's not like you are unable to fly frigates now... +1 |
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