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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
Apollo Eros
Daktaklakpak.
120
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Posted - 2014.08.27 15:56:00 -
[31] - Quote
Being a leader of Daktak. Our group has attempted to keep an open mind. Even over the controversial stuff. We have thought about adapting vs complaining. Before we start to voice an opinion we want to see how these new chains start to form and look. We are looking forward to more connections bridging out to more places over New Eden. The jump mass was not really a big problem and kind of fun as well. We are not a large WH group. We do not have slave scouts or anything of that nature. If your living in WH space and freaking out because you cannot close all your connections to PVE then you may have your priorities out of wack. At the moment I have enjoyed the changes so far. The only thing I do agree with is on the k162 side of a frig only hole that there be some kind of indicator that it is for smaller mass ships. But then again. Our scouts could let us know that when they go through the first time. But I think some type of indicator would be appropriate since there is an indicator with wormholes related to other areas ex c1-c6 etc. [Triple OG LVL 5 Space Wizard] |
Moloney
Mass Effect Enterprises
75
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Posted - 2014.08.27 16:08:00 -
[32] - Quote
CCP, I am disgusted with your lack of communication.
Your lack of taking player concerns into account.
You quick-fire, broad changes to a game area that myself and many others use to enjoy.
And most of all I am disgusted that for a F**king WH related change you have STILL DONE NOTHING ABOUT POS MANAGEMENT.
Proves that you are god damn well deaf due to mining up your own wormhole. |
Naglerr
235MeV Waterboard Comedy Tour
16
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Posted - 2014.08.27 16:23:00 -
[33] - Quote
Moloney wrote:CCP, I am disgusted with your lack of communication.
It is interesting how little real talk exists on the thread titled by ISD as such. The OP already contains via link all the comments from the player base regarding Hyperion. The only real talk that is lacking at this point is a response from CCP to all the valid concerns and questions raised. I ask again: Is there any sort of estimate of when to expect a response from CCP? |
Rek Seven
Probe Patrol Ixtab.
1773
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Posted - 2014.08.27 16:35:00 -
[34] - Quote
There was a town hall, which Fozzie attended, and some posts from Fozzie in the feedback threads. I'm i'm curious as to what comments you want...?
I'm all about complaining if i don't like something but i never forget who is being payed to design the game. +1 |
Bronya Boga
Isogen 5
453
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Posted - 2014.08.27 16:53:00 -
[35] - Quote
Rek Seven wrote:There was a town hall, which Fozzie attended, and some posts from Fozzie in the feedback threads. I'm i'm curious as to what comments you want...? I'm all about complaining if i don't like something but i never forget who is being payed to design the game.
I think the point is that the town hall was more of an attempt at damage control went sideways because wormholes are a passionate bunch that read between the line(a side effect or paranoia). Hence why people are asking for additional comments that might actually address the concerns directly and not in a round about way.
As far as your second comment but CCP has a long tracking record of making mistakes with their designs (pre incarna and post) something we have hoped was remedied by the CSM and a higher involvement between CCP and the players. Both of which seemed to have been in large portions ignored aside from additional number tweaking.
What I am curious about is what type of feedback would have changed CCPs mind about the mass based jump distance changes? considering in large part most of the feedback was negative while providing no incentive for new groups to move into wspace and simultaneously pushing some out of it.
This thread is redundant if you want feedback look over the thousands of replies to your original posts CCP Host of Down The Pipe-áIngame Channel DTP Podcast www.downthepipe-wh.com GÇïIsogen 5 is recruiting. Check us out
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Naglerr
235MeV Waterboard Comedy Tour
16
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Posted - 2014.08.27 16:55:00 -
[36] - Quote
Rek Seven wrote:There was a town hall, which Fozzie attended, and some posts from Fozzie in the feedback threads. I'm i'm curious as to what comments you want...? I'm all about complaining if i don't like something but i never forget who is being payed to design the game.
You are true that there was some conversation had prior to the release. That was good. But look at the responsiveness of CCP post patch and I think you'll find it quite lacking. The response from the majority of players regarding wormhole changes, post release, ranges from Meh/Ok I guess to OMG, end of the world. Some people took the time to write well reasoned posts about how this change has and will negatively affect their gameplay and the gameplay of the community as a whole. The volume of the responses coupled with the merit of the points raised in these posts seems to justify a response from CCP to address these concerns. Example reponses:
"Yes this is exactly how we intended to have wormholes work now. We understand that this is drastically different than what you are familiar with but we did this for XYZ reason. We do not intend to change the mechanics."
"We intended to change the XYZ aspect of wormhole life but had not considered point ABC mentioned in the forums. With this new information we will reconsider these changes and update the community in 24 hours."
"We did not intend for the effect of changes XYZ to have the impact that it is having on the wormhole community. Based upon gameplay statistics we may re-balance the mechanics in ABC time period, stay tuned."
All of these statements have a key factor: reasons. We did something because of these reasons while considering this data. I really want to understand if the end result is exactly what CCP was hoping. I also want to know why they wanted to make these changes. Adults talk about issues using reasons. There are many reasons that players have mentioned that explain their distaste for this change. I think it's appropriate and needed for CCP to discuss their reasons for the change.
I never forget who is being paid to design the game as long as they don't forget who they are designing the game for. |
CivilWars
Rolled Out Triumvirate.
113
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Posted - 2014.08.27 17:10:00 -
[37] - Quote
All of these topics are a bunch of crying. The only logic people have put into any of their reasoning is they don't want to put ships at risk. Guess what, EVE, and especially w-space in EVE, is dangerous space. The sign on the door even tells you that before you enter last time I checked. If you don't want to put your assets at risk then don't leave your POS, or better yet find a station, it is much safer. Nobody wants to hear CCP's reasoning, all they want to hear is that CCP will do whatever it is you want.
W-space, like any other space, is special because of the people, certainly not the craptastic mechanics. If the people you are with don't make you want to stay in w-space then find new/better people to fly with. If you need suggestions you can stop by our pub channel, all the cool kids hang out there. We Re-Rolled. Stop by public channel Rolled Out to join the fun. |
Naglerr
235MeV Waterboard Comedy Tour
16
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Posted - 2014.08.27 17:25:00 -
[38] - Quote
Quote:All of these topics are a bunch of crying. The only logic people have put into any of their reasoning is they don't want to put ships at risk.
LOL. I am not a risk averse pilot. I'll put spaceships on the field if there is a reasonable expectation of a good outcome. But why would anyone want to attempt a fight that they have no chance of winning? Reasonable risk is perfectly fine, risk with no reward is simply not intelligent.
Quote: If you don't want to put your assets at risk then don't leave your POS, or better yet find a station, it is much safer.
This is exactly the issue, I WANT to leave the POS in a combat ship and pew pew. I can't do that with 3 or 4 corp members when there are 5 connections to my hole. Most of us have at least 2 or 3 accounts, but if every toon is a scout then who is doing the shooting? This would not be an issue if the number of connections wasn't so large or the holes so difficult/actually impossible to crush.
Quote:Nobody wants to hear CCP's reasoning, all they want to hear is that CCP will do whatever it is you want.
No. Much of the outrage at this point is the how of this release. A discussion was opened by CCP for feedback and then walked away from post release. It's quite rude to solicit feedback on something and then not explain the reasons why the general consensus was not the outcome. So the reasons are just as important as the outcome for me, and many others I suspect.
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CivilWars
Rolled Out Triumvirate.
113
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Posted - 2014.08.27 17:57:00 -
[39] - Quote
So wait, you think that suddenly because you have 4-6 connections to your home/static that means everyone is just waiting for you to leave your POS to blob you? In what world does that even remotely make sense. First people complained that they only had one static, so they had to rage roll to find someone because nobody lives in w-space anymore. Now CCP gives you more holes, so more potential pew, and that too is a problem because, well, I am not quite sure why that is a problem.
To me it sounds like "I want to pew, but only on my terms where I know I will win." which is the very definition of risk averse. The first step is admitting you have a problem. I am here to help if any of you need someone to talk to. We Re-Rolled. Stop by public channel Rolled Out to join the fun. |
Aquila Sagitta
Blue-Fire
440
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Posted - 2014.08.27 17:59:00 -
[40] - Quote
Industry changes had 6 months if not 1 year+ of warning and talking about changes before hand. Industry is at the heart of Eve so this is understandable. So why do wormholes, something that the community is much more passionate about, only get a measly 4 weeks to discuss changes that effect the foundations of wormholes? It feels like CCP was on a deadline and had to push something out regardless of how the players felt about it. It just happened to be the wormhole community that you **** on. These changes should have been pushed back a release at the vary least with the amount of outcry from the community. When the vast majority of the community is against the changes it should make you think about another time when CCP pushed out a change the community was against that nearly ruined the company. This whole thing feels very rushed and badly planned.
What would have happened if these changes were pushed back an expansion? It would have given CCP time to actually deal with feedback. 4 weeks is enough time for minor tweaks and changes but not enough time for the major changes and reworks the community was requesting. CCP would now have 10 weeks to address feedback which gives more time for these big changes to sink in. Thus, preventing the player base from getting up in arms like now at least not to this degree.
TL;DR Hyperion feels like a rush job set to fill a quota leaving no real time to address feedback. Making all these 'feedback threads' meaningless PR objects CCP can point to saying, "We're listening see!", but not able or willing to properly address feedback. Blue-Fire Best Fire |
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lmmortalist
lmmortality Associates
2
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Posted - 2014.08.27 18:08:00 -
[41] - Quote
Endo Riftbreaker wrote:I'd like to echo the comments made by others about the negative impact to small/solo corps. The addition of so many new holes has made scanning and op sec a basic non-starter for any small group. I logged in yesterday, took one look at the 6 holes connecting to my system, the 5 holes connected to my static, and logged off.
The holes now are like swiss cheese, with each one having 5+ connections and 5 more connections in the hole you jump into. It feels like null-sec with a system that has 6 gates and no local! There's not a chance anyone in their right mind would take the risk to run some sites in this environment.
The feeling/lore of being lost/isoluated in W space is complete gone, it's just one giant interconnected parking lot now, with no one running anything and everyone POS'd up because you can't roll even 1 of the 6 connections you have.
For me, I'm a solo corp, I'll be running down my fuel reserves and then moving out of J space, and possibly leaving the game. WH's were the last place a solo operator could "claim" and defend/homestead a system, enjoy some PvP hunting/being hunted and make decent income. But I'm not here to be cannon fodder to the 150 people my home system is connected to on any given day, and I doubt many other low class WH inhabitants are either.
I thought about posting to give some feedback but won't even bother writing anything new because this post said it all. The only exception being that I'm in wormholes with a friend instead of being solo.
But yeah, this. |
Naglerr
235MeV Waterboard Comedy Tour
16
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Posted - 2014.08.27 18:13:00 -
[42] - Quote
CivilWars wrote:So wait, you think that suddenly because you have 4-6 connections to your home/static that means everyone is just waiting for you to leave your POS to blob you? In what world does that even remotely make sense. First people complained that they only had one static, so they had to rage roll to find someone because nobody lives in w-space anymore. Now CCP gives you more holes, so more potential pew, and that too is a problem because, well, I am not quite sure why that is a problem.
To me it sounds like "I want to pew, but only on my terms where I know I will win." which is the very definition of risk averse. The first step is admitting you have a problem. I am here to help if any of you need someone to talk to.
CivilWars, I don't assume that each connection to my hole has a fleet waiting to blob me. I'll admit that most holes appear inactive. Were you to enter my hole it would also appear inactive. That's because idling in your pos is silly, idling cloaked somewhere meaningful is more likely whats happening. So if I scout a hole out and don't see anything happening that simply means no one is decloaked, not that no one is there. It certainly could mean that there is a fleet in some/all of them also watching me. This means each hole presents an added risk and added reward.
