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Billy Hardcore
Jaded.
164
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Posted - 2014.09.13 21:05:00 -
[1] - Quote
Some simple idea's to increase the reward in the "unknown" after hyperions risk increase.
1. Bring ice belts to wh-space (lore wise might not work)
2. MOON-GOO (Gives a new material to make T-3's) #ContentDriver
3. New Types of Sleeper escalations (spawned from Marauders?)
YA or nay? #BillyFleet |
Glyndi
Doom Generation THE H0NEYBADGER
247
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Posted - 2014.09.13 21:17:00 -
[2] - Quote
Billy Hardcore wrote:Some simple idea's to increase the reward in the "unknown" after hyperions risk increase.
1. Bring ice belts to wh-space (lore wise might not work)
2. MOON-GOO (Gives a new material to make T-3's) #ContentDriver
3. New Types of Sleeper escalations (spawned from Marauders?)
YA or nay?
I don't mind these too much. The MOON-GOO would be best implemented if it was a 'random' limited spawn. Ice belts would be ok too but again CCP needs to make ore sites scannable again, at least in WSpace. Marauder escalations in c1-c4 would be acceptable as well. |
Billy Hardcore
Jaded.
164
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Posted - 2014.09.13 21:26:00 -
[3] - Quote
Glyndi wrote:Billy Hardcore wrote:Some simple idea's to increase the reward in the "unknown" after hyperions risk increase.
1. Bring ice belts to wh-space (lore wise might not work)
2. MOON-GOO (Gives a new material to make T-3's) #ContentDriver
3. New Types of Sleeper escalations (spawned from Marauders?)
YA or nay? I don't mind these too much. The MOON-GOO would be best implemented if it was a 'random' limited spawn. Ice belts would be ok too but again CCP needs to make ore sites scannable again, at least in WSpace. Marauder escalations in c1-c4 would be acceptable as well.
The MOON-GOO would not be the same in every system. Like how PI is good in some and terrible in others. It would create a situation in which ppl would find to take wh's for the isk in it. And the residents would fight back to keep it. #BillyFleet |
Amak Boma
Dragon Factory
25
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Posted - 2014.09.13 21:51:00 -
[4] - Quote
i agree to have limited spawn of ice sites but they should be mixed with ore sites so some asteroids and some ice but yes the ore sites should be only scannable ,
moon mining in wormhole is pointless and ccp wont let us to do it we can forget ice belts too. maybe if they add regular asteroid belts somthing could be changed but lower class wormhole only 1 - 2 belts higher up to 10 asterouid belts could have sleeper spawn once per hour up to battleship sleeper spawn in all wormhole class but chance for large spawn in lower class could be small while in higher class higher chance , |
Aquila Sagitta
Blue-Fire
474
|
Posted - 2014.09.13 22:22:00 -
[5] - Quote
STOP trying to homogenize space
wh != null Blue-Fire Best Fire |
Billy Hardcore
Jaded.
164
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Posted - 2014.09.13 22:46:00 -
[6] - Quote
Aquila Sagitta wrote:STOP trying to homogenize space
wh != null
Im not. I was thinking of ideas. We still dont have sov thank god. But we do seem to have a Blue donut.
#BillyFleet |
Angsty Teenager
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
580
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Posted - 2014.09.13 22:49:00 -
[7] - Quote
I'm ok with this.
Couldn't possibly make w-space any worse than it is now. |
Aquila Sagitta
Blue-Fire
474
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Posted - 2014.09.13 22:58:00 -
[8] - Quote
Billy Hardcore wrote: Im not. I was thinking of ideas. We still dont have sov thank god. But we do seem to have a Blue donut.
Can you expound on this? If you're referring to evictions, they are neither profitable nor fun. Its not because everyone's blue. I assure you anyone will shoot anyone in wspace, but they will also temp blue up with each other in a second to kill a greater foe. Blue-Fire Best Fire |
Receg
Jaded.
68
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Posted - 2014.09.14 00:21:00 -
[9] - Quote
Aquila Sagitta wrote:STOP trying to homogenize space
wh != null
Moon mining also takes place in lowsec...
