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Maximus Martinus
Universal Dynamics Corp Silent Requiem
13
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Posted - 2015.01.13 01:07:28 -
[1] - Quote
I searched some interesting earlier posts on the subject of seemingly continuous war decs but couldn't see the answer. Other than being awarded a white feather, are there any implications of joining another corp (at peace) in the middle of an ongoing war?
MM
We are here to educate and amuse
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Paranoid Loyd
3497
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Posted - 2015.01.13 01:16:48 -
[2] - Quote
Is that you Nevil?
"Gankers are just other players, not supernatural monsters who will get you if you don't follow some arbitrary superstition. Haul responsibly and without irrational fear." Masao Kurata
Fix the Prospect!!!
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Eldwinn
SomeWhat SophiSticateD Shadow Cartel
274
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Posted - 2015.01.13 01:16:55 -
[3] - Quote
The question is phrased a bit odd. I had to re-read it a couple times. To answer your question, no. There are no implications for leaving a corporation that is at war to move into another corporation at peace. This is part of the reason why ganking exists in high security space. |
Eldwinn
SomeWhat SophiSticateD Shadow Cartel
274
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Posted - 2015.01.13 01:20:40 -
[4] - Quote
Paranoid Loyd wrote:Is that you Nevil?
This aswell. |
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors Snuffed Out
7078
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Posted - 2015.01.13 01:33:01 -
[5] - Quote
You can hop over from a corporation at war to another corp that is not. There is nothing more to it. No timers, no cooldowns... nothing.
Personally though... you should stay and fight. You might learn a few tricks if you are nice to your assailants. You may be able to use said tricks to then frustrate their efforts and "win" by making the war not worth their while.
Change isn't bad, but it isn't always good. Sometimes, the oldest and most simple of things can be the most elegant and effective.
"How did you veterans start?"
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Celine Sophia Maricadie
Tal-Cel Industry and Salvage LLC
250
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Posted - 2015.01.13 01:42:42 -
[6] - Quote
The only consequence of leaving a corp that is wardecced is that you have to wait 7 days or for the war to end, which ever comes first, in order to re-join the corp that you left, should you want to. |
Maximus Martinus
Universal Dynamics Corp Silent Requiem
13
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Posted - 2015.01.13 02:05:50 -
[7] - Quote
Thanks to you all for the very quick replies, both amusing and factual. I now have the answer.
In my limited experience war decs don't involve much fighting but rather station sitting or haunting low sec to avoid the enemy. There is a valid point of view which says avoid trouble and you avoid the war being extended. Even without casualties, war is expensive as it slows down training (empty head in low sec), reduces trading and manufacturing, stops my PI plans, no missions or mining.
Without an alt, it would be a bit dull.
MM
We are here to educate and amuse
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ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors Snuffed Out
7079
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Posted - 2015.01.13 02:12:02 -
[8] - Quote
If you are already used to operating in low-sec then there should not be any problems operating in high-sec during a war-dec.
Use the same tactics and carry on as usual (see: your PI, industry, and trading doesn't have to stop or suffer, just take extra precautions).
Change isn't bad, but it isn't always good. Sometimes, the oldest and most simple of things can be the most elegant and effective.
"How did you veterans start?"
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Trevor Dalech
Adeptus Assassinorum Silent Eviction
78
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Posted - 2015.01.13 02:37:21 -
[9] - Quote
Maximus Martinus wrote:Even without casualties, war is expensive as it slows down training (empty head in low sec),
Learn how to save your pod, there is no reason to have an empty head in low sec. |
Ralph King-Griffin
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
8478
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Posted - 2015.01.13 02:53:43 -
[10] - Quote
http://evedarklord.blogspot.ca/2015/01/surviving-wardecs.html
"I'm also quite confident that you are laughing
and it's the kind of laugh that gives normal people shivers."
=]I[=
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Sabriz Adoudel
Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE.
4358
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Posted - 2015.01.13 05:24:16 -
[11] - Quote
Maximus Martinus wrote:Thanks to you all for the very quick replies, both amusing and factual. I now have the answer.
In my limited experience war decs don't involve much fighting but rather station sitting or haunting low sec to avoid the enemy. There is a valid point of view which says avoid trouble and you avoid the war being extended. Even without casualties, war is expensive as it slows down training (empty head in low sec), reduces trading and manufacturing, stops my PI plans, no missions or mining.
Without an alt, it would be a bit dull.
MM
You should engage, but only in ships you can comfortably afford to lose, and ideally in situations where you have unexpected reinforcements.
