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IIshira
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
1294
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Posted - 2014.08.11 05:14:41 -
[1] - Quote
I just found an interesting "feature" of the recent patch that allows you to fit but not online modules without the skill. You can fit rigs without any skill. Unlike modules rigs don't go "offline" you can also use them. You don't get reduction in drawbacks but some rigs lack drawbacks.
These are a few rigs with no drawbacks. CCP might as well remove the skill requirements all together.
Engineering rigs: Ancillary Current Router, Capacitor Control Circuit etc. Resource Processing rigs: Ice Harvester Accelerator, Salvage Tackle etc. Scanning rigs: Gravity Capacitor Upgrade
I'm sure I missed some rigs without drawbacks since I just did a quick look at the market. I'm just wondering if CCP thought of this before they made the change. If so why didn't they remove the skill requirements for some rigs that no longer need or benefit from skills?
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Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
2193
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Posted - 2014.08.11 06:14:37 -
[2] - Quote
Last I head, they were aware of the issue and considering adding drawbacks to more rigs. It's in one of the threadnaughts from F&I though I can't recall which one. Fozzie was the poster iirc. |
IIshira
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
1294
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Posted - 2014.08.11 06:44:37 -
[3] - Quote
Zhilia Mann wrote:Last I head, they were aware of the issue and considering adding drawbacks to more rigs. It's in one of the threadnaughts from F&I though I can't recall which one. Fozzie was the poster iirc. I hope they don't add drawbacks to fitting rigs because one huge drawback is you don't have a more useful rig in its place.
Perhaps make it where you can't install them without skills. That's what Jury Rigging was for anyways. Not to use the rigs. Maybe that's a coding issue to make them different than modules though.
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Jonas Staal
The Echo Initiative
70
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Posted - 2014.08.11 06:51:22 -
[4] - Quote
In the past you could already have a friend rig your ship for you. I don't see the difference. |
Jacob Holland
Weyland-Vulcan Industries
323
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Posted - 2014.08.11 07:08:39 -
[5] - Quote
The difference is that there is no longer a market for rigging services, no potential premium for rigged ships. |
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
4276
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Posted - 2014.08.11 10:26:02 -
[6] - Quote
IIshira wrote:I just found an interesting "feature" of the recent patch that allows you to fit but not online modules without the skill. You can fit rigs without any skill. Unlike modules rigs don't go "offline" you can also use them. You don't get reduction in drawbacks but some rigs lack drawbacks. This was announced by CCP.
See Skillless Module Fitting: Dev Blog - CCP Punkturis - 'Little Things' coming to EVE Online in Crius
IIshira wrote:These are a few rigs with no drawbacks. CCP might as well remove the skill requirements all together.
Engineering rigs: Ancillary Current Router, Capacitor Control Circuit etc. Resource Processing rigs: Ice Harvester Accelerator, Salvage Tackle etc. Scanning rigs: Gravity Capacitor Upgrade
I'm sure I missed some rigs without drawbacks since I just did a quick look at the market. I'm just wondering if CCP thought of this before they made the change. If so why didn't they remove the skill requirements for some rigs that no longer need or benefit from skills? All rigs that only require the Rigging skill do not have any drawbacks.
See the Dev Blog.
CCP Punkturis wrote:But some of the rigs have drawbacks when you donGÇÿt have the skills for them and in the future weGÇÿre thinking about adding drawbacks to more rigs. |
IIshira
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
1294
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Posted - 2014.08.11 13:02:40 -
[7] - Quote
Jonas Staal wrote:In the past you could already have a friend rig your ship for you. I don't see the difference. The difference is before they required a skill to fit. Now they don't but the skill is still listed as a requirement for the module. |
IIshira
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
1294
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Posted - 2014.08.11 13:32:43 -
[8] - Quote
Okay I found the dev blog remark about rigs. It's not much so I'll quote it here.
