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Wade Barrett
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
0
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Posted - 2015.01.04 21:57:08 -
[1] - Quote
I'm currently LV4 missioning with a Vargur, i found that dropping a MTU and letting it do the work may be more profitable than having a salvaging alt following you gate by gate, is it only a impression or can it be a viable way of maximizing revenues? |
Orlacc
707
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Posted - 2015.01.04 22:26:27 -
[2] - Quote
It is viable and entirely up to you!
"Measure Twice, Cut Once."
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Hasikan Miallok
Republic University Minmatar Republic
1309
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Posted - 2015.01.04 22:36:26 -
[3] - Quote
It used to be viable but the recent loot nerf and reprocessing nerf obviously has an effect. There is no one answer it will depend on your skills and also who you mission for (ISK/LP is relevant as is what sort of loot the local rats drop)
Best bet is run an experiment:
1) do some missions with a salvage alt and tally ISK/Hour
2) run the same missions with your alt flying a logi/bomber/ship-of-choice and semi blitz ignoring salvage then tally ISK/Hour
Compare 1 and 2 and see which is better at your skill levels for your corp. If your ISK/LP ratio is high and local rats are loot poor a second ship in mission may be a better option.
Also remember there are loot collecting corps that will do it for you for a cut of the loot. |
atomic killer
State War Academy Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2015.01.04 23:04:40 -
[4] - Quote
I found having salvaging alt useless....income from salvage is realy low if you compare it to looting. For looting no hassle at all, drop MTU and pick up all. |
Jessica Lanson
Port Hercules
6
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Posted - 2015.01.05 00:37:36 -
[5] - Quote
Wade Barrett wrote:I'm currently LV4 missioning with a Vargur, i found that dropping a MTU and letting it do the work may be more profitable than having a salvaging alt following you gate by gate, is it only a impression or can it be a viable way of maximizing revenues?
We don't know how fast you run missions, which factions you're shooting at, or your LP conversion rate. Some people do AE4 with bonus in 45 minutes, and some do it in 90 or more. You will really have to time yourself and count the loot, with and without the alt.
If you are using an alt in a second account, remember that it could be running missions instead so you also need to compare a) running mission with main, b) running mission with main and salvage alt, c) running two missions at once, d) using main and alt to shoot rats in the same mission.
Really, this question is stupidly complex and you're going to have to determine the answer experimentally.
edit: For myself personally, I use a single account with a Golem, I launch MTU and Salvage drones on entering the mission, kill everything and leave after no targets remain. I don't wait for the MTU/drones to complete cleanup. I get a sustainable conversion rate of 1750 LP per ISK which I could maintain for over 90K LP per day (Yes I know someone wil say they get 3,000+ ISK/LP in high sec but it won't work for 90K points per day). |
ValentinaDLM
Pyre Falcon Defence and Security
557
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Posted - 2015.01.05 01:03:16 -
[6] - Quote
If it is on a separate account then you would be better off training for an additional mission ship to run two at once, or if you aren't that coordinated, a command link alt to allow you to fit tank links and move to a lower slot tank in order to maximize DPS and DPS application. If on the same account, it really doesn't seem worth it unless the damage you are putting out is really low and the missions take a very long time to complete, and since the OP is skilled enough for a vargur, that just isn't the case here, so I would say no to a salvaging alt. |
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor Cosmic Consortium
5667
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Posted - 2015.01.05 03:19:27 -
[7] - Quote
Approximately a quarter of my mission income would come from salvaging, if I was to do the salvaging myself. Salvaging costs me time, so when I can complete a mission in under 20 minutes I would need to finish the salvaging in under five minutes otherwise that time salvaging becomes worth less than simply contracting the salvaging to someone else or even just forgetting the salvage altogether.
I have alts on different accounts. I do not use them for salvaging my missions because they make more ISK/hr hauling stuff to market or running missions (if I run two missioning characters in parallel I end up making 50% more ISK/hr, due to loss in efficiency thanks to my inadequate human brain and fingers).
If you have the alt already and you want to use it for salvaging, go for it. A Noctis or Nereus can be configured to "AFK" salvage using drones and an MTU, for those who prefer just flying the one missioning character.
