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PinkKnife
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
509
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Posted - 2014.12.15 17:58:13 -
[1] - Quote
The Market in eve is fantastic, but it's missing some currency markets. We already have a form of localized currency in the faction LP. You could easily rename these (or just leave it as is) as local currencies (think Amarr debloons, or Thucker Marks, or Sansha Kroners, or whatever flavor text you want).
The idea being that let us trade said LP /currency for ISK, or for other currencies. This would work great for Aurum as well, and we could see a whole new section of the market opening up. |
Old Man Parmala
Talons Co.
1
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Posted - 2014.12.15 18:13:31 -
[2] - Quote
Trading LP of one type for another would be nice... |
Frostys Virpio
The Mjolnir Bloc The Bloc
1398
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Posted - 2014.12.15 18:21:02 -
[3] - Quote
PinkKnife wrote:The Market in eve is fantastic, but it's missing some currency markets. We already have a form of localized currency in the faction LP. You could easily rename these (or just leave it as is) as local currencies (think Amarr debloons, or Thucker Marks, or Sansha Kroners, or whatever flavor text you want).
The idea being that let us trade said LP /currency for ISK, or for other currencies. This would work great for Aurum as well, and we could see a whole new section of the market opening up.
You can already do that with a medium called items. Your idea would only make it so we don't have to haul stuff as LP are "stocked" in the journal. You can't gank someone for his LP but you can for his data cores. |
PinkKnife
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
509
|
Posted - 2014.12.15 18:40:36 -
[4] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:PinkKnife wrote:The Market in eve is fantastic, but it's missing some currency markets. We already have a form of localized currency in the faction LP. You could easily rename these (or just leave it as is) as local currencies (think Amarr debloons, or Thucker Marks, or Sansha Kroners, or whatever flavor text you want).
The idea being that let us trade said LP /currency for ISK, or for other currencies. This would work great for Aurum as well, and we could see a whole new section of the market opening up. You can already do that with a medium called items. Your idea would only make it so we don't have to haul stuff as LP are "stocked" in the journal. You can't gank someone for his LP but you can for his data cores.
Using Items as a medium, while allowing for ganking, doesn't really facilitate the functionality of trading directly. You can't take an aggregate score of an entire faction's LP worth in a glance, and each item functions and fluctuates on it's own merit, not on the merits of the currency itself.
You might look and see, Navy Apocs being used and thus Amarr LP should be super high, but that doesn't represent the actuality of the entire IN line of items.
It's like having 200 different mini-currencies for each faction, and it doesn't at all represent what an actual faction currency would be.
You'd still have items to move around and gank, as those would still be carried and sold as they might out perform/under perform an individual market.
So, for example, you run Amarr FW, and want to cash in some 120K LP. You can do it in amarr where the rate of trade is something like 1.2:1 since lots of people cash out there, or you can go to say Jita and get .8:1 for your LP.
You might make some decent isk off that, but then that represents the entire LP's worth. You might find that Navy heatsinks get you .5:1 however, and those must still be purchased in Amarr space, and hauled to jita for the profit. Where as something useless like, small Navy armor reps, might get you 3:1 in exchange.
Does that clarify? Or at least illustrate that a currency/LP direct trade wouldn't negate the need for hauling and inter-station trading. |
Riot Girl
You'll Cowards Don't Even Smoke Crack
3603
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Posted - 2014.12.15 18:43:43 -
[5] - Quote
Loyalty Points are a reward for your loyalty. They allow you to purchase special items because you are a special person. I'm not a special person, so why should I be allowed to purchase items from the secret store for special people?
Oh god.
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PinkKnife
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
509
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Posted - 2014.12.15 18:45:34 -
[6] - Quote
Riot Girl wrote:Loyalty Points are a reward for your loyalty. They allow you to purchase special items because you are a special person. I'm not a special person, so why should I be allowed to purchase items from the secret store for special people?
Hence why I suggested renaming them, or did you not catch that part?
Rename them to currency specific terms then if you're worried about that. |
Frostys Virpio
The Mjolnir Bloc The Bloc
1399
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Posted - 2014.12.15 18:49:57 -
[7] - Quote
PinkKnife wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:PinkKnife wrote:The Market in eve is fantastic, but it's missing some currency markets. We already have a form of localized currency in the faction LP. You could easily rename these (or just leave it as is) as local currencies (think Amarr debloons, or Thucker Marks, or Sansha Kroners, or whatever flavor text you want).
The idea being that let us trade said LP /currency for ISK, or for other currencies. This would work great for Aurum as well, and we could see a whole new section of the market opening up. You can already do that with a medium called items. Your idea would only make it so we don't have to haul stuff as LP are "stocked" in the journal. You can't gank someone for his LP but you can for his data cores. Using Items as a medium, while allowing for ganking, doesn't really facilitate the functionality of trading directly. You can't take an aggregate score of an entire faction's LP worth in a glance, and each item functions and fluctuates on it's own merit, not on the merits of the currency itself. You might look and see, Navy Apocs being used and thus Amarr LP should be super high, but that doesn't represent the actuality of the entire IN line of items. It's like having 200 different mini-currencies for each faction, and it doesn't at all represent what an actual faction currency would be. You'd still have items to move around and gank, as those would still be carried and sold as they might out perform/under perform an individual market. So, for example, you run Amarr FW, and want to cash in some 120K LP. You can do it in amarr where the rate of trade is something like 1.2:1 since lots of people cash out there, or you can go to say Jita and get .8:1 for your LP. You might make some decent isk off that, but then that represents the entire LP's worth. You might find that Navy heatsinks get you .5:1 however, and those must still be purchased in Amarr space, and hauled to jita for the profit. Where as something useless like, small Navy armor reps, might get you 3:1 in exchange. Does that clarify? Or at least illustrate that a currency/LP direct trade wouldn't negate the need for hauling and inter-station trading.
The LP trade value would balance at a value like it does now. Items not worth the hassle just don't get bought and you see the funny things like faction guns having ridiculous prices for what they can achieve. If the best ISK/LP any items on the Amarr store was 1k, the amarr LP would also trade very close to 1k/lp. Selling your LP in Amarr or Jita would make no difference as you could "haul" them in a noobship or even a pod at no risk because you can't lose LP. Nobody would buy LP at a higher price elsewhere since there is no point to do so. Traveling with faction items make buying them at one palce over another somewhat valuable. Doing so with LP is useless. |
virgofire
The Travelling Circus Alternate Allegiance
35
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Posted - 2014.12.15 19:01:05 -
[8] - Quote
No |
PinkKnife
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
509
|
Posted - 2014.12.15 19:15:47 -
[9] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:
The LP trade value would balance at a value like it does now. Items not worth the hassle just don't get bought and you see the funny things like faction guns having ridiculous prices for what they can achieve. If the best ISK/LP any items on the Amarr store was 1k, the amarr LP would also trade very close to 1k/lp. Selling your LP in Amarr or Jita would make no difference as you could "haul" them in a noobship or even a pod at no risk because you can't lose LP. Nobody would buy LP at a higher price elsewhere since there is no point to do so. Traveling with faction items make buying them at one palce over another somewhat valuable. Doing so with LP is useless.
I think you underestimate how lazy people are. While yes, you COULD just fly out and trade the LP directly, if you're talking Sansha or Thucker LP, that's a bit of a journey, and people are lazy, hence why trade hubs as a whole exists and command premiums (or discounts) over other stations.
If it's between making 200m here and now, or flying out to Great WIldlands or Stain for 210m, I'm going to sit here and call it a day.
You also assume the people only buy/haul faction mods for liquidation, which also isn't true. |
Frostys Virpio
The Mjolnir Bloc The Bloc
1400
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Posted - 2014.12.15 19:22:54 -
[10] - Quote
PinkKnife wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:
The LP trade value would balance at a value like it does now. Items not worth the hassle just don't get bought and you see the funny things like faction guns having ridiculous prices for what they can achieve. If the best ISK/LP any items on the Amarr store was 1k, the amarr LP would also trade very close to 1k/lp. Selling your LP in Amarr or Jita would make no difference as you could "haul" them in a noobship or even a pod at no risk because you can't lose LP. Nobody would buy LP at a higher price elsewhere since there is no point to do so. Traveling with faction items make buying them at one palce over another somewhat valuable. Doing so with LP is useless.
