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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Archi Viralfury
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Posted - 2006.09.26 19:59:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Archi Viralfury on 26/09/2006 20:00:06 Hello all,
Firstly im sory if there was already a thread about this, as i used the search function as well as looking all over the forum and didnt see any post on it.
Quote: Fixes:
Deadspace acceleration gates no longer permit the entry of carriers, freighters, dreadnoughts, motherships and titans.
Well i personally can not fly a carrier yet, but imho i see this as a VERY bad idea, i know quite a few people that use carriers and dreads to do missions, and i feel that this is a blow well below the belt to anyone that has spent their hard earned ISK on a carrier or dread only to find out that they can no longer use it for any mission or cosmos.
Unless i missed the part where it was stated that "all missions would be open space and we are doing away with deadspace gates" i feel very strongly that this should not happen and the say of capital ship pilots and indeed anyone that likes the idea of capital ships being able to do missions/deadspace areas should be heard loud and clear by CCP.
Therefore i ask anyone that thinks this is a bad idea to make their self heard in this thread, in the hope that CCP will stop greatly reducing the usefullness of capital ships, capital ships that take alot of time to train and get the ISK for.
Thanks
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Archi Viralfury
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Wizzkidy
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Posted - 2006.09.26 20:10:00 -
[2]
I don't see it as such a bad idea, these ships are designed for the pvp side of the game, I don't think they where intended to be used in missions anyway and should they imo no they should not.
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Isyel
Minmatar Masuat'aa Matari Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2006.09.26 20:30:00 -
[3]
If someone trains capital ships just to run lvl 4 missions there is something incredibly wrong with said person in my opinion. I mean seriously, need to make a boring grind even more boring by removing every single degree of danger from it? Sheesh, some people amaze me, and that's pretty hard to do i assure you.
I welcome the change, and don't say it's something new. I've been hearing how cap ships were never supposed to enter complexes etc. for a long time. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Originally by: Jim McGregor
All the nodes are belong to us!
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Waragha
Art of War Cult of War
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Posted - 2006.09.26 20:33:00 -
[4]
It would be stupid having to balance missions after ships that very few people can fly. Im very sure that is why they are not allowed in.
Originally by: Trepkos
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The only difference between GS and NPC's are that GS respawn quicker.
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Princess Aspire
DarkStar 1 Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.09.26 20:53:00 -
[5]
command ships 4tw!
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Perseus D'Solos
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Posted - 2006.09.26 21:08:00 -
[6]
Well, then I suppose you who favour this nerf has carriers in your hangars? I shouldn't think so. The time and effort that goes into training and getting carriers is immense, and IMHO, if it wouldn't have been possible to use capital ships in complexes from the start, fair enough, but that's not the way it's been working, has it now? This will definatly lose CCP many long term customers who've been busting their **** to get, and get into, carriers.
And oh, some missions, notably the later stages of for example the Audesder war effort, are extremely hard, if not impossible, to do in battleships, so the PvP-only argument is, at the very least, flawed.
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Fuujin
Hadean Drive Yards
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Posted - 2006.09.27 00:16:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Fuujin on 27/09/2006 00:17:06 How is this a bad idea? It's a long time coming. Get over it and adapt.
I fly a chimera and yes i favour it. I have other ships for that sort of thing. _______________
The sword has to be more than a simple weapon; it has to be an answer to life's questions
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Blind Man
Caldari 0utbreak
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Posted - 2006.09.27 00:46:00 -
[8]
they should never have been allowed in the first place anyways
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quenaveir
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Posted - 2006.09.27 05:29:00 -
[9]
I think that if you have the skills and the ship you should beable to go where ever you want complex mission pvp dont matter
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Gaogan
Gallente Solar Storm Axiom Empire
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Posted - 2006.09.27 16:37:00 -
[10]
10/10 complexes were designed to be run by a good sized gang. The rewards are high so the effort required should also be high. Soloing them in a dread was never intended, so it's about time they fixed it.
Maybe now we'll start seeing logistics ships put to use instead of rotting in hangers.
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Acceber Reuabnehel
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Posted - 2006.09.28 05:37:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Isyel If someone trains capital ships just to run lvl 4 missions there is something incredibly wrong with said person in my opinion. I mean seriously, need to make a boring grind even more boring by removing every single degree of danger from it? Sheesh, some people amaze me, and that's pretty hard to do i assure you.
Fine, if you dont like the 'grind' of doing missions/complexes, then dont. But just because someone doesn't like PVE doesn't mean that another, whom enjoys the PVE aspect of the game, should be restricted from using the larger ships. Perhaps 'easier' Complexes/missions should have a maxiumum ship size of Battleship, and allow only the hardest levels of missions (perhaps those level 5 agents that arent activated yet) use gates that can be activated by dreads/carriers.
