Pages: [1] :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Waffle Nips
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
1
|
Posted - 2014.11.04 21:29:16 -
[1] - Quote
Hello eve community was hoping people smarter than me could provide advice or perhaps a possible ships that could compete vs a worm. Can be specialized as hell if need be.
lets say standard buffer worm since im not sure it's even possible to take out the dual asb version with just a single ship since asb's are allowed to have 2 and be neut proof.... side bar why are 2 aar's not allowed you can counter with neuts and armor is the defense where you need 2 just to equal one oversized shield repper.. go figure... anyway back to point.
I was thinking perhaps firetail/dramiel could maybe have some success because of dmg selection or daredevil because of crazy dps but they seem to lack the tank to hold out vs the almighty worm... I thought maybe ecm jammers and put them on the 2 drones to try and negate a lot of the dps maybe dramiel or comet with 3 jam drones could maybe negate one drone for most the fight?
Would like to hear your thoughts and any succesful 1v1 wins vs non derp worms in novices or with a non t2 frig.
thx guys for any feedback and thoughts.
|
Skelee VI
Wraithguard. Dirt Nap Squad.
48
|
Posted - 2014.11.05 00:18:33 -
[2] - Quote
Garmur or fed navy comet |
Fenris Orion
Rapid Withdrawal
24
|
Posted - 2014.11.05 03:14:26 -
[3] - Quote
All things being equal (links/implants), the Worm seems to have the highest tank/dps combination along with a pretty high base speed. I think a dual-rep Astero could probably pull it off: kill his drones asap and use acolytes for em damage vs shields, but that'sassuming the Astero can catch the Worm in the first place.
Problem is: most Worm pilots carry snake implants and bring Links along, so they're a heinous pain in the arse to catch. |
Waffle Nips
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
1
|
Posted - 2014.11.05 03:23:52 -
[4] - Quote
this is true the speed tank dps and ability to control range and do max dps at range is just ridiculous I just like the challenge of trying to kill the flavor of the month before they nerf it. I feel like killing the drones is almost pointless because it takes so long which is why I was thinking perhaps you can jam one. It's only 2 drones if you jam one you eliminat about 100dps.
perhaps armor dramiel with ab scram web and a multi jammer for one of the drones and perhaps jam drones on the other if either hit you take a huge chucnk of dmg out and perhaps give yourself the advantage. and if both hit you only have missile dmg.
what would be your suggestion on how a garmu or comet could win. comet does less dps and can't fit more buffer or enough active tank for the dps ... garmur you can gtfo but seems like you wont do enough dmg to kill him before the drones do enough drive by damage to kill you or chase you off.. just playing devils advocate :) |
James Baboli
Ferrous Infernum
210
|
Posted - 2014.11.05 09:30:48 -
[5] - Quote
Garmur with links and a scram, plus a faction web to OH and ruin their speed, while you kill their drones. or a DD with a web for each drone, eat them with blasters and make them go away crying.
Yes, I do incursions. Find out more here
Tech 3 battleships.
Moar battleships
|
Daniel Plain
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
2159
|
Posted - 2014.11.05 12:37:00 -
[6] - Quote
Waffle Nips wrote:perhaps armor dramiel with ab scram web and a multi jammer for one of the drones [...]
you could fit two jammers on a garmur...
I should buy an Ishtar.
|
Garnoo
Eternity INC. Goonswarm Federation
120
|
Posted - 2014.11.05 12:38:01 -
[7] - Quote
theres a diffrent issue... if theres a counter to worm, and you will have it he will simply not warp to you (remepber hes a human, not npc)
People are going to try to ruin your day. Get together with others, ruin their day back --á EvE
|
ggodhsup
Raider corp
6
|
Posted - 2014.11.05 14:48:25 -
[8] - Quote
problem with beating a worm is......you will probably have to spend as much isk as the worm pilot to beat him/her, that being said expensive implants and an expensive hull will probably get you there.
personally i would use a griffin and hope for a perma jam, kill his/her drones, and slowly peck him to death.....pack a scram to shut off mwd and hope for one of the most epic mails ever......and if you lose.....well its only a griffin. |
Waffle Nips
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
1
|
Posted - 2014.11.06 03:34:22 -
[9] - Quote
ggodhsup wrote:problem with beating a worm is......you will probably have to spend as much isk as the worm pilot to beat him/her, that being said expensive implants and an expensive hull will probably get you there.
personally i would use a griffin and hope for a perma jam, kill his/her drones, and slowly peck him to death.....pack a scram to shut off mwd and hope for one of the most epic mails ever......and if you lose.....well its only a griffin.
haha this is also an amazing idea :) |
Iyokus Patrouette
No Vacancies
190
|
Posted - 2014.11.06 04:16:47 -
[10] - Quote
This same thread in Warfare and Tactics and Ships and modules has been making me think i've been clicking the wrong buttons... I hate you for confusing me like this.