Let's say my alliance wardecs you, and we send a force of three people into your home system to pick off anyone we can catch. A bad corporation will either dock up for a week or will fight back in a 'last stand' approach.
A better corporation will present a tempting target alone in a (very heavily tanked) battleship somewhere, with only one other war target in local. We engage, your battleship warp disrupts multiple targets, and your eight rookie pilots in tech 1 frigates, destroyers and cruisers that have been hiding in a neighbouring system (or better yet, hiding in a wormhole) jump into system and dogpile us.
You might earn a few expensive kills, and you'll definitely earn our respect.
Chaos. Opportunity. Destruction. Excitement... Vote #1 Sabriz Adoudel for CSM 10
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ergherhdfgh
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
256
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Posted - 2015.01.13 07:24:05 -
[12] - Quote
Sabriz Adoudel wrote:
You should engage, but only in ships you can comfortably afford to lose, and ideally in situations where you have unexpected reinforcements.
Let's say my alliance wardecs you, and we send a force of three people into your home system to pick off anyone we can catch. A bad corporation will either dock up for a week or will fight back in a 'last stand' approach.
A better corporation will present a tempting target alone in a (very heavily tanked) battleship somewhere, with only one other war target in local. We engage, your battleship warp disrupts multiple targets, and your eight rookie pilots in tech 1 frigates, destroyers and cruisers that have been hiding in a neighbouring system (or better yet, hiding in a wormhole) jump into system and dogpile us.
You might earn a few expensive kills, and you'll definitely earn our respect.
The guy asked for advice on the consequences of leaving a corp not for opinions on how you think he should play his game.
There are people that just don't want to PvP if you actually can guilt them into PvPing they will likely get frustrated and leave the game. Not all people are the same not all people like the same things and that is good otherwise we'd all be trying to live in the same house on the same street and marry the same woman have the same job.......
I'm not really sure why you want to make other people play the game the way you think they should play. If you keep trying to push people into stuff that they don't feel comfortable with don't be surprised if we loose a lot of what would otherwise be welcomed editions to the player base. |
Sabriz Adoudel
Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE.
4361
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Posted - 2015.01.13 07:57:24 -
[13] - Quote
ergherhdfgh wrote: The guy asked for advice on the consequences of leaving a corp not for opinions on how you think he should play his game.
There are people that just don't want to PvP if you actually can guilt them into PvPing they will likely get frustrated and leave the game. Not all people are the same not all people like the same things and that is good otherwise we'd all be trying to live in the same house on the same street and marry the same woman have the same job.......
I'm not really sure why you want to make other people play the game the way you think they should play. If you keep trying to push people into stuff that they don't feel comfortable with don't be surprised if we loose a lot of what would otherwise be welcomed editions to the player base.
If someone doesn't want to PVP they should play on the test server. There, their actions impact noone, and noone's actions can impact them.
If they play on the real servers, they have to accept that their actions have gamewide consequences, and some people may not like those consequences and might try to stop them. Whether they like it or not, whether they know it or not, that mission runner looting a 'Phased Muon Sensor Disruptor I' and selling it is helping Goonswarm in nullsec wars. Goons might be happy with that - N3 might want to teach them a lesson.
Chaos. Opportunity. Destruction. Excitement... Vote #1 Sabriz Adoudel for CSM 10
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ergherhdfgh
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
256
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Posted - 2015.01.13 08:08:32 -
[14] - Quote
Sabriz Adoudel wrote:ergherhdfgh wrote: The guy asked for advice on the consequences of leaving a corp not for opinions on how you think he should play his game.
There are people that just don't want to PvP if you actually can guilt them into PvPing they will likely get frustrated and leave the game. Not all people are the same not all people like the same things and that is good otherwise we'd all be trying to live in the same house on the same street and marry the same woman have the same job.......
I'm not really sure why you want to make other people play the game the way you think they should play. If you keep trying to push people into stuff that they don't feel comfortable with don't be surprised if we loose a lot of what would otherwise be welcomed editions to the player base.
If someone doesn't want to PVP they should play on the test server. There, their actions impact noone, and noone's actions can impact them. If they play on the real servers, they have to accept that their actions have gamewide consequences, and some people may not like those consequences and might try to stop them. Whether they like it or not, whether they know it or not, that mission runner looting a 'Phased Muon Sensor Disruptor I' and selling it is helping Goonswarm in nullsec wars. Goons might be happy with that - N3 might want to teach them a lesson. So your response is another attempt to tell people how they should play their game? |
Chiana Moro
Coreli Corporation The Kadeshi
25
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Posted - 2015.01.13 09:56:22 -
[15] - Quote
Maximus Martinus wrote:Thanks to you all for the very quick replies, both amusing and factual. I now have the answer.
In my limited experience war decs don't involve much fighting but rather station sitting or haunting low sec to avoid the enemy. There is a valid point of view which says avoid trouble and you avoid the war being extended. Even without casualties, war is expensive as it slows down training (empty head in low sec), reduces trading and manufacturing, stops my PI plans, no missions or mining.
Without an alt, it would be a bit dull.
MM
Run anomalies in quiet low sec. Mision problem solved. PI is also better in low sec. There are enough -5s around so trade in some low sec areas would be possible. I don't see a problem here.
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Velicitia
XS Tech
2747
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Posted - 2015.01.13 12:18:06 -
[16] - Quote
As other people have said, leaving your corp during a wardec carries few penalties (pretty much just the "7 day timer" for re-joining).
However, there are player-enforced penalties that can be given, such as not getting into a (new) corp because of your corp-hopping history. Or, if you do get into a corp, you're pretty much relegated to "cannon fodder", as your history prevents you from moving up the ranks (due to the belief you'll bail at a critical time).
Or ... if you happened to be the loudmouth who got your corp dec'd in the first place ... well, the deccer might just follow you.
One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia
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Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
1972
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Posted - 2015.01.13 12:19:01 -
[17] - Quote
ergherhdfgh wrote:So your response is another attempt to tell people how they should play their game? It's for some reason wrong to tell people to play the game with an awareness that their actions have widespread consequences?
You'd rather people play the game assuming nothing they do affects anyone else? Because that's plainly and objectively false and will typically result in negative outcomes for people. |
J'Poll
Green Skull LLC
5416
|
Posted - 2015.01.13 12:20:57 -
[18] - Quote
Velicitia wrote:As other people have said, leaving your corp during a wardec carries few penalties (pretty much just the "7 day timer" for re-joining).
However, there are player-enforced penalties that can be given, such as not getting into a (new) corp because of your corp-hopping history. Or, if you do get into a corp, you're pretty much relegated to "cannon fodder", as your history prevents you from moving up the ranks (due to the belief you'll bail at a critical time).
Or ... if you happened to be the loudmouth who got your corp dec'd in the first place ... well, the deccer might just follow you.
Pretty much this.
Nothing stops you from hopping out of corps when under war.
But what likely will happen, that corps don't want you at all. As you show clearly you only in it for the gain, not the pain.
As a former corp recruiter, I did rather recruit only 3 people in a month, knowing they would stick with us even through bad times...then recruit 30 and lose 27 again on the first day of a war.
Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy
Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded
Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club
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J'Poll
Green Skull LLC
5416
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Posted - 2015.01.13 12:23:49 -
[19] - Quote
ergherhdfgh wrote:Sabriz Adoudel wrote:
You should engage, but only in ships you can comfortably afford to lose, and ideally in situations where you have unexpected reinforcements.
Let's say my alliance wardecs you, and we send a force of three people into your home system to pick off anyone we can catch. A bad corporation will either dock up for a week or will fight back in a 'last stand' approach.
A better corporation will present a tempting target alone in a (very heavily tanked) battleship somewhere, with only one other war target in local. We engage, your battleship warp disrupts multiple targets, and your eight rookie pilots in tech 1 frigates, destroyers and cruisers that have been hiding in a neighbouring system (or better yet, hiding in a wormhole) jump into system and dogpile us.
You might earn a few expensive kills, and you'll definitely earn our respect.
The guy asked for advice on the consequences of leaving a corp not for opinions on how you think he should play his game. There are people that just don't want to PvP if you actually can guilt them into PvPing they will likely get frustrated and leave the game. Not all people are the same not all people like the same things and that is good otherwise we'd all be trying to live in the same house on the same street and marry the same woman have the same job....... I'm not really sure why you want to make other people play the game the way you think they should play. If you keep trying to push people into stuff that they don't feel comfortable with don't be surprised if we loose a lot of what would otherwise be welcomed editions to the player base.
Sorry, but I do agree with Sabriz.
It is better to stand and fight then to run and hide.
And if you do not want any PvP. Don't play EVE / stay in a NPC corp. The moment you step into the world of Player corps, you know that PvP chance will sky rocket
Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy
Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded
Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club
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Solecist Project
All Glory to the HypnoBoobs
16288
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Posted - 2015.01.13 13:04:19 -
[20] - Quote
ergherhdfgh wrote:There are people that just don't want to PvP if you actually can guilt them into PvPing they will likely get frustrated and leave the game. Not all people are the same not all people like the same things and that is good otherwise we'd all be trying to live in the same house on the same street and marry the same woman have the same job....... so much crap ... Please don't parrot all the idiots who don't think before they speak.
