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Caleb Seremshur
The Atomic Fallout Kids
414
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Posted - 2014.11.14 07:28:53 -
[1] - Quote
Ok real talk time.
First of all **** you to those who will inevitably say something about me personally for posting this. And a pre-emptive **** you to those who will come out with platitudes like "just deal with it" or "do it yourself".
Let's talk about watchlisting.
To those remarkable individuals who stumbled on to my tower I thank you for driving home to me how utterly ridiculously broken this particular thing is. Some of us here might remember me making a post about mobile depots showing your name. This is one of those things. This is one of those situations where having your name plastered on everything in space is a really ******* bad idea particularly in this scenario. My tower and the ships inside its forcefield have my name on them. The logical conlusion to draw here is that upon finding me you watchlist me. And then from that day forwards you will always know when I'm online. Now right now there is an anathema in my home hole, I saw it enter and cloak up before warping off grid. There are at LEAST 5 tengus and a loki and legion waiting for me. There is absolutely nothing I can do because I'm watch listed. I can't even pack up my tower without that fact being immediately revealed to everyone. I'm ****** basically. Now good on you for having some proactive measures in place with your scout, that's nice, but why the hell do you assume, why the hell are you even allowed to know I'm online and active? There's no handshake, it's a totally unilateral act of aggression, there's no player driven action I can perform to escape this scenario. And that's why I'm mad, not because you're running sites in my home, but because you're passively waiting for me to appear so you can gank me. Because you know I'm online. That is just utterly ******. At least coalition intel networks require people to actually be there and report hostiles and neutrals when they're found.
An argument could be created for k-space allowing these things through local networks because gates are tracking you or CONCORD knows (same with ESS things and whatever) or whatever contrived excuse you want to come up with for at least reporting that someone is in your area. This is completely different. Without D-scan you can't determine anything is there, short of launching combat probes which then allows people to know that you're there. Wormhole space. No local. Detection is based on proactive measures, defense relies on being proactive and detecting incoming hostiles, choking holes or bubbling them or otherwise d-scanning for probes or uncloaked enemies. But there is watchlisting.
Congrats, I'm just going to minimise my eve window for the rest of the day because I'm ******. I'm not going to sit here and try to do anything and let you gank me because of this flagrantly broken intel tool is letting you know that I'm still here. And after downtime I'm just not gonna log in for a couple of days. Have fun with waiting for me.
Second complaint comes back to my post ages ago about mobile depots and the fact that they reveal your name. And really any other kind of non-descript asset in space. Surely this is just a binary thing that could be switched off in the back-end by the developers. Because asking people who want to gank someone to actually be there the whole time waiting is too much, no it has to be easy. You have to be able to identify capital pilots by watchlisting their ships while they're not there or logged off, you have to be able to know instantly who might be the logistics guy for a group through similar means. All you gotta do is watchlist and then if it's worthwhile you just seed and attack while they're all offline. Because that makes any sense whatsoever. Do battle tanks in reality in the names of their drivers or even the country they belong to written on them? No. Not normally. What about combat aircraft? Well no they don't either normally because it's ********. It's just a dumb idea. Why is my name and corp even visible on my tower? If this was me in reality I wouldn't plaster my ******* name all over everything in extremely dangerous territory because maybe if I catch someone trying to steal my **** I don't want them to know it's mine and that I would be formulating a response plan. Instead you can just watchlist my whole corporation, whoever I am and know instantaneously whether I'm around or not. That's just ridiculous. It's patently ridiculous.
CCP this is the part you need to pay attention to. By now I'm calming down a bit I admit I am ******* pissed right now because I can't play without dying right now there's literally nothing I can do. And because of a programming fault. A fault in your game design and therefore programming.
You want to have things like "shattered systems" where people are going to transiently occupy presumably with either capitals for the higher class systems or mobile depots for lower class systems, or bustards or whatever that allows people to refit in space. OK. That will make being the predator so incredibly easy because a depot at the very least has a finite time span its alive. It belongs to one person. In a wormhole especially noones going to leave this behind. So you know when you find one you just click on it to see who it belongs to and if it's someone who is likely flying something work ganking you watchlist - and if they're online you know you should start scanning the hole. And if they're offline maybe you move on maybe you stay who knows you still got that massive free intel on someone because of some arbitrary *need* for every object in space to have your name on it.
This is so massive I need 2 posts for this
Join channel Aussies in space to chat with AU/NZ players
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Caleb Seremshur
The Atomic Fallout Kids
414
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Posted - 2014.11.14 07:29:11 -
[2] - Quote
Some people might just want their name on the map because of non-specific "reasons" but maybe people who are flying around solo in the most dangerous space in the whole game don't want, don't deserve that kind of crippling vulnerability. It is just totally unfair, you don't get even a courtesy notification that you were watchlisted. It's not like watchlisting is deactivated in wormhole space either (despite the fact that until Thera, clone jumping has been deactivated in wormholes because of thematical and gameplay reasons particularly the fact that if you're residing in a wormhole you're actually required to be there). And what about not being able to anchor towers in these new systems? Well that's even better! Because now as soon as someone spots your depot on d-scan, there's an actual credible reason to start scanning for it because it belongs to someone who maybe cannot leave it behind. Maybe its storing their cloak at a whopping 100m3 maybe its their only real way to refit in to that cloak. But nevermind, because you just watchlist and for the entire duration you're staying in that hole as soon as they log on you just warp to that depot and get ready for action because refitting from covops to combat is probably, most likely, going to require the use of that depot and of course you didn't sit there watching it anything because watchlisting the owner of this item told you everything you need to know for free.
If wormhole space is supposed to be hard, then it should be fair too. No watchlisting should reveal when someone is online unless they consent to allowing you to know that fact, and the permission to declare a state of being online to someone should be modifiable via the contacts library at any time. Watchlisting should also NEVER work in wormholes. Full stop. End of story. There is no overarching system in place to monitor your presence. Naturally your state of activity will be declared by appearing in corp chat because you're part of a corp. They deserve to know when you're online for reasons including security and your activity levels (for groups like Tuskers especially). But at no point should anything I don't want to have my name on it have my name on it unless I'am actually in it. At no point should anyone be able to know I'm active or even online unless I have agreed via contact adding to reveal that information.
I am seriously pissed off. I literally can't play the game right now and no amount of insipid calls for YoLo or brasso will change that, because dying uselessly is incredibly stupid especially in this game where you lose everything forever.
Join channel Aussies in space to chat with AU/NZ players
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Aquila Sagitta
Blue-Fire
536
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Posted - 2014.11.14 08:02:56 -
[3] - Quote
http://i.imgur.com/uzlcfuZ.gif
no but seriously. TL;DR Dude
Blue-Fire Best Fire
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Lloyd Roses
Blue-Fire
750
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Posted - 2014.11.14 10:04:27 -
[4] - Quote
I have a super proposal for you:
How about we remove your name from both your tower and your tractors, but in exchange everyone can freely access them since both don't have an owner - so while you run your precious sites, I can just decloak and loot your MTU! Or drop by your POS and reship. Don't want that? Better put your name on it.
"I honestly thought I was in lowsec"
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epicurus ataraxia
Z3R0 Return Mining Inc. Illusion of Solitude
1361
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Posted - 2014.11.14 10:27:00 -
[5] - Quote
He does have an interesting point though, It is a question that is valid to ask, is the balance of the availability of intel versus the "unknown" element of wormhole space out of line?
For a hunter the intel is pure gold. For the hunted, not so much.
I certainly see the argument for an intel update (watchlist) being delayed for a short while. But as for removing it, that has wider effects.
It would be a very annoying to lose the use of this tool, but I can see both sides in this, worth thinking more on, we don't want to make hunting purely blundering into people though.
The point about unoccupied items delivering the owners name, being at odds with wormhole space is interesting, he has a good point. That is worth talking about as well.
[u]_There is one EvE. Many people. Many lifestyles. WE are EvE _[/u]
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Aivo Dresden
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
390
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Posted - 2014.11.14 10:53:49 -
[6] - Quote
Never understood the watch list mechanic. I'm all for changing it (for example not have people show up until they use a gate, enter HS, ...) Make it linked to "CONCORD player tracking" or so. |
King Fu Hostile
Imperial Collective Unsettled.
232
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Posted - 2014.11.14 11:01:40 -
[7] - Quote
Watchlist is a broken and ******** metagame mechanic, but not really specifically so in wormholes.
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calaretu
Honestly We didnt know Unsettled.
234
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Posted - 2014.11.14 11:23:46 -
[8] - Quote
Have to agree that watchlist really is a stupid mechanic unless mutually agreed. It would be better gameplay without it. Move the functuality to locater agents instead
~Bringer of happiness
http://collapsedbehind.blogspot.no/
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Phoenix Jones
Isogen 5
857
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Posted - 2014.11.14 11:46:29 -
[9] - Quote
Long post but relevant point. We all use it for free tracking. It shouldn't work that way in this space.
Yaay!!!!
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Montgomery Black
Awakened Ones Acquisition Of Empire
63
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Posted - 2014.11.14 11:48:11 -
[10] - Quote
If you have ever hunted people in WH space, you would know that it can take hours to successfully track down a target and set up the kill. WH hunters need some tools to help this process, Watchlists, dscan and corp names etc from towers are some of these tools. Otherwise it makes an already challenging job more challenging to the point of being unfun. And we all play EvE to have fun.
As the prey you have multiple options available to you...
a. If you really want to evac ...check their killboard and see when they are online and then move your stuff out when they are usually offline. If you have annoyed someone so much that they have bothered to do 24/7 hole control... then go buy a better personality.
b. if your pure pve.. set up tacticals and use a cloaky hauler to go about your business as per usual. or take a covert ops, sneak out of your hole and go play in HS or what ever for the day.. Use deception.. uncloak a ship at a safe, warp it between safes and while they are hunting that.. sneak out.
c. makes some friends in WH space, fleet up, get them to cloak one WH over, derp a bait ship on the hole and then warp your friends in when they go to tackle it.
d. offer to pay a ransom to make them go away.
Its not that hard....
Watchlists may not be that lore friendly but spending 4 hours watching a hole for a "insert juicy ship" to come through and not knowing that the ship and its pilot actually cloaked and logged off in a location off dscan 2 hours ago is pretty unfun. |
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Ya Huei
Imperial Collective Unsettled.
187
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Posted - 2014.11.14 12:04:37 -
[11] - Quote
No question that watchlisting is a broken and stupid mechanic that should be consensual and revokable.
The OP is being a crybaby about it though and should probably man up.
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Jack Miton
Isogen 5
3944
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Posted - 2014.11.14 12:15:40 -
[12] - Quote
i love people who watchlist me, it makes me happy to know theyre pointlessly tracking the logging in and out of my toons which is completely random and the only they have listed are generally afk :)
Stuck In Here With Me:-á http://sihwm.blogspot.com.au/
Down the Pipe:-á http://downthepipe-wh.com/
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Erica Dusette
Isogen 5
17986
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Posted - 2014.11.14 12:23:38 -
[13] - Quote
Jack Miton wrote:i love people who watchlist me
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Architeuthis Rex
Awakened Ones Acquisition Of Empire
18
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Posted - 2014.11.14 12:24:33 -
[14] - Quote
I have an amazing idea.
It's called watch listing.
Get an alt to add the names of the corp that are stopping you from bearing.
When they all log off, get in your faction fit Orca and move your stuff to Highsec.
Problem solved. |
Yuka Mayaki
Gambrini
0
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Posted - 2014.11.14 12:28:11 -
[15] - Quote
Montgomery Black wrote:
c. makes some friends in WH space, fleet up, get them to cloak one WH over, derp a bait ship on the hole and then warp your friends in when they go to tackle it.
Wohoooo free PewPew! Can i bring a drake or 10 to deal with these pesky peasants?
https://evepics.files.wordpress.com/2012/09/epdrakefleetbridge.jpg
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Phoenix Jones
Isogen 5
857
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Posted - 2014.11.14 12:32:59 -
[16] - Quote
Architeuthis Rex wrote:I have an amazing idea.
It's called watch listing.
Get an alt to add the names of the corp that are stopping you from bearing.
When they all log off, get in your faction fit Orca and move your stuff to Highsec.
Problem solved.
As much as I want to jump on the troll train and as much as the op's post is Lyrics to "Cry Me A River". His point still stands.
In wormhole space, we shouldn't get notifications of when enemies log in and off.
The watchlist has two functions. Notifies us when friends log in, and notifies us when targets log in.. The friend part I wouldn't change, the enemy part in wormhole space I would take a look at.
Its very common for all of us to watchlist an entire corporation to track movements when we are in the hole, and outside of the hole. We used to do that when using the API to watch sleeper kills to know when people are awake.
I don't see this much different than that. But I see the difficulty of changing it (because we do use it to track when people log off.
Scouts in a hole, has the entire corp watchlisted. Checks watchlist, nobody on, scout logs off, jumps on alt. Alts playing, watchlist goes "ping ping ping", logs off alt, logs scout on. If we hate someone that much... yea we would do that, especially in sieges.
We use it for seeding invasion forces.
Use it to identify when people run sites.
Use it to know when people are not online.
Use it to figure out when they went LD.
It has alot of uses. We don't use all of them, but we use some in some combination to give us the intel we need.
Yaay!!!!
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Aladar Dangerface
Transcendent Sedition Protean Concept
21
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Posted - 2014.11.14 12:43:35 -
[17] - Quote
This post should have been called: There are douchebags in my hole. Anyone want some t3 kills?
Bait them out.
You problem would be solved pretty easily man.
Ps. Watch list is a bit **** but there are worse things in eve than that.
I don't need twitter.
I'm already following you.
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Terrorfrodo
Renegade Hobbits for Mordor
691
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Posted - 2014.11.14 13:06:42 -
[18] - Quote
So much text on a non-issue. Just log in after downtime and cloak up, then stay online 23/7 and do nothing. Do this for several days. If you are always online, the intel value of that fact becomes zero.
.
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Phoenix Jones
Isogen 5
858
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Posted - 2014.11.14 13:54:19 -
[19] - Quote
Terrorfrodo wrote:So much text on a non-issue. Just log in after downtime and cloak up, then stay online 23/7 and do nothing. Do this for several days. If you are always online, the intel value of that fact becomes zero.
Some do this but for most people (myself included) this is not a viable option (data caps, power concerns, shared computers, etc). Not everybody has a always on computer running eve (many use laptops, others travel and play, others only have specific times when they can login). Basically that is not a viable answer/counter for the typical eve player (or game player infact).
Yaay!!!!
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Niskin
League of the Lost
60
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Posted - 2014.11.14 14:03:56 -
[20] - Quote
As a solo WH'er I can understand the frustration, and if someday I'm hole camped by somebody I'll probably find it just as frustrating. But really this shouldn't be a common occurrence, at least not one that goes on very long. Most people have a home hole to get back to, unless this is personal they aren't likely to stay in your hole. That is why the watch list is super effective in a WH when you are there but almost useless when you are not.
Your first step should be to watch list them, as has been noted. Cloak up, warp around, try to get eyes on them so you can do that. Then find something else to do. Make a run to sell loot and/or get fuel. Explore your chains. Nothing is more annoying to somebody who is trying to gank you than to see you are online and not be able to find you, especially when they thought they knew where you were.
I know there have been times I've logged in looking to do something specific and it's hard to change gears when you login to find you aren't alone. One thing that could really be funny is if you find a frigate hole on a day when this is happening to you. Go through it, scout it out, find some gas or ore. Take in a Venture and mine for a bit. They might send a scout after you but if they are running T3's then they won't be coming after you or will have to run the chain home to swap ships first. I'm sure there are other good suggestions, I just can't think of them at the moment. |
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Caleb Seremshur
The Atomic Fallout Kids
417
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Posted - 2014.11.14 14:17:22 -
[21] - Quote
Terrorfrodo wrote:So much text on a non-issue. Just log in after downtime and cloak up, then stay online 23/7 and do nothing. Do this for several days. If you are always online, the intel value of that fact becomes zero.
Ok so I've read all the posts and two of them stand out as being particularly banal and yours is the second one.
Let me elucidate on the issue for you so you can understand:
1. I'm not paying to play this game so I can sit there and do nothing. 2. When I'm online, I should be able to do something with the credible threat of being hunted down and shot to death, not the incredible threat of having someone automatically know I'm there because the game lets them.
What you are proposing is exactly the same as having someone sitting on the curb outside my house, accessing and using my Wifi at full speed for as long as they want, all day every day. And in your fantasy world I'm required to just wait for them to get bored and drive home before I'm allowed to use the service I'm paying for because of some utterly arbitrary ruleset that denies me the power to lock them out of my own internal system.
Now a logical response would be to set a password or otherwise deny incoming connection requests except for whitelisted devices which I would have to specify. In your completely crazy interpretation of this game this isn't allowed just because you're not allowed. You're not allowed to proactively defend yourself against this type of invasion. That's literally the scenario you are advocating because you don't understand what you're talking about.
I have a real life. I don't work from home and I don't use a computer at work. I'm not going to leave my computer running all day every day just to satisfy this beauracratic requirement that I waste my own time doing NOTHING in a game I play for fun just so other people get bored and stop paying attention to me. Not only is this an incredibly stupid thing to have to do it's also catagorically bad gameplay and should be excised like the cancer of intellectual integrity it is.
@Montgomery Black: mate I respect that you're genuinely trying to help, so I'm going to address your points one by one.
1. I didn't even know these people existed until today. Literally our only interaction was seeing them on d-scan with an anathema and then combat probing him, which prompted the forementioned t3's to appear. In the 5 hours since that initial encounter they've tried to scram me twice despite me going totally inactive for like 4 hours straight. Someone was literally waiting that entire time in the hole for me, knowing I was online. The fact they knew I was online was the sole reason they stayed there waiting for me. It's a very simple progression of logic.
2. I'm not pure pve, check my killboard. I'm not going to just leave my hole either and play somewhere else because taking your ball and going home when the other players don't follow your rules is bad gameplay and is not to be encouraged.
3. I have friends in WH space, unfortunately it's friday night and they had better things to do than come defend my hole at 6pm. I imagine they were getting drunk. Probably.
4. I could have offered a ransom, but that's not a binding agreement is it. Denial of service through not logging in however is 100% effective. It's still bad gameplay. It's not healthy for the game to have people being forced to log out forever because they literally have no recourse against someone. Things like this result in (whowouldathunkit) drone assign nerfs, bomber nerfs, RR nerfs, pulsar nerfs, capital jump drive nerfs and a whole host of other changes deliberately introduced by CCP in order to limit the capacity of one group in being able to force another in to using the "the only winning move is not to play" card. Because people not logging in is bad for the game.
5. This one is particularly vexing. Because you're too lazy to probe I have to be visible at all times. That's fundamentally what you're saying. I'd like to use a real life example here and I like to use real life examples for very good reasons. Because in real life animals exist in an equilibrium between predator and prey species. Watchlisting amounts to giving wolves bionic eyes that allow them to see the thermal signatures of their prey species (and of their own natural predators). This kind of mechanic if it were introduced in to real animals would destabilise their equilibrium by allowing the wolves to become disproportionately effective at hunting compared to the defence of the deer. It gives the wolves an information advantage at avoiding bears or whatever as well. In this way players can avoid being hotdropped by supers because they just watchlist and if the supers log on en masse you know something is up and to bail out.
You say that hunting is too hard and that finding things to shoot is too hard so you need watchlists to help you know when people are online to shoot. Have you ever considered that this made you too effective at killing and that the reason you should let watchlisting be removed is because it would slow down the rate that people are being killed therefore encouraging a higher population to accumulate because the survival rate is better?
In my particular case I can't run, I can only hide. Unfortunately I can only hide properly by being logged off. Logging on and sitting there doing nothing while cloaked doesn't help me, it doesn't help the game, it doesn't help the guys chasing me, it does nothing but diminish the game experience. If they couldn't watchlist me then they would be required to actively search for me which would most likely result in a higher activity level per player because they're having to perform more work cooperatively to pin down opponents, the same as how wolves running in a pack increases success rates because more eyes and more ears means more chances of detection. Not because of cheap gimmicks.
Join channel Aussies in space to chat with AU/NZ players
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350125GO
Transcendent Sedition Protean Concept
125
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Posted - 2014.11.14 14:25:34 -
[22] - Quote
I don't see how being watchlisted is preventing you from playing. There's a strange sense of entitlement in the OP's thread, as if he should be able to solo his WH when he wants to.
It's just an odd way to raise the issue of the watch list being a broken mechanic. The way it's presented, this argument is not very different from the K-space PVE crowd complaining about how unfair it is to be war-dec'd without consent.
You're young, you'll adjust.
I'm old, I'll get used to it.
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Caleb Seremshur
The Atomic Fallout Kids
417
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Posted - 2014.11.14 14:52:34 -
[23] - Quote
350125GO wrote:I don't see how being watchlisted is preventing you from playing. There's a strange sense of entitlement in the OP's thread, as if he should be able to solo his WH when he wants to.
It's just an odd way to raise the issue of the watch list being a broken mechanic. The way it's presented, this argument is not very different from the K-space PVE crowd complaining about how unfair it is to be war-dec'd without consent.
That is completely different. You are so far off the mark you have landed out of the ball park and in to the sea.
War-deccing is a mechanic which can be avoided, it also allows you to shoot back in highsec without interference. It allows you introduce more friends than they have and attack their assets. Critically it requires that your war-targets actually sacrifice money and time towards the effect of being at war with you. And that's just a very brief overview of the wardec system which you clearly do not understand at all. I did wardecs for a YEAR. I know them.
Being watchlisted is free. It presents literally no risk whatsoever to the person doing the watchlisting whatsoever, other than that they might waste time pursuing a target that isn't where they thought they were. But then locator agents solve that problem too, don't they? Another cheap gimmick that needs immediate nerfing. If people want to be elite bounty hunters that pursue people across the universe it should require more effort than paying 200,000 ISK to some NPC who then tells you what you need to know. And please don't bring up standings, that's just ridiculous. How locator agents and standings are even tied to each other is just another invisible wall that makes no sense either.
And no, you're wrong again. See I'm not the one feeling entitled to total safety, *you're* the one who feels entitled to free intel provided by a counter-intuitive system that literally degrades the game.
Join channel Aussies in space to chat with AU/NZ players
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MooMooDachshundCow
Incertae Sedis
128
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Posted - 2014.11.14 14:55:31 -
[24] - Quote
You know what I do when people are in my WH? Shoot them. You know what I do when there are too many people in my WH? Find some friends to help me shoot them.
Too bad that you got a case of the hostiles, but I think that watchlist is fine. I say that because in WH space it's very hard to find someone's hole/anyone to shoot at. Watchlist lets me go "Oh - maybe I should go check if I can shoot at THAT guy now". It's very helpful for that.
I see your frustration, and I agree that the mechanic is a bit OP, but considering how remote WH space is and how hard it is to find ANY activity sometimes, I like this mechanic.
From a lore perspective: Maybe "the system" that handles reincarnating your pod has some sort of a WIFI where it knows when your clone "comes online" and tracks it always. vOv.
OBTW - tanks/airplanes usually always DO have markings to say what country/pilot etc.
What a fighter jet pilot's name looks like
Yeah, well, it's just like my-áopinion, man.
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Teleil Zoomers
Usque Ad Mortem TCC.
6
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Posted - 2014.11.14 15:06:03 -
[25] - Quote
http://imgur.com/3RLoLKL |
Phoenix Jones
Isogen 5
859
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Posted - 2014.11.14 15:20:44 -
[26] - Quote
MooMooDachshundCow wrote:You know what I do when people are in my WH? Shoot them. You know what I do when there are too many people in my WH? Find some friends to help me shoot them. Too bad that you got a case of the hostiles, but I think that watchlist is fine. I say that because in WH space it's very hard to find someone's hole/anyone to shoot at. Watchlist lets me go "Oh - maybe I should go check if I can shoot at THAT guy now". It's very helpful for that. I see your frustration, and I agree that the mechanic is a bit OP, but considering how remote WH space is and how hard it is to find ANY activity sometimes, I like this mechanic. From a lore perspective: Maybe "the system" that handles reincarnating your pod has some sort of a WIFI where it knows when your clone "comes online" and tracks it always. vOv. OBTW - tanks/airplanes usually always DO have markings to say what country/pilot etc. What a fighter jet pilot's name looks like
I have zero issue about what depot is who. We had that addressed regarding siphons and armies of trial accounts all anchoring them everywhere.
The watch list is another issue. were all pointing it out, but we're all looking at it as "wait I'll lose my Intel tool"... Then just staring at the possible issue like a deer in headlights.
I'll put it like this, if there was a paid option in ISk per month which would prevent non-friends from putting you on a watch list, how many people would pay the billions in order to do that.
Titan pilots, carrier pilots, half of nullsec, a good chunk of lowsec, etc.
And if people had to pay isk to watch list a non confirmed blue friend "say 2 million ISk a day per person", how many would sign up for it, and how long would you use it for.