---- Advocate for the initiation of purple coloured wormholes----
|
|
Daemun Khanid
Saeculari Imperial Outlaws.
19
|
Posted - 2014.11.07 15:30:06 -
[11] - Quote
ggodhsup wrote:problem with beating a worm is......you will probably have to spend as much isk as the worm pilot to beat him/her, that being said expensive implants and an expensive hull will probably get you there.
personally i would use a griffin and hope for a perma jam, kill his/her drones, and slowly peck him to death.....pack a scram to shut off mwd and hope for one of the most epic mails ever......and if you lose.....well its only a griffin.
If you don't lock him and land that insta-jam before he can assign his drones you're toast. It takes about 2 volleys from worm drones to pop a griffin. It happens VERY fast. Most worm pilots aren't going to let you get close enough for a scram/web so if you do manage to keep from being inst-popped by his drone's he's still probably going to just out run you and leave at that point.
The answer is... fly another worm. Otherwise there is no effective single ship counter for a worm that can fit in a novice.
Daemun of Khanid
|
Boozbaz
Brutor Clan
2
|
Posted - 2014.11.28 11:30:26 -
[12] - Quote
What about an ECM burst? https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Item_Database:Ship_Equipment:Electronic_Warfare:ECM_Bursts |
Valkin Mordirc
408
|
Posted - 2014.11.28 11:56:43 -
[13] - Quote
ggodhsup wrote:problem with beating a worm is......you will probably have to spend as much isk as the worm pilot to beat him/her, that being said expensive implants and an expensive hull will probably get you there.
personally i would use a griffin and hope for a perma jam, kill his/her drones, and slowly peck him to death.....pack a scram to shut off mwd and hope for one of the most epic mails ever......and if you lose.....well its only a griffin.
A Griffin wouldn't be able to defeat the tank of the drones. Specially if the Worm Pilot is paying attention.
Honestly the only thing that comes to mind that can beat a Worm is a Garmur or something that can outrun the drones while keeping tackle. Or get another Worm and hope you can out DPS him before he out DPS's you,
#DeleteTheWeak
|
Perkin Warbeck
Black Watch Guard Curatores Veritatis Alliance
184
|
Posted - 2014.11.29 02:52:23 -
[14] - Quote
Daemun Khanid wrote:ggodhsup wrote:problem with beating a worm is......you will probably have to spend as much isk as the worm pilot to beat him/her, that being said expensive implants and an expensive hull will probably get you there.
personally i would use a griffin and hope for a perma jam, kill his/her drones, and slowly peck him to death.....pack a scram to shut off mwd and hope for one of the most epic mails ever......and if you lose.....well its only a griffin. If you don't lock him and land that insta-jam before he can assign his drones you're toast. It takes about 2 volleys from worm drones to pop a griffin. It happens VERY fast. Most worm pilots aren't going to let you get close enough for a scram/web so if you do manage to keep from being inst-popped by his drone's he's still probably going to just out run you and leave at that point. The answer is... fly another worm. Otherwise there is no effective single ship counter for a worm that can fit in a novice.
Fit a sensor booster to the Griffin. I used to do the same to lock solo thrashers before they could do the same to me (and if you missed locking them in time you were alphaed). Two racial jammers should be enough to permajam any frig or dessy. It's hilarious when it does work. |
Dato Koppla
Elite Guards
713
|
Posted - 2014.11.29 14:03:18 -
[15] - Quote
I think the answer here is obvious, if the only counter for it is some extremely weird Griffin fit with a SeBo that will get instapopped if you're a second too late, it means Worms are OP. |
Ares Desideratus
Star Children Of Cain
176
|
Posted - 2014.11.29 14:15:13 -
[16] - Quote
What about a brawling Cruor ?
If it's a kiting Worm he will still have huge damage but the Cruor should be able to get in scram range no problem with the web bonus.
Like maybe
Damage Control 2x Armor Repairers Adaptive Nano Plating / Heat Sink
MWD Scram Web
Small Focused Pulse Lasers (if they fit) Nosferatu 2x
Just web him, burn toward him, scram him, and brawl him down ?
Is there any way to unswallow my pride? Can I fuck myself down?
|
Dato Koppla
Elite Guards
713
|
Posted - 2014.11.29 16:01:46 -
[17] - Quote
Ares Desideratus wrote:What about a brawling Cruor ?
If it's a kiting Worm he will still have huge damage but the Cruor should be able to get in scram range no problem with the web bonus.
Like maybe
Damage Control 2x Armor Repairers Adaptive Nano Plating / Heat Sink
MWD Scram Web
Small Focused Pulse Lasers (if they fit) Nosferatu 2x
Just web him, burn toward him, scram him, and brawl him down ?
A Worm will easily break that tank, even with heat and standard exile you're tanking just shy of 200dps, a kite Worm can put out 278dps with only 2 launchers (which many kite Worms seem to run) not to mention high alpha on the drones which makes it easy for the Worm to bleed you into hull between cycles. By the time you've caught him and started brawling, the fight would have been over for you, you still have to punch through close to 10k EHP not to mention the Worms weapons can't be neuted out. |
Ares Desideratus
Star Children Of Cain
176
|
Posted - 2014.11.29 18:32:35 -
[18] - Quote
So basically, if you are willing to spend some ISK you can fit out a Cruor like this
Damage Control Ancillary Armor Repairer Corpii or Centii Armor Repairer Centii Adaptive Nano plating
MWD Scram Web
Small Focused Pulses x2 Corpii / Sansha Nosferatu x2
Auxiliary Nano Pump Tech 2 Auxiliary Nano pump Nanobot Accelerator
You said you were willing to use a very specialized fit
Well a kiting-*** Worm is probably spend just as much ISK here.
With a Standard Exile Booster Plus some Cyclone links here are the stats
383 maximum defense / 477 with reps overloaded
3,500 M/S , 5,000 overloaded
144 DPS with faction Multi, 163 overheated
Cap lasts 40 seconds with everything running LOL
If you swap the nanobot accelerator for another aux nano pump you lose a bit of tank but gain more capacitor
If you do that you can run everything with the MWD off for 18 minutes.
Not sure if this would even work but maybe it would!
Is there any way to unswallow my pride? Can I fuck myself down?
|
Dato Koppla
Elite Guards
713
|
Posted - 2014.11.29 22:41:29 -
[19] - Quote
Ares Desideratus wrote:So basically, if you are willing to spend some ISK you can fit out a Cruor like this
Damage Control Ancillary Armor Repairer Corpii or Centii Armor Repairer Centii Adaptive Nano plating
MWD Scram Web
Small Focused Pulses x2 Corpii / Sansha Nosferatu x2
Auxiliary Nano Pump Tech 2 Auxiliary Nano pump Nanobot Accelerator
You said you were willing to use a very specialized fit
Well a kiting-*** Worm is probably spend just as much ISK here.
With a Standard Exile Booster Plus some Cyclone links here are the stats
383 maximum defense / 477 with reps overloaded
3,500 M/S , 5,000 overloaded
144 DPS with faction Multi, 163 overheated
Cap lasts 40 seconds with everything running LOL
If you swap the nanobot accelerator for another aux nano pump you lose a bit of tank but gain more capacitor
If you do that you can run everything with the MWD off for 18 minutes.
Not sure if this would even work but maybe it would!
The stats I was comparing it to is a simple T2 Worm with T2 rigs being the only pimp, this is the fit I was comparing it to:
[Worm, PvP Kite Cheap]
Drone Damage Amplifier II Drone Damage Amplifier II Internal Force Field Array I
Limited 1MN Microwarpdrive I Warp Disruptor II Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I Medium Shield Extender II
Compact Light Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Inferno Light Missile Compact Light Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Inferno Light Missile [Empty High slot]
Small Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer II Small Ancillary Current Router II Small Core Defense Field Extender II
Hobgoblin II x1 Warrior II x2 Hobgoblin II x2
So basically you need a pimp fit, linked, implanted Cruor to even stand a chance against a Worm and frankly, even if the whole fight started as a brawl at 0m I'm still not sure the Cruour would win, you need heat and paste to tank the Worms dps which you can't run continuously for long and once the Worm is capped out you will cap yourself out very quickly to. The worm has an extremely large buffer for a frigate and the Cruor has very low dps. |
ggodhsup
internet spaceship relocation movement
15
|
Posted - 2014.11.29 23:04:03 -
[20] - Quote
its not op....its a 70 mil hull.....
ofc its going to rip apart anything....and for the rest of the nay sayers about my griffin idea....lets compare cost.....
its a fraction that is so ridiculous that its not worth saying....
and at the end of the day....all we want is a KM with a griffin......if its a worm.....huge bonus.
if the answer is a garmur......then a SeBo griffin is still not half as ridiculous as you say....the garmur cost almost double a worm.
i would give a worm a fight with a griffin any day of the week.....and if i win once in a hundred times......im pretty sure that if the isk loss is close(which it will be)......... im good with it
|
|
Daemun Khanid
Saeculari
24
|
Posted - 2014.11.30 00:34:16 -
[21] - Quote
One thing I've been wondering. The cruor has bandwidth for a single drone. I'm away from a pc so dont feel like searching numbers, but what is the probability of jamming a drone with an ecm drone? It would at least cut the worms drone dps in half and replacing that single combat drone without any bonuses wont make a lot of difference in the cruors dps output. If it works it might make the cruor at least a threat to a worm.
