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Samuel Sachs
5
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Posted - 2014.09.08 15:17:00 -
[1] - Quote
Was playing with some T3 Logistic Fittings and create this:
[Legion, REPP] Legion Engineering - Capacitor Regeneration Matrix Legion Defensive - Adaptive Augmenter Legion Propulsion - Wake Limiter Legion Offensive - Drone Synthesis Projector Legion Electronics - Dissolution Sequencer
Damage Control II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II 1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I Energized EM Membrane II Energized Thermic Membrane II
Experimental 10MN Microwarpdrive I Large Capacitor Battery II Cap Recharger II Small Capacitor Booster II, Navy Cap Booster 400 Conjunctive Radar ECCM Scanning Array I
Corelum B-Type Medium Remote Armor Repairer Corelum B-Type Medium Remote Armor Repairer Corelum B-Type Medium Remote Armor Repairer Corelum B-Type Medium Remote Armor Repairer Corelum B-Type Medium Remote Armor Repairer Automated Targeting Unit I
Medium Remote Repair Augmentor I Medium Remote Repair Augmentor I Medium Capacitor Control Circuit I
Hammerhead II x5 Vespa EC-600 x5 Valkyrie II x5 Medium Armor Maintenance Bot II x5
I like this, but the big problem is range for remote repair modules, dead space modules have 7000m and the normal medium have 6000m range, this is simple not useful.
Idea is, introduce a subsystem for T3, to increase repair module range, maybe 100% more range. Other idea is a new skill to increase range for remote repair modules. Maybe add attribute to existent subsystem like "per skill level + XY% remote repair range.
Nestor Battleship i remember for example get more range added before the ship was in game because not useful with normal module range.
Maybe someone else has other ideas ? |
Syrias Bizniz
Zebra Corp The Bastion
333
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Posted - 2014.09.08 15:48:00 -
[2] - Quote
I, too, would like to see T3 Logistics be able to rep at ranges of, let's say logi frigs, so ~20-30 km. Preferrably these ranges are achieved with Large modules. So even less for mediums.
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Fer'isam K'ahn
None Of One
392
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Posted - 2014.09.08 16:41:00 -
[3] - Quote
And I thought ppl always complained about logi being to strong
I-¦d say 'no' to general T3 rep range bonus on subs.
-1 for the 'I like this... I want this' suggestion approach.
Further more, wait out the new tiericide changes, we might actually get more range differences with the basic and faction mods.
There has also been a thread about range rigs, which I would support more, since only non-specialized ships can use them with good effect, which also might cover above needs. (T2 logi won't be able to).
Don't be so narrow minded and just think: one - ship one fit - fix it for me.
Join the BIG Lottery (see Bio ingame), oldest and only non-profit Lottery in EVE, every second Monday. Wire ISK to BIG GAMES for tickets ! Join the Channel, have fun, being a lucky winner is optional ,)
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Samuel Sachs
6
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Posted - 2014.09.08 17:02:00 -
[4] - Quote
Fer'isam K'ahn wrote:And I thought ppl always complained about logi being to strong I-¦d say 'no' to general T3 rep range bonus on subs. -1 for the 'I like this... I want this' suggestion approach. Further more, wait out the new tiericide changes, we might actually get more range differences with the basic and faction mods. There has also been a thread about range rigs, which I would support more, since only non-specialized ships can use them with good effect, which also might cover above needs. (T2 logi won't be able to). Don't be so narrow minded and just think: one - ship one fit - fix it for me.
Its not only for me, its just an idea after play with fittings, and yes of course i like my fitting idea but the range is a big issue and i bring some ideas in, dont think its only for me, its just my "i like it"...
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Fer'isam K'ahn
None Of One
392
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Posted - 2014.09.08 17:16:00 -
[5] - Quote
Sure, but argue the point and the consequences for everyone and exploits, not just 1 very nice fit.
I fly tinker myself, even with newbies and its up to discipline and navigation to make it work. Sure a bit more range will help, but like I said, if so, think more broad not just T3. Also think about trade-offs .. what will you be willing to lose, suffer to get that bit more range ... Join the BIG Lottery (see Bio ingame), oldest and only non-profit Lottery in EVE, every second Monday. Wire ISK to BIG GAMES for tickets ! Join the Channel, have fun, being a lucky winner is optional ,)
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Samuel Sachs
6
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Posted - 2014.09.08 17:26:00 -
[6] - Quote
Fer'isam K'ahn wrote:Sure, but argue the point and the consequences for everyone and exploits, not just 1 very nice fit.
I fly tinker myself, even with newbies and its up to discipline and navigation to make it work. Sure a bit more range will help, but like I said, if so, think more broad not just T3. Also think about trade-offs .. what will you be willing to lose, suffer to get that bit more range ...
You are right!
I was just working on a T3 logi example but yes, this is true, i was not thinking far enough as i made this post, please forgive me |
Jezza McWaffle
Pandora Sphere Disavowed.
147
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Posted - 2014.09.08 17:40:00 -
[7] - Quote
The T3 Logi subsystem does need changing as in its current state I don't think I have ever seen it used successfully. And why would you when you have Guardians which are just better outside of tank and maybe ECCM C6 Wormhole blog http://holelotofwaffle.wordpress.com/ |
baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
13032
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Posted - 2014.09.08 17:43:00 -
[8] - Quote
We have enough issues with logi without adding one with a bigger tank and that can hide in a fleet overview... Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship |
Lugh Crow-Slave
Guardians of the Morrigan
29
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Posted - 2014.09.08 18:09:00 -
[9] - Quote
Jezza McWaffle wrote:The T3 Logi subsystem does need changing as in its current state I don't think I have ever seen it used successfully. And why would you when you have Guardians which are just better outside of tank and maybe ECCM
I'll take it you haven't been in many black ops fleets because a T3 is the only Logi you can get a blops to bridge (outside the AT logi prize ship) and if range were added to these things it would make them way to powerful in this role. |
Syrias Bizniz
Zebra Corp The Bastion
333
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Posted - 2014.09.08 19:58:00 -
[10] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:We have enough issues with logi without adding one with a bigger tank and that can hide in a fleet overview...
Hm, definately true, haven't thought about that.
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Adrie Atticus
The Shadow Plague The Bastion
275
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Posted - 2014.09.08 20:24:00 -
[11] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:We have enough issues with logi without adding one with a bigger tank and that can hide in a fleet overview...
How about Logithrons? |
Samillian
Angry Mustellid Overload Everything
591
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Posted - 2014.09.08 21:32:00 -
[12] - Quote
Haven't T3's rendered enough ship classes obsolete? NBSI shall be the whole of the Law |
Ines Tegator
Towels R Us
503
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Posted - 2014.09.08 22:43:00 -
[13] - Quote
No.
T3's have enough problems with balance and outclassing specialized ships. Making them experts in ANOTHER of the most powerful fleet roles in the game is a bad idea. - Mission Overhaul - Bridging the PVP / PVE Gap - -áIf the game stops teaching people to fear lowsec, maybe people will start going there? |
Zan Shiro
Alternative Enterprises
483
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Posted - 2014.09.08 22:48:00 -
[14] - Quote
High tank potential, long range repping, and with dissolution sequence (+ sensor skill, + implants, + mods) is more ecm proof......whats the worst that can happen? |
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
1531
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Posted - 2014.09.09 01:47:00 -
[15] - Quote
Wait for the general T3 rebalance, you are likely to see this then, of course, T3's will also loose tank & DPS in their OP DPS configs (Especially the Tengu, oh the tears, I must invest in more buckets) at the same time, and they may put cloak and nullification on mutually exclusive subsystems. |
Ktersida Nyn'Amanyn
Querschlaeger
5
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Posted - 2014.09.09 04:27:00 -
[16] - Quote
I don't see a problem in adding 40% rr range per skill level of the logi sub. And from the comments of the most i see u never used the logi subsystem. HP with the logi sub isn't much higher then the racial counter part logistic.
So +1 for this. |
Lugh Crow-Slave
Guardians of the Morrigan
35
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Posted - 2014.09.09 05:11:00 -
[17] - Quote
Ktersida Nyn'Amanyn wrote:I don't see a problem in adding 40% rr range per skill level of the logi sub. And from the comments of the most i see u never used the logi subsystem. HP with the logi sub isn't much higher then the racial counter part logistic.
So +1 for this.
I don't use the module much outside of black ops fleets but like i said before adding range to this mod would make blop drops almost unstoppable through in two legions with the range boosted logi subsystem and they can keep up any of the recon and black ops BBs with out a problem the only thing that would be vulnerable is the stealth bombers that can be alphaed |
Luwc
Brodozers Inc.
216
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Posted - 2014.09.09 06:53:00 -
[18] - Quote
and then it would be op.
next http://hugelolcdn.com/i/267520.gif |
Kell Braugh
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
8
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Posted - 2014.09.09 07:59:00 -
[19] - Quote
While I agree T3 subs need a good looking at, killing an entire ship-class doing it is prolly not the best route. |
SFM Hobb3s
Wrecking Shots Black Legion.
127
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Posted - 2014.09.09 16:49:00 -
[20] - Quote
Yep I'm in the camp where RR range should get slashed and nerfed so bad you basically have to reach down your throat and out your butt to do it. |
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Soldarius
Deadman W0nderland Test Alliance Please Ignore
774
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Posted - 2014.09.09 17:56:00 -
[21] - Quote
No. Jesus God no. All T3s must die. Until they get a massive EHP nerf, nothing on T3s should be buffed.
GÇ£I personally refuse to help AAA take space from itself so it can become an even shittier version of itselfGÇ¥ -Grath Telkin, 2014.