It just annoys me that people will outright dismiss and critisize something that they can choose to ignore, especially when it doesn't have to affect them. If you don't run missions, what care have you for what ships are allowed to complete them?
I personally want to PVP later in the game, but I also like having my options open for other avenues of gaming. I never read anything that said EVE was strictly for PVP players. As a matter of fact, part of the draw to this game is the freely mingled intertwined aspects of both pve and pvp.
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Venkul Mul
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Posted - 2006.09.28 07:51:00 -
[12]
Unless I am mistaken, most of those ships can't pass a Jumpgate but need a cynosural field, right? So stand to reason that the older and less efficent acceleration gates can't move them. I you can build a cynosural field in a deadzone, you shouldn't have problems, if not, it stand to reason you could not enter them. For the methagaming reasons: as a mission and complex runner I find it is best if the access to complex for the big ships is limited. The possibility for a single player to do a complex mean that he will farm it as often as possible, making the complex useless for most of the players. Limiting the complexes so that you need a gang to do them make them useful for a greater number of players.
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Venkul Mul
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Posted - 2006.09.28 07:52:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Venkul Mul on 28/09/2006 07:55:07 Duble post, sorry
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Grytok
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Posted - 2006.09.28 07:58:00 -
[14]
I love the idea of having capital ships outside the Missions and Complexes. A single Carrier which farms a Complex is just lame and also those high ranked Complexes were never ment as solo-runs.
Get yourself a gang together to fly those Complexes and even LVL4 Missions should require more than a single ship to complete them.
EVE is a teamplay game!!!
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The Novis
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Posted - 2006.09.28 09:15:00 -
[15]
Capital ships require a lot of time, effort and isk to get, to then be told after the fact that that was all wasted because the people who couldnt be bothered to do it complained enough to get the rules changed.
Verry anoying, but thats that so time to adapt
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Jaketh Ivanes
Amarr 1st Praetorian Guard
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Posted - 2006.09.28 12:03:00 -
[16]
Originally by: The Novis Capital ships require a lot of time, effort and isk to get, to then be told after the fact that that was all wasted because the people who couldnt be bothered to do it complained enough to get the rules changed.
Verry anoying, but thats that so time to adapt
Can you direct me to the threads where people complain about cap ships in missions? Or even complexes?
I have found some about complex farming, but that was not cap ship specific.
If you can't, then there were no whine and it was never intended?
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FawKa
Gallente Old Farts The Phantom Conglomerate
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Posted - 2006.09.28 13:01:00 -
[17]
Thing is, theres pvpers in carriers and theres mission runners in carrier. CCP just closed the door for mission runners which is a part of this game to.
I dont think the gates should have been closed to 10/10 complexes before CCP makes lvl 5 missions for capital ships. I guess they havent places a lot of resources into that yet, but they just screwd a lot of guys by making their carrier useless to em. - even if "it is ment to be a pvp ship".
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=369662&page=1#10 Link to banner |
Grez
Minmatar The Raven Warriors
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Posted - 2006.09.28 14:29:00 -
[18]
For the last bloody time. A carrier is fleet support, NOT a solo-mission runner. If you don't like it, don't use them! They're in no way designed to allow people to be able to do missions with no risk, and allow them to kill things quickly. ---
Cache Clearer
Still waiting for a Wrangler-edit! |
The Novis
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Posted - 2006.09.28 14:59:00 -
[19]
Edited by: The Novis on 28/09/2006 15:01:35
Originally by: Grez For the last bloody time. A carrier is fleet support, NOT a solo-mission runner. If you don't like it, don't use them! They're in no way designed to allow people to be able to do missions with no risk, and allow them to kill things quickly.
why not? they are just a ship if its power thats the problem then you would want lvl1 missions to not allow destroyers up and lvl2 bc and up and lvl 3 bs up.
why should hard work be penalised. as for the mission wines ill try and find a few.
dont get me wrong i know the game changes and the players have to change with it, but this change severly hurts a minority of players who have invested lots to get the ship they want. Other people could have doine the same
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Capt Williams
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Posted - 2006.09.28 22:36:00 -
[20]
Edited by: Capt Williams on 28/09/2006 22:36:11 i live in empier and im a pvp pilot. first off this change sucks a big one. i have a carrier and a dread. the dread is good for one thing shoting a pos thats it. lock time is so bad 80 sec to lock a frig. even if you do get a lock the target best be stoped. carrier has the same problem for pvp lock time sucks. only thing a carrier is good for is moveing frigs out to 0.0 or defending a 0.0 pos. but thats because you can sit at you pos and assing drones and never risk your ship. i run more of risk in my carrier running missions in low sec than pvping in 0.0. so tell me how this helps anyting. it dont if you are a empier pilot you are screwed and should sell your carrier now. i know i will probly be selling mine.