Whose to say that ccp couldn't write that in, what were once considered barren moons with no valuable resources have been discovered to contain numerous minerals valuable to making t3's? As is, you occupy a wh for its.....what? static? effect? The amount of isk you can make sitting on your ass doing nothing? And people run eviction ops when they get bored and feel like picking on the little guy, or hold a grudge/one of the bigger groups gets bored, as that's the only way they can generate content due to their size. Wh groups already roam out to nullsec quite often, so why not introduce another content/conflict driver into wspace with moon goo? That way, individuals and groups would have a reason to hold down specific systems, and other groups would have reasons to try and evict them. |
The Feuror
Release the Hounds
62
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Posted - 2014.09.14 00:39:00 -
[10] - Quote
Receg wrote:Aquila Sagitta wrote:STOP trying to homogenize space
wh != null Moon mining also takes place in lowsec...
it shouldnt be too hard to write in. even the highsec moons have the minerals already your just not able to anchor the array.
3. New Types of Sleeper escalations (spawned from Marauders?) love this idea. I would even say put them in all the holes not just c5/6. maybe more waves? VVOOF is recruiting able pvpers for WH BLOPS operations |
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Rek Seven
Probe Patrol Ixtab.
1857
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Posted - 2014.09.14 09:28:00 -
[11] - Quote
Apart from the marauder escalations, I'd be okay with these additions. Cap escalations are one of the few things that make it worthwhile living in c5 & c6 space. +1 |
Ktersida Nyn'Amanyn
Querschlaeger
5
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Posted - 2014.09.14 11:38:00 -
[12] - Quote
Billy Hardcore wrote:Some simple idea's to increase the reward in the "unknown" after hyperions risk increase.
1. Bring ice belts to wh-space (lore wise might not work)
2. MOON-GOO (Gives a new material to make T-3's) #ContentDriver
3. New Types of Sleeper escalations (spawned from Marauders?)
YA or nay?
1. Simply no because people should do logistic stuff and interaction with other spaces. Ice Belts in wormeholes will only lead to more game in game. Like null is now.
2. Moongoo is bad too because people should leave their POSs for resource gathering and smaller groups will be faster kicked out of their systems.
3. Don't know. Don't we generate enough ISK in wormholes?
There should be more stuff to RE and build from the sleeper salvage. The forum is full of examples for good mods / rigs etc. That will increase the value of wh resources and we have more to shoot while other people try to gather the resources.
In addition some sleeper / talocan dead space goodies would be nice to attract the exploration guys. |
Proclus Diadochu
Oberon Incorporated RAZOR Alliance
1845
|
Posted - 2014.09.15 05:25:00 -
[13] - Quote
Billy Hardcore wrote:Some simple idea's to increase the reward in the "unknown" after hyperions risk increase.
1. Bring ice belts to wh-space (lore wise might not work)
2. MOON-GOO (Gives a new material to make T-3's) #ContentDriver
3. New Types of Sleeper escalations (spawned from Marauders?)
YA or nay? Hey space friends, itGÇÖs been awhile. So, I logged in this morning, and my old buddy Billy convoGÇÖd me up. Asked me what I thought about his ideas and if IGÇÖd provide some feedback, and honestly I was very grateful for his request. I have been rather quiet of late, but IGÇÖve followed the Hyperion expansion and the feedback closely, however leaving wormhole space left me with a rather bland sense toward staying involved with the forums/community.
That said I will say that, overall, my impression about Hyperion has been that CCP seemed determined to provide GÇ£contentGÇ¥ and GÇ£changeGÇ¥ to the gameplay, however disregarding the communityGÇÖs feelings on the mass/distance deal was a poor decision. Two things:
- I think that the mass/distance arrangement should be removed or reversed. IGÇÖd be fine either way.
- Frigate wormholes are unappealing. Keep them, but make them closable, or remove them. IGÇÖd be fine with either decision.
Quote:1. Bring ice belts to wh-space (lore wise might not work) When I started in wormholes in 2009, and I always loved the idea of being able to frontier and GÇ£live off the landGÇ¥ so to say, so IGÇÖd be interested in having roving ice belts in and throughout wormholes. With the current changes, IGÇÖd suggest that both ore belts and ice belts be signatures, and requiring scanning.
Quote:2. MOON-GOO (Gives a new material to make T-3's) #ContentDriver My thoughts on moon-goo are simple. Moon-goo should deplete, and respawn in a different moon. I know that setting up POSGÇÖs is a PITA, but that would lead into my discontent with POS mechanics, that IGÇÖm sure all can relate. CCP should fix the POS design, and also allow moon-goo to deplete in ALL moons.
Moon-goo outside wormholes for T2 production, PI for various production, and Wormhole moons for something new or augment for T3 production. I donGÇÖt care, but with moon materials depleting and respawning all over, this idea would be fine.
