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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 23 post(s) |
Xindi Kraid
Priano Trans-Stellar State Services Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
866
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Posted - 2014.12.11 08:29:38 -
[121] - Quote
Hey random ass question in case my memory is fragged: Didn't Khanid ships (Vengance, Sacrelige, etc.) used to have a silver and metallic blue paintjob?
Under PBR it is silver and grey (i'd describe the color as graphite), but my mind is saying that's not quite right. |
Nagarythe Tinurandir
House of Freedom The Pursuit of Happiness
190
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Posted - 2014.12.11 09:31:22 -
[122] - Quote
Xindi Kraid wrote:Hey random ass question in case my memory is fragged: Didn't Khanid ships (Vengance, Sacrelige, etc.) used to have a silver and metallic blue paintjob?
Under PBR it is silver and grey (i'd describe the color as graphite), but my mind is saying that's not quite right.
I always thought their colors were silver and black, to oppose the gold&white of amarr ships.
Maybe it has already been answered, but I did not find it. Why does the ambient light of nebula shine through solid objects? For example Jita 4-4 undock - the red minmatar nebulus illuminates all ships undocking, although it is behind the station. You even see the red glow through the station... The bouncing light is pretty, but in such cases it urks me :-/ |
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation Ineluctable.
1044
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Posted - 2014.12.11 12:14:37 -
[123] - Quote
Xindi Kraid wrote:Hey random ass question in case my memory is fragged: Didn't Khanid ships (Vengance, Sacrelige, etc.) used to have a silver and metallic blue paintjob?
Under PBR it is silver and grey (i'd describe the color as graphite), but my mind is saying that's not quite right. Khanid are supposed to be Silver-very dark gray/black.
Why does the Ark look like a cheap Chinese plastic toy model? What is the reasoning behind removing its 2 different gold tones, which actually looked like solid gold plating, and replacing them with this uniform layer of gold foil on top of plastic surface?
Why do ships look flatter and less detailed than before?
Why was this feature released even though it is neither nearly finished nor polished nor are we remotely close to anything that requires it? Why is it not labeled Beta like the map? |
marly cortez
Mercurialis Inc. RAZOR Alliance
59
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Posted - 2014.12.11 12:39:24 -
[124] - Quote
Dunno what you did but it severely impacted frame rates overall, plus whats with the aberrations and artifacts that keep appearing at random with structures, Bit disconcerting to see a portion of the structure suddenly split off and lag behind the rest of the movement on the screen.
Still don't liker the new ship renders, terms like xmas decorations and flat screen TV's are floating about, Vaga even on max settings looks flat and uninteresting now. |
Tarpedo
Incursionista
1431
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Posted - 2014.12.11 15:04:43 -
[125] - Quote
Can we get dark gold texture for Nightmare - like it was on Sisi ~4 weeks prior to this patch? With present color ship actually look like real pile of crap =( |
Archetype 66
Epsilon Lyr Nulli Secunda
179
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Posted - 2014.12.11 16:06:54 -
[126] - Quote
It's really nice guys. GJ CCP |
eliminator2
The Trolls from Tunttaras Bad-Intentions
20
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Posted - 2014.12.11 19:39:52 -
[127] - Quote
the engine looks nice and i love it but some ships have lost that sexyness ie vindicator
but others have been made better for example the vargur looks amazing
just would like some ship colours to have remained the same |
d0cTeR9
Astro Technologies Apocalypse Now.
7
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Posted - 2014.12.11 20:32:09 -
[128] - Quote
So what have we learned?
CCP works REALLY hard on the graphic side of EVE (Coming from someone who played beta-eve and first subbed to try it). Some people need to upgrade their 5 year old computers and stop slowing down progress for other's. With any change, here come the whiners... Dominix still looks like a potato.
Of course this is a WIP, so do voice some legitimate concerns (i.e: Vindicator, Dominix, Pirate Camo) so that CCP can learn from this and work on it. |
Arthur Aihaken
X A X
4026
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Posted - 2014.12.11 21:02:17 -
[129] - Quote
CCP Darwin wrote:High uses PBR with dirt maps.
Medium uses PBR without dirt maps, which is a significant optimization but still retains the lighting model.
