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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Anslo
Scope Works
19865
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Posted - 2014.10.28 17:04:37 -
[1] - Quote
Simple question; anyone know of communities or cities or colonies or somewhere where Amarr and Minmatar baseliners living in the warzone have gone through so much back and forth that they simple co-exist without the slavery?
I know I know, slavery is a part of Amarr, a big one. I'm not trying to detract from it or whatever. But it's a big cluster, anything can happen.
So, anyone?
[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
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Samira Kernher
Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
787
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Posted - 2014.10.28 17:10:39 -
[2] - Quote
I don't think there is any coexistence. There certainly aren't settlers, or people moving in, so you won't find Empire and Republic citizens living side-by-side, aside from the occupation forces.
I do expect that there is very little slavery in the warzone for simple pragmatic purposes. Republic occupational forces would likely enforce its disolution (or at least the manumission of all Matari), so I expect most Holders in the region have in anticipation of this fact already transferred their stock to core world holdings or sold it off to Holders in less volatile territories. |
Diana Kim
State Protectorate Caldari State
1364
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Posted - 2014.10.28 17:24:45 -
[3] - Quote
I can bet there are though many colonies where Amarr and Minmatar baseliners coexist peacefully with slavery. And under Imperial rule. I can bet even more, that under Republic rule, Amarr and baseliners might coexist without slavery, but definitely not peacefully, taking into account republician's attitude towards Imperials. |
Anslo
Scope Works
19865
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Posted - 2014.10.28 17:25:22 -
[4] - Quote
So in your long stint in the Zone, Samira, you've never seen one mixed colony co-existing?...huh...interesting.
No I'm not saying you're full of **** or anything. I'm just surprised that none exist after all this time.
Hmm...
[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
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Samira Kernher
Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
788
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Posted - 2014.10.28 17:30:10 -
[5] - Quote
Anslo wrote:So in your long stint in the Zone, Samira, you've never seen one mixed colony co-existing?...huh...interesting.
No I'm not saying you're full of **** or anything. I'm just surprised that none exist after all this time.
Hmm...
Most people are trying to leave the warzone colonies, not immigrate to them. This will be the case for as long as the war lasts. So the population ratio remains relatively static.
You won't be seeing mixed colonies until after the war ends and stability returns to the region. Then any territories that have permanently changed hands will start seeing large-scale settling by the new sovereignty. |
Anslo
Scope Works
19865
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Posted - 2014.10.28 17:31:31 -
[6] - Quote
Really now? Long term eh?....I think I'm gonna do a thing. Thanks for the input Samira!
[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
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Valerie Valate
Church of The Crimson Saviour
638
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Posted - 2014.10.28 17:34:37 -
[7] - Quote
I seem to recall reading somewhere, that most of the Minmatar systems are now uninhabited, planetside.
Amamake was the example given. Uninhabited, save for any garrisons of planet-based weapons. |
Ria Nieyli
21919
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Posted - 2014.10.28 18:03:57 -
[8] - Quote
I find the scenario unlikely. Baseliners are a lot more bound by ideological conduct than we are, in general.
Mirrored eyes
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Karynn Denton
Clan Katanga Caravan
298
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Posted - 2014.10.28 18:13:32 -
[9] - Quote
Interesting.
Katanga Caravan would be keen to trade with such communities, if they exist. Please, let me know if you encounter any.
Karynn Denton
Caravan Master
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Anslo
Scope Works
19867
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Posted - 2014.10.28 18:14:20 -
[10] - Quote
No.
[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
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Siddhar Gangari
Wolfdale Inc. Ushra'Khan
0
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Posted - 2014.10.28 18:32:18 -
[11] - Quote
Diana Kim wrote:I can bet even more, that under Republic rule, Amarr and baseliners might coexist without slavery, but definitely not peacefully, taking into account republician's attitude towards Imperials.
You have it backwards. |
Samira Kernher
Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
789
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Posted - 2014.10.28 18:47:56 -
[12] - Quote
It's not backwards, but it's also not accurate. Social unrest between the two happens in both empires and has become a lot more pronounced since the war started.
Thus any coexisting that happens after the war ends is going to be a cause of strife between the peoples involved, rather than peaceful mingling. |
Anslo
Scope Works
19868
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Posted - 2014.10.28 18:51:34 -
[13] - Quote
But you think if it ever happened, it'd only be AFTER the war, right?
[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
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Pieter Tuulinen
Pyre Falcon Defence and Security Imperial Outlaws.
4036
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Posted - 2014.10.28 18:52:38 -
[14] - Quote
Samira Kernher wrote:It's not backwards, but it's also not accurate. Social unrest between the two happens in both empires and has become a lot more pronounced since the war started.
Thus any coexisting that happens after the war ends is going to be a cause of strife between the peoples involved, rather than peaceful mingling.
Frankly you can lay the blame for that at the feet of people who decided to build the warzone from populated colonies. Madness! Black Rise was always bleak, but the Minmatar/Amarr frontier is starting to rival it.
"You let one of them go, but that's nothing new is it? Every now and then a little victim is allowed to escape; because she smiled, because he's got freckles, because they begged. And that's how you live with yourself. That's how you slaughter millions."
"Only a killer would know that..."
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Diana Kim
State Protectorate Caldari State
1366
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Posted - 2014.10.28 19:04:09 -
[15] - Quote
Siddhar Gangari wrote:Diana Kim wrote:I can bet even more, that under Republic rule, Amarr and baseliners might coexist without slavery, but definitely not peacefully, taking into account republician's attitude towards Imperials. You have it backwards. Mr. Gangari,
Do you agree, that Imperials can live as they want, that you must not tell them to stop being slavers, that you must not tell the release slavers. Do you agree, that they can pray to their God where they want, including your territories? Would you welcome a Holder with open arms, if he won't bring slaves to your territory, but will tell you he have millions left at his home? |
Anslo
Scope Works
19868
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Posted - 2014.10.28 19:14:25 -
[16] - Quote
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:Samira Kernher wrote:It's not backwards, but it's also not accurate. Social unrest between the two happens in both empires and has become a lot more pronounced since the war started.
Thus any coexisting that happens after the war ends is going to be a cause of strife between the peoples involved, rather than peaceful mingling. Frankly you can lay the blame for that at the feet of people who decided to build the warzone from populated colonies. Madness! Black Rise was always bleak, but the Minmatar/Amarr frontier is starting to rival it. Woopsie?
[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
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Samira Kernher
Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
790
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Posted - 2014.10.28 19:24:15 -
[17] - Quote
Anslo wrote:But you think if it ever happened, it'd only be AFTER the war, right?
Yes. Very few people want to move to wartorn areas. Settling is always something that happens after a war, not during. |
Anslo
Scope Works
19868
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Posted - 2014.10.28 19:24:56 -
[18] - Quote
Samira Kernher wrote:Anslo wrote:But you think if it ever happened, it'd only be AFTER the war, right? Yes. Very few people want to move to wartorn areas. Settling is always something that happens after a war, not during. CHALLENGE ACCEPTED!
[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
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Samira Kernher
Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
791
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Posted - 2014.10.28 19:32:05 -
[19] - Quote
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:Samira Kernher wrote:It's not backwards, but it's also not accurate. Social unrest between the two happens in both empires and has become a lot more pronounced since the war started.
Thus any coexisting that happens after the war ends is going to be a cause of strife between the peoples involved, rather than peaceful mingling. Frankly you can lay the blame for that at the feet of people who decided to build the warzone from populated colonies. Madness! Black Rise was always bleak, but the Minmatar/Amarr frontier is starting to rival it.
Wars are not fought over empty rock and space. Maybe Black Rise is about resources and potential profit, but in the southeast our war is about people. |
Soren Tyrhanos
PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
25
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Posted - 2014.10.28 20:00:50 -
[20] - Quote
Samira Kernher wrote:
Most people are trying to leave the warzone colonies, not immigrate to them. This will be the case for as long as the war lasts. So the population ratio remains relatively static.
This especially more so for those few living on the surface of temperate planets with the advent of the Clone Soldier Technology.
Certainly I could imagine frontiersmen wishing to leave the warzone under normal circumstances, more so given the Imperial Guard and Tribal Command's new operators and their significantly greater capability to wreak havoc on planet-side infrastructure. While admittedly limited in terms of where they can operate, when, and how those conflicts do become very bitter and internicine from time to time. |
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Ria Nieyli
21921
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Posted - 2014.10.28 20:12:58 -
[21] - Quote
Soren Tyrhanos wrote:This especially more so for those few living on the surface of temperate planets with the advent of the Clone Soldier Technology.
Certainly I could imagine frontiersmen wishing to leave the warzone under normal circumstances, more so given the Imperial Guard and Tribal Command's new operators and their significantly greater capability to wreak havoc on planet-side infrastructure. While admittedly limited in terms of where they can operate, when, and how those conflicts do become very bitter and internicine from time to time.
It only follows reason when most capsuleers themselves abstain from operating in the warzone due to safety concerns.
Mirrored eyes
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Soren Tyrhanos
PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
26
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Posted - 2014.10.28 23:24:33 -
[22] - Quote
Ria Nieyli wrote:Soren Tyrhanos wrote:This especially more so for those few living on the surface of temperate planets with the advent of the Clone Soldier Technology.
Certainly I could imagine frontiersmen wishing to leave the warzone under normal circumstances, more so given the Imperial Guard and Tribal Command's new operators and their significantly greater capability to wreak havoc on planet-side infrastructure. While admittedly limited in terms of where they can operate, when, and how those conflicts do become very bitter and internicine from time to time. It only follows reason when most capsuleers themselves abstain from operating in the warzone due to safety concerns.
Indeed. With the added danger that if anyone finds any left over weaponry and attempts to use it for any reason they are liable to tear their own arms off or spontaneously combust without the protection of a dropsuit. |
Elmund Egivand
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
142
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Posted - 2014.10.29 00:03:46 -
[23] - Quote
I cannot confirm the existence of such settlements planetside but they do exist in the stations. They are mostly refugees or former crewmen of extinguished warships. Yes, some of them coexist peacefully, but only because stationside security ensured nobody's rioting. You can feel the restlessness and the tension inundating your every pore whenever you walk through their camps. Every so often, there is a riot.
Everyone suffers equally when displaced. |
Soren Tyrhanos
PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
26
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Posted - 2014.10.29 00:38:26 -
[24] - Quote
Elmund Egivand wrote:I cannot confirm the existence of such settlements planetside but they do exist in the stations. They are mostly refugees or former crewmen of extinguished warships. Yes, some of them coexist peacefully, but only because stationside security ensured nobody's rioting. You can feel the restlessness and the tension inundating your every pore whenever you walk through their camps. Every so often, there is a riot.
Everyone suffers equally when displaced.
It's less so settlements and more so installations like Communications Relay's, Research Centre's, and Orbital Artillery Facilities.
You'll often find skeleton crews once the facility wide lock downs have ended. I've actually been meaning to off load a number of captives for repatriation, 11 in total secured from a Research Outpost captured in Roushzar. |
Elmund Egivand
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
142
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Posted - 2014.10.29 01:18:38 -
[25] - Quote
Soren Tyrhanos wrote:Elmund Egivand wrote:I cannot confirm the existence of such settlements planetside but they do exist in the stations. They are mostly refugees or former crewmen of extinguished warships. Yes, some of them coexist peacefully, but only because stationside security ensured nobody's rioting. You can feel the restlessness and the tension inundating your every pore whenever you walk through their camps. Every so often, there is a riot.
Everyone suffers equally when displaced. It's less so settlements and more so installations like Communications Relay's, Research Centre's, and Orbital Artillery Facilities. You'll often find skeleton crews once the facility wide lock downs have ended. I've actually been meaning to off load a number of captives for repatriation, 13 in total secured from a Research Outpost captured in Roushzar. Kador Ouryon wrote:
Classiarii operatives secured ground in over half a dozen systems making more notable gains in Isbrabata, Ontorn, and Gebuladi.
[EXCERPT REDACTED]
Despite encountering heavy resistance from hostile mercenary groups G.L.O.R.Y and Fatal Absolution, as well as the Matari loyalist organisation Carbon 7, we achieved an 80% success rate in our operations and have been under taking all possible efforts to minimise collateral damage to captured structures and residents of the Bleak Lands and Devoid.
During the events we were able to secure a number of prisoners including several Republic Marines escorting a group of a dozen Matari refugee's who surrendered without bloodshed. On questioning they appeared to be the inhabitants of the districts Communications Hub we secured. Currently they have been assigned to Soren Tyrhanos who is awaiting orders on what is to be done with them.
List of Captured Personnel: 6x Republic Marines (Marines) 4x Refugees 1x Janitor 2x Science Graduates
-Excerpt as recorded by Classriarii Ouryon in the Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Deployment Logs
I do not believe we are talking about the same thing. I was referring to the camps that were set up in the stations, as in those huge lumpy things you dock ships in, inhabited by refugees who missed the last state-operated transport out to high security space, or were put there due to various starship-gutting-related mishaps. |
Jennifer Maxwell
Crimson Serpent Syndicate Heiian Conglomerate
203
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Posted - 2014.10.29 13:10:15 -
[26] - Quote
I'm sure there are settlements in nullsec wherein Amarr and Minmatar coexist. Likewise wormhole space. In the Rise, I know of a few independent enclaves of each race, though I can't say if they mingle seeing as they're often hunted by the Navy in one form or another and are reluctant to speak to anyone they don't know. |
Katrina Oniseki
Revenent Defence Corperation Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
3345
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Posted - 2014.10.29 15:15:21 -
[27] - Quote
I have not visited the Amarr/Minmatar warzone, but I am aware of mixed colonies in both Placid and Black Rise.
Ch+½j+ì Katrina Oniseki
~ (RDC) Chief Operations Officer
~ [I-RED] Director of Internal Affairs
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Pieter Tuulinen
Pyre Falcon Defence and Security Imperial Outlaws.
4043
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Posted - 2014.10.29 16:13:25 -
[28] - Quote
Katrina Oniseki wrote:I have not visited the Amarr/Minmatar warzone, but I am aware of mixed colonies in both Placid and Black Rise.
I believe some mining and industrial colonies have mixed populations, since they are driven more by a desire to hit quota than where the pendulum is swinging this week.
I try to stay away from both native populations in the Amarr/Minmatar warzone, to be honest.
"You let one of them go, but that's nothing new is it? Every now and then a little victim is allowed to escape; because she smiled, because he's got freckles, because they begged. And that's how you live with yourself. That's how you slaughter millions."
"Only a killer would know that..."
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Desiderya
Pyre Falcon Defence and Security Imperial Outlaws.
841
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Posted - 2014.10.29 18:26:36 -
[29] - Quote
It's pretty hard to find legal slave holdings in Placid or Black Rise.
Ruthlessness is the kindness of the wise.
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Katrina Oniseki
Revenent Defence Corperation Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
3345
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Posted - 2014.10.29 18:35:14 -
[30] - Quote
I didn't mean slaves. I just meant colonies of mixed Federation and State populations.
Ch+½j+ì Katrina Oniseki
~ (RDC) Chief Operations Officer
~ [I-RED] Director of Internal Affairs
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