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Zeur Maximus
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2014.09.22 00:55:00 -
[1] - Quote
Intrinsic Exploits -
I was wondering if everyone agrees that suicide ganking short circuits the intent of High Security Space?
I'll bet its really confusing to newbies when it happens lol..
Easy enough to make some program code that states a ship cannot self destruct when in damage proximity of a friendly..
Don't forget in HS we are all friendly.. unless at war.
People may differ in opinion but I don't think this exploit of the rules add emersion or fun to the game.
Most of us that choose to live in High Sec prefer no wildcards.. If you want to fight go south- or join Faction War faring corps.
Thoughts ? |
Arden Elenduil
Scary Devil Monastery
136
|
Posted - 2014.09.22 01:12:00 -
[2] - Quote
Random alt: check Mentions most things that will likely get a reaction: check
Troll? Most likely... |
Zeur Maximus
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2014.09.22 01:17:00 -
[3] - Quote
Arden Elenduil wrote:Random alt: check Mentions most things that will likely get a reaction: check
Troll? Most likely...
No its really something (one of the few things) I don't care for in this nearly perfect game..
Any constructive thoughts on the post ? |
Jack Carrigan
Order of the Shadow The Revenant Order
1303
|
Posted - 2014.09.22 01:17:00 -
[4] - Quote
Failtroll is fail. "War is not measured in terms of who wins or loses, who is right or wrong.-á It is measured in terms of who survives"-á |
Iain Cariaba
354
|
Posted - 2014.09.22 01:56:00 -
[5] - Quote
Zeur Maximus wrote:Thoughts ? Try having an original one.
Since all you need to due is search forums to find all the reasons why you are wrong, I'll leave that to you and not fill three or four seperate posts by restating all of them.
Also, due to your failure of a topic name, InB4Lock. Disclaimer: My opinion does not necessarily reflect that of my corp or alliance. My opinion is my own, and if you don't like, that is your problem. |
Zeur Maximus
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2014.09.22 02:00:00 -
[6] - Quote
Iain Cariaba wrote:Zeur Maximus wrote:Thoughts ? Try having an original one. Since all you need to due is search forums to find all the reasons why you are wrong, I'll leave that to you and not fill three or four seperate posts by restating all of them. Also, due to your failure of a topic name, InB4Lock.
Laughable
Balanced mechanics?
This is a forum isn't it?
No I am not wrong .. |
Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
2701
|
Posted - 2014.09.22 02:19:00 -
[7] - Quote
Suicide ganks in highsec are not an exploit. In fact, they're one of the few things keeping highsec income from being nerfed into oblivion. Don't believe me? Ask CCP. |
LT Alter
Ouroboros Research and Development
133
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Posted - 2014.09.22 02:21:00 -
[8] - Quote
in b4 lock |
Iain Cariaba
354
|
Posted - 2014.09.22 02:41:00 -
[9] - Quote
I wasn't going to do this, but what the hell. I'm stuck at work on a Sunday night, I'm bored, so I'll take the trollbait.
Zeur Maximus wrote:Intrinsic Exploits -
I was wondering if everyone agrees that suicide ganking short circuits the intent of High Security Space?
I'll bet its really confusing to newbies when it happens lol..
Easy enough to make some program code that states a ship cannot self destruct when in damage proximity of a friendly..
Don't forget in HS we are all friendly.. unless at war.
People may differ in opinion but I don't think this exploit of the rules add emersion or fun to the game.
Most of us that choose to live in High Sec prefer no wildcards.. If you want to fight go south- or join Faction War faring corps.
Thoughts ? 1: It has already been said, numerous times, by CCP Devs that "high security space is safer, not safe." 2: Sure it is, but they are quickly sorted out. 3: Self destruct does not damage anything beyond the ship self destructing, so this line is pointless. 4: Hahahahaha, if you really think that, then you aren't playing EvE. Even the market is a form of PvP, where every buy and sell order that undercuts the others is a form of economic warfare. Then there's all the scammers throughout highsec. I could fill a post with all the examples that disprove this line alone. 5: What exploit? It is absurdedly easy to not get ganked in highsec. That you fail to do this does not make an exploit. 6: If you want no wild cards, go find another game to play. I've heard Hello Kitty Online is a nice place to avoid PvP. Disclaimer: My opinion does not necessarily reflect that of my corp or alliance. My opinion is my own, and if you don't like, that is your problem. |
Angeal MacNova
LankTech
206
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Posted - 2014.09.22 03:11:00 -
[10] - Quote
Iain Cariaba wrote:6: If you want no wild cards, go find another game to play. I've heard Hello Kitty Online is a nice place to avoid PvP.
Nah man, kitties got some serious pvp skills.
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Iain Cariaba
354
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Posted - 2014.09.22 03:15:00 -
[11] - Quote
Angeal MacNova wrote:Iain Cariaba wrote:6: If you want no wild cards, go find another game to play. I've heard Hello Kitty Online is a nice place to avoid PvP. Nah man, kitties got some serious pvp skills. *looks up at the ceiling* I didn't do anything. Disclaimer: My opinion does not necessarily reflect that of my corp or alliance. My opinion is my own, and if you don't like, that is your problem. |
Zeur Maximus
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2014.09.22 03:33:00 -
[12] - Quote
Iain Cariaba wrote:Angeal MacNova wrote:Iain Cariaba wrote:6: If you want no wild cards, go find another game to play. I've heard Hello Kitty Online is a nice place to avoid PvP. Nah man, kitties got some serious pvp skills. *looks up at the ceiling* I didn't do anything.
Well at least we got more details instead of just bs.
Hmm I suppose you think the safety feature is terrible too ?
I don't like it myself..
I like the violence and all out player ran game totally.. really the discussion was just over mechanics.. mechanics.. mechanics lol..
thanks .. |
Zan Shiro
Alternative Enterprises
487
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Posted - 2014.09.22 03:34:00 -
[13] - Quote
Suicide ganking is how ccp controls isk making in empire imo. Its working as intended.
0.0 can spam their rats but die to roams and ops.
WH's same thing.
Low sec can die to piewats or thrill seekers (not a pirate per se myself but if 0.0 was just dead did have roams hit low sec for giggles) or if active in fw stuff.
See the trend....make isk, give some back to the pve gods in form of pvp (consensual or non-concensual) losses. CCP likes it if you make 1 billion isk....then give back say 250 mil in a ship loss.
then you get the empire bears. Who lacking ganking once they learn the game and stop dying in pve missions would have no ship loss. That be a problem.
And this not even an issue many have. Fly smart mixed with some luck and bank changes drop to real low levels. Many runners and miners go gank free their while time in eve in empire. |
Celthric Kanerian
Ascendance Of New Eden Workers Trade Federation
106
|
Posted - 2014.09.22 05:36:00 -
[14] - Quote
Zeur Maximus wrote:
Don't forget in HS we are all friendly.. unless at war.
You got to be kidding me with this...
|
Valkin Mordirc
282
|
Posted - 2014.09.22 06:04:00 -
[15] - Quote
Does any one else smell gasoline? #DeleteTheWeak |
Zeur Maximus
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2014.09.22 06:59:00 -
[16] - Quote
Celthric Kanerian wrote:Zeur Maximus wrote:
Don't forget in HS we are all friendly.. unless at war.
You got to be kidding me with this...
No not kidding we are speaking in terms of game rules.
You know - high security ; ) |
Zmikund
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
4
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Posted - 2014.09.22 08:38:00 -
[17] - Quote
Zan Shiro wrote:Suicide ganking is how ccp controls isk making in empire imo. Its working as intended.
Suicide gangs are lames form of pvp in this game and should be removed from it at all ... if CCP want pvp in high sec they can make wars little more attractive ... suicide gangs are worst thing that eve has ... if you could at least get your revenge to noobs gankers but u cant do even that ... |
Duchess Starbuckington
Starbuckington Manor
300
|
Posted - 2014.09.22 09:16:00 -
[18] - Quote
Zmikund wrote:Zan Shiro wrote:Suicide ganking is how ccp controls isk making in empire imo. Its working as intended. Suicide gangs are lames form of pvp in this game and should be removed from it at all ... if CCP want pvp in high sec they can make wars little more attractive ... suicide gangs are worst thing that eve has ... if you could at least get your revenge to noobs gankers but u cant do even that ...
Suicide ganking serves a purpose in balancing the game economy. It's easy enough to avoid if you use your brain and do some research.
Oh yeah and I've had to run haulers around plenty of times and never been ganked. Hmmm, I wonder how I managed that? |
Ralph King-Griffin
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
5067
|
Posted - 2014.09.22 09:23:00 -
[19] - Quote
this is the "can i bring my drake" of forum trolls, nothing to see here =]I[= |
Gully Alex Foyle
Black Fox Marauders Spaceship Bebop
1933
|
Posted - 2014.09.22 09:40:00 -
[20] - Quote
Sorry you got misled too, op.
CCP should rename it medium security. Would fix everything both for trolls and for genuinely confused people, as you claim to be. Make space glamorous! Is EVE dying or not? Ask the EVE-O Death-o-meter! |
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Voxinian
46
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Posted - 2014.09.22 11:48:00 -
[21] - Quote
If anything High Sec should be more dangerous and have a bigger chance of PvP interaction, its rediculously easy to never lose a ship ever in high sec. |
Rupert Dealcount
University of Caille Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2014.09.22 12:19:00 -
[22] - Quote
I was ganked in HS ones in my fine industrial ship mowing my highly valuable PI. I raged. I wanted to throw my screen out of the window, I blamed everybody and everything, I called names, I started even a petition to CCPGǪ After a minute, however, when my GǣdisappointmentGǥ vanished I was thrilled. The adrenaline rush was amazing and I ended up donating 50m to the ganker, because, to be honest, the loot fairy f*** us up. |
Angeal MacNova
LankTech
207
|
Posted - 2014.09.22 12:22:00 -
[23] - Quote
In all seriousness OP, I don't care for suicide ganking either but with the current war mechanics and the ease of war dodging, it's a necessary evil.
If being in hi-sec meant that your ship's safety was perma green, then people would put up with the 10% tax of an NPC corp and play in absolute safety within hi-sec.
Personally I would like to see the following changes:
-Players must earn the right to gank by connecting it to sec status. Make it so that you can only set your ship's safety to yellow in hi-sec allowing you to steal from other players. In low-sec you can set to red and kill other players to get an even bigger sec status hit. Once you reach -5, you can now set your safety to red in hi-sec and can therefore gank. Except now you are a criminal and the people you plan to attack can preemptively attack. CONCORD response time may have to be reduced.....increased?....take longer to respond.
-New players get a few months to complete the tutorial and SoE epic arc. After that the only NPC corp players can default to are either FW ones. "Safety" is then connected with system sec status. With the navy responding in a similar fashion to enemy faction players as CONCORD does to criminals. Increasing in strength and numbers and more quickly with higher system sec status. With greater rewards (better belts, Lv4 missions, higher bounties in plexes, etc.) in the lower sec systems. Thus risk vs reward. As it is now, it's possible to join FW and get the benefit of 0% tax (that's right FW NPC corp charge 0 tax) and run Lv4s far from the FW systems and never see a WT.
-Dodging wars should be more difficult but declaring wars should be something you do for a reason other than "because I can". A competing corp is taking over the belts in the system you mine in? You should be able to war dec them and drive them out. Want to set up a POS in a system but all the moons are taken? You should be able to war dec one of them to take it out. Think it would be fun/funny to war dec a new corp with just 3 or 4 members with characters only a few weeks old? You shouldn't be able to war dec them. But how is the game to distinguish such things? Maybe if the cost of war dec'ing was much more than it is now.
