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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 8 post(s) |
Petra Hakaari
EVE Corporation 987654321-POP The Marmite Collective
112
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Posted - 2014.11.22 18:06:17 -
[1] - Quote
According to last devblog by CCP Seagull, there will be coming a new way of rendering that will use shaders more realistically, so far the gif seen looks really shiny, but I went to SISI just to witness it for myself, logged in with my carebearing toons, and found this:
http://i.imgur.com/775B2yt.jpg (discard the image on the right, thats the 3rd monitor and wallpaper.
On the left monitor you can see TQ, on the center you can see SISI.
I've been expecting the upcoming devblog but I can't help it, can't hold myself anymore...
Why does it looks like duck diarrhea?
With the old rendering you can see this chromatic shader rainbow style typical of Sansha ships and all the hues of the green-ish hull, with the new rendering, well, it indeed shines more, but its... dull, I agree that reflecting the enviromental light is a step forward, but don't disregard the original feel of the ships...
I also took a closer look to the ships on the gif, the Apoc looks really nice, relly really nice, also does the Orcale, then I went to see my other favourite ships, the Paladin for example, the red ain't red anymore, looks dull again, damped, yeah I know that the surface is different, its matte, its not supposed to reflect the light in the same fashion than the golden polished surfaces but still... paladin aint golden and red anymore :c it looks shinny gold and damped red.
Kinda the same happens with Gallente ships, I took a closer look at the Brutix, at first glance it looks neater, but when comparing them:
http://i.imgur.com/5QfjrNL.jpg
Same thing happens, shinny parts look good, but matte parts look too damped.
So, what I'm saying about the Nightmare is not the same than the other, about the nightmare I insist that it kinda lost its essence, that rainbow chromatic shader its almost gone, and it looks too much dull green.
About the Paladin and Brutix, what I'm saying is that the matte colours look too dull.
On the other hand I must say that I can appreciate much more the volume created by parallax, which is really nice.
Because tities .
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Ranger 1
Ranger Corp Vae. Victis.
6017
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Posted - 2014.11.22 21:54:06 -
[2] - Quote
I've been checking in regularly to see how this work is going. I wouldn't judge too harshly yet, as I'm seeing graphical changes and adjustments being made frequently to these ships. I believe they are still in the process of fine tuning everything with the new system in place.
View the latest EVE Online developments and War Thunder game play by visiting Ranger 1 Presents.
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Petra Hakaari
EVE Corporation 987654321-POP The Marmite Collective
112
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Posted - 2014.11.22 22:07:05 -
[3] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:I've been checking in regularly to see how this work is going. I wouldn't judge too harshly yet, as I'm seeing graphical changes and adjustments being made frequently to these ships. I believe they are still in the process of fine tuning everything with the new system in place.
i really hope so because sansha ships look like duck turd and the paladin was so disappointing
Because tities .
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Leonard Nimoy II
Dark Force Protectorate Special Operators Federation Alliance
86
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Posted - 2014.11.22 22:10:14 -
[4] - Quote
Petra Hakaari wrote:Ranger 1 wrote:I've been checking in regularly to see how this work is going. I wouldn't judge too harshly yet, as I'm seeing graphical changes and adjustments being made frequently to these ships. I believe they are still in the process of fine tuning everything with the new system in place. i really hope so because sansha ships look like duck turd and the paladin was so disappointing
Yer.....along with many of the gallente ships, and angel cartel.....but I would suspect this is not the final product (or at least hope so). |
Shalashaska Adam
Partial Safety
36
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Posted - 2014.11.23 03:48:41 -
[5] - Quote
If this "improvement" was to get unleashed onto TQ I'm pretty sure there would be a riot. |
Bagrat Skalski
Poseidaon
6759
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Posted - 2014.11.23 10:22:31 -
[6] - Quote
This gimmicky "oil spill" isn't a realistic thing it seems, and with realistic lightning, it's just gone.
Recon makes them stronger
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Lugh Crow-Slave
227
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Posted - 2014.11.23 11:44:51 -
[7] - Quote
i just want the ware and tear back onto the widow >.> |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp Vae. Victis.