Quote:Rigs will also be fittable without skills because you can already fly ships with rigs fitted by your skilled friend. We know this means some people will be angry because they trained rig skills and feel like theyGÇÿve spent valuable skill training time on something that now doesnGÇÿt matter, and we get your point. But some of the rigs have drawbacks when you donGÇÿt have the skills for them and in the future weGÇÿre thinking about adding drawbacks to more rigs.
I don't CCP thought it through when they removed the skill requirement to fit modules and rigs. It works great for modules because you can't online them so without the skill they don't work. Rigs don't online...
Okay lets look at a T2 CCC for example. The "Requirements" tab lists Mechanics 3 and Jury Rigging 4. None of these skills are needed or have any effect on the rig so why are they still listed as a requirement?
Adding more drawbacks? Does a fitting rig really need a drawback? I would say the drawback is you're not fitting a more helpful rig. |
Dorian Wylde
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
475
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Posted - 2014.08.11 15:55:00 -
[9] - Quote
Jonas Staal wrote:In the past you could already have a friend rig your ship for you. I don't see the difference.
This. Also "a few" rigs with no drawbacks does not mean they should scrap the entire system. It's what, a couple engineering rigs? Compared to ALL the other ones? You don't burn your house down and start over just because one nail gets bent.
IIshira wrote: Adding more drawbacks? Does a fitting rig really need a drawback? I would say the drawback is you're not fitting a more helpful rig.
Considering how often CCCs are used, I doubt you'll find much traction at CCP with this argument. And before you say it, "I don't use them" is not a valid argument. |
IIshira
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
1294
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Posted - 2014.08.12 03:19:35 -
[10] - Quote
Dorian Wylde wrote:Jonas Staal wrote:In the past you could already have a friend rig your ship for you. I don't see the difference. This. Also "a few" rigs with no drawbacks does not mean they should scrap the entire system. It's what, a couple engineering rigs? Compared to ALL the other ones? You don't burn your house down and start over just because one nail gets bent. IIshira wrote: Adding more drawbacks? Does a fitting rig really need a drawback? I would say the drawback is you're not fitting a more helpful rig.
Considering how often CCCs are used, I doubt you'll find much traction at CCP with this argument. And before you say it, "I don't use them" is not a valid argument.
I've never said scrap the entire system. If anything make it where you can't fit rigs without the proper skill. Modules can stay as is...
So just because it's popular it needs to be nerfed? I really hate that train of thought that seems to be popular in Eve. Oh no people like ____ so lets nerf it till it's a worthless piece of Drake... I mean worthless piece of crap..
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Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
4276
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Posted - 2014.08.12 19:12:04 -
[11] - Quote
IIshira wrote:I don't CCP thought it through when they removed the skill requirement to fit modules and rigs. It works great for modules because you can't online them so without the skill they don't work. Rigs don't online... CCP was responding to a popular player request of enabling large numbers of ships to be easily fitted. CCP has already taken several steps to make this easier, and rigs was just another one. |
IIshira
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
1294
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Posted - 2014.08.12 23:00:41 -
[12] - Quote
Tau Cabalander wrote:IIshira wrote:I don't CCP thought it through when they removed the skill requirement to fit modules and rigs. It works great for modules because you can't online them so without the skill they don't work. Rigs don't online... CCP was responding to a popular player request of enabling large numbers of ships to be easily fitted. CCP has already taken several steps to make this easier, and rigs was just another one.
That's fine... I'm not against change. If you're going to make rigs not need any skills at least fix the outdated information in the item description. |
Daemun Khanid
Saeculari
18
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Posted - 2014.08.13 04:02:12 -
[13] - Quote
.
Daemun of Khanid
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IIshira
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
1294
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Posted - 2014.08.14 13:15:10 -
[14] - Quote
A man of few words |
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
1621
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Posted - 2014.08.14 21:37:54 -
[15] - Quote
IIshira wrote: That's fine... I'm not against change. If you're going to make rigs not need any skills at least fix the outdated information in the item description.
They answered this already. There is some behind the scenes tech requirement that the skill which affects drawbacks be under requirements. |
IIshira
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
1129
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Posted - 2014.08.14 23:08:00 -
[16] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:IIshira wrote: That's fine... I'm not against change. If you're going to make rigs not need any skills at least fix the outdated information in the item description.
They answered this already. There is some behind the scenes tech requirement that the skill which affects drawbacks be under requirements. With drones that have no drawbacks there is no secondary rigging skill that affects drawbacks. |
IIshira
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
1294
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Posted - 2014.08.14 23:08:57 -
[17] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:IIshira wrote: That's fine... I'm not against change. If you're going to make rigs not need any skills at least fix the outdated information in the item description.
They answered this already. There is some behind the scenes tech requirement that the skill which affects drawbacks be under requirements. With rigs that have no drawbacks there is no secondary rigging skill that affects drawbacks.
Edited: For some reason I typed "With drones that have no drawbacks there is..." I'm not sure if that was phone auto correct or me posting too early without coffee LOL |
Matcha Mosburger
Manu Fortius Bleak Horizon Alliance.
6
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Posted - 2014.08.14 23:36:03 -
[18] - Quote
The post explaining this "Feature" was up for some time, there was a good push to have them add "offline/online" instead of adding new drawbacks. Basically the player base didn't seem to make a big stink about it, and most wanted to fit rigs without skills so the push for a different option died.
They said all Rigs will receive drawbacks, including the fitting rigs will now have them. Also since anyone can fit any rig now, they feel T2 draw backs aren't quite enough since anyone can fit one now. So all rigs will have their draw backs increased and rebalanced for this new "feature".
I'm personally waiting for the drawbacks to happen, so then i can collect forum tears and live off of them when all the fittings get broken and people scream bloody murder. Then I'll laugh and collect more tears because i already trained the skills. People want instant benefit and just ignore the long term nerf even when warned... oh this isn't affecting me now, I don't care. |
Rain6637
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
23171
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Posted - 2014.08.17 21:27:48 -
[19] - Quote
Yeah here's something that happened yesterday: I replaced a reactor control with a Large ACR on two orcas, and fit more tank with bulkhead IIs. laughed at the no-skill rig thing, because it's a joke.
President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub | Twitter |-ámk.III | Imgur
| Evening Games Club: Casino concept redefined |
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Zan Shiro
Alternative Enterprises
515
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Posted - 2014.08.20 04:42:12 -
[20] - Quote
Matcha Mosburger wrote:The post explaining this "Feature" was up for some time, there was a good push to have them add "offline/online" instead of adding new drawbacks. Basically the player base didn't seem to make a big stink about it, and most wanted to fit rigs without skills so the push for a different option died.
They said all Rigs will receive drawbacks, including the fitting rigs will now have them. Also since anyone can fit any rig now, they feel T2 draw backs aren't quite enough since anyone can fit one now. So all rigs will have their draw backs increased and rebalanced for this new "feature".
I'm personally waiting for the drawbacks to happen, so then i can collect forum tears and live off of them when all the fittings get broken and people scream bloody murder. Then I'll laugh and collect more tears because i already trained the skills. People want instant benefit and just ignore the long term nerf even when warned... oh this isn't affecting me now, I don't care.
I had (type) rig 5 planned for some rigs anyway (at 4 across the board now anyway)...let the drawbacks come.
Also I hope some of these peeps eft/pyfa before they rush to the hubs. Weapons rigs...they can do a number on you, even if ftting skills maxed. For the shield tankers....best check those sig radii too. that stuff will have passive tank attract rounds/lasers/missiles like a magnet when the cdfe/purge gets slapped on. |
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lord xavier
Immortalis Inc. Shadow Cartel
22
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Posted - 2014.08.20 04:53:00 -
[21] - Quote
Jacob Holland wrote:The difference is that there is no longer a market for rigging services, no potential premium for rigged ships. No one half-way smart would pay for a "rigging service." They would ask a friend with rigging skills to 4, not trust a complete stranger with their ship. |
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