Even a command ship can handle "AFK" salvaging with an MTU, assuming the missioning character is doing the looting. So you can run higher DPS & lower tank on the missioning boat, boost the tank with the command ship, and even have a "get put of gaol free" card by ensuring that the command ship has some capacity for remote repairs and shooting elite frigates.
Just be sure to fit some buffer (armor plates or shield extenders or bulkheads) so the suicide gankers don't have an easy target.
Day 0 Advice for New Players
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Kharaxus
CareBear Initiations The Foundation To Protect Endangered CareBears
73
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Posted - 2015.01.05 15:25:34 -
[8] - Quote
I've used salvaging alts. I've used MTU's. And I've used destroyers with tractors and salvagers equipped.
My best experience in missions has been from running missions in groups. Great way to learn. Maybe if you were in a corp have somebody tag along, scoop loot/salvage, and gain standings.
There are mechanics all over the board for this type of thing that can be applied for future situations depending on what you plan to do in the future besides doing missions. |
Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE
865
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Posted - 2015.01.05 21:42:11 -
[9] - Quote
meh, lately I've been declining Enemies abound just because I feel like I have to loot it, and its what 100m+/hour in loot?
looting just annoys me at this point
I'll join the chorus asking CCP, don't take my fancy names away from me!
In the name of the Limos, the Malkuth, and the Arbalest, so help me pod
- Mara Rinn
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Tsukino Stareine
Serene Vendetta Brawls Deep
804
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Posted - 2015.01.05 22:18:15 -
[10] - Quote
wait, ur in a marauder
cant u just do everything in that? |
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Nalelmir Ahashion
Omegon 42nd Core
638
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Posted - 2015.01.05 22:24:10 -
[11] - Quote
I've found best practice to drop MTU or number of them and loot\salvage while I'm doing the mission. saves time and doesn't interfere with me shooting stuff.
"To know the true path, but yet, to never follow it. That is possibly the gravest sin"
- The Scriptures, Book of Missions 13:21
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Nad'x Hapax
Aliastra Gallente Federation
55
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Posted - 2015.01.05 22:36:45 -
[12] - Quote
MTUs are overrated. To damn slow.
Fit all tractors and let salvaging drones do the salvaging. They are pretty fast. If done right in a Marauder u should be done tractoring/looting/salvaging 30sec-1 min after uve cleared the room |
Sal Goodman9
SG Capitals
0
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Posted - 2015.01.06 00:20:01 -
[13] - Quote
Wade Barrett wrote:I'm currently LV4 missioning with a Vargur, i found that dropping a MTU and letting it do the work may be more profitable than having a salvaging alt following you gate by gate, is it only a impression or can it be a viable way of maximizing revenues?
If you have two monitors and can easily run an alt, it would be worth the extra isk. However, if you don't currently have a salvage alt and have to take time to train it, I would say its not worth it. But if you have a lazy salvage alt, then put it to work. |
Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE
865
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Posted - 2015.01.06 02:25:31 -
[14] - Quote
Tsukino Stareine wrote:wait, ur in a marauder
cant u just do everything in that?
48km tractor beams kinda suck... noctis has over 80km with industrial 4, plus it pulls them in at 2km/s rather than 1.2km/s with a marauder.
in general I fly my marauders like they don't even have tractor beams fit. I only really loot mission completion items, and zor wrecks. most of my loot comes from the mobile tractor unit I plonk down.
I'll join the chorus asking CCP, don't take my fancy names away from me!
In the name of the Limos, the Malkuth, and the Arbalest, so help me pod
- Mara Rinn
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Nad'x Hapax
Aliastra Gallente Federation
55
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Posted - 2015.01.06 02:40:12 -
[15] - Quote
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:Tsukino Stareine wrote:wait, ur in a marauder
cant u just do everything in that? 48km tractor beams kinda suck... noctis has over 80km with industrial 4, plus it pulls them in at 2km/s rather than 1.2km/s with a marauder. in general I fly my marauders like they don't even have tractor beams fit. I only really loot mission completion items, and zor wrecks. most of my loot comes from the mobile tractor unit I plonk down.
There are ways around the 48 km. Like fitting a MWD and burn in position to tractor everything and if theres anything outside of range after that, just aggro it and kill the rest while they close in. 3 tractors to that will make your missions completion times the same as without salvaging anything |
Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE
865
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Posted - 2015.01.06 03:11:34 -
[16] - Quote
Nad'x Hapax wrote:There are ways around the 48 km. Like fitting a MWD and burn in position to tractor everything and if theres anything outside of range after that, just aggro it and kill the rest while they close in. 3 tractors to that will make your missions completion times the same as without salvaging anything
yes there are ways to mitigate it, but with current loot prices it really isn't worth the effort.