I think you underestimate how lazy people are. While yes, you COULD just fly out and trade the LP directly, if you're talking Sansha or Thucker LP, that's a bit of a journey, and people are lazy, hence why trade hubs as a whole exists and command premiums (or discounts) over other stations. If it's between making 200m here and now, or flying out to Great WIldlands or Stain for 210m, I'm going to sit here and call it a day. You also assume the people only buy/haul faction mods for liquidation, which also isn't true.
The one that deal with LP fly them for liquidation or they would not take them to Jita. The one flying said mods for usage will buy them wherever they are and most likely are too lazy to buy your LP to then convert them into mods they then have to haul to their deployment zone. There is no gain from being able to buy LP instead of items for the users unless they somehow happen to live in the right corp station. |
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virgofire
The Travelling Circus Alternate Allegiance
35
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Posted - 2014.12.15 19:23:00 -
[11] - Quote
So you are saying that since its hard to get certain types of LP items, CCP should made it easier for you by allowing the LP to be bought and traded?
Ummmm No |
Bienator II
madmen of the skies
3023
|
Posted - 2014.12.15 19:34:04 -
[12] - Quote
LP transfer contracts https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2625458#post2625458
would be awesome yeah
eve style bounties (done)
dust boarding parties
imagine there is war and everybody cloaks - join FW
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Frostys Virpio
The Mjolnir Bloc The Bloc
1405
|
Posted - 2014.12.15 22:03:38 -
[13] - Quote
If you found who wants to buy your LPs, you can trade them the LP store items directly so there is no need to trade the LPs. |
McChicken Combo HalfMayo
The Happy Meal
114
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Posted - 2014.12.15 22:07:25 -
[14] - Quote
A new item that can be cross-converted is the only way I'd support this, as you'd still have to haul that item to move it.
Basically an LP token. You can convert LP into the tokens and convert the tokens back into LP.
~ Bookmarks in overview
~ Fleet improvements
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Akrasjel Lanate
Naquatech Conglomerate Naquatech Syndicate
1622
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Posted - 2014.12.15 22:27:01 -
[15] - Quote
Yes
Akrasjel Lanate
General Director(CEO) of Naquatech Conglomerate
Executor of Naquatech Syndicate
Citizen of Solitude
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Frostys Virpio
The Mjolnir Bloc The Bloc
1407
|
Posted - 2014.12.15 22:36:28 -
[16] - Quote
McChicken Combo HalfMayo wrote:A new item that can be cross-converted is the only way I'd support this, as you'd still have to haul that item to move it.
Basically an LP token. You can convert LP into the tokens and convert the tokens back into LP.
Only if the token can only be redeemed inside a station where that corp's LP store is. No fly to Jita with LP in journal, transfer to token, put token on matket, buy token, transfer in LP, fly to station with LP in journal and then buy stuff on LP store. |
voetius
Quiet Days in Clichy
319
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Posted - 2014.12.15 22:38:13 -
[17] - Quote
I'm not sure how you envisage it working but if it was something like a market where you could place buy and sellorders for LP of specific corporations, or somehow set exchange rates I can't really see what the problem would be.
It would address one thing that is brought up often, that of clearing small amounts of LP off the Journal as a sort of tidy up / clean up thing and would be quite cool IMO.