I'm not saying "do it". I'm more playing devils advocate.
Yaay!!!!
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350125GO
Transcendent Sedition Protean Concept
126
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Posted - 2014.11.14 15:29:32 -
[27] - Quote
Caleb Seremshur wrote:350125GO wrote:I don't see how being watchlisted is preventing you from playing. There's a strange sense of entitlement in the OP's thread, as if he should be able to solo his WH when he wants to.
It's just an odd way to raise the issue of the watch list being a broken mechanic. The way it's presented, this argument is not very different from the K-space PVE crowd complaining about how unfair it is to be war-dec'd without consent. That is completely different. You are so far off the mark you have landed out of the ball park and in to the sea. War-deccing is a mechanic which can be avoided, it also allows you to shoot back in highsec without interference. It allows you introduce more friends than they have and attack their assets. Critically it requires that your war-targets actually sacrifice money and time towards the effect of being at war with you. And that's just a very brief overview of the wardec system which you clearly do not understand at all. I did wardecs for a YEAR. I know them. Being watchlisted is free. It presents literally no risk whatsoever to the person doing the watchlisting whatsoever, other than that they might waste time pursuing a target that isn't where they thought they were. But then locator agents solve that problem too, don't they? Another cheap gimmick that needs immediate nerfing. If people want to be elite bounty hunters that pursue people across the universe it should require more effort than paying 200,000 ISK to some NPC who then tells you what you need to know. And please don't bring up standings, that's just ridiculous. How locator agents and standings are even tied to each other is just another invisible wall that makes no sense either. And no, you're wrong again. See I'm not the one feeling entitled to total safety, *you're* the one who feels entitled to free intel provided by a counter-intuitive system that literally degrades the game.
Yeah. this is the same argument as the war decs except that it's free, as if the expense of a war dec is something the high sec corps even consider. I don't use the watch list because I can't be bothered, however, I'm thinking about making an exception for you. You're whinging doesn't explain how people knowing you're online prevents you from playing. Again, you seem to feel that you're entitled to live your gameplaying life in solitude (not the system), yet you decided to play an MMO.
I'm glad to hear you "did wardecs for a YEAR" which means you should understand the idea that you can invite friends to help you fight in your wormhole, move out, or go bugger off down the chain. Knowing you're online does not mean knowing where you are, especially in WH space.
Seeing how you respond to people though, and seeing your initial wall of whinging, I'm guessing you didn't make nice with whomever is in your hole and they're going to hunt you. That's on you, not them. We're never as innocent as we want to believe.
You're young, you'll adjust.
I'm old, I'll get used to it.
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Bronya Boga
Isogen 5
531
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Posted - 2014.11.14 16:30:03 -
[28] - Quote
Dude...if you have ships floating in your pos go and get an SMA. If you cant afford the 5mil mail me in game ill buy you two of them jesus. Also pick up your **** from space (mobile depot, MTU, ect.) How is this a problem?
Host of Down The Pipe Ingame Channel DTP Podcast
www.downthepipe-wh.com
GÇïIsogen 5 is recruiting. Check us out
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Niskin
League of the Lost
62
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Posted - 2014.11.14 16:49:00 -
[29] - Quote
I'm starting to lose any sympathy I had for you, seriously, if people are hunting you maybe it's you?
The watchlist tells them you are online. That is the only thing it tells them. If by chance they happen to know where you are then you have to control that variable and not whine about them knowing you are online. I'm sorry that you were in the unfortunate situation of your hunters knowing where you are. However that is easily controlled by one simple decision to be somewhere else. So far you have showed what others are calling entitlement by saying "no, I want to stay here and still avoid them." Well, you can't, so suck it up.
If you leave your hole it no longer matters that they know you are online. If you have a T3 with a mobile depot you could leave cloaked, refit in another hole and run some anoms. Then refit to cloaky before you come back. If you go a few holes down the chain they will have a real hard time finding you. All you have to do is accept that your original plans are cancelled and then it's easy to choose to do something else.
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Sexy Cakes
Have A Seat
833
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Posted - 2014.11.14 17:04:19 -
[30] - Quote
Despite all the blabber in your posts, which I didn't fully read, I agree that being able to add someone to contacts without some kind of approval from the person is kind of lame.
Not today spaghetti.
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