Free PASTA! |
James Baboli
Ferrous Infernum
88
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Posted - 2014.09.09 19:15:00 -
[22] - Quote
Playing around with the fits, you can get 60k EHP tengus or legions that outrep their logi counter parts by 50%, and reps aside, are full stable without injectors and full t2 fit with no implants. If you add any range, this means you have almost doubled the amount of tank one can pack into any given gang, making everything else less attractive again. t3s and capitals online anyone? That crazy bag FC with the silly things on the hull that shouldn't but just did. |
Zan Shiro
Alternative Enterprises
483
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Posted - 2014.09.09 23:09:00 -
[23] - Quote
James Baboli wrote:Playing around with the fits, you can get 60k EHP tengus or legions that outrep their logi counter parts by 50%, and reps aside, are full stable without injectors and full t2 fit with no implants. If you add any range, this means you have almost doubled the amount of tank one can pack into any given gang, making everything else less attractive again. t3s and capitals online anyone?
it was quite funny, in a sick way, by week 3/4 of AT shield and armour t3 was banned pretty much most of the time. And they weren't banned for 100mn AB weapons spamming lol.
Sadly in day to day eve...there is no ship banning lol.
Fix its (e)hp maybe we could put this on the table. ATM...range seems to be its only controlling factor. Basi (edit and other logi's) may be squishier....but it has range. Lets keep basi in a job lol. This change with current stats....if not for the fact I need it for triage I would petition for my logi sp back lol. |
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed Agony Empire
4122
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Posted - 2014.09.10 00:31:00 -
[24] - Quote
Samillian wrote:Haven't T3's rendered enough ship classes obsolete?
I echo the above sentiment. At the same time, I think a 100% increase to range is reasonable. It would be VERY easy to usurp the logi class if this bonus was over-implemented. As such, I have strong opinions the T3 Logi should NEVER be able to rep beyond 15-20 kms.
Also, nerf logistics ships. In a 50 vs 50 battle, it is asinine one side can win wipe the field without losing ships. |
Zan Shiro
Alternative Enterprises
483
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Posted - 2014.09.10 02:30:00 -
[25] - Quote
Gizznitt Malikite wrote: Also, nerf logistics ships. In a 50 vs 50 battle, it is asinine one side can win wipe the field without losing ships.
That be the side that didn't bring enough support. Not all doctrine is run and gun and kill em all. While it has its appeal sometimes...it also tends to break down to mindless button mashing.
Also factors in bringing in e-war and such. to add more to the mixing pot. But that's me...I like mixed fleet compositions. Vice zerg rush mindless head bashing. Well that and I have tons of SP in the support roles. For the days I just want to try something more exotic than going lr to sr or vice versa for a change of pace lol. |
Rroff
Questionable Ethics. Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork
810
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Posted - 2014.09.10 03:46:00 -
[26] - Quote
I'd rather see it as a high calibration cost rig (~250) with a very specific bonus - it would boost remote repair range by a set amount (i.e. to 20,000m) and has no effect if the current remote repair range with bonuses exceeds that distance (so for instance small unbonused remote repair modules would get the biggest boost from it), multiple instances of the rig have no further benefit over 1 and probably couldn't be fit with the calibration cost anyway and should come with a small penalty to say sensor strength, with the T2 variant having less of a penalty. |
Spugg Galdon
APOCALYPSE LEGION The Obsidian Front
481
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Posted - 2014.09.15 12:09:00 -
[27] - Quote
To be honest, I feel like all remote rep / shield transporter / energy transfer ranges are anaemic and should get their ranges buffed to make them useful on ships other than logistics ships.
To that end I would suggest:
N.B. Does not apply to capitals/capital modules
Step 1: Double the range of all Remote Armour Repair / Remote Energy Transfers / Shield Transporters
Step 2: Cut the range bonus of all logistics ships to compensate. Cut T1 Logistics Frigates range bonus to 200% (or x3 range bonus) Cut T1 Logistics Cruiser range bonus from 1000% (which is utterly stupid) to 300% (48km range with T2 and 60km range with deadspace) Cut T2 Logistics Cruiser Range bonus from 150% / level to 50% / level (meaning a flat 250% range bonus or 3.5x range) Cut The Nestor's range bonus to 100%
Step 3: Create rigs that buff range: Callibration point cost: T1: 150 T2: 200
Engineering Rig: "Energy Transfer Projector" T1 + 20% range +10% Energy Transfer PG req T2 + 30% range +10% Energy Transfer PG req
Armour Rig: "Remote Repair Projector" T1 + 20% range +10% PG Req T2 + 30% range +10% PG Req
Shield Rig: "Shield Transportor Projector" T1 + 20% range +10% CPU Req T2 + 30% range +10% CPU Req
So what would this do? To frigates that aren't rigged for range - nothing. But these ships aren't much of an issue. With rigs they get a small range buff. To Logistics cruisers that aren't rigged for range - a small range nerf (approx 10km). With 1 T1 rig they get current ranges, with a T2 rig they get a small increase over current ranges. A Battleship fitted as a RRBS ala days of olde (I miss those days) gets 16.2km range unrigged or approx 20km rigged. A Nestor would have 32km range unrigged or approx 40km rigged or be able to rig for energy transfer range to have effective long range energy transfers.
Ships that don't have a bonus to range would have a limited but much more useful/useable range for RR modules instead of the current extremely limiting range that makes them useless unless on a range bonused ship.
For those that fail at math: a 200% bonus = x3 range not x2 because: 50% bonus = x1.5 100% bonus = x2 150% bonus = x2.5 200% bonus = x3
EDIT: for bad engerlend |
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