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AvgGuy
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Posted - 2006.09.28 22:51:00 -
[21]
I really can take either side on this. First I can see CCP wanting to promote team play and discourage solo-farming off high lvl complexes. On the other hand what happened to the sandbox where you can do pretty much whatever you want? If they keep this in I don't see how they CAN'T create PvE capital ship missions/complexs where you must have at least one in your gang.
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Sharkbait
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Posted - 2006.09.28 23:30:00 -
[22]
i haven't read all the replys, kinda tired and heading for the shower. but i will say that the current complexes and missions was not designed to handle capital ships. so they have been removed from the allowed list.
Spank You later |
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Clone runner
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Posted - 2006.09.29 00:44:00 -
[23]
guess the only fun a carrier pilot could have is gone now wouldnt have been to bad if carriers would have been boosted to get them away from safespots/pos and get them onto the front lines like tux said he would do months ago in a forum thread. guess all the people with carriers have an expensive hauler now
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Archi Viralfury
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Posted - 2006.09.29 01:15:00 -
[24]
Edited by: Archi Viralfury on 29/09/2006 01:17:43 Was going to post something, but then i thought, what the hell, no one ever listens to the people that contest a change. So whats the point in wasting my sanity.
GG CCP, or at least it was!
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Desirez Brutus
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Posted - 2006.09.29 01:18:00 -
[25]
I wonder if CCP has noticed a marked increase in the number of payment plans cancelled in the last 24-48 hours.
I know our alliance is suffering because of this.
I can understand removing access to complexes from capital ships, but i cant for the life in me understand why they would remove access to level 4 missions, i mean anyone that has actually done a level 4 mission in a carrier or dread will tell you that its bloody slow going. I have seen carriers do average level 4 missions slower than a solo battleship, and as for overpowered, ive also seen capital ships go POP in level 4 missions like the new Mordus Headhunters (which btw is practically impossible to solo unless you spend as much or even more on faction mods as you would spend on a carrier).
So, my final thought... I agree with removing capital ships from complexes, but strongly urge the people responsible to reconsider level 4 mission access, especially with the recent addition of even harder missions. A carrier or dread is not much more than an alternative to sinking 2bln into pirate implants and faction items to solo in a raven for instance without blinking an eye. The only thing that could right this "wrong" without giving access to level 4 missions agin would be to implement level 5 agents within a couple of weeks, rather than a couple of years (as i feel it might take) Otherwise the people that have staked their clame of ISK in a carrier are going to be sat in the hanger waiting out the rest of their paid subscription before they leave for pastures new. Because, after all,who in their right mind is going to buy a carrier in empire after this patch.
Thanks to anyone that listens to my ramble, And to anyone that bothers to reply to it.
See ya in space |
Grytok
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Posted - 2006.09.29 08:11:00 -
[26]
To all you whiners sitting in Carriers not anymore able to run Missions with them:
THIS IS A ROLE-PLAYING-GAME!!!
Therefore also the ships have different roles in this Game-Universe. A Carrier or any other Capital ship was designed to engage in Fleet-Battles. They are not ment to run missions or farm complexes. If you whine about it know, then you misunderstood the whole Game in that point.
We do LVL4-Missions in a little Group with 2 BS, a supporter and a cruiser and it just works fine. This is exactly how CCP wanted it to be. So get warm with it.
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Dratheros
Phoenix Knights
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Posted - 2006.09.29 08:32:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Grytok To all you whiners sitting in Carriers not anymore able to run Missions with them:
THIS IS A ROLE-PLAYING-GAME!!!
Therefore also the ships have different roles in this Game-Universe. A Carrier or any other Capital ship was designed to engage in Fleet-Battles. They are not ment to run missions or farm complexes. If you whine about it know, then you misunderstood the whole Game in that point.
We do LVL4-Missions in a little Group with 2 BS, a supporter and a cruiser and it just works fine. This is exactly how CCP wanted it to be. So get warm with it.
Then I guess Battleships weren't meant to sit in a belt for 2H and mine away, able to tank the rats in 0.0? No, didn't think so. And yet people do this. So please, lay off the talk about 'Role' of a ship. Do you get a sportscar and always go to the racing-track to drive it? No, you drive where the other normal cars drive, to show it off.
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Grez
Minmatar The Raven Warriors
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Posted - 2006.09.29 08:38:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Desirez Brutus I wonder if CCP has noticed a marked increase in the number of payment plans cancelled in the last 24-48 hours.
I know our alliance is suffering because of this.
I can understