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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 38 post(s) |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1009
|
Posted - 2014.10.10 15:29:00 -
[781] - Quote
Current Habit wrote:CCP in charge of screwing their own power projection nerf.
1. Use barely nerfed JFs to create ship caches around the galaxy. 2. Travel in Haulers with JBs around half the map in 15min. 3. ??? 4. Power projection nerfed! /s
Retar Aveymone wrote:would one of the many idiots who think an industrial through jump bridges will ever be faster than a taxi interceptor post a video proving it
i look forward to the utter lack of videos as you discover an interceptor will always be faster in any reasonable situation
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Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness
1782
|
Posted - 2014.10.10 15:31:00 -
[782] - Quote
Querns wrote:Current Habit wrote:CCP in charge of screwing their own power projection nerf.
1. Use barely nerfed JFs to create ship caches around the galaxy. 2. Travel in Haulers with JBs around half the map in 15min. 3. ??? 4. Power projection nerfed! /s Try an hour. Crossing our own territory in fatigue-bonused industrials takes an hour. Interceptors do it in 30 minutes, without using jump bridges or titan bridges.
You decided to cross the Universe.. but if your objective is to get to 10 LY away, depending on the part of the universe it will be faster trough the hualer.
AND the hauler movement cannot be detected or intercepted so easily . Something that is MORE important military wise than the speed of movement itself. "If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!" |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1009
|
Posted - 2014.10.10 15:31:00 -
[783] - Quote
that is not even counting how easy it is to bubble and murder a horde of t1 industrials following a known route compared to how impossible it is to catch a taxiceptor which can only be lost to an internet hiccup |
Kiwinoob
Perkone Caldari State
23
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Posted - 2014.10.10 15:31:00 -
[784] - Quote
Dirk MacGirk wrote:Querns wrote:I miss you, Dinsdale. Please come back to us. These half-hearted attempts at tinfoil do not compare to your mastery.
RIP Dinsdale Pirannha, it's been nearly a month since you posted. I'm pretty sure that nerfing JF's into the ground was the last nail in the coffin of hisec industry. Reversing the nerf would undoubtedly also be the last nail in the coffin of hisec industry. I'm pretty sure the middle ground would also be the last nail in the coffin. There ya go, I channeled him for you.
You're probably not far off. No matter what happens now all the JF pilots are going to be so busy trolling the forums for any hint of another range nerf new eden is about to grind to a halt.
Devs are nothing more than machines that turn coffee into code. The quality of the-ácode is inversly proportional to the quality of the coffee.
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Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1009
|
Posted - 2014.10.10 15:32:00 -
[785] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote:AND the hauler movement cannot be detected or intercepted so easily . Something that is MORE important military wise than the speed of movement itself. "the hauler, which must travel a known path and is dead the instant it lands in a bubble, cannot be intercepted as easily as a 2s align interceptor, which is bubble immune and can warp before you lock"
"these things i believe, the above and the importance of eating paint chips for lunch" |
Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness
1782
|
Posted - 2014.10.10 15:32:00 -
[786] - Quote
Retar Aveymone wrote:that is not even counting how easy it is to bubble and murder a horde of t1 industrials following a known route compared to how impossible it is to catch a taxiceptor which can only be lost to an internet hiccup
Peopel will NOT use the hualers in gates. THey will JUMP trough a Jump bridge in a hauler get a ceptor on the other site and run the last few jumps on it.
When returning They dock the ceptor get the hauler and use the jump bridge AGAIN in the hauler. Advantaeg? they did not hurt at all their fatigue. THat means that later in the day if they need to use their carriers, they can make a force d fast travel of 2 jumps without being worried about having been previously fatigued during the day. "If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!" |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1009
|
Posted - 2014.10.10 15:34:00 -
[787] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:that is not even counting how easy it is to bubble and murder a horde of t1 industrials following a known route compared to how impossible it is to catch a taxiceptor which can only be lost to an internet hiccup Peopel will NOT use the hualers in gates. THey will JUMP trough a Jump bridge in a hauler get a ceptor on the other site and run the last few jumps on it. When returning They dock the ceptor get the hauler and use the jump bridge AGAIN in the hauler. Advantaeg? they did not hurt at all their fatigue. THat means that later in the day if they need to use their carriers, they can make a force d fast travel of 2 jumps without being worried about having been previously fatigued during the day. this is an even dumber plan than your initial one
like seriously people, look at this |
VolatileVoid
ELVE Industries Brothers of Tangra
39
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Posted - 2014.10.10 15:34:00 -
[788] - Quote
Nerfing logistic will incrase and move the empty systems to the outer regions making them less reachable and less interesting. |
Hicksimus
Torgue
359
|
Posted - 2014.10.10 15:34:00 -
[789] - Quote
Retar Aveymone wrote:that is not even counting how easy it is to bubble and murder a horde of t1 industrials following a known route compared to how impossible it is to catch a taxiceptor which can only be lost to an internet hiccup
Don't let the word smart in smart bombs scare you. Do you have it? |
Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness
1782
|
Posted - 2014.10.10 15:35:00 -
[790] - Quote
Retar Aveymone wrote:Kagura Nikon wrote:AND the hauler movement cannot be detected or intercepted so easily . Something that is MORE important military wise than the speed of movement itself. "the hauler, which must travel a known path and is dead the instant it lands in a bubble, cannot be intercepted as easily as a 2s align interceptor, which is bubble immune and can warp before you lock" "these things i believe, the above and the importance of eating paint chips for lunch"
WHY WOULD THE HAULER USE A GATE DAMMIT? At least not more than 1 every jump bridge sump. Since it can use the bridges to move fast and without chance of being detected . You can move 300 Pilots more QUIETELY this way than with interceptors depending on the geography of the region. "If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!" |
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Dirk MacGirk
Specter Syndicate Tactical Narcotics Team
105
|
Posted - 2014.10.10 15:35:00 -
[791] - Quote
Kiwinoob wrote:Dirk MacGirk wrote:Querns wrote:I miss you, Dinsdale. Please come back to us. These half-hearted attempts at tinfoil do not compare to your mastery.
RIP Dinsdale Pirannha, it's been nearly a month since you posted. I'm pretty sure that nerfing JF's into the ground was the last nail in the coffin of hisec industry. Reversing the nerf would undoubtedly also be the last nail in the coffin of hisec industry. I'm pretty sure the middle ground would also be the last nail in the coffin. There ya go, I channeled him for you. You're probably not far off. No matter what happens now all the JF pilots are going to be so busy trolling the forums for any hint of another range nerf new eden is about to grind to a halt.
The sad part of this thread is 90% of it is related to non-JF industrials. most people seem OK with holding off on JF's until they get more into their development changes. The big, silly debate seems relegated to subcap industrials and whether they will be used as taxis by those who own jump bridge superhighways. |
Josef Djugashvilis
2593
|
Posted - 2014.10.10 15:35:00 -
[792] - Quote
What's the difference between a hi-sec care bear and a null-sec care bear?
The null-sec care bear is in denial. This is not a signature. |
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CCP Greyscale
C C P C C P Alliance
3471
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Posted - 2014.10.10 15:36:00 -
[793] - Quote
Before I start with specifics:
The general intent here is to be as sure as possible that we achieve our goals over the long run, while placing as few limitations as possible. There are various ideas being thrown around, of varying degrees of plausibility, for circumventing these changes. Some may actually end up being practical, most probably won't. Rather than nerfing everything into the ground up front, we'd rather catch the really obvious stuff first and then see how the game plays out. You *can* HG-Ascendency a super to move it around, sure, but by the same token you *can* get an officer neut to fit on a Curse. We like it when people occasionally do weird, unexpected things with the tools we give them, but we step in when such cases become both common and counter to goals.
If any of these things become commonplace, we will very likely nerf them. Here's a list of things that have been up, some reasons as to why we're skeptical of their utility, and a sample of the sort of nerf we'd be likely to do to counter them:
- Setting up caches of ships and jump cloning to them -- Difficulty and cost of setting up and maintaining caches of sufficient size and density -- Limit jump clone usage furtehr - Ascendancy capitals -- Risks involved, rarity of key items -- Reduce bonuses hyperspatial whatsamajigs give to supers - Battle rorqual -- Lots of cross-training for questionable value and the certainty that we'll nerf it anyway -- Reduced/removed drone bonus - T1 hauler redeployment -- Risk of moving your whole fleet in T1 haulers, bridging or no -- Nerf hauler fatigue bonus - Using JFs to move your fleet -- Requires everyone to train for and own a JF, requires you to fly round in an unescorted fleet of JFs -- We're going to nerf JFs evenutally, if we have to tackle this in the meantime we'll think of something - Blockade-runner/black ops fleet movement -- Need to have BO stationed everywhere to pull it off -- Nerf BR bonuses - Roaming fast-warp carrier gangs -- It's a gimmick, there's probably a good counter -- Delete carriers from game (kidding, unfortunately, but we'll think of something)
Manfred Sideous wrote:@CCP Most people don't understand the roadmap. They can't fill in the blanks even though some have been able to for a long time . I think it would make things so much better for one of you or Seagull to reiterate the roadmap. To fill in some of the holes. You don't have to give particulars or dates but I think it will pay dividends on community relations. If everyone was able to understand what some of us do people would be more receptive. I don't have any special or privileged knowledge of the roadmap for instance. However , I have listened carefully and considered what would fundamentally change Eve and make it a more exciting healthier place. Once you have done that it's easy to see what will be done. So far i'm batting a 1000. So please I implore you to give consideration to talking more about the roadmap and the steps that will reach the destination.
Passing this on.
Danika Princip wrote:CCP Greyscale wrote:Vesan Terakol wrote:I want to raise a question about the Prospect - would it be treated as industrial (90% reduction) or covert (50% reduction) ship in therms of fatigue? Not designated as a hauler so not getting the industrial bonus; can use covert portal so will get 50% bonus while using covert portal. What about shuttles? They're designated as haulers. Or leopards?
Good point. Will look into that.
Darryl Brown wrote:CCP Greyscale wrote: Black Ops fatigue is a value we're happy to tune, within a reasonable range. Make a case for a number and we'll listen :)
Oooh, ooh, pick me! Combat black ops drops (e.g. Falcon tackles Rattlesnake in a Sanctum, lights covert cyno, two Panthers and a Sin jump in and kill Rattlesnake) are great fun. They add value to Eve because ratting with neuts or reds in local should be risky. They're not perfect; the target might be pre-aligned to a safe, loaded with warp core stabilizers, handy with an AB and MJD, or bait for a counter-drop. Blops drops depend upon stealth, patience, and mobility. The primary weapon is surprise - and jumping to the hunter cyno is essential for the surprise to work. Here's how things work currently: The hunter roams through a region, dodging gate camps and looking wistfully at shiny ships in POSes. At last! He spots a target in an anomaly. Things happen quickly - decloak, tackle, cyno, blops bses jump in, target dies, cyno down, scoop the loot, leave the scene. The black ops battleships wait for jump cap and then return to the staging system via jump. The hunter moves on in search of the next target. Here's how things would work with a 5ly jump with these revised changes: Hunter cyno goes up, Blops ships jump in, kill the target, and wait for 1+2.5 minutes before the jump cool-down expires. If they jump 5ly to the exit cyno after 3.5 minutes with 3.15 fatigue they get 3.15 x 3.5 = 11.025 fatigue and are done for the day. If they choose to wait in the system for at least 25 minutes, their fatigue drops below 1 and the next jump isn't quite so painful. Assuming they're adaptive folks - they have abandoned the practice of always returning to the staging system and instead wait to jump directly to the next target. Either way - there is no point in continuing to hunt for 20+ minutes until the combat blops pilots' fatigue is reduced. This is not fun. Although I suppose the hunter could go around and do "catch and release" fishing for a bit. How about taking gates? Combat blops ships are certainly better than most ships at navigating bubble camps (better speed while cloaked, can fit MJDs), but they're also pricey and fragile. Plus, they warp at 2.2au/s, so warping from in-gate to target is not feasible. I think a -50% fatigue factor is better than the original proposal but still extremely constraining. The added range (8 vs. 7.5ish) is nice, but this iteration would still mean 1-2 potential kills per session. Currently the limiting factors are all based on player behavior: Can you catch someone? Did they use their intel network and successfully avoid you? Counter-point to what I just said:
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Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness
1782
|
Posted - 2014.10.10 15:37:00 -
[794] - Quote
Retar Aveymone wrote:Kagura Nikon wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:that is not even counting how easy it is to bubble and murder a horde of t1 industrials following a known route compared to how impossible it is to catch a taxiceptor which can only be lost to an internet hiccup Peopel will NOT use the hualers in gates. THey will JUMP trough a Jump bridge in a hauler get a ceptor on the other site and run the last few jumps on it. When returning They dock the ceptor get the hauler and use the jump bridge AGAIN in the hauler. Advantaeg? they did not hurt at all their fatigue. THat means that later in the day if they need to use their carriers, they can make a force d fast travel of 2 jumps without being worried about having been previously fatigued during the day. this is an even dumber plan than your initial one like seriously people, look at this
If YOU are uanble to use your brain that is not MY PROGBLEM.
People do not like to click jump 40 times and they will NOT if they can use haulers with jump bridges for 3/4 of the travel.
Only an IDIOT would not take advantage of that. "If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!" |
Querns
GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation
897
|
Posted - 2014.10.10 15:37:00 -
[795] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote:Querns wrote:Current Habit wrote:CCP in charge of screwing their own power projection nerf.
1. Use barely nerfed JFs to create ship caches around the galaxy. 2. Travel in Haulers with JBs around half the map in 15min. 3. ??? 4. Power projection nerfed! /s Try an hour. Crossing our own territory in fatigue-bonused industrials takes an hour. Interceptors do it in 30 minutes, without using jump bridges or titan bridges. You decided to cross the Universe.. but if your objective is to get to 10 LY away, depending on the part of the universe it will be faster trough the hualer. AND the hauler movement cannot be detected or intercepted so easily . Something that is MORE important military wise than the speed of movement itself. Compared to how catchable interceptors are?
Hint: interceptors enjoy a role bonus that prevents them from being caught by bubbles. Hint two: Jump bridges are confined to one per system. This means you have to take gates in between. Jump bridges provide static routes through space, which can be discerned beforehand and camped. Interceptors can vary their route to avoid the infinitesimal dangers they do face while traveling.
Why aren't you all focusing your efforts on the interceptor instead? It just boggles the mind that so much effort is going into trying (poorly, I might add) to prove one edge case where a T1 industrial might have an edge, when you could be attacking the root of the problem instead.
I suspect the motives here are disingenuous and have more to do with maintaining the supremacy of interceptors than they do with the surface goal, but that could just be paranoia talking. I don't know for sure. This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay. |
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CCP Greyscale
C C P C C P Alliance
3471
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Posted - 2014.10.10 15:38:00 -
[796] - Quote
Tiberizzle wrote:a bonus to covert jump portal fatigue is stupid
bomber siegefleets are one of the most effective tools in the sov null strategic toolbox and nearly everyone has a combat T3 doctrine, which can carry a depot and refit in space to a minimal mass covert/nullified travel fit
pretty much the absolute last thing the game needs is everything except low-counterability, non-content-generating coward strategies and convenience features to be kneecapped in the name of nerfing force projection while the most egregious examples of content avoidance tactics are buffed stratospherically
This isn't the only change we're making to bombers in this release.
Catt Stevens wrote:Greyscale CAN I HAVE YOUR BABIES!!!!!!
No, I need them for dinner.
Zifrian wrote:Can someone explain to me why jump freighters and rorquals jump ranges limit "force projection"? I just don't get why they are part of these changes at all.
We've specifically avoided using the term "force projection" because it carries a lot of baggage with it. They're part of the changes because a) we want jump systems to work in a unified way, and b) we were originally of the opinion that this was a good opportunity to rein in their power too, which we've since changed our minds on. a) still stands, though. |
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Dirk MacGirk
Specter Syndicate Tactical Narcotics Team
105
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Posted - 2014.10.10 15:41:00 -
[797] - Quote
What if we did this a little different.
The jump fatigue and range changes to capitals excluding the Jump Freighter, are absolutely fine. However, what if jump freighters had a fatigue-reduction bonus of 125% rather than 90%? Not only could you haul some things, but you could actually earn back fatigue credit. Now, before you say I'm crazy or just trolling, just remember that I am not advocating giving this Fatigue Eater bonus to other industrials. That would be lunacy. |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1009
|
Posted - 2014.10.10 15:42:00 -
[798] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote: WHY WOULD THE HAULER USE A GATE DAMMIT? At least not more than 1 every jump bridge sump. Since it can use the bridges to move fast and without chance of being detected . You can move 300 Pilots more QUIETELY this way than with interceptors depending on the geography of the region.
yeah, see, this is another brain-dead argument by someone who has never been in nullsec
i don't get 300 pilots without broadcasting enough the spies all know to tune in |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1009
|
Posted - 2014.10.10 15:47:00 -
[799] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote: If YOU are uanble to use your brain that is not MY PROGBLEM.
the ironing is delicious
"god its so easy, just pre-position tons of industrials, swap out after every single jb jump to an interceptor, take one gate, dock, swap back to an industrial, undock, use the jb, dock, swap back to an interceptor, undock, take one gate, dock, swap back to another prepositioned haulerm, undock, take the jb (whoops you used it before your 5m timer was up fatigue has started accumulating hard) dock, swap back to the prepositioned interceptor, undock..."
oh wait, the session changes
"god its so easy, just pre-position tons of industrials, swap out after every single jb jump to an interceptor, take one gate, dock *session change timer* swap back to an industrial,*session change timer* undock *session change timer* use the jb dock up *session change timer* swap back to an interceptor *session change timer* undock *session change timer* take one gate dock up *session change timer* swap back to another prepositioned hauler *session change timer* undock *session change timer*take the jb (whoops you used it before your 5m timer was up fatigue has started accumulating hard) dock up swap back to the prepositioned interceptor undock..."
god that's so easy compared to every system taking like five seconds in an interceptor man everyone is going to do it |
Querns
GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation
897
|
Posted - 2014.10.10 15:48:00 -
[800] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote:Tiberizzle wrote:a bonus to covert jump portal fatigue is stupid
bomber siegefleets are one of the most effective tools in the sov null strategic toolbox and nearly everyone has a combat T3 doctrine, which can carry a depot and refit in space to a minimal mass covert/nullified travel fit
pretty much the absolute last thing the game needs is everything except low-counterability, non-content-generating coward strategies and convenience features to be kneecapped in the name of nerfing force projection while the most egregious examples of content avoidance tactics are buffed stratospherically This isn't the only change we're making to bombers in this release. Bombers aren't really the issue to which he refers. Bombers are pretty easy to destroy. It's the other stuff you can stuff into a covert jump portal, such as covert strategic cruisers, and the blackops battleships themselves. (Yes, you can bridge blackops BS in lieu of using their built-in jump drives -- it eats a lot of fuel, but the 50% reduction in fatigue makes it worthwhile.)
It seems somewhat misleading to announce broad reductions in power to jumping and bridging, while maintaining (and, in fact, augmenting!) the power of the blackops BS drop in the same breath. Most of this has to do with the range -- that they enjoy an outsized range bonus seems too powerful, especially in concert with their reduced fatigue.
I can make the same arguments about Jump Freighters too, but I get why you're special casing them -- the state of nullsec industry is such that the umbilical cord to empire cannot yet be cut, and that it's a work in progress. I'm not HAPPY about it, but I understand why you're doing it. This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay. |
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CCP Greyscale
C C P C C P Alliance
3472
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Posted - 2014.10.10 15:48:00 -
[801] - Quote
afkalt wrote:Jenn aSide wrote:Speedkermit Damo wrote:The status quo will now be maintained. The blue donut and vast rental empires will stay as they are. Good job CCP. I guess placating mittens is more important than saving your game and your company after all.
Another good example of the bad thinking I'm preaching against, mainly because it displays no willingness to entertain the idea that the changes could have made the "mittens" and "blue donuts" of the EVE world WORSE than they are right now. At the very least, the 'loosening' of the jump range nerfs means that NPC null doesn't get the super shaft that was aimed at it. You know what would help a LOT, actually, is if CCP actually alluded to the other things that they have planned for later. It would probably help everyone as it is literally impossible to take part 1 of a 3 phase plan and hold it on overal merits if we do not know parts 2 and 3 even loosely. Specifics are not required - just something of the greater plan we can hold these changes up against. At this point (to use a crappy TV analogy) we are basically arguing about whodunnit after watching part 1 of a 3 part TV murder mystery show!
We're not ready to share more than what's already in the blog, sorry.
Dwissi wrote:That is not CCPs fault but the players fault. There seems to be a misconception of what goals are. CCPs goals have to be to prevent too many from reaching THE end goal to keep the game interesting and dynamic somehow. Where as a player your goal is to reach that end goal and try to gather as much information upfront to prepare and succeed. Both concepts are completely opposite to each other which makes people start making assumptions, throwing bones and predicting futures out of it - not to mention all those fantastic crystal balls everyone seems to have. With every prediction CCP will adjust and change course to prevent too much of it actually happening and the circle starts a new round.
Astute observations here. |
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Bronson Hughes
The Knights of the Blessed Mother of Acceleration
519
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Posted - 2014.10.10 15:48:00 -
[802] - Quote
A question for CCP Greyscale: If one of the goals of these, and future, changes is to get nullsec industry to become more self-sufficient, wouldn't it make sense to focus more on limiting the moving of goods (i.e. changing hauler movement mechanics) between empire and nullsec than to focus on limiting the movement of goods period? If you want nullsec industry to take off, it needs to be easy to move goods within your own territory, and to encourage that growth it needs to be hard to import materials into nullsec from empire.
No particular suggestion here, just a question/observation. CCP Falcon's thoughts on suicide ganking. Reading Comprehension: a skill so important it deserves it's own skillbook. I want to create content, not become content. |
Dwissi
Miners Delight
29
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Posted - 2014.10.10 15:53:00 -
[803] - Quote
To throw something completely different into the entire discussion i would like to quote something from Eve - The book Vers.1.4:
'In an average binary system the jump gate has a range of around 5 light-years, provided the jump gate is constructed on the third resonance node.'
The 5 LY distance isnt something CCP just popped out of nothing - its a basic part of the lore and history Eve is build on. Should i do anything when all 3 things on my ship are fully red?
My thanks to all Eve players for the continued forums drama - i had no idea how much i missed it while i was away :) |
Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness
1783
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Posted - 2014.10.10 15:54:00 -
[804] - Quote
Retar Aveymone wrote:Kagura Nikon wrote: If YOU are uanble to use your brain that is not MY PROGBLEM.
the ironing is delicious "god its so easy, just pre-position tons of industrials, swap out after every single jb jump to an interceptor, take one gate, dock, swap back to an industrial, undock, use the jb, dock, swap back to an interceptor, undock, take one gate, dock, swap back to another prepositioned haulerm, undock, take the jb (whoops you used it before your 5m timer was up fatigue has started accumulating hard) dock, swap back to the prepositioned interceptor, undock..." oh wait, the session changes "god its so easy, just pre-position tons of industrials, swap out after every single jb jump to an interceptor, take one gate, dock *session change timer* swap back to an industrial,*session change timer* undock *session change timer* use the jb dock up *session change timer* swap back to an interceptor *session change timer* undock *session change timer* take one gate dock up *session change timer* swap back to another prepositioned hauler *session change timer* undock *session change timer*take the jb (whoops you used it before your 5m timer was up fatigue has started accumulating hard) dock up swap back to the prepositioned interceptor undock..." god that's so easy compared to every system taking like five seconds in an interceptor man everyone is going to do it
DUDE!! You do not even understand the mechanics? WHY to swap to the interceptor then to the hauler again? The fatigue is on YOU!!
And if you cannot move 1 2 mil isk hauler ahead of the others on the SINGLE jump between jump bridges, then your group is absolutely incompetent!
No. Smart people will travel inside their empires with haulers if the geography means that they do not need to expose their fleet and the direct trough gate routes woudl expose. And they will jump to the interceptor when they get near the border of their territory.
Need someoen to draw for you?Because I think even a 7 year old can understand that. "If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!" |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1009
|
Posted - 2014.10.10 15:55:00 -
[805] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote: - Battle rorqual -- Lots of cross-training for questionable value and the certainty that we'll nerf it anyway -- Reduced/removed drone bonus
just out of curiosity let us suppose the battle rorqual fleet was deployed
how long do you think we'd have to play around with it before it got nerfed :sun: |
Ncc 1709
Fusion Enterprises Ltd Brothers of Tangra
75
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Posted - 2014.10.10 15:56:00 -
[806] - Quote
Retar Aveymone wrote:CCP Greyscale wrote: - Battle rorqual -- Lots of cross-training for questionable value and the certainty that we'll nerf it anyway -- Reduced/removed drone bonus
just out of curiosity let us suppose the battle rorqual fleet was deployed how long do you think we'd have to play around with it before it got nerfed :sun: 6 weeks? |
Dirk MacGirk
Specter Syndicate Tactical Narcotics Team
106
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Posted - 2014.10.10 15:56:00 -
[807] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote:
This isn't the only change we're making to bombers in this release.
I hope a change to bombers you aren't planning is to cause cloaked ships to decloak other cloaked ships, as seems to be the case on SISI. That would relegate bombers back to the dustbin like they were before that change was made a few years ago.
More importantly though, I hope you aren't making these changes to bombers because they have been abused by those using ISBoxer. Get rid of ISBoxer, don't destroy the functionality of bombers |
Dwissi
Miners Delight
29
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Posted - 2014.10.10 15:57:00 -
[808] - Quote
Ncc 1709 wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:CCP Greyscale wrote: - Battle rorqual -- Lots of cross-training for questionable value and the certainty that we'll nerf it anyway -- Reduced/removed drone bonus
just out of curiosity let us suppose the battle rorqual fleet was deployed how long do you think we'd have to play around with it before it got nerfed :sun: 6 weeks?
Less - patches can be deployed outside regular scheduled releases Should i do anything when all 3 things on my ship are fully red?
My thanks to all Eve players for the continued forums drama - i had no idea how much i missed it while i was away :) |
Yun Kuai
Justified Chaos Spaceship Bebop
220
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Posted - 2014.10.10 15:57:00 -
[809] - Quote
Querns wrote:Yun Kuai wrote:Well yeah, when you follow goons mantra of just "dock up and blue ball them until they get disinterested and don't come back" of course it's not fun for anyone. The real fun is when you send the freighter through the gate first to make sure you get everyone agressed and then jump the rest of the fleet and cyno in all of your archons...oh wait....sorry...too soon? Yes, let's use our paper thin freighters holding up to 35b apiece as bait. Rational people don't let this happen.
Rational people wouldn't put all their eggs in one basket either but hey you guys just keep doing what you're doing. See that right there is the problem with you null bears, you are exactly the kind of people who expect easy, instant gratification...moving that kind of value, I.e. 35bil a piece, should never have anything but beyond impossible tagged to it. The fact that you can move that kind of value from highsec out to nullsec with such ease just validates the point that it should be significantly harder and put at significantly higher risk.
Here's a novel idea, given the size of freighters and the massive cargo hold of them, why not take into consideration all of the m3 of the contents being moved inside the freighter in addition to the freighters mass. It would make Titan bridging freighters or having them jump through a JB cost a about a billion in fuel. --------------------------------------------------------::::::::::::--:::-----:::---::::::::::::--------------:::----------:::----:::---:::----------------------:::::::-------:::---:::----::::::-------------------:::-----------:::--:::----:::---------------------::::::::::::----:::::::----:::::::::::::------- |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1010
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Posted - 2014.10.10 15:57:00 -
[810] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote: DUDE!! You do not even understand the mechanics? WHY to swap to the interceptor then to the hauler again? The fatigue is on YOU!!
boy i don't know where i got that dumb idea
oh wait
Kagura Nikon wrote: Peopel will NOT use the hualers in gates. THey will JUMP trough a Jump bridge in a hauler get a ceptor on the other site and run the last few jumps on it.
it is interesting to see even you realize how dumb your idea is when you forget you said it |
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