I support the general idea but would like to see how it might be implemented as EVE players are quite good at finding ways to manipulate systems, and while there isn't anything wrong with that per se, it can make a system unworkable or have bad side effects (think of the old Bounty System that was generally perceived as completely useless). |
Nariya Kentaya
Ministry of War Amarr Empire
1642
|
Posted - 2014.12.15 22:39:16 -
[18] - Quote
No on every level, if LP could be traded all it would do is devalue all LP, the whole point of the loyalty store is to be a reward for services rendered, fi you want Sansha LP, go do sansha missions in Sansha space, you shouldnt get the reward without the risk
as for buying the item bought with LP, thats fine because your risking that item not even being for sale in the ISK market (in exchange for the safety of not having to go to null to farm it)
so again, no, risk/reward, working as intended, not even WoW went this easy-mode |
Frostys Virpio
The Mjolnir Bloc The Bloc
1407
|
Posted - 2014.12.15 22:41:56 -
[19] - Quote
Nariya Kentaya wrote:not even WoW went this easy-mode
It did from day 1. It's called bind on equip items. Let someone else take the punishment of doing high-end raiding and buy his loot for in-game gold. |
Celthric Kanerian
Ascendance Of New Eden Workers Trade Federation
154
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Posted - 2014.12.15 23:33:00 -
[20] - Quote
Trade loyalty points? How about... No |
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Corraidhin Farsaidh
Farsaidh's Freeborn
844
|
Posted - 2014.12.15 23:50:55 -
[21] - Quote
And no from me too, buy the faction stuff and trade that instead, what with there being a market and all for that. |
Nariya Kentaya
Ministry of War Amarr Empire
1646
|
Posted - 2014.12.17 20:05:13 -
[22] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:Nariya Kentaya wrote:not even WoW went this easy-mode It did from day 1. It's called bind on equip items. Let someone else take the punishment of doing high-end raiding and buy his loot for in-game gold. No, what OP is asking for is allowing you to sell honor/justice/secondary currencies for gold, which WoW has not done, and shouldnt, because it would be stupid |
Lord Parallax
Phoenix Industries Wicked Nations
3
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Posted - 2014.12.18 02:02:01 -
[23] - Quote
Old Man Parmala wrote:Trading LP of one type for another would be nice...
I would love this. I posted in a different thread about this idea.
Say you have 47,000 LP from Caldarri Navy, but you moved to Amarr space, why not be able to trade the Cal Navy LP over to Amarr Navy at a 3:1 ratio or just cash out the LP from the Cal Navy at a 2:1 isk coversion.
I also like the Eve Market idea. Sell my LP on the market to others that may need it or want it more than I do. We can do the LP swap with Concord LP from running Incursions why not be able to swap them out from other Npc Corps to Concord or other Npc Corps?
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Donnachadh
United Allegiance of Undesirables
78
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Posted - 2014.12.18 02:13:55 -
[24] - Quote
On the fence about trading LP from one faction to another as per the example Caldari to Amarr, I can see good and bad things about it.
Trading LP for ISK, or selling LP on the market on the other hand get s thumbs down from me as well. |
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Farsaidh's Freeborn
844
|
Posted - 2014.12.18 10:03:28 -
[25] - Quote
I'll say the same here as in other such threads (I like to be consistent :D ). LP is for loyalty to a specific corp and should not be tradeable. The most I think should be a Letter of Recommendation to allow you to push LP from a corp up to the controlling faction to partially aggregate them. Whichever faction you worked under will give you nice faction goodies to sell on the market. |
Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness
1928
|
Posted - 2014.12.18 10:19:58 -
[26] - Quote
Riot Girl wrote:Loyalty Points are a reward for your loyalty. They allow you to purchase special items because you are a special person. I'm not a special person, so why should I be allowed to purchase items from the secret store for special people?
A sure.. you mean.. EXACTLY as the money you are payed by your employer works? You got that money because it is YOU that he is rewarding.... exaclty the same.
"If brute force does not solve your problem.... then you are surely not using enough!"
For the rest hire PoH |
Recruitment
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Shivanthar
149
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Posted - 2014.12.18 11:25:34 -
[27] - Quote
Another point of view from me: I found it very nonesense that all offices under same allied factions can't consume each others LP. If I earned tons of LP from Gallente, why not purchase Minmatar stuff with the same?
It might be my bad to not knowing it, but is there any way to exchange it?
_Half _the lies they tell about me **aren't **true.
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Corraidhin Farsaidh
Farsaidh's Freeborn
845
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Posted - 2014.12.18 12:42:28 -
[28] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote:Riot Girl wrote:Loyalty Points are a reward for your loyalty. They allow you to purchase special items because you are a special person. I'm not a special person, so why should I be allowed to purchase items from the secret store for special people? A sure.. you mean.. EXACTLY as the money you are payed by your employer works? You got that money because it is YOU that he is rewarding.... exaclty the same.
Actually it's not exactly the same, you get paid for doing the job, you get rewarded with LP (and hence Faction goods) for working for a given corp / faction regularly. You want better faction stuff from them then you'd better work more for them to reward your loyalty.
Anyone can get paid for a one off job, only those that show loyalty through repeated jobs get the additional rewards. |
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