Quote:3. New Types of Sleeper escalations (spawned from Marauders?) This was a discussion point at some point when I was running for CSM. Not sure when, but I thought it was an interesting concept to help with C1-C4 wormhole residents. Allow them with a sleeper escalation based on Marauders landing on grid. With proper attention to the design, CCP could really go places with having PVE content that responded and evolved with the decisions of the players, whether with escalations of Caps, Marauders, Logi, or whatever. Lots of interesting PVE potential can be expanded from this idea.
Overall, wormholers will want more incentive for the increased risk added, not to mention the added risk to smaller organizations and solo players that participate in wormholes. Anyhow, thatGÇÖs my two cents. Cheers~ **Irrelevant-á| Twitter: @autoritare | [email protected] My Blog: http://diogenes-club.blogspot.com/ | The Diogenes Club |
Moloney
Faceless Men
152
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Posted - 2014.09.15 08:27:00 -
[14] - Quote
No to moon goo.
The rest is fine. |
Janeway84
Its a good day to die ORPHANS OF EVE
102
|
Posted - 2014.09.15 08:47:00 -
[15] - Quote
I would vote yes to a few of these ideas, but moon goo im not sure, it feels like it goes agaisnt the ideas of wh space where you go out there in space and do things and put your stuff on the line. If they would add moon goo imo they should do it differently from harvesting to what you produce with it. You could harvest the moon goo with ships instead of pos module and moo go could be used to produce something new like t3 mods instead of old t2 mods. But since CCP hasnt finnished ship and module rebalance its just a dream. Im still wondering where the recon ship pass is? |
Pavel Sohaj
Anoikis Exploration
49
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Posted - 2014.09.15 09:55:00 -
[16] - Quote
Moongoo is silly. Not a good idea. Provide something else. BOnus to manufacturing? Better PI? More waves or better loot? Unlike null, we dont get spawns constantly to farm around. |
RudinV
Syndicate of Death BLOOD UNION
397
|
Posted - 2014.09.15 10:14:00 -
[17] - Quote
carebears wanna moreeeeeee |
Pavel Sohaj
Anoikis Exploration
49
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Posted - 2014.09.15 10:18:00 -
[18] - Quote
RudinV wrote:carebears wanna moreeeeeee
Not liek you guys would ever shoot empty space right? |
RudinV
Syndicate of Death BLOOD UNION
397
|
Posted - 2014.09.15 11:01:00 -
[19] - Quote
Pavel Sohaj wrote:RudinV wrote:carebears wanna moreeeeeee Not liek you guys would ever shoot empty space right? not liek its empty cose of carebear`s whined so hard that ccp smthfour decided to make it easier for ya. and srsly maradeurs escalations?? |
Eve The Charitable
A.A.A
3
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Posted - 2014.09.15 11:55:00 -
[20] - Quote
RudinV wrote:Pavel Sohaj wrote:RudinV wrote:carebears wanna moreeeeeee Not liek you guys would ever shoot empty space right? not liek its empty cose of carebear`s whined so hard that ccp smthfour decided to make it easier for ya. and srsly maradeurs escalations??
Think of all the juicy marauder kills, man, just think about it. |
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Ruffio Sepico
Hidden Agenda Deep Space Engineering
29
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Posted - 2014.09.15 12:21:00 -
[21] - Quote
If anything wspace need resources that is only used in items possible to make from wspace. More t3 items/mods not necessary that much better than other things out there, just other functions or combination of effects. Just have sleepers drop mods that is wrecked that can be reverse engineered. Would help boost value of sleeper salvage too.
I remember CCP talked about comet mining in the past. Sounds dangerous enough for wspace right? Could yield new materials not found elsewhere.
Why does a POS need to be fueled the way it does? How about alternative fuel cells possible to make from sleeper tech, just something that would enhance industry or at least give people options in wspace. Give people more things to do that is worth the while doing. Catching someone harvesting resources for fuel, or catching someone hauling fuel, interaction all the same right?
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Meytal
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
543
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Posted - 2014.09.15 12:36:00 -
[22] - Quote
It should not be "moon goo" at any rate. That is a passive income activity which should be discouraged. You could argue the same about mining in general, but this is not the thread for proposing mining changes.
The same resources should be made available in scannable signatures; I would have dumped them into the generic "Grav" sites category in the past, which would also have included the occasional and random ice field. I believe harvesting/mining comets was an idea that was floated.