I'll join the chorus asking CCP, don't take my fancy names away from me!
In the name of the Limos, the Malkuth, and the Arbalest, so help me pod
- Mara Rinn
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servalaan
16
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Posted - 2015.01.06 05:20:32 -
[17] - Quote
Salvage alt are history. Salvage nerf, loot nerf = retired salvage alts
If pinocchio told you his nose was about to grow, what would happen?
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atomic killer
State War Academy Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2015.01.06 11:43:40 -
[18] - Quote
Guys, drop MTU (1250 m/s only cost 30 mils ), kill the rats, comeback to it, pick the loot, warp off. |
Dato Koppla
Elite Guards
750
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Posted - 2015.01.06 12:29:29 -
[19] - Quote
The salvaging alt would be better put in another mission boat to allow you to complete missions even faster, you can just contract all the loot to ProSynergy to salvage/loot for you so you get a cut of the loot with 0 effort. The second combat character will make you far more money than a salvaging alt. |
Denise Le'Slut
imagination corp
0
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Posted - 2015.01.06 13:48:18 -
[20] - Quote
Two Marauders, thus 6 tractors + 10 salvage drones, cherrypick missions in a system with two security agents on same station. Four missions equal two full marauders most of the time. All looting done while shooting. Yes it's a clickfest. |
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Ion Kirst
KIRSTONE ALLIANCE
95
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Posted - 2015.01.06 20:54:37 -
[21] - Quote
No to the salvaging alt. . .
It would just be a waste of time and effort.
There is so much more you could do with an alt.
-Kirst
Always remember Tovil-Toba, and what was done there.
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Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE
878
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Posted - 2015.01.07 01:21:14 -
[22] - Quote
atomic killer wrote:Guys, drop MTU (1250 m/s only cost 30 mils ), kill the rats, comeback to it, pick the loot, warp off.
Also I decided to make a table how quickly I do the missions, what is the income.
An example lvl 4 Gone berserk. I do it in a Gila in 15 minutes, I get from it 3890 lp (thats 10 mils aproximately in ISK), agent reward is 1677000 isk, bounty 10700000 isk. So far it is 22 mils and 15 mins. To get loot it takes anothe 15 minutes, because it's all spread out. Loot gave me 9 mils, salvage around 2 mils.
For this mission the best way was to drop MTU, collect whatever in collected, then do another mission. But it all depends how quickly you kill those rats. coming back requires wasting time, and fiddling around with bookmarks, CBA. not to mention all the time of actually selling/refining the loot.
Dato Koppla wrote:The salvaging alt would be better put in another mission boat to allow you to complete missions even faster, you can just contract all the loot to ProSynergy to salvage/loot for you so you get a cut of the loot with 0 effort. The second combat character will make you far more money than a salvaging alt. a second account is a lot more clicking. most missions I'm in and out so fast I'd spend more time messing with my alt than running the mission.
IMO better use is a trade alt, easy to update a few orders when you are in warp.
I'll join the chorus asking CCP, don't take my fancy names away from me!
In the name of the Limos, the Malkuth, and the Arbalest, so help me pod
- Mara Rinn
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chaosgrimm
Universal Production and Networking Services
173
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Posted - 2015.01.07 05:43:17 -
[23] - Quote
Up to you but not necessary. you can pull the majority of the value from loot + salvage in the marauder via tractors in the high slots + micromanaging the salvage drones during combat, without or with very little reduction of your mission times. MTU's arent even necessary |
Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE
880
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Posted - 2015.01.07 06:36:26 -
[24] - Quote
in the blockade rats spawn pretty much well out of tractor range, and most have 50km orbits anyways. I'd grab some of the loot if I could, as blockade takes long enough where there are moments where looting is easy. http://i.imgur.com/n7PTIG0.png
I'll join the chorus asking CCP, don't take my fancy names away from me!