Some people can't stand up to themselves, can't defend themselves, can be pushed around easily.
Does that mean we should accept how they are ... ... or maybe even adapt the surroundings to their weakness?
No. Accepting people for the bullshit idiocy called "individualism" leads to a society full of self entitled idiots who don't care about improving themselves.
"I'm great the way I am." ... No, you suck. Improve yourself.
Ralph King-Griffin > **** you sol, years, ****ing years since thats happend
The Cuppy Cake Song <3 <3 <3 :D :D :D
Come along now, come along with me and I'll eeaasee your pain..
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Feyd Rautha Harkonnen
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
1779
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Posted - 2015.01.13 15:42:37 -
[21] - Quote
Sabriz Adoudel wrote: ... A better corporation will present a tempting target alone in a (very heavily tanked) battleship somewhere, with only one other war target in local. We engage, your battleship warp disrupts multiple targets, and your eight rookie pilots in tech 1 frigates, destroyers and cruisers that have been hiding in a neighbouring system (or better yet, hiding in a wormhole) jump into system and dogpile us.
You might earn a few expensive kills, and you'll definitely earn our respect.
+1. A swarm of cheap T1 frigs shooting the same target (priming) is no joke, even if they all get subsequently popped by the other enemies, once they pop that primed pimp-fit T2/T3 they will have won the fight on ISK...
Even T1 logi and ewar is no joke now, and quick to train for. Hell, a single dude at range in a Griffin can give an enemy fleet a real ballache.
Throw in a logoff trap on the bait, and you are really cooking at catching the agressor with pants down...
Edit: Perhaps most importantly, even if you do all go down in those cheap T1 frigs, the loss is negligible, but the gains tremendous. You will not only increase self-respect, but the respect of others, and most importantly open yourself to other avenues of gameplay down the road you might never have considered before. Going all-in in cheap T1 frigs is like walking into a chocolate shop and at least trying all the different varieties, before deciding to limit yourself to a life of just eating caramels (pve)...at least you gave the macaroons a try...
F
Would you like to know more?
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Cannibal Kane
Blood Raiders Elite
4631
|
Posted - 2015.01.13 15:52:08 -
[22] - Quote
Learn from it, embrace it and destroy all.
Become the predator...
"Kane is the End Boss of Highsec." -Psychotic Monk
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J'Poll
Green Skull LLC
5420
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Posted - 2015.01.13 16:24:02 -
[23] - Quote
Cannibal Kane wrote:Learn from it, embrace it and destroy all.
Become the predator...
Listen to Kane.
When the blood raiders have trouble killing people, they call Kane for help.
Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy
Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded
Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club
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Cara Forelli
Green Skull LLC
852
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Posted - 2015.01.13 16:29:21 -
[24] - Quote
Solecist Project wrote:Does that mean we should accept how they are ... ... or maybe even adapt the surroundings to their weakness?
No. Accepting people for the bullshit idiocy called "individualism" leads to a society full of self entitled idiots who don't care about improving themselves. Pot, meet Solecist.
Solecist Project wrote:The harm behind minimizing this kind of friction, as you put it, comes from you simply putting a whole lot of different people into one box .......
... and you're not even really dealing with it.
You just put it away. Literally.
And you do that, by telling us to stay away. Within our group. Isolated.
What kind of person does that?
How many boxes have you put away by now??
Why do you deny me the right to be an intelligent human being? I suggest you start posting constructively. We're all getting tired of your useless tirades and personal attacks.
OP, I agree with Sabriz. I have seen wardec corps do a complete 180 when their target corps put up a fight and actually assist them in their other wars. The typical wardec corp has many wardecs going at a time, and maybe 1/10 of them yields an interesting fight. Killing miners gets boring. Give them what they want, and they might just turn out to be a friend in disguise.
And as far as PVP vs. non-PVP, the original question in the OP was answered and I don't see any harm in expanding on his options. If a new player asked what remap they should use to train into a phoenix you would expect us to answer the question, but also provide our opinion on why that is a bad idea. New players need all the context because sometimes they don't know what questions to ask.
Adventures
New player with questions? Join my public channel in game: House Forelli
GSLLC is recruiting
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Feyd Rautha Harkonnen
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
1779
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Posted - 2015.01.13 16:40:26 -
[25] - Quote
Cara Forelli wrote: ... OP, I agree with Sabriz. I have seen wardec corps do a complete 180 when their target corps put up a fight and actually assist them in their other wars. The typical wardec corp has many wardecs going at a time, and maybe 1/10 of them yields an interesting fight. Killing miners gets boring. Give them what they want, and they might just turn out to be a friend in disguise. ...
Quoted for truth.
F
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Maximus Martinus
Universal Dynamics Corp Silent Requiem
13
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Posted - 2015.01.13 17:10:36 -
[26] - Quote
I hadn't anticipated so many responses.
Picking up on the comments about fighting back - it's apparent that there is a huge gulf between responder's corps and mine. 5 people on line is the record and usually it's just 1. That means that anything requiring organisation (like an armed response) just does not happen. Other than the occasional amusing chat it's not much different to flying solo.
Perhaps I'll revisit the recruitment forum.
MM
We are here to educate and amuse
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Paranoid Loyd
3499
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Posted - 2015.01.13 17:14:36 -
[27] - Quote
Maximus Martinus wrote:Perhaps I'll revisit the recruitment forum. Good idea. If you are willing to fight, and no one else is, you are in the wrong corp.
"Gankers are just other players, not supernatural monsters who will get you if you don't follow some arbitrary superstition. Haul responsibly and without irrational fear." Masao Kurata
Fix the Prospect!!!
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ergherhdfgh
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
259
|
Posted - 2015.01.13 21:34:22 -
[28] - Quote
Vimsy Vortis wrote:ergherhdfgh wrote:So your response is another attempt to tell people how they should play their game? It's for some reason wrong to tell people to play the game with an awareness that their actions have widespread consequences? You'd rather people play the game assuming nothing they do affects anyone else? Because that's plainly and objectively false and will typically result in negative outcomes for people. You guys are confusing affects and consequences with competition. The two can exist in the same place but have nothing to do with each other, other than the fact that they are both happenings.
Interactions are interactions, Consequences are consequences. Affects are affects or the result of an effect. Competition on the other hand is a personal perspective. It's the lens through which you view: interactions, consequences, affects etc... One person can be competing with another with the other being competitive back. Two people can compete with each other. Two people can work together in a cooperative environment.
Is a married couple competing with each other when paying their bills together or raising their children together? Granted in some cases they do but those usually wind up in divorce. In many cases they are not.
Further he did not tell people that they should play the game with awareness he told them how when and where they should play and suggested I am guessing directed at me that I should play on the test server. I am not really sure where you get that he said the OP should play with awareness especially with regards to anything that I quoted or commented on because it just is not there.
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ergherhdfgh
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
259
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Posted - 2015.01.13 21:42:29 -
[29] - Quote
J'Poll wrote:
Sorry, but I do agree with Sabriz.
It is better to stand and fight then to run and hide. Not only will you learn from it, you will make great friends in that corp by fighting together through a tough situation and you will earn the respect of others (including your enemy).
And if you do not want any PvP. Don't play EVE / stay in a NPC corp. The moment you step into the world of Player corps, you know that PvP chance will sky rocket
Again what you are saying here is assuming that the person in question wants to PvP and / or is interested in earning the respect of others. Neither of which is inherently true. Granted my perspective is not the norm but yours in not inherent.
The staying in an NPC corp thing is decent advice to avoid war decs but there are reasons why someone would want to be in a corp and drop during a dec and indeed there are corps which allow that. To each his own and let the guy play his game his way.
Let me say there that I have no issue with people suggesting possible consequences to their actions just please stop telling people how they "should" play as if it were some objective thing that were the same for everyone when indeed it is not. |
ergherhdfgh
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
259
|
Posted - 2015.01.13 21:47:55 -
[30] - Quote
Solecist Project wrote:ergherhdfgh wrote:There are people that just don't want to PvP if you actually can guilt them into PvPing they will likely get frustrated and leave the game. Not all people are the same not all people like the same things and that is good otherwise we'd all be trying to live in the same house on the same street and marry the same woman have the same job....... so much crap ... Please don't parrot all the idiots who don't think before they speak. Some people can't stand up to themselves, can't defend themselves, can be pushed around easily. Does that mean we should accept how they are ... ... or maybe even adapt the surroundings to their weakness? No. Accepting people for the bullshit idiocy called "individualism" leads to a society full of self entitled idiots who don't care about improving themselves. "I'm great the way I am." ... No, you suck. Improve yourself. I very much think before I speak.
You can accept who you are and adapt / improve yourself at the same time. You don't have to summon self hatred to decide you want to improve things. Improving things also is very subjective. You are claiming to have some objective knowledge of what is good and or bad for other people which just does not exist.
I am wondering if you think before you post. Or did you intend to imply that you know what is better for others more than they do? |
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