Scouting 5 holes isn't a bit issue in itself either, it takes effort but so what? Well now after they are scouted I'll want to do something. Due to a limitation of pilots available, only so many holes can be covered at once while doing whatever activity the corp decides to do. We need to adjust the risk/reward to a scale that is appropriate for the number of pilots available. To address that issue we will close the holes where we do not intend to fly into, this eases the burden of scouting so many holes and reduces the likelihood of getting caught in a position I don't want to be caught in. The big problem is that closing holes is now quite a bit more difficult/risky or possibly definite death depending on the situation.
It is somewhat true that I want to pew pew on my terms. I want to pew pew where I have a chance to win. Would you engage a 10 man fleet with 2 T3s? Doubtful. Neither would I. This does not mean risk averse. Risk averse is turning down what appears to be a close/fair fight. This I do not do.
TLDR: More holes is good. More holes I can't close is bad. |
Ayeson
Hard Knocks Inc.
518
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Posted - 2014.08.27 18:16:00 -
[43] - Quote
I think this belongs here
Content: What update? I GÖÑ the orthrus
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CivilWars
Rolled Out Triumvirate.
114
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Posted - 2014.08.27 18:20:00 -
[44] - Quote
Naglerr wrote:CivilWars wrote:So wait, you think that suddenly because you have 4-6 connections to your home/static that means everyone is just waiting for you to leave your POS to blob you? In what world does that even remotely make sense. First people complained that they only had one static, so they had to rage roll to find someone because nobody lives in w-space anymore. Now CCP gives you more holes, so more potential pew, and that too is a problem because, well, I am not quite sure why that is a problem.
To me it sounds like "I want to pew, but only on my terms where I know I will win." which is the very definition of risk averse. The first step is admitting you have a problem. I am here to help if any of you need someone to talk to. CivilWars, I don't assume that each connection to my hole has a fleet waiting to blob me. I'll admit that most holes appear inactive. Were you to enter my hole it would also appear inactive. That's because idling in your pos is silly, idling cloaked somewhere meaningful is more likely whats happening. So if I scout a hole out and don't see anything happening that simply means no one is decloaked, not that no one is there. It certainly could mean that there is a fleet in some/all of them also watching me. This means each hole presents an added risk and added reward. Scouting 5 holes isn't a bit issue in itself either, it takes effort but so what? Well now after they are scouted I'll want to do something. Due to a limitation of pilots available, only so many holes can be covered at once while doing whatever activity the corp decides to do. We need to adjust the risk/reward to a scale that is appropriate for the number of pilots available. To address that issue we will close the holes where we do not intend to fly into, this eases the burden of scouting so many holes and reduces the likelihood of getting caught in a position I don't want to be caught in. It is somewhat true that I want to pew pew on my terms. I want to pew pew where I have a chance to win. Would you engage a 10 man fleet with 2 T3s? Doubtful. Neither would I. This does not mean risk averse. Risk averse is turning down what appears to be a close/fair fight. This I do not do. TLDR: More holes is good. More holes I can't close is bad. Bolded the important part. To answer the underlined question I guess you don't know me or my corp that well. We have gone 7 jumps down chain to fight outnumbered in someone else's home hole because they refused to even meet us in a neutral hole somewhere in chain. We have fought outnumbered by a large margin more times that I can count. If we only took fights where the outcome was relatively certain, or the fight was "fair" then our killboard would be much more baren.
So, now let me ask you a question. When you come across a lonely venture huffing gas, or a solo Tengu killing C3 sleepers do you let them live because you don't want to "catch them in a position they don't want to be caught in", or do you kill then pod them? My guess is the latter. Sometimes you are the hunter, sometimes you are the hunted. Both can be equally fun. We Re-Rolled. Stop by public channel Rolled Out to join the fun. |
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