It would be interesting to have the stuff there, but it should neither be static, predictable, nor consistent. If it's present at all (still questionable). There should be more reasons to leave the home wormhole, not more reasons to turtle up.
There are also still a number of wormhole resources that are so infrequently used and available in such quantities as to render them useless. Rebalance the Sleeper salvage usage in blueprints, and add new items to the game that require Sleeper salvage and other WH "goo" first.
But don't expect these things any time soon, especially moon materials. That would come dangerously close to touching Nullsec industry and would therefore never happen.
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Nash MacAllister
Anomalous Existence Low-Class
168
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Posted - 2014.09.15 14:39:00 -
[23] - Quote
#3 Perhaps it could be based off mass-on-grid triggers which have some +/- factor, say 20%, versus solely Marauders. This would allow the idea to be used for all C1-C4 as nobody would ever use a Marauder in a C1 or C2, or likely even a C3. However, I would love to see more risk/randomness injected into C1-4 site running. I always loved the random triggers in the C5 Quarantine sites as well, would be a welcome addition. I don't think there is a need to significantly boost ISK/site, but something on the order of 25% - 30% increase over current would encourage site runners. These numbers would be for a C4, lower class could scale from there. C3 difficulty vs reward does seem to be a little skewed high against the other low class wh though... Yes, if you have to ask yourself the question, just assume we are watching you... |
Incindir Mauser
Adhocracy Incorporated Adhocracy
436
|
Posted - 2014.09.15 15:53:00 -
[24] - Quote
At the risk of sounding like a broken record, WH Moon Goo is a non starter for me personally.
W-space needs a new entirely different economic driver outside of T3 production, and outside of resources used or gathered from K-space.
For example, if we take income sourced from L4 security missions as kind of a baseline. C1 income should beat that easily. C2's would be a step above that. C3's would start around the same level as what the average incursion runner would expect to make hourly, C4's a step above that. C5's and C6's should be flat out the best personal income available considering the resources needed to extract that income and the personal risks pilots are putting on the line to keep making it.
Most folks would probably prioritize POS revamps ahead of this. It's my opinion that W-space needs to re-establish itself as the best isk making venture for small to medium sized corps and alliances. 20-500 pilots respectively. It would make sense that C6 space would be a logical stepping stone for W-space corps to make a transition from there to null-sov if they so chose to take that route. Something of a stepping stone or a place for disenfranchised null blobbers to regroup and make isk to restablish themselves.
This has a two fold benefit of bringing in more pilots for W-space dedicated residents to shoot at, and making W-space more attractive versus high-reward low-risk Incursions. |
Ruffio Sepico
Hidden Agenda Deep Space Engineering
29
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Posted - 2014.09.15 17:01:00 -
[25] - Quote
Incindir Mauser wrote: At the risk of sounding like a broken record, WH Moon Goo is a non starter for me personally.
W-space needs a new entirely different economic driver outside of T3 production, and outside of resources used or gathered from K-space.
For example, if we take income sourced from L4 security missions as kind of a baseline. C1 income should beat that easily. C2's would be a step above that. C3's would start around the same level as what the average incursion runner would expect to make hourly, C4's a step above that. C5's and C6's should be flat out the best personal income available considering the resources needed to extract that income and the personal risks pilots are putting on the line to keep making it.
Most folks would probably prioritize POS revamps ahead of this. It's my opinion that W-space needs to re-establish itself as the best isk making venture for small to medium sized corps and alliances. 20-500 pilots respectively. It would make sense that C6 space would be a logical stepping stone for W-space corps to make a transition from there to null-sov if they so chose to take that route. Something of a stepping stone or a place for disenfranchised null blobbers to regroup and make isk to restablish themselves.
This has a two fold benefit of bringing in more pilots for W-space dedicated residents to shoot at, and making W-space more attractive versus high-reward low-risk Incursions.
If you expand on t3 and what you can build from sleeper salvage. It would ramp up the value of salvage though. Not necessary new t3 ships, but modules or what not. But yeah better pos's and infrastructure to make it easier to include new players would help a lot too.
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Incindir Mauser
Adhocracy Incorporated Adhocracy
439
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Posted - 2014.09.15 18:00:00 -
[26] - Quote
Ruffio Sepico wrote: If you expand on t3 and what you can build from sleeper salvage. It would ramp up the value of salvage though. Not necessary new t3 ships, but modules or what not. But yeah better pos's and infrastructure to make it easier to include new players would help a lot too.
Good points.
POS revamp really only affects a handful of people per corporation usually. Would we all benefit from a standard of living change to them to make them easier to use and easier to secure? Sure. Absolutly, CCP has a buttload of work to do to make them compartmentalized enough from the existing code to make radical changes that would be neccessry to give us those QoL changes.
From what I've heard and seen in the past is that tweaking WH income and putting in new economic ventures tied to Sleepers, W-space anoms and PI could be implimented far quicker than fundamental changes to POS code.
Simply adjusting WH income to be competitive with Hisec Incursions would be a boon, since Incursions came out, it feels like W-space has seen steady declines in interest from pilots over the years.
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Billy Hardcore
Jaded.
165
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Posted - 2014.09.15 18:07:00 -
[27] - Quote
Incindir Mauser wrote:Ruffio Sepico wrote: If you expand on t3 and what you can build from sleeper salvage. It would ramp up the value of salvage though. Not necessary new t3 ships, but modules or what not. But yeah better pos's and infrastructure to make it easier to include new players would help a lot too.
Good points. POS revamp really only affects a handful of people per corporation usually. Would we all benefit from a standard of living change to them to make them easier to use and easier to secure? Sure. Absolutly, CCP has a buttload of work to do to make them compartmentalized enough from the existing code to make radical changes that would be neccessry to give us those QoL changes. From what I've heard and seen in the past is that tweaking WH income and putting in new economic ventures tied to Sleepers, W-space anoms and PI could be implimented far quicker than fundamental changes to POS code. Simply adjusting WH income to be competitive with Hisec Incursions would be a boon, since Incursions came out, it feels like W-space has seen steady declines in interest from pilots over the years.
well of course they have. You can bear all day and never once be afraid of loosing your ship. #BillyFleet |
Sinwalker
Anomalous Existence Low-Class
30
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Posted - 2014.09.15 18:36:00 -
[28] - Quote
Agreed, you need something to drive conflict.
Currently we have a number of members that run incursions to make isk, wormhole risk vs reward is very skewed as nanoribbons have dropped in price over the years. Once you get a certain number of people running sites together, the isk per hour drops dramatically, even in things like c4s. When even level 4's can generate almost equal isk per hour, let alone incursions, something is wrong. Here we are in 0.0 with no local, and we can make almost just as much money in highsec? That seems silly.
I agree Moon Goo is not the answer, as it doesn't drive conflict. At least with PI, you can catch haulers at a customs office. My idea would be to make nanoribbons useful for more things, to get our prices back to what they once were. Or you could even create a "sleeper faction" to drop faction modules. Then even c1 sites are potentially worth running. More people running sites = more people to kill. More people with more money = more pvp as they aren't worried about losing 3 days of carebearing in one go. Perhaps then my members wouldn't have to leave wormholes to make semi-decent isk or farm for a week to make up a t3/faction battleship loss. I'm fine with more escalations, give us super battleships in c4s or something, wormholes are supposed to be challenging. But increasing nanoribbon counts aren't the answer, as you will just dilute the market even more. |
Pro TIps
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
26
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Posted - 2014.09.15 19:03:00 -
[29] - Quote
Billy Hardcore wrote:3. New Types of Sleeper escalations (spawned from Marauders?) This would be a nerf to guys who solo combat anoms in Marauders. I don't know if I'm for or against that; just an observation.
When the Hyperion changes were announced, there seemed to be a very large divide between "PVP" posters and carebears. I have noticed a lot more food-chain oriented "PVP" posters of late. I think that's a good thing. If the sun doesn't shine on us plankton, you sharks will eventually starve. I don't mind fighting you guys and losing if I'm not rapidly going broke in the process. |
Billy Hardcore
Jaded.
165
|
Posted - 2014.09.15 19:06:00 -
[30] - Quote
Pro TIps wrote:Billy Hardcore wrote:3. New Types of Sleeper escalations (spawned from Marauders?) This would be a nerf to guys who solo combat anoms in Marauders. I don't know if I'm for or against that; just an observation. When the Hyperion changes were announced, there seemed to be a very large divide between "PVP" posters and carebears. I have noticed a lot more food-chain oriented "PVP" posters of late. I think that's a good thing. If the sun doesn't shine on us plankton, you sharks will eventually starve. I don't mind fighting you guys and losing if I'm not rapidly going broke in the process.
I would like to point out that even the largest "PVP" groups CAN and DO carebear right there with the most affluent of bear. It comes with living in wh space. Don"t let them fool you. #BillyFleet |
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