There needs to be conflict in hi-sec but in needs to be such that everyone (even brand new players) have tools at their disposal to not get blown up the moment they undock for the lulz of someone that's been playing for years. The current setup of hi-sec is good enough. |
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
20777
|
Posted - 2014.09.22 13:59:00 -
[24] - Quote
Zeur Maximus wrote:Don't forget in HS we are all friendly.. unless at war. Eve is a hyper capitalist dystopia, Star Treks' Ferengi would love it.
With that in mind; define friendly...
The difference between a carebear and a bear is that one expects the world to revolve around them, the other accepts the world for what it is and works around it.
Nil mortifi sine lucre. |
Zeur Maximus
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2014.09.22 15:34:00 -
[25] - Quote
I will add that it's interesting players keep mentioning 'thinning' in high sec.. ATM for miners it is more profitable to be in High Sec day over day... Ready markets, good market volume, relatively good policing for large vulnerable op fleets.. Opposed to waiting till all your buddies have free time to log-on and run a protection fleet..
Fix the economies of the above and people will be busting down the walls to get hell out of high sec. For about a year I have been pondering moving my business ops down to low sec.. not easily done and its not necessarily more profitable going to a skiff from a decked out Hulk(s). etc.. et al..
I pvp and live in null - work North in High for those reasons.
Sorry for the sidebar - but I do believe NULL should be the most valuable place to be and everyone's logical end goal.. In some cases today it is not-keeping High Sec full up - Just like in the real world Economy fixes or breaks everything.
IMO some quaint little suicide ability will not help make High Sec thinner.. |
Paranoid Loyd
1947
|
Posted - 2014.09.22 16:31:00 -
[26] - Quote
Source
The essential core concept of EVE Online is that it is full time PvP in a sandbox environment. As has been mentioned in previous sections any player can engage another player at any time in any place. In high-sec space there may be consequences if a pilot attacks another without just cause, but they can still make that attack if they wish. In low-sec and null-sec, there are no limitations to PvP at all. Some of the wide variety of PvP styles are described in more detail below.
7.1 WHAT FORM DOES PVP TAKE IN EVE? There are various ways that players can engage with others in EVE. Simple combat is one of the most common forms of PvP; ranging from a one-on-one fight between frigates or cruisers to a massive fleet battle with battleships, dreadnoughts, carriers or even titans, with hundreds or thousands of pilots involved. Then there is Factional Warfare and Duelling as mentioned previously. There are a variety of ways to make your way in EVE if you wish to concentrate on PvP; you can be a pirate GÇô preying on pilots on popular trade routes or taking part in GÇÿgate campsGÇÖ, where you lie in wait for pilots who jump from system to system. Maybe youGÇÖd prefer to become a bounty hunter; tracking down other pilots for a rich reward or the simple glory of the kill. Or even become a renowned fleet commander; directing the actions of hundreds of other pilots in one of the massed battles mentioned earlier. The choice, as with all things in EVE, is yours.
7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided. The safest systems are the GÇÿrookie systemsGÇÖ where new players start their journey in EVE. In high-sec systems, you are less likely to be attacked since CONCORD will exact retribution on pilots who attack another pilot without good reason. But, for example, if you are flying a ship with a high value cargo, a player may attack you to destroy the ship and steal anything from the wreck if they think that itGÇÖs worth the effort. Such attacks are known as GÇÿgankingGÇÖ and if the profit theyGÇÖll make is sufficient, pilots are willing to accept the expense of losing their ship to CONCORD and having their security status lowered for their crimes. So it will be up to a pilot to remain vigilant wherever they may be flying and be ready for anything at any time. "PvE in EVE is a trap to turn you into PvP content, don't confuse it for actual gameplay." Lipbite |
Komi Toran
Paragon Trust The Bastion
250
|
Posted - 2014.09.22 18:11:00 -
[27] - Quote
Zeur Maximus wrote:Easy enough to make some program code that states a ship cannot self destruct when in damage proximity of a friendly.. Why do I think Op is guilty of trolling with a bad joke?
|
Agondray
Avenger Mercenaries VOID Intergalactic Forces
130
|
Posted - 2014.09.22 18:23:00 -
[28] - Quote
Alvatore DiMarco wrote:Suicide ganks in highsec are not an exploit. In fact, they're one of the few things keeping highsec income from being nerfed into oblivion. Don't believe me? Ask CCP.
ganking doesnt stop highsec income from being nerfed, its not like it removes isk at all, he moves isk from the ganker and person ganked to the indy guy that made both ships and whoever either made or salvaged the modules. Should the market be moved to a NPC market then you would see a MASSIVE isk sink "Sarcasm is the Recourse of a weak mine" -Dr. Smith |
Ima Wreckyou
The Conference Elite CODE.
262
|
Posted - 2014.09.22 19:07:00 -
[29] - Quote
Zeur Maximus wrote:I'll bet its really confusing to newbies when it happens lol.. Ganking in Highsec is a very new player friendly activity. It allows you to play a very interesting and funny part of the sandbox with only a few hours of training.
This is a MMOG = massive multiplayer online game, it's all about interesting player interaction. Ganking is one of the most interesting mechanics you have access as a brand new player where you can interact with a lot of other players in a meaningful way. Now you try to get rid of it so you can play EVE like a single player game in perfect isolation without the fear of losing your bling ships?
There are a lot of single player space games out there. Maybe they are what your are looking for? the Code ALWAYS wins |
Zeur Maximus
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2014.09.22 19:18:00 -
[30] - Quote
Paranoid Loyd wrote:Zeur Maximus wrote:Easy enough to make some program code that states a ship cannot self destruct when in damage proximity of a friendly.. This makes it obvious you don't even understand how the mechanic works. Please try to fully understand the mechanics before you formulate opinions. Here are CCP's comments on the subject: SourceThe essential core concept of EVE Online is that it is full time PvP in a sandbox environment. As has been mentioned in previous sections any player can engage another player at any time in any place. In high-sec space there may be consequences if a pilot attacks another without just cause, but they can still make that attack if they wish. In low-sec and null-sec, there are no limitations to PvP at all. Some of the wide variety of PvP styles are described in more detail below. 7.1 WHAT FORM DOES PVP TAKE IN EVE? There are various ways that players can engage with others in EVE. Simple combat is one of the most common forms of PvP; ranging from a one-on-one fight between frigates or cruisers to a massive fleet battle with battleships, dreadnoughts, carriers or even titans, with hundreds or thousands of pilots involved. Then there is Factional Warfare and Duelling as mentioned previously. There are a variety of ways to make your way in EVE if you wish to concentrate on PvP; you can be a pirate GÇô preying on pilots on popular trade routes or taking part in GÇÿgate campsGÇÖ, where you lie in wait for pilots who jump from system to system. Maybe youGÇÖd prefer to become a bounty hunter; tracking down other pilots for a rich reward or the simple glory of the kill. Or even become a renowned fleet commander; directing the actions of hundreds of other pilots in one of the massed battles mentioned earlier. The choice, as with all things in EVE, is yours. 7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided. The safest systems are the GÇÿrookie systemsGÇÖ where new players start their journey in EVE. In high-sec systems, you are less likely to be attacked since CONCORD will exact retribution on pilots who attack another pilot without good reason. But, for example, if you are flying a ship with a high value cargo, a player may attack you to destroy the ship and steal anything from the wreck if they think that itGÇÖs worth the effort. Such attacks are known as GÇÿgankingGÇÖ and if the profit theyGÇÖll make is sufficient, pilots are willing to accept the expense of losing their ship to CONCORD and having their security status lowered for their crimes. So it will be up to a pilot to remain vigilant wherever they may be flying and be ready for anything at any time.
Finally - a good answer.. Some emotional flaming but no one is perfect right? Thanks mate. If you have the time or desire please comment on the 'safety' mechanism, what do you think of it.. |
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