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Divus
Hybrid Syndicate
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Posted - 2006.07.24 14:41:00 -
[91]
the tounrnament was top-notch entertainment lads and gents! thanx for that - only one thing: do 5 1on1s if needed next time, not 1.
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Shayla Sh'inlux
Millennium
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Posted - 2006.07.24 14:46:00 -
[92]
Quote:
Your saying a ranis could catch a 8000m/s Crow?
Without Gistii MWD and without Skirmish Warfare 5? Show me how to do that.
Lol 8k/sec Crow o.0
Anyway, I think it's a shame that such a nice tournament is being ruined by having the finals be an inty 1v1 which basically is decided by the fitting of the ship.
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DB Preacher
Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2006.07.24 15:22:00 -
[93]
Edited by: DB Preacher on 24/07/2006 15:22:43
Originally by: Shayla Sh'inlux
Quote:
Your saying a ranis could catch a 8000m/s Crow?
Without Gistii MWD and without Skirmish Warfare 5? Show me how to do that.
Lol 8k/sec Crow o.0
Anyway, I think it's a shame that such a nice tournament is being ruined by having the finals be an inty 1v1 which basically is decided by the fitting of the ship.
Why would he show you how to do it?
If you can't work out how to do it yourself then don't expect anyone else to hand it on a silver platter for you.
Gunstar WAS going just under 8 k/s in his crow in that crow, we tested it in NOL just before the fight.
dbp
Current RKK Ranking: (PSCAL6) Proficient Short Tanto
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Crellion
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Posted - 2006.07.24 15:43:00 -
[94]
lol at those who believed it was a rail Crow. Guess none of you have ever flown one.
Rocket Crow would have weon it if he had snake implants. ASCN should have been prepared for this and have one ready given their tactics of choice.
No need for faction stuff to go 8km/s. I go 4700 before gang in a tanked Crow and have under perfect navigation skills with no snakes. With a set of Snakes (normal not low-grade) and a couple more lvl 5s thats 8km/s more or less.
Thats why I was sure that the char TWD would not be used (as opposed to what they thought in the studio) because he (I guess) had Halos fitted for the Ishkur and wouldnt throw them away and install a fresh set of Snakes.
I would like to comment on the commentators as well but I need to check my hotmail account first cause I suspect I might find something there regarding a post I made yesterday that appears to have been removed If I am wrong and my hotmail is clear I ll come back here, edit and let it rip
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Evil Thug
Rage and Terror
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Posted - 2006.07.24 21:43:00 -
[95]
Originally by: Medici
Originally by: Evil Thug
Originally by: j0sephine
Right, because day after day in every 1v1 encounter in EVE when single web + scrambler rocket crow meets blaster 'ranis, then it's _always_ the Crow that bites the dust.
Please :|
Depends on many factors. But i`d bet on taranis with 2 webs.
Your saying a ranis could catch a 8000m/s Crow? Not sure myself,thought ranis had a lower base speed and more mass?
I made that sentence bold. I meant rocket crow. Rocket crow = repair + plate in most cases. I beleive that you will be unable to reach 8km\s speed with 2 of your crow low slot wasted.
Rage and Terror - making people quit EVE. |
Gunstar Zero
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.07.24 22:08:00 -
[96]
Originally by: Shayla Sh'inlux
Quote:
Your saying a ranis could catch a 8000m/s Crow?
Without Gistii MWD and without Skirmish Warfare 5? Show me how to do that.
Lol 8k/sec Crow o.0
Anyway, I think it's a shame that such a nice tournament is being ruined by having the finals be an inty 1v1 which basically is decided by the fitting of the ship.
8k/s is reasonable easy to achieve.
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Robbie Boozecruise
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.07.24 22:17:00 -
[97]
when it comes to inti pilots in ASCN i can only think of 2 that stick out in my mind MrFix and Gazza29. both fly crows both extremly good at flying crows one prefers the rocket crow one prefers the standard launcher crow.
who would i have picked if bother were online???? Gazza only because he had a snake set in his head. But Fix has balls for stepping up and fighting and i hope he hasnt lost all them crows i give him yet when i used to fly with him
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Marcus Right
Minmatar
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Posted - 2006.07.25 05:04:00 -
[98]
Edited by: Marcus Right on 25/07/2006 05:06:35
Originally by: Leon 026 Edited by: Leon 026 on 24/07/2006 00:37:59
Yea, not sure where the *****ing and flaming that the guy had a 125mm rail came from. Its a standard rocket setup, not some off the wall railgun crow setup that people are imagining.
It's cause the commentators on the EveTV were phreaking out on air that he had "railguns" on his crow. So, every stupid n00b who doesn't know jack about crows or reall about PvP suddenly thinks they know more then the guy flying in the PvP match. After all, if the commentator says it's not right, it must be so.
-----
It's retarded that both of them got convo spammed. I heard and completely believe they both did. People were being idiots and/or trying to fix the match.
As for the person higher up in the chat that said something like, "If he was locked up how did he armor repair so many times then? Tin foil hats..."
WELL, NUB: He turned his armor repair on just before the convo spams and gang invite spams started. After that, it's on auto. It wasn't a matter of lag (though I'm sure he probably was lagging too)... but those stupid pop-up boxes that dont' allow you to do anything until you close them certainly get in the way of moving or firing. I wasn't in either pilot's*****pit to know exactly what they know, but I've had the boxes mess me up in combat outside of tournies before so I can some what imagine.
It's too bad the match couldn't have gone on without outside interference. I really wounder how it might have gone down without other people ruining it for everyone else. I mean, maybe we would have still loss, but at least the people watching might have been able to see a good fight instead of our guy frozen and unable to even fire.
- Right -
People who don't like it when other people ask questions fear the trueth.
www.eve-search.com |
Semkhet
KR0M The Red Skull
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Posted - 2006.07.25 13:57:00 -
[99]
Of course many factors could have played a role, but the most significant one has been ASCN's gamble to choose a close combat setup.
When you don't know what you will face, it is preferable to keep your options open, and by definition a long range ceptor does exactly that. On the contrary, no close combat ceptor may be effective before reaching rocket range. Since the fight started at 50 Km, it was pertinent to fit a setup able to inflict immediate damage from the beginning of the duel.
On ceptors, you can't simultaneously fly fast, inflict good damage and enjoy tanking abilities without drying your cap at an unsustainable rate. Therefore you make setup choices which will improve some abilities and hamper others.
To get back to the duel, if we assume that both pilots could fly at equivalent speeds, I don't think that their respective PvP knowhow would have made any difference for a simple reason: it's always the close range setup that tries to close in against the long range setup. And when you are a pursuer who can't really fly faster than your target, you loose the advantage of the initiative: you must follow.
Fighting at speeds of 8 Km/sec imply a whole set of navigational considerations that are known only in the high-end ceptor world. At those speeds, half a second lag may mean going off mark up to 8 Km, since not only your speed but also the speed of your opponent gets factorized. According to the vectors, the relative speed between both ceptors may vary from apparently stationary from up to 16 Km/sec when they go against each other. Now relocate all this in the context of an arena of 150 Km where crossing the limits means loosing the fight, and you may start to imagine the level of micromanagement and the reaction time required by manoeuvers and counter-manoeuvers.
It's mainly the setup that dictated the outcome of the duel instead of respective pilot's quality that you may be sure where equally outstanding. The match would have depended more on pilot's skills if both ceptors were able to fight at the same range, but statistically there's always exactly a 50:50 % chance that a ceptor duel isn't balanced due to setup reasons if you don't know what your opponent will fit, and that's precisely what happened here.
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Yoko Shimazaki
O.R.C. Outrage Compliant
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Posted - 2006.07.26 11:00:00 -
[100]
Light missiles explosion velocity is 1750m/s, 2625m/s with max skills (target navigation prediction lvl 5). So against anything flying at 6km/s+ the damage from such missiles is reduced to pretty much nothing. One can wonder why ASCN's crow wasn't able to reach such speed as obviously it was taking quite a hit against BoB's light missiles...
In perfect conditions I very doubt the outcome of the duel would have been so evident.
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Gunstar Zero
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.07.26 12:37:00 -
[101]
Originally by: Yoko Shimazaki Light missiles explosion velocity is 1750m/s, 2625m/s with max skills (target navigation prediction lvl 5). So against anything flying at 6km/s+ the damage from such missiles is reduced to pretty much nothing. One can wonder why ASCN's crow wasn't able to reach such speed as obviously it was taking quite a hit against BoB's light missiles...
In perfect conditions I very doubt the outcome of the duel would have been so evident.
