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Catain Tsuruomo
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2014.12.11 20:22:50 -
[1] - Quote
Solo PvE and just a few days into the game with 5 days to go before I can get into barges. Procurer or Retriever is the question of the hour. Thoughts?
~ Bad or missing keyboard. Press F1 to continue ~
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Jur Tissant
The TERRA Guardians of Serenity
343
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Posted - 2014.12.11 20:27:17 -
[2] - Quote
Retriever is the best for solo ISK/hr. The only difference in yield is that it can fit an extra mining laser upgrade, with the T2 variant this amounts to a 9% increase in yield vs the Procurer. However, the large ore hold is especially helpful for solo mining.
The Procurer is good if you're paranoid of ganks, but to be honest if you find a 0.5-0.6 system with low traffic (usually outside of Caldari space) then you shouldn't expect to meet many pirates. Pirates will frequent higher population systems for obvious reasons. If you are mining ice then consider a Procurer since ganks are more frequent (ice belts are usually full of miners), but in general the frequency of ganks in high-sec is largely overstated. |
Evei Shard
Shard Industries
389
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Posted - 2014.12.11 21:26:06 -
[3] - Quote
First: By going with a barge, especially a Retriever, you are agreeing to become one of the most highly sought after targets in the entire game. You are committing to either playing in a state of near paranoia, or to accepting that you will lose 20mil isk on occasion. You are also joining one of the most hated groups in the entire game, which also ties into why they are the most sought after targets. Additionally, you will be a common target for extortion by groups like CODE, who will demand that you pay them to not gank you (and then use alt corps to gank you when you do pay).
If you intend to make isk via mining, you have to be vigilant and aware of your surroundings (local, etc.). It also helps to keep your eyes on the market to make sure you are mining the best ore for value.
Second: if you're going to go at things solo, you will probably make more isk/hour running level 4's once you are capable of doing so. Unboosted mining in T1 ships is income, but not much more. Get into a procurer (better tank), fit it with a Strip Miner I, then figure out what you want to do with your skill queue. Look closely at the path you want to take and what ships you want to train for.
I did industry specifically for a couple years, and I enjoyed it, but that's partially because I wasn't just mining, I was building ships and had set goals to work towards.
Industry in general can be enjoyable in this game. Mining all by itself, is treacherous to your Eve career, because it is mind numbing solo.
Profit favors the prepared
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Catain Tsuruomo
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2014.12.11 21:52:32 -
[4] - Quote
Evei Shard wrote:...you are also joining one of the most hated groups in the entire game
Hated for a reason, or "just because"?
~ Seems I'm a diagnostic: someone who doesn't know whether there are two gods. ~
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Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
252
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Posted - 2014.12.11 22:11:22 -
[5] - Quote
Catain Tsuruomo wrote:Evei Shard wrote:...you are also joining one of the most hated groups in the entire game
Hated for a reason, or "just because"? Solo highsec mining is viewed by many as an antisocial activity usually done AFK, that doesn't add much to the game. It is also pretty boring so many look down on it as a form of income. Take a look at http://www.minerbumping.com/p/the-code.html to see what you are up against.
Don't let that put you off if you enjoy it but be aware that there is not much more gameplay to it then you are doing now. I would encourage you not to skill for Exhumers until you have tried a few other professions as pretty much everything else pays better and is more engaging and the skill points are useless for anything else if you find you like something better.
As was said the Procurer is a good choice as it is the safest, while the Retriever has a slightly better yield and a larger hold. Personally I would use a Procurer as it is cheaper, almost as good yield wise, but far safer, but if you are paying attention you can fly the Retriever. Just make sure you have enough for a backup ship I case your Retriever does get ganked.
Sabriz Adoudel for CSM 10 is a good idea.
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Ralph King-Griffin
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
7375
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Posted - 2014.12.11 22:13:31 -
[6] - Quote
Catain Tsuruomo wrote:Evei Shard wrote:...you are also joining one of the most hated groups in the entire game
Hated for a reason, or "just because"? For [reasons] and miners have a tenancy to spew vitriolic slurry and accusations of psychiatric disorders oll over local when you shoot them in the face try to have a friendly chat with them.
They are not all like this, in fact most people have or still do mine to some degree but enough of the former are about to give the rest a bad name.
And just because
"I'm also quite confident that you are laughing
and it's the kind of laugh that gives normal people shivers."
=]I[=
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Sabriz Adoudel
Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE.
4053
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Posted - 2014.12.11 22:18:50 -
[7] - Quote
As one of those people that preys on miners myself, there's lots of reasons. Mostly it's fun, but also there's a good number of economic metagame reasons.
Can I suggest that you try some miner suppression activities on the side. You might like ganking, and even if you do not, what you learn from *being* a ganker will help protect you from people like me if you return to mining.
Chaos. Opportunity. Destruction. Excitement... Vote #1 Sabriz Adoudel for CSM 10
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Paranoid Loyd
2968
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Posted - 2014.12.11 22:27:02 -
[8] - Quote
Catain Tsuruomo wrote:Evei Shard wrote:...you are also joining one of the most hated groups in the entire game
Hated for a reason, or "just because"? Read section 7 of this. As long as you understand what it says, reasons become irrelevant.
The game is about doing what ever you want and having fun with the understanding that fun for some people is blowing spaceships up. Don't ever take it personally and don't ever let yourself get mad. Getting mad is the only way to lose at this game.
"Gankers are just other players, not supernatural monsters who will get you if you don't follow some arbitrary superstition. Haul responsibly and without irrational fear." Masao Kurata
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Menkary Hardluck
The Scope Gallente Federation
13
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Posted - 2014.12.11 22:46:30 -
[9] - Quote
God help you; do not mine in a Retriever. Those get ganked all the time. Look at any CODE. killboard to see what I am talking about. Use a Procurer with the following fit:
High Slot: Strip Miner Medium Slot: Survey Scanner Medium Slot: Medium Shield Extender Medium Slot: Adaptive Invulnerability Field Medium Slot: Adaptive Invulnerability Field Medium Slot: Thermic Dissipation Field Low Slot: Mining Laser Upgrade Low Slot: Mining Laser Upgrade Rig: Medium Core Defense Field Extender 1 Rig: Medium Core Defense Field Extender 1 Rig: Medium Core Defense Field Extender 1
If you have the skills, use the tier 2 version of the fit, otherwise tier1 or a meta version. This will allow you almost as much isk/hour as a Retriever and be far more resilient to ganks. |
Evei Shard
Shard Industries
390
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Posted - 2014.12.11 23:06:13 -
[10] - Quote
Menkary Hardluck wrote:God help you; do not mine in a Retriever. Those get ganked all the time. Look at any CODE. killboard to see what I am talking about. Use a Procurer with the following fit:
High Slot: Strip Miner Medium Slot: Survey Scanner Medium Slot: Medium Shield Extender Medium Slot: Adaptive Invulnerability Field Medium Slot: Adaptive Invulnerability Field Medium Slot: Thermic Dissipation Field Low Slot: Mining Laser Upgrade Low Slot: Mining Laser Upgrade Rig: Medium Core Defense Field Extender 1 Rig: Medium Core Defense Field Extender 1 Rig: Medium Core Defense Field Extender 1
If you have the skills, use the tier 2 version of the fit, otherwise tier1 or a meta version. This will allow you almost as much isk/hour as a Retriever and be far more resilient to ganks.
This^^^
Just learn who the gankers are, what their tricks are, then set them red and keep your eyes on local. Using d-scan is pointless. If they show up on scan they're already on your doorstep and you don't have time to do anything but make sure you have a spot to warp your Pod to.
Pay attention to your surroundings. If you warp to a belt, and CONCORD is there, warp to a safe or dock up and find out *why* they were there. Use Dotlan or other resources to check for recent ganks in the system or nearby systems, etc.
Last but not least, this is Eve. Just because the guy that just warped in is in a mining barge, it doesn't mean he's on your side. Often CODE will use a mining barge as a warp-to because many miners ignore other mining ships, even ones that get up right next to them within blaster range.
Profit favors the prepared
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Paranoid Loyd
2970
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Posted - 2014.12.11 23:06:38 -
[11] - Quote
Mining in a Retriever is fine as long as you are aware of the danger and pay attention. Learn to mark gankers and their corps, learn to d-scan, learn that if a venture or some other ship sets up right on top of you he is probably not there to mine.
Learn that quite a few low level security missions give out more ore than a single person can mine in a day or even two (not to mention as long as you don't complete the objective you can mine the same mission for a week without any penalty other than losing a minuscule bonus).
"Gankers are just other players, not supernatural monsters who will get you if you don't follow some arbitrary superstition. Haul responsibly and without irrational fear." Masao Kurata
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Catain Tsuruomo
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2014.12.11 23:26:46 -
[12] - Quote
D-scan is a new term to me...
~ Seems I'm a diagnostic: someone who doesn't know whether there are two gods. ~
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Paranoid Loyd
2971
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Posted - 2014.12.11 23:29:21 -
[13] - Quote
D-Scan
It's a scanner that will allow you to tell when threats are incoming.
"Gankers are just other players, not supernatural monsters who will get you if you don't follow some arbitrary superstition. Haul responsibly and without irrational fear." Masao Kurata
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Ralph King-Griffin
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
7378
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Posted - 2014.12.11 23:30:33 -
[14] - Quote
Catain Tsuruomo wrote:D-scan is a new term to me... Believe me when I tell you , it's an important one.
"I'm also quite confident that you are laughing
and it's the kind of laugh that gives normal people shivers."
=]I[=
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Paranoid Loyd
2971
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Posted - 2014.12.11 23:37:32 -
[15] - Quote
Evei Shard wrote: Using d-scan is pointless. If they show up on scan they're already on your doorstep and you don't have time to do anything but make sure you have a spot to warp your Pod to. This is not true, you have more than enough time to align and warp out if you are paying attention. The only exception may be is if you are mining very close to a gate or station.
Like I said, look into mining out lvl1 security mission, this will keep you off the radar of 99% of the gankers.
"Gankers are just other players, not supernatural monsters who will get you if you don't follow some arbitrary superstition. Haul responsibly and without irrational fear." Masao Kurata
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Candi LeMew
Isogen 5
7572
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Posted - 2014.12.11 23:39:09 -
[16] - Quote
Ralph on D, scramble all the things!
Procurer.
Don't worry about the stereotypes, Catain. Do what you enjoy. Whatever that is you'll end up exploding at some point anyway.
=ƒΙΖ I am a banana.
"I been kicked out of better homes than this" - Rick James
Seek freedom and become captive of your desires. Seek discipline and find your liberty.
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Sabriz Adoudel
Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE.
4055
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Posted - 2014.12.11 23:39:22 -
[17] - Quote
Evei Shard wrote:
Last but not least, this is Eve. Just because the guy that just warped in is in a mining barge, it doesn't mean he's on your side. Often CODE will use a mining barge as a warp-to because many miners ignore other mining ships, even ones that get up right next to them within blaster range.
Confirming that I have an alt that flies a Procurer named "Ungankable", and if that ship is within 3 kilometres of you, you'd better start warping out RIGHT NOW, or else you'll be added to the killboard.
Chaos. Opportunity. Destruction. Excitement... Vote #1 Sabriz Adoudel for CSM 10
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Ralph King-Griffin
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
7379
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Posted - 2014.12.12 00:12:25 -
[18] - Quote
No offense ment here but saying this
Quote:Using d-scan is pointless.
In the same breath as this
Evei Shard wrote:Pay attention to your surroundings.
if fairly silly.
The directional scanner is one of the best ways of telling what's in systsysand where it is, you can hunt with the thing ffs.
"I'm also quite confident that you are laughing
and it's the kind of laugh that gives normal people shivers."
=]I[=
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Catain Tsuruomo
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2014.12.12 01:08:16 -
[19] - Quote
Paranoid Loyd wrote:[quote=Evei Shard]...you have more than enough time to align and warp out if you are paying attention. The only exception may be is if you are mining very close to a gate or station.
I've actually gotten into the habit of aligning while I am mining. Saves that turn time.
~ Seems I'm a diagnostic: someone who doesn't know whether there are two gods. ~
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Paranoid Loyd
2974
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Posted - 2014.12.12 01:18:23 -
[20] - Quote
I would suggest looking into gas mining as well. The prices have recently skyrocketed and it is quite profitable right now.
You will need to read up on: Gas Mining (obviously) Wormholes Probing
It is inherently more dangerous, but you will only really be risking a Venture and maybe your pod.
"Gankers are just other players, not supernatural monsters who will get you if you don't follow some arbitrary superstition. Haul responsibly and without irrational fear." Masao Kurata
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Catain Tsuruomo
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2014.12.12 02:01:34 -
[21] - Quote
Paranoid Loyd wrote:I would suggest looking into gas mining as well. The prices have recently gone up considerably and it is quite profitable right now. Must be, since the level I skill is 20 million +
~ Seems I'm a diagnostic: someone who doesn't know whether there are two gods. ~
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Paranoid Loyd
2974
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Posted - 2014.12.12 02:58:22 -
[22] - Quote
True, but it is well worth it...
https://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/ore/gas.html
"Gankers are just other players, not supernatural monsters who will get you if you don't follow some arbitrary superstition. Haul responsibly and without irrational fear." Masao Kurata
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BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie
The Conference Elite CODE.
1213
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Posted - 2014.12.12 07:24:55 -
[23] - Quote
Catain Tsuruomo wrote:Paranoid Loyd wrote:[quote=Evei Shard]...you have more than enough time to align and warp out if you are paying attention. The only exception may be is if you are mining very close to a gate or station. I've actually gotten into the habit of aligning while I am mining. Saves that turn time. Please keep in mind that to be "aligned" you have to be moving at 75% of your max speed towards the warp destination. Passive alignment does not exist. If you are not moving it does not matter what direction your ship is facing, it will take the same amount of time to align in any direction.
New player resources:
Uni Wiki - General Info
Eve Altruist - PvP
Belligerent Undesirables - High Sec Pvp
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Menkary Hardluck
The Scope Gallente Federation
14
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Posted - 2014.12.12 11:40:17 -
[24] - Quote
Some previous posts about gas mining are good, but it is only truly profitable in a worm whole and those are incredibly dangerous.
I repeat my earlier warning that mining ore in a Retriever is a really bad idea. Look at other posters' comments about it. You have to be absolutely paranoid or some ganker pops your barge. Lose that Paranoia and go with the tanked out Procurer I posted middle of the first page. |
J'Poll
CDG Playgrounds
4973
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Posted - 2014.12.12 12:14:07 -
[25] - Quote
BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie wrote:Catain Tsuruomo wrote:Paranoid Loyd wrote:[quote=Evei Shard]...you have more than enough time to align and warp out if you are paying attention. The only exception may be is if you are mining very close to a gate or station. I've actually gotten into the habit of aligning while I am mining. Saves that turn time. Please keep in mind that to be "aligned" you have to be moving at 75% of your max speed towards the warp destination. Passive alignment does not exist. If you are not moving it does not matter what direction your ship is facing, it will take the same amount of time to align in any direction.
This.
I'm still amazed how many people are stupid enough that think that direction your pretty ship is pointing matters.
EVE works with velocity not speed.
Velocity is a vector physical quantity. At 0 velocity you have NO vector and no matter which direction you are going, it will increase at the same pace. The whole turning if your ship is just aesthetics, hence why if you warp fast enough (tripple web a freighter for instance) you can warp "backwards" cause the aesthetics part of EVE couldn't keep up with the real mechanics (aka the vectors that make you go in a direction with a certain speed.
Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy
Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded
Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club
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Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
254
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Posted - 2014.12.12 12:44:59 -
[26] - Quote
J'Poll wrote: This.