Low chucks the lighting model out the window for something entirely different (maybe Lambert shading with illumination clamped above zero? I haven't looked at the code) and reintroduces the dirt maps because even with them the rendering is faster than Medium or High.
Low's different lighting model, because it does away entirely with any shininess or reflections, will have more saturated colors, and it'll have the details from the dirt map.
If you like one look better than another, I absolutely encourage you to pick the one you like. Any chance you guys might be able to come up with something different for medium? It really seems to be the red-headed stepchild of the three. For example, could you drop PBR for medium, include the dirt map and use the old settings under Phoebe?
I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
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Kesthely
Fleet of the Damned Ace of Spades.
169
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Posted - 2014.12.11 22:23:29 -
[130] - Quote
First things first:
The new physical rendering looks awesome!
If you sense a but comming your correct.
While the physical rendering looks awesome, low to mid end pc's have quite a lot of trouble with the rendering. (my computer is about a year old and i already have problems) With the group i play with this has been the case for most players. And haveing to resort to optimize for performance or memory makes the switching to the new physical rendering, actually a downgrade in the aestethics for me.
Atm i can only warp about, without experiancing what feels like lag. With a reasonable amount of eye candy still active If several objects need to be rendered (missions/pvp/going to a tradehub) it feels like i'm trying to play the game on a 20 year old computer, while with the old rendering, i could pvp with every effect and full quality on.
I'll continue to try to tweak between aestethics and performance, but i feel like that person thats beeing shown lots of candy, and then is denied getting any!
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Lil' Brudder Too
Pistols for Pandas
71
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Posted - 2014.12.11 22:25:19 -
[131] - Quote
CCP Darwin wrote: If you have to use Medium shader settings to get decent performance, you might want to try both Low and Medium to see which you prefer. Or, you may be able to get away with High if you change other settings.
Hope that helps a little bit.
I'm noticing a theme here....the only huge complaints about "medium" looking terribad seems to be based on just the Gallente hulls....
Maybe do to the fact that the "dirt map" all Gallente ships includes all the color minus the base green and the chrome layer. If you compare this to every other faction, the difference between Medium and High is nearly indistinguishable. It seems that it is just the gallente hulls that have this issue. Have you even considered this?
Instead of pulling out your soap box and telling all the dissidents to bugger off with their opinions (essentially that is your tone), why don't you take some time to see what the problem we are actually seeing is...
Gallente hulls need to be brought up to be comparable to the other factions. Every other faction essentially only loses the shiney reflection whilst stepping the graphics down from High to Medium to Low. Except for Gallente. Please don't make me take a pic of every ship in all three settings to show you, when you could do it yourself, by just simply looking at the ships.
Abaddon is a great example of the difference. Compare the Abaddon in all three shader settings...note the lack of change of actual color (just some dirt and details are added). Now do the same with the Megathron, the color changes between each one. |
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CCP Darwin
C C P C C P Alliance
624
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Posted - 2014.12.11 22:40:51 -
[132] - Quote
Lil' Brudder Too wrote:It seems that it is just the gallente hulls that have this issue. Have you even considered this?
Instead of pulling out your soap box and telling all the dissidents to bugger off with their opinions (essentially that is your tone), why don't you take some time to see what the problem we are actually seeing is...
The issues you raise are already topics of discussion on the art team as they talk about how to improve the first version of PBR. And, of course player opinions matter, positive or negative.
That said, when you turn your comments against the people involved rather than the things you like or don't like about the work, you do risk them tuning out, which is a shame because you're raising comments about the work that have value.
CCP Darwin GÇó Senior Technical Artist, EVE Online GÇó @mark_wilkins
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Lil' Brudder Too
Pistols for Pandas
71
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Posted - 2014.12.11 23:18:25 -
[133] - Quote
CCP Darwin wrote: The issues you raise are already topics of discussion on the art team as they talk about how to improve the first version of PBR. And, of course player opinions matter, positive or negative.
Sooo, why couldn't this have been the first thing stated when someone gave you feedback saying the gallente hulls specifically looked terribad? Instead of telling the people giving you the feedback to eat it? (maybe not you specifically, but that is the general tone we have gotten from the dev's) It took proding you guys for, what, a month(?) to finally get this response...finally...
CCP Darwin wrote:That said, when you turn your comments against the people involved rather than the things you like or don't like about the work, you do risk them tuning out, which is a shame because you're raising comments about the work that have value. Yet if ANY of the dev's would have responded like you just did now...with a "we see this is an issue" mentality, and not just saying "well, i advise you select the setting that you like most"....we wouldn't be in this situation now. (lets not forget all the feedback that was given, and seemingly ignored while this was on SiSi) You can't talk down to your customers, while NOT telling them they are infact showing you something that is an issue, then expect them to somehow know that you are infact looking into said issue...even though no Dev has ever said it. Then you get mad at us for constantly baggering you to look at the issue...of course we are...because you haven't answered it yet!!!
Its simply about communication. We (the general players saying the same thing i have been) gave you specific details about what was wrong with certain ships, every CCP response was either ignoring our feedback, or telling us to eat it. If that was not what your intention was, i suggest you tailor your replies in the future a little better.
How else should i go about saying "stop being a d-bag and listen to what i'm saying" while every response i see from a dev responding to this particular issue was generally "deal with it...either go full out or not at all." I'm sorry if i sound peeved off, but its because i am. Also, i try not to 'turn against' any particular dev, and usually try to address "CCP" as a whole...
Also, you might want to send someone over to update the "Rhea Issues" thread....or atleast show that you guys are still looking at it. (can you atleast see where my frustration is coming from?) |
Arthur Aihaken
X A X
4026
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Posted - 2014.12.11 23:19:03 -
[134] - Quote
CCP Mankiller, caught your interview on o7. With the before and after screenshots I posted I was using the Medium shader settings for both as my particular graphics card doesn't support the High option. So it's a fair comparison between Phoebe and Rhea based on my limitations. When I get my upgraded system later in December I eagerly look forward to the High shader settings.
I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
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Arthur Aihaken
X A X
4026
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Posted - 2014.12.11 23:19:24 -
[135] - Quote
Double post.
I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
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Vincent Athena
V.I.C.E.
3011
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Posted - 2014.12.12 00:39:04 -
[136] - Quote
Arthur Aihaken wrote:CCP Mankiller, caught your interview on o7. With the before and after screenshots I posted I was using the Medium shader settings for both as my particular graphics card doesn't support the High option. So it's a fair comparison between Phoebe and Rhea based on my limitations. When I get my upgraded system later in December I eagerly look forward to the High shader settings. I do not really have the option to consider high settings. My computer supports it, but the FPS is too low. In fact, when I triple box, even medium is now too high. It use to run fine on medium.
Please keep those of us with less than top of the line equipment in mind, both in terms of a good looking game and in terms of performance. Recently it seems your goal is to make the game look good for the few with top end hardware, and as long as it can be used by everyone else, even if it looks worse (or has to be made to look worse by turning down settings to get a useable fps), it ships.
http://vincentoneve.wordpress.com/
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Sylveria Relden
The Scope Gallente Federation
34
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Posted - 2014.12.12 00:53:31 -
[137] - Quote
The colors look a ton better after the patch. The Gallente green looks substantially better - not as "lime" as it was before. The Amarr combination looks a lot better, too- the gold still stands out but it's not quite as reflective. Awesome job on the PBR stuff so far, keep up the good work! |
Dangeresque Too
Pistols for Pandas
22
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Posted - 2014.12.12 01:06:22 -
[138] - Quote
Found this gem when I was going to my recent screenshots... I know they say its not done yet as they only released like 1/3 of a full graphics system upgrade, but this just looks wrong.
Nado, full graphics on high, ugh...
Is that the interim intended look of the ship? I hope not. Further reference this was in taken in Jita, last night, 24 hours ago to be exact, and I don't think they have made changes since then. |
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CCP Darwin
C C P C C P Alliance
624
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Posted - 2014.12.12 01:15:08 -
[139] - Quote
Dangeresque Too wrote:Found this gem when I was going to my recent screenshots... I know they say its not done yet as they only released like 1/3 of a full graphics system upgrade, but this just looks wrong.
It does look wrong. If you are able to go back to where you were and re-create the screenshot as part of a bug report through the F12 menu, we'll get a bunch of additional info that will help us identify why it looks like that under those circumstances.
CCP Darwin GÇó Senior Technical Artist, EVE Online GÇó @mark_wilkins
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Dangeresque Too
Pistols for Pandas
22
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Posted - 2014.12.12 01:58:49 -
[140] - Quote
It was straight out from 4-4, someone had mentioned the new naga warp animation so I was seeing if the nado had one... then I saw that. I'll see what I can do to replicate it, though I can't see if it is any other minnie ships as the nado is the only one I have in Jita, well, I guess I have a rupture too. |
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Dangeresque Too
Pistols for Pandas
22
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Posted - 2014.12.12 02:31:04 -
[141] - Quote
Submitted, then afterwards I confirmed, its not just the nado. In fact, I found an uglier ship in the process, the mega look absolutely appalling in that spot too.
Also saw how overkill the sensor sweep is... it was bright/overpowering enough it blocked out the planet as it went through. And yet I can't turn off the dumb sweep no matter how hard I try, unless I'm missing something hidden somewhere. |
McChicken Combo HalfMayo
The Happy Meal
102
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Posted - 2014.12.12 07:39:06 -
[142] - Quote
How is anyone complaining about Gallente hulls? They look totally badass now. Dat Myrmidon...
The new lighting system has really improved the look of the game. I do have one complaint. More than ever now are the questionable texture qualities apparent. The Rattlesnake is an easy example of this.
We need high-res textures.
~ Bookmarks in overview
~ Fleet improvements
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Atricc
Cosmic Shipwright Alliance
0
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Posted - 2014.12.12 11:07:43 -
[143] - Quote
Jessica Danikov wrote:Gallente ships in particular have had a significant loss of 'green' to them, was that intentional?
There are a bunch of old vs new ships that have the same shader, leading to a situation where if you tweak it to make one generation look better, it's going to harm the other generation (e.g. old Caldari ships like the Rokh and Naga with large amounts of matte, vs. new Caldari ships like the Condor and the Blackbird). Any plans to divide and tweak the generational materials/shaders separately?
Chrome spray-paint delux..... Plastic looking! do they bend>? Personally "Dislike" |
Atricc
Cosmic Shipwright Alliance
0
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Posted - 2014.12.12 11:10:08 -
[144] - Quote
Rivr Luzade wrote:Xindi Kraid wrote:Hey random ass question in case my memory is fragged: Didn't Khanid ships (Vengance, Sacrelige, etc.) used to have a silver and metallic blue paintjob?
Under PBR it is silver and grey (i'd describe the color as graphite), but my mind is saying that's not quite right. Khanid are supposed to be Silver-very dark gray/black. Why does the Ark look like a cheap Chinese plastic toy model? What is the reasoning behind removing its 2 different gold tones, which actually looked like solid gold plating, and replacing them with this uniform layer of gold foil on top of plastic surface? Why do ships look flatter and less detailed than before? Why was this feature released even though it is neither nearly finished nor polished nor are we remotely close to anything that requires it? Why is it not labeled Beta like the map?
Agreed . |
waltari
Mortis Angelus The Kadeshi
1
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Posted - 2014.12.12 12:52:19 -
[145] - Quote
Will be there a way to disable this new lulzy shiny like dogs balls textures? Seriously, did you take a look on some of the ships? From what i can randomly shoot, Apocalypse is horrible, so is Ishtar and Hyperion and my Paladin looks like ass. Some of the textures looks good indeed, nothing special but acceptable, but rest is like buncha cellophane that makes my eyes bleed. |
Dangeresque Too
Pistols for Pandas
22
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Posted - 2014.12.12 14:57:31 -
[146] - Quote
McChicken Combo HalfMayo wrote:How is anyone complaining about Gallente hulls? They look totally badass now. Dat Myrmidon...
The new lighting system has really improved the look of the game. I do have one complaint. More than ever now are the questionable texture qualities apparent. The Rattlesnake is an easy example of this.
We need high-res textures. This is what is wrong with the entire Gallente line...
http://i.imgur.com/qpZWiwn.jpg?1
Like the work team responsible for actually painting the medium variant called in sick, but the foreman decided to call the job finished anyways, and if people didn't like the non-painted variant then they could just use the others instead. |
Dangeresque Too
Pistols for Pandas
23
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Posted - 2014.12.12 15:15:55 -
[147] - Quote
CCP Darwin wrote:Dangeresque Too wrote:Found this gem when I was going to my recent screenshots... I know they say its not done yet as they only released like 1/3 of a full graphics system upgrade, but this just looks wrong. It does look wrong. If you are able to go back to where you were and re-create the screenshot as part of a bug report through the F12 menu, we'll get a bunch of additional info that will help us identify why it looks like that under those circumstances. To further clarify, its not just the Nado, and not just Jita. Seems to be anywhere. If you can put your ship in a place/direction that the side (or part of the ship you are looking at) is not being lit by the sun, and there is a large dark object between you and a bright nebula, you will see this effect.
I think the effect is still there the whole time, but most of the time you can't really see it because the screen is washed out by the bright nebula. Does that make sense? Like the textures are trying to reflect light from the nebula that is directly behind them (instead of at a reflective angle) and from a source that is through another object (or multiple, aka through the ship and on the other side of the planet). My guess is that since I've only really checked it in Caldari space with the white/blue nebula, that you would see a red glowing plastic like ship in Minnie space, and a brown effect in Amarr space.
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Ranger 1
Ranger Corp Vae. Victis.
6069
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Posted - 2014.12.12 18:19:57 -
[148] - Quote
Lil' Brudder Too wrote:Ranger 1 wrote:CCP Vertex wrote:Lil' Brudder Too wrote:... -- Okay, so i narrowed the biggest "ugliness" culprit down....its the "shader quality" With everything else set on "high"...here is what happens with the model when changing " shader quality" from high-medium-low....something is off here.... HighMediumLowMaybe someone (i don't know, maybe the Imbedded QA????) should test their stuff before saying its 'done'. Good form CCP. I suspect it is like this for numerous other ships as well. But since i'm paying you (CCP) to test these sort of things while you are developing them...and not the other way around...i have other things more important to do. Hi Lil' Brudder Too, We most certainly consider and go to great lengths to investigate the visual and performance impact of our graphic features on a wide range of hardware, specifically using our minimum & recommended specification machines as control points. You have discovered yourself that the ships don't look as good on Medium shader quality, this is because we do not include the dirt map in that shader model. This reduces the instruction count by roughly 50%, this was done purposefully to ensure players with mid-range hardware that cant cope with high settings can have improved performance at the cost of reduced visual fidelity. I can see your GPU should be more than capable of running the client with high shader quality, if there is a reason such as performance issues that is forcing you to run on medium shader quality then we'd love to see a bug report from you so we can investigate. This just in: CCP Vertex has to explain to a rude player that Low and Medium graphics settings don't look at good as high graphics settings. Patience of a Saint... If calling someone out because it looks like they did not do their job is considered rude...i can live with that. Also, re-read the underlined parts...and look at the pics again...i think you missed those the first time around. I wasn't complaining that "low and medium graphics look worse than high"...of course they will...i was merely pointing out that the Low actually has more texture and color than the Medium, which seems bassackwards to me. CCP: so pray tell why have the "medium" setting if it doesn't even include what is in the "low"? How does the Medium Shader help increase performance over what the "low" does? (as seems to be your reasoning) If it does nothing better, but looks worse...what is the logical point of it? The ships on medium simply don't look like they are done. It looks like someone forgot to click a button to turn on a layer or forgot to create the layer altogether. (or a spawn for some particular required item, but that would never happen) As to why i don't normally run "everything high"....because i multibox, and i like my PC the way it is...and want to keep it this way for as many years as i can...i don't want to have to replace hardware every year because i needlessly run high graphics 100% of the time on everything. Yes, running everything as hard as you can and will wear stuff out faster...its a electro-mechanical device, it takes wear. (and uses more electricity when pushed) I was just curious why the Medium had less detailed (almost none infact) paint than the Low. And since you guys have a bad habit of not responding (or acknowledging) to the non-positive feedback posted in the Dev-created feedback threads for stuff you put on SiSi, (i posted this very issue specifically stating the Mega in the SiSi feedback thread...btw's) i was just making sure you guys even knew about it. Face it, CCP as a whole does seem to have a less than stellar history of fully QA'ing their releases. I think they addressed your concerns fairly directly in the latest episode of 07. Different levels of detail use different layers and effects, and some of those layers are having issues and will need to be tweaked. It will take a while to go through every model and make the appropriate adjustments. They've been pretty up front about this from day one.
View the latest EVE Online developments and War Thunder game play by visiting Ranger 1 Presents.
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Ranger 1
Ranger Corp Vae. Victis.
6069
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Posted - 2014.12.12 18:31:38 -
[149] - Quote
Lil' Brudder Too wrote:CCP Darwin wrote: The issues you raise are already topics of discussion on the art team as they talk about how to improve the first version of PBR. And, of course player opinions matter, positive or negative.
Sooo, why couldn't this have been the first thing stated when someone gave you feedback saying the gallente hulls specifically looked terribad? Instead of telling the people giving you the feedback to eat it? (maybe not you specifically, but that is the general tone we have gotten from the dev's) It took proding you guys for how long to finally get this response...finally... CCP Darwin wrote:That said, when you turn your comments against the people involved rather than the things you like or don't like about the work, you do risk them tuning out, which is a shame because you're raising comments about the work that have value. Yet if ANY of the dev's would have responded like you just did now...with a "we see this is an issue" mentality, and not just saying "well, i advise you select the setting that you like most"....we wouldn't be in this situation now. (lets not forget all the feedback that was given, and seemingly ignored while this was on SiSi) You can't talk down to your customers, while NOT telling them they are infact showing you something that is an issue, then expect them to somehow know that you are infact looking into said issue...even though no Dev has ever said it. Then you get mad at us for constantly baggering you to look at the issue...of course we are...because you haven't answered it yet!!! Its simply about communication. We (the general players saying the same thing i have been) gave you specific details about what was wrong with certain ships, every CCP response was either ignoring our feedback, or telling us to eat it. If that was not what your intention was, i suggest you tailor your replies in the future a little better. How else should i go about saying "stop being a d-bag and listen to what i'm saying" while every response i see from a dev responding to this particular issue was generally "deal with it...either go full out or not at all." I'm sorry if i sound peeved off, but its because i am. Also, i try not to 'turn against' any particular dev, and usually try to address "CCP" as a whole... Also, you might want to send someone over to update the "Rhea Issues" thread....or atleast show that you guys are still looking at it. (can you atleast see where my frustration is coming from?) I think you are aptly named, considering the obvious chip on your shoulder. You have gotten reasoned, considered answers and for the most part have responded with nothing but lip. i would suggest that you drop the defensive attitude, realize that not every post is going to get a personal reply, and that if someone disagrees with your opinion it doesn't mean that they are telling you to "eat it". In other words, try acting a little less like a stereotypical lil brudder... it's making you look bad and causes people to ignore what might otherwise be reasonably intelligent points you have made.
View the latest EVE Online developments and War Thunder game play by visiting Ranger 1 Presents.
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asteroidjas
Rothschild's Sewage and Septic Sucking Services The Possum Lodge
99
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Posted - 2014.12.12 23:55:18 -
[150] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote: I think you are aptly named, considering the obvious chip on your shoulder...try acting a little less like a stereotypical lil brudder...
You sir lose 10 internet points....
Lil' brudder
Okay, back on topic.
I understand where he is coming from. The responses CCP have given from the start have been "well if you don't like the setting, don't use it"...while he was trying to tell them something looked wrong with the setting, not that he 'didn't like it', but that something looked wrong. Apparently, all while they were already internally aware to some extent and were 'talking about' working on it. Yet, it wasn't until the final response that they actually answered that the issue with the gallente hulls is something they are talking about working on. If they had simply answered with that to begin with, he would have had no need to keep going back at them...that's how i read it anyway.
Gallente hulls, compared to every other faction, lack in the medium quality. Good comparison that was posted before. The medium on every other faction still has all the same colors. The Gallente though, drops colors on the medium setting. The argument from him was never 'medium looks worse than high'....because duh, it does and will always.
And no, a lot of us do not in fact watch o7. Sorry. But that is not where we look to for Dev responses on game issues. |
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