6019
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Posted - 2014.11.23 16:57:30 -
[8] - Quote
Petra Hakaari wrote:Ranger 1 wrote:I've been checking in regularly to see how this work is going. I wouldn't judge too harshly yet, as I'm seeing graphical changes and adjustments being made frequently to these ships. I believe they are still in the process of fine tuning everything with the new system in place. i really hope so because sansha ships look like duck turd and the paladin was so disappointing I'm not that unhappy with the Paladin at the moment, probably because the red area's of that ship have such a distinct texture. That same dark red does not work quite as well on say the Pilgrim or the Crusader where those area's are smooth.
I've considered putting up some comparisons in my Ranger 1 Presents channel on YouTube, but every time I log on and start getting footage I realize things have changed yet again and my video would likely be outdated before I could get it uploaded and released.
View the latest EVE Online developments and War Thunder game play by visiting Ranger 1 Presents.
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Petra Hakaari
EVE Corporation 987654321-POP The Marmite Collective
112
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Posted - 2014.11.23 17:18:10 -
[9] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:I'm not that unhappy with the Paladin at the moment, probably because the red area's of that ship have such a distinct texture. That same dark red does not work quite as well on say the Pilgrim or the Crusader where those area's are smooth. I've considered putting up some comparisons in my Ranger 1 Presents channel on YouTube, but every time I log on and start getting footage I realize things have changed yet again and my video would likely be outdated before I could get it uploaded and released.
I'm looking forward for the final version and your video :)
Because tities .
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Tarpedo
Incursionista
1409
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Posted - 2014.11.24 10:51:41 -
[10] - Quote
I like new rendering so much I've purchased Nightmare on TQ immediately after checking Sisi - just to look at it sometimes. (check the ship outside of station - she is beautiful)
p. s. Why there is no diver on second pic? What happened? Is he ok? |
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Petra Hakaari
EVE Corporation 987654321-POP The Marmite Collective
113
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Posted - 2014.11.24 20:49:19 -
[11] - Quote
Tarpedo wrote:I like new rendering so much I've purchased Nightmare on TQ immediately after checking Sisi - just to look at it sometimes. (check the ship outside of station - she is beautiful)
p. s. Why there is no diver on second pic? What happened? Is he ok? I'm not sure if youre trolling or its just that you have a hell of a bad taste.
Because tities .
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Gungnir Winder
Euphoria Released Triumvirate.
167
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Posted - 2014.11.25 22:28:30 -
[12] - Quote
I'm assuming they obviously need to tweak materials shineness (since ships like deimos and stuff look like made out of glass).
But honestly I like ships being more opaque and less shiny. They look more realistic.
What I think it's causing ships to look weird is that the base textures were not made for this lightning rendering, thus looking washed out.
I strongly believe that if they tweak base textures and some shineness setting, eye candy level will be over 9000
My Youtube channel-á Gungnir Winder
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Petra Hakaari
EVE Corporation 987654321-POP The Marmite Collective
113
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Posted - 2014.11.27 17:09:53 -
[13] - Quote
Gungnir Winder wrote:What I think it's causing ships to look weird is that the base textures were not made for this lightning rendering, thus looking washed out. I thought about that too, i saw that today they've released the Confessor on SISI so i updated it with the hope of having also updated the textures or tweaked whatever but they have not :c
Because tities .
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Tarpedo
Incursionista
1422
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Posted - 2014.12.01 15:45:09 -
[14] - Quote
Petra Hakaari wrote:I'm not sure if youre trolling or its just that you have a hell of a bad taste. Apparently devs have published half-finished (beautiful) variant before, finished color variant (available now) made the ship look like a turd with pikes =(
Well, this is yet another good lesson to never trust devs. |
Dangeresque Too
Pistols for Pandas
11
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Posted - 2014.12.01 15:48:05 -
[15] - Quote
Most importantly:Tarpedo wrote:p. s. Why there is no diver on second pic? What happened? Is he ok? Second most important, at least they finally made my nighthawk look like it hadn't been sitting in a desert for 100 years.
Though when I started seeing all those used/dirty looking ships I had another thought, what if the ship went through levels of wear after certain set amount of use periods, like it looks a little worn after X months of being fitted and/or used in combat for X number of hours. Then the wear gets worse at the next level etc, and maybe you could send it through the repair shop to clean the windows and rebuff the paint? (and it would give us another ISK sink)
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Aurelius Valentius
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
412
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Posted - 2014.12.01 19:17:48 -
[16] - Quote
the biggest issues I have with the PBJ (sorry hungry), ahem... PBR is that the lighting is too bright on the ships - and washes out or causes the white jagged lines on edges and all that mess...even in high it does it.
EVE needs to be a bit darker - and this can be seen by using the ship preview - then take any ship - look at it from the sun-lit side then look at it from the dark side - and not that the colors, lights and over all everything look better on the dark side of the ship - it's just richer and more realistic, the sun-lit side is washed out, too shiny and detail is lost due to the glare as well as all the optical illusion or shapes being lost.
Also the reds have gone brown again... and much of the grays (grey to you UK'ers) are too light etc... but these are just hue and saturation issues that can be addressed, the real issue I think is the sun-lit to darkness needs a better and less drastic contrast between them, and the sweet spot is less light and bright so that things looks like the enormous space ships they are, and well as long as you are in there - sharp details in dark lighting over fuzzy details in bright lighting wins every time...
Also for god's sake flatten out the colors on the Blackbird hulls and Moa hulls - the shine on them is way too much given the number of sides... it's multi-facet side glare overload... |
Petra Hakaari
EVE Corporation 987654321-POP The Marmite Collective
113
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Posted - 2014.12.05 07:46:44 -
[17] - Quote
Well, 4 days left and ships still looking like pure liquid duck crap.
I foresee drama...
Because tities .
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Murkar Omaristos
The Alabaster Albatross Eternal Pretorian Alliance
7
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Posted - 2014.12.05 08:44:35 -
[18] - Quote
I do wish CCP would respond to one of these PBR threads (or the graphics feedback thread) to at least give some indication that they recognize just how much negative feedback PBR on sisi has received so far. |
Petra Hakaari
EVE Corporation 987654321-POP The Marmite Collective
113
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Posted - 2014.12.05 10:04:42 -
[19] - Quote
Murkar Omaristos wrote:I do wish CCP would respond to one of these PBR threads (or the graphics feedback thread) to at least give some indication that they recognize just how much negative feedback PBR on sisi has received so far. Next thing you will know is that fozzie will post a devblog saying how happy and how wonderful the feedback has been, just as he did on the hyperion release that killed deep wormhole activity, killing small corps, which mine by that time was among...
Because tities .
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CCP Huskarl
C C P C C P Alliance
110
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Posted - 2014.12.05 12:09:54 -
[20] - Quote
Hey pilots
I just want to give you a heads up on the issues related to the PBR (physically based rendering) conversion. I think there is no doubt that PBR gives us a much better and more realistic overall lighting in EVE. The ships feel more integrated into the scene since the reflection from the nebula has energy now and is actually lightening up the ships, the materials can look and behave very realistic as you can see with the Amarr gold for instance or the bright fresnel on some of the metals.
However there are some issues that we are fully aware of and are working hard to fix. The textures we are using where not made for PBR and it was a massive undertaking for the art team in a relatively short time to convert the textures and we will need to revisit a lot of them in the future. I-¦m aware of a lot of issues with some of the factions like for instance Sansha that was tweaked before we got the oil part of the PBR shader working properly. We plan to revisit all of them in the future and will look for feedback on the forums.
We are also looking into the "washed out" look and lack of sharpness as well as the dirt and scuffing on the ships looks very rough and flat. We have made some progress there and we will have to work out the best way to implement that as soon as possible.
07 Huskarl |
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Shalashaska Adam
Partial Safety
41
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Posted - 2014.12.05 13:16:17 -
[21] - Quote
CCP Huskarl wrote:Hey pilots
Could PBR on TQ be put off until such a time that it doesn't make the majority of the ships look worse than they do now?
I thought the idea of the new release schedule was to allow a feature that's clearly not ready, to be easily pushed back.
PBR is clearly not ready for TQ. |
Worrff
Viziam Amarr Empire
23
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Posted - 2014.12.05 13:31:39 -
[22] - Quote
CCP Huskarl wrote:The textures we are using where not made for PBR and it was a massive undertaking for the art team in a relatively short time to convert the textures and we will need to revisit a lot of them in the futurel
We have been told that there is sufficient time not to rush stuff into releases. Well that is s load of bollox tbh.
Dont REVISIT.....just wait until it's fixed BEFORE implementing.
FFS you always do this with every release and every "feature". Just STOP until it's sorted.
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Lil' Brudder Too
Pistols for Pandas
62
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Posted - 2014.12.05 15:10:38 -
[23] - Quote
CCP Huskarl wrote:Hey pilots
I just want to give you a heads up on the issues related to the PBR (physically based rendering) conversion. I think there is no doubt that PBR gives us a much better and more realistic overall lighting in EVE. The ships feel more integrated into the scene since the reflection from the nebula has energy now and is actually lightening up the ships, the materials can look and behave very realistic as you can see with the Amarr gold for instance or the bright fresnel on some of the metals.
However there are some issues that we are fully aware of and are working hard to fix. The textures we are using were not made for PBR and it was a massive undertaking for the art team in a relatively short time to convert the textures and we will need to revisit a lot of them in the future. I-¦m aware of a lot of issues with some of the factions like for instance Sansha that was tweaked before we got the oil part of the PBR shader working properly. We plan to revisit all of them in the future and will look for feedback on the forums.
We are also looking into the "washed out" look and lack of sharpness as well as the dirt and scuffing on the ships looks very rough and flat. We have made some progress there and we will have to work out the best way to implement that as soon as possible.
07 Huskarl Sooo, the feedback up until this point will be considered void...and you will only work on anything we mention after this heap hits TQ tuesday? Sounds like a great plan to me!
Also, wasn't the point of this new 'quicker release schedule' supposed to make it easier for you to NOT RELEASE stuff that still needed alot of work?
There are a HUGE amount of very ugly ships right now. (not sure if patch today is changing anything) Will we need to start listing every individual ship that needs work, or will your imbedded QA actually look at things before they are considered "done"? |
Petra Hakaari
EVE Corporation 987654321-POP The Marmite Collective
113
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Posted - 2014.12.05 15:29:20 -
[24] - Quote
CCP Huskarl wrote:Hey pilots
I just want to give you a heads up on the issues related to the PBR (physically based rendering) conversion. I think there is no doubt that PBR gives us a much better and more realistic overall lighting in EVE. The ships feel more integrated into the scene since the reflection from the nebula has energy now and is actually lightening up the ships, the materials can look and behave very realistic as you can see with the Amarr gold for instance or the bright fresnel on some of the metals.
However there are some issues that we are fully aware of and are working hard to fix. The textures we are using were not made for PBR and it was a massive undertaking for the art team in a relatively short time to convert the textures and we will need to revisit a lot of them in the future. I-¦m aware of a lot of issues with some of the factions like for instance Sansha that was tweaked before we got the oil part of the PBR shader working properly. We plan to revisit all of them in the future and will look for feedback on the forums.
We are also looking into the "washed out" look and lack of sharpness as well as the dirt and scuffing on the ships looks very rough and flat. We have made some progress there and we will have to work out the best way to implement that as soon as possible.
07 Huskarl Thanks for answering, but don't you think that you guys should wait until its really ready?
Theres even a ******* video on youtube now... WTF
Dont incarna again, srsly... please?
Because tities .
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Arthur Aihaken
X A X
4002
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Posted - 2014.12.05 16:03:24 -
[25] - Quote
CCP Huskarl wrote:However there are some issues that we are fully aware of and are working hard to fix. We've been telling you this for weeks now, so at what point do you guys start to realize that you might need to postpone this?
I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
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CCP Darwin
C C P C C P Alliance
527
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Posted - 2014.12.05 17:10:35 -
[26] - Quote
Petra Hakaari wrote:Thanks for answering, but don't you think that you guys should wait until its really ready?
CCP Huskarl, in his post, describes a number of details of ship look that he'd probably characterize as minor issues that he'd like to revisit over time after PBR's release. You largely agree on what the issues are, but you'd characterize them as game-breaking.
These types of questions are the kinds of things on which reasonable artists disagree all the time, and ultimately it comes down to the judgment of the designers on the project.
In EVE, the emotional connection players have to different aspects of the look of ships they fly regularly makes large look changes tricky. A detail that one player might characterize as iconic, or central to the impact of the design, might be seen by an art director as less important to the overall impression of the ship.
Note that our answer to this is not to simply say we know best, but to listen to feedback from the community as an important input to deciding where to focus attention as we improve ships further.
As CCP Huskarl said, we're releasing PBR into the game with the intent to iterate on it, and this necessarily implies that where it will be on Rhea's release day will not be perfect. However, across the range of hundreds of ships, they currently look pretty good, and each ship will at least meet our designers' minimum standard for that ship at release, while many will look much better.
That doesn't mean that your favorite ship might not have lost an element of its look to which you've become attached. What it does mean is that you should offer your feelings about it, as you have here, and we'll iterate on ships as we can.
Quote:I do wish CCP would respond to one of these PBR threads (or the graphics feedback thread) to at least give some indication that they recognize just how much negative feedback PBR on sisi has received so far.
Overall, feedback on PBR has been quite positive.
Most negative feedback on the forums has been in relation to the looks of specific ships or shared looks across factions, and those are the types of issues that we will focus on as we iterate. That feedback, particularly if it's presented specifically and clearly in relation to what details players feel don't work for them, can be very helpful.
More general comments, or ones that mainly express a negative emotional reaction rather than describing how the look could be better, don't help us that much.
CCP Darwin GÇó Senior Technical Artist, EVE Online GÇó @mark_wilkins
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Makari Aeron
The Shadow's Of Eve TSOE Consortium
148
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Posted - 2014.12.05 17:16:50 -
[27] - Quote
I only hate PBR because I'm at work so I can't get on SiSi to check it out. And to be fair, that video only showed like 1 ship of each race. Totally blueballed. T_T
CCP RedDawn: Ugly people are just playing life on HARD mode. Personally, I'm playing on an INFERNO difficulty.
CCP Goliath: I often believe that the best way to get something done is to shout at the person trying to help you. http://goo.gl/PKGDP
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Lil' Brudder Too
Pistols for Pandas
64
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Posted - 2014.12.05 17:26:39 -
[28] - Quote
Can we please see the reduction of certain factions/ships proliferation of "pimp my ride" on their skins....there is entirely too much chome finish on quite a few ships. They essentially look like i'm flying a christmas tree decoration... |
Shalashaska Adam
Partial Safety
41
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Posted - 2014.12.05 18:02:37 -
[29] - Quote
CCP Darwin wrote:However, across the range of hundreds of ships, they currently look pretty good
I would wholeheartedly disagree with this opinion.
Even on the ships that PBR isn't destroying, there's still a noticeable reduction in texture detail.
On the large swathes of ships PBR is clearly not gelling with, the results are extremely alarming.
CCP Darwin wrote:Overall, feedback on PBR has been quite positive.
Reading this feedback forum top to bottom, I really cannot agree.
I think there has been a huge amount of detailed feedback calling for CCP to delay the release of PBR on TQ.
It's quite disappointing to see it being brushed off in this way. |
Unezka Turigahl
Det Som Engang Var
493
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Posted - 2014.12.05 18:10:49 -
[30] - Quote
It's a mixed bag at the moment.
The shiny bits of Gallente ships are way too shiny. Even more so on Creodron ships. The Ishtar has been progressively looking worse. It looked good in the blueish color, less good in green as it is on TQ now, and the test server version is an even worse off-putting green and far too shiny. Someone mentioned Gallente ships looking like xmas tree ornaments on the test server. That comment was spot on. Large chromed shapes on the capital ships is particularly weird looking.
The Ivory base color on Amarr doesn't look as good as the old beige. Making them lighter like this makes them look less menacing. Beige is also closer in tone to the gold, so the ships are more cohesive that way. With the ivory their forms are being chopped up too much. Split in two. Its the same problem as the camouflage patterns, just not as severe.
On the other hand the detail on ships like the Naga, Rokh, and Oracle are much improved over the TQ versions. It's almost like the TQ versions don't have normal maps and the test version do. And the Confessor is quite detailed and interesting to look at as well, hopefully this is a glimpse at the future for all EVE ships.
I still think the Blackbird and it's variants are hard to decipher. The overall shape and design is good but the interior forms don't read clearly. It probably could have used a little simplification shape-wise in the middle. Bolder forms, less finicky plane-changes. And if you look at it from the side the texture resolution seems a bit low and the tower doesn't stand out enough from the rest of the forms.
Minmatar ships look a bit weird, particularly ones with large flat surfaces like the Fenrir or the two carriers. Its a bit odd how drastically the tone of the brown changes as you rotate the ships and they catch the light. They look waxy. Though I am only viewing these ships in the preview window, I can't fly them in space.
The way the ships react to space and the lighting in general is of course an improvement. |
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