I'm still amazed how many people are stupid enough that think that direction your pretty ship is pointing matters.
EVE works with velocity not speed.
Velocity is a vector physical quantity. At 0 velocity you have NO vector and no matter which direction you are going, it will increase at the same pace. The whole turning if your ship is just aesthetics, hence why if you warp fast enough (tripple web a freighter for instance) you can warp "backwards" cause the aesthetics part of EVE couldn't keep up with the real mechanics (aka the vectors that make you go in a direction with a certain speed.
While this is true Catain, paranoid miners do mine aligned, especially in null and lowsec. The trick is to mine aligned to a celestial or safe spot while moving at 75% of your maximum velocity. Then if a hostile pops on grid, you can insta-warp to safety.
Of course this means trawling along the asteroid belt, in straight line towards your warp point, switching asteroids often as you move along so it is a more active way to mine. As you can imagine, this is one case where the range of your mining lasers actually does matter, so increasing that is useful. As well, the Higgs Anchor rigs have recently been added to the game which slows down your maximum velocity thus increasing the time you spend in range of a asteroid which is also useful for this type of mining.
This style of mining is probably not worth the effort in highsec though as there is little chance of a cloaky gank ship surprising you in a belt. Your Dscan is a much better tool to see the more usual incoming Catalysts so if you keep an eye on that and local you will likely to be able to get into warp before they land and warp scramble you even if you are at rest.
Still, moving in a belt is always a good idea as it makes the accurate warp-in of the gank ship more difficult. Orbit an asteroid or something if at all possible to make yourself a little safer. Personally, I take it as a challenge to land my gank ship on a target while they are moving (so don't think that alone makes you safe), but I will admit sometimes I have misjudged and been too far away for my very short-range blasters to hit so I have aborted the gank and the target escaped.
Sabriz Adoudel for CSM 10 is a good idea.
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Catain Tsuruomo
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
1
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Posted - 2014.12.12 12:47:05 -
[27] - Quote
J'Poll wrote:...I'm still amazed how many people are stupid enough that think that direction your pretty ship is pointing matters. I'm still amazed how many forum posters infer that people who are new to games are stupid.
Thanks for info BeBop, and great tips all, I appreciate them.
~ Seems I'm a diagnostic: someone who doesn't know whether there are two gods. ~
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J'Poll
CDG Playgrounds
4973
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Posted - 2014.12.12 12:53:39 -
[28] - Quote
Catain Tsuruomo wrote:J'Poll wrote:...I'm still amazed how many people are stupid enough that think that direction your pretty ship is pointing matters. I'm still amazed how many forum posters infer that people who are new to games are stupid. Thanks for info BeBop, and great tips all, I appreciate them.
I wasn't talking about new players in particular.
You will be amazed how many older players still think it matters too.
Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy
Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded
Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club
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Shiloh Templeton
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
211
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Posted - 2014.12.12 14:33:14 -
[29] - Quote
Start with a Procurer. It's cheaper to buy and fit and much more worry free. After you get more experience and isk, also buy a Retriever for when you feel like it's very safe to mine. |
Paranoid Loyd
2977
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Posted - 2014.12.12 14:38:40 -
[30] - Quote
Menkary Hardluck wrote:Some previous posts about gas mining are good, but it is only truly profitable in a worm whole and those are incredibly dangerous.
I repeat my earlier warning that mining ore in a Retriever is a really bad idea. Look at other posters' comments about it. You have to be absolutely paranoid or some ganker pops your barge. Lose that Paranoia and go with the tanked out Procurer I posted middle of the first page. What is such a big deal about losing a Venture? Even the cost of a Retriever is minuscule in the grand scope of things. The game is about fun, not doing everthing you can to not get blown up (unless for some reason avoiding interacting with everyone in an mmo is your idea of fun). If you get past your initial fear of losing ships, the game will be a lot more fun.
"Gankers are just other players, not supernatural monsters who will get you if you don't follow some arbitrary superstition. Haul responsibly and without irrational fear." Masao Kurata
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