In the name of the Limos, the Malkuth, and the Arbalest, so help me pod
- Mara Rinn
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Charlie Jacobson
274
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Posted - 2015.01.07 07:27:02 -
[25] - Quote
Don't even bother with salvage and loot at all if it slows down your mission clearing times. People who think they're making mad isk per hour by salvaging and looting often forget to factor in all the time they spend sorting, hauling and selling the loot. Multiboxing also takes a lot more effort and might make the game feel like more of a chore.
In juicy single pocket missions with lots of battleships you can drop an MTU early and only pick up the 1mil+ meta4 items. |
Hipqo
Byrg's Associates
3
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Posted - 2015.01.07 08:12:34 -
[26] - Quote
Ive recently grinded SOE standing and LP, for a long time, so i had a good opportunity to test salvaging :)
So far ive found, only a few lvl3 are actually worth salvaging, most doesnt even give 1m isk, from loot and salvage. L4 on the other hand, can be a pure gold mine!
I ussually jump into the mission and drop a MTU instantly, then i start killing crap and when the mission is complete, i go back to the station and swap boat, to a salvager. By the time i get back to the mission, the MTU has almost collected everything. At the moment im using a Moa, as my salvager, because its dirt cheap, has 5 high slots, 4 low slots, is quite agile and can "easily" reach 1000m3 cargohold, which is enough for even the biggest lvl4 mission, ive encountered so far. Sometimes the salvage is not worth that much (3-5m) but in other missions you can salvage 15+m easily.
So far i think salvaging is worth it, it gives me the opportunity to generate more isk/hour (the infamous statistic!) then just doing missions for reward and bounty, because of the MTU and "low" SP, basicly. Without a MTU i dont know if missions would be worth salvaging, for low SP capsuleers.
I also realise theres some risk involved in using a MTU, but as long as you dont engage anyone messing with it, nothing happens and you can just move on to the next mission. MTU are fairly cheap aswell, so its not a big problem to replace one, if needed, although ive never had to yet.
Just my 0.02 isk :) |
Madmansreturn
Viziam Amarr Empire
3
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Posted - 2015.01.07 09:24:53 -
[27] - Quote
Forget that alt for salvaging. Salvage and loot only what your Marauder, MTU and 5 Salvage drones can make while shooting through your missIon. A hint for your alt.let him train social skills. Build up fleet with him if hes on a seperate account. At standing 5.0 Do cherry pick missions with both chars but beware of your standing while declining missions. |
Nad'x Hapax
Aliastra Gallente Federation
55
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Posted - 2015.01.07 10:54:53 -
[28] - Quote
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:Nad'x Hapax wrote:There are ways around the 48 km. Like fitting a MWD and burn in position to tractor everything and if theres anything outside of range after that, just aggro it and kill the rest while they close in. 3 tractors to that will make your missions completion times the same as without salvaging anything yes there are ways to mitigate it, but with current loot prices it really isn't worth the effort.
More like completely eliminate it. 5-15 mil extra for 15-20 min work in which u would be shooting rats anyway is worth it imo. Thats a minimum of 15 mil extra/hour up to about 60mil extra/hour. |
chaosgrimm
Universal Production and Networking Services
173
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Posted - 2015.01.07 13:57:33 -
[29] - Quote
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:in the blockade rats spawn pretty much well out of tractor range, and most have 50km orbits anyways. I'd grab some of the loot if I could, as blockade takes long enough where there are moments where looting is easy. http://i.imgur.com/n7PTIG0.png
Cardinals and Pope orbit at 49km, the rest are within the 48km tractor range.
I havent been to amarr space in awhile, so I should jump clone out to my pally and see if this is realistic for the BR version, but in minmatar space if you want to loot + salvage the blockade, its effective to pop all the triggers then start on the group closest to you, which gives time for other groups to get into a nice range. |
Eru GoEller
State War Academy Caldari State
90
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Posted - 2015.01.07 14:28:55 -
[30] - Quote
There's no need for an salvaging alt. Lvl 1-3 missions are there for getting corp or faction standings up, not to mess around with salvaging. This to be able to do lvl4-missions for a choosen corp with the use of corp standing, or by any and all corps within a faction with faction standings. Don't mess around with salvaging, concentrate on getting the best ISK/LP conversions possible instead. For an extra income from lvl 4's, check the availability of: https://sites.google.com/site/prosynergypublic/ , in your missioning area. An salvaging alt is better of as an additional mission runner, to extend the mission offers being available due to declining missions.
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