I think his crow was doing around 4-4.5k/s
I do have max skills
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MIGHTYDWC
Gallente
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Posted - 2006.07.27 16:26:00 -
[102]
Edited by: MIGHTYDWC on 27/07/2006 16:27:08 I think that throughout the smack talk about a single ship fitting, Gun's post with the killmail, CYVOK, and BlackLight stepping in and speaking their 2 cents worth show great integrity on both sides. To me it doesn't matter if ASCN and BOB are friends, enemies, or neutral ATM, their 2 post show the respect that both sides have for each other, or atleast I think they have for each other. GJ to BOB for the win, GJ to ASCN for the hard work our team put into this. Props to Guns for posting the mail and showing the people "without a clue" that rails are a secondary weapon of choise to Caldari pilots when missles/rockets are n/a or unequipable on a ship.
Favorite saying on TS: This "phoon of Doom" is very easy to kill things with. They die very fast. <---JaegerX
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Shayla Sh'inlux
Millennium
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Posted - 2006.07.28 23:23:00 -
[103]
Originally by: Gunstar Zero
Originally by: Shayla Sh'inlux
Quote:
Your saying a ranis could catch a 8000m/s Crow?
Without Gistii MWD and without Skirmish Warfare 5? Show me how to do that.
Lol 8k/sec Crow o.0
Anyway, I think it's a shame that such a nice tournament is being ruined by having the finals be an inty 1v1 which basically is decided by the fitting of the ship.
8k/s is reasonable easy to achieve.
I did the math and I stand corrected.
I used the wrong speedboost for Local Hull Overdrives.
If I'm not mistaken, using 3 Local Hull Overdrives, Full Snake and a 5% speed implant you could, in theory, reach about 8300 m/s in a Crow with maxed skills.
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Gunstar Zero
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.07.29 00:46:00 -
[104]
Originally by: Shayla Sh'inlux
Originally by: Gunstar Zero
Originally by: Shayla Sh'inlux
Quote:
Your saying a ranis could catch a 8000m/s Crow?
Without Gistii MWD and without Skirmish Warfare 5? Show me how to do that.
Lol 8k/sec Crow o.0
Anyway, I think it's a shame that such a nice tournament is being ruined by having the finals be an inty 1v1 which basically is decided by the fitting of the ship.
8k/s is reasonable easy to achieve.
I did the math and I stand corrected.
I used the wrong speedboost for Local Hull Overdrives.
If I'm not mistaken, using 3 Local Hull Overdrives, Full Snake and a 5% speed implant you could, in theory, reach about 8300 m/s in a Crow with maxed skills.
With 3 x Local Hulls, I think I max out at ~ 11k/s
In gang I've made 15,895 in Gang, still using Nano's not overdrives. Screenshot prior to the tweaking (forgot to get the full speed pic afterwards)
http://www.gunstar.34sp.com/gsz_speed.jpg
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Malthros Zenobia
Caldari Independent Navy Reserve Kimotoro Directive
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Posted - 2006.07.29 02:10:00 -
[105]
Originally by: Dyanmo rocket crow needs to come in close...
A Rocket crow can hit from 15km.
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Malthros Zenobia
Caldari Independent Navy Reserve Kimotoro Directive
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Posted - 2006.07.29 02:35:00 -
[106]
Originally by: Gunstar Zero With 3 x Local Hulls, I think I max out at ~ 11k/s
In gang I've made 15,895 in Gang, still using Nano's not overdrives. Screenshot prior to the tweaking (forgot to get the full speed pic afterwards)
http://www.gunstar.34sp.com/gsz_speed.jpg
Faction speedmod/mwd and gangmate with proper skills maxxed?
How close can you orbit something going 15km/s?
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Shayla Sh'inlux
Millennium
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Posted - 2006.07.29 10:12:00 -
[107]
Quote:
With 3 x Local Hulls, I think I max out at ~ 11k/s
In gang I've made 15,895 in Gang, still using Nano's not overdrives. Screenshot prior to the tweaking (forgot to get the full speed pic afterwards)
I was still using the tournament rules where a Gistii MWD is not allowed. I can't see how you can make 11 km/sec without that. Correct me if I forgot anything:
Base Speed 425 m/s 3x Local Hull Overdrive Injector: + 102 m/s Navigation lvl 5 = +25% Speed Implant: +5% Full Snake: +53,63% tech II MWD with Acc control lvl 5: +687,5% Add the slot 10 implant that gives 5% extra: +721,875%
So in total we get: 527 * 1,25 * 1,05 * 1,5363 * 8,21875 = 8733,57 m/s.
I can see this go ove 11k easy with using the Gistii MWD and in gang with Skirmish warfare lvl 5 and a Rapid Deployment mod and maybe even a Mindlink and a Claymore I think you can go over 17-18 km/s.
Let's try a Claw :-)
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