Daemun of Khanid
|
Dato Koppla
Elite Guards
713
|
Posted - 2014.11.30 00:59:20 -
[22] - Quote
Daemun Khanid wrote:One thing I've been wondering. The cruor has bandwidth for a single drone. I'm away from a pc so dont feel like searching numbers, but what is the probability of jamming a drone with an ecm drone? It would at least cut the worms drone dps in half and replacing that single combat drone without any bonuses wont make a lot of difference in the cruors dps output. If it works it might make the cruor at least a threat to a worm.
A single EC-300 has a jam strength of 1 and a Hobgoblin II has a sensor strength of 7.5. So you have a 13.3% chance to jam 1 drone every 20 seconds, which frankly is terrible odds if you're on the receiving end of almost 300dps. A single combat drone isn't going to do much either so it isn't a bad idea, but it's far too unreliable to make the Cruor a considerable threat to a Worm. |
Daemun Khanid
Saeculari
24
|
Posted - 2014.11.30 01:09:10 -
[23] - Quote
Dato Koppla wrote:Daemun Khanid wrote:One thing I've been wondering. The cruor has bandwidth for a single drone. I'm away from a pc so dont feel like searching numbers, but what is the probability of jamming a drone with an ecm drone? It would at least cut the worms drone dps in half and replacing that single combat drone without any bonuses wont make a lot of difference in the cruors dps output. If it works it might make the cruor at least a threat to a worm. A single EC-300 has a jam strength of 1 and a Hobgoblin II has a sensor strength of 7.5. So you have a 13.3% chance to jam 1 drone every 20 seconds, which frankly is terrible odds if you're on the receiving end of almost 300dps. A single combat drone isn't going to do much either so it isn't a bad idea, but it's far too unreliable to make the Cruor a considerable threat to a Worm.
Agreed.
Daemun of Khanid
|
Ares Desideratus
Star Children Of Cain
178
|
Posted - 2014.11.30 01:23:55 -
[24] - Quote
Dato, no one's arguing that the Worm isn't OP. Well, at least I'm not.
But your simple Tech 2 fit Worm, fit with mostly Tech 2 though it may be, is still about as pimped as it can get, I mean how much more could you pimp it ? Faction DDAs ? Faction shield extender ? Edit: Obviously you could put on some faction MWD and tackle, but those things won't make it any harder to catch for the Cruor fit I posted.
No doubt the Cruor fit I posted would be able to catch you for sure.
Don't let your hatred for the Worm cloud your judgement, though.
Is there any way to unswallow my pride? Can I fuck myself down?
|
Tusker Crazinski
Delta vane Corp. Mordus Angels
3
|
Posted - 2014.12.01 01:52:02 -
[25] - Quote
get really good at hitting frigs with a bomber.
nuke it in orbit; it's the only way to be sure. |
Dato Koppla
Elite Guards
713
|
Posted - 2014.12.01 04:25:44 -
[26] - Quote
Ares Desideratus wrote:Dato, no one's arguing that the Worm isn't OP. Well, at least I'm not.
But your simple Tech 2 fit Worm, fit with mostly Tech 2 though it may be, is still about as pimped as it can get, I mean how much more could you pimp it ? Faction DDAs ? Faction shield extender ? Edit: Obviously you could put on some faction MWD and tackle, but those things won't make it any harder to catch for the Cruor fit I posted.
No doubt the Cruor fit I posted would be able to catch you for sure.
Don't let your hatred for the Worm cloud your judgement, though.
Faction tackle would make it alot harder for you to catch the Worm fit I posted because OH FN Web range is 18km and you won't be able to close into scram distance at all since the Worm will be faster while webbed and you will also be webbed at a far enough range that you won't have the inertia to carry you into scram range. If the playing field is level and nobody had links or pimp/both had links or pimp, it's still highly unlikely you'll win a fight with a kite Worm in that Cruor even if you did manage to catch it.
We all agree the Worm is OP, my point is that your idea that the Cruor is a counter is a terrible idea and is extremely unreliable. Sure you could win maybe 10% of the time if the Worm pilot is crap, but I think if both players are playing well, your chance to win in that Cruor is nearly 0. |
|
|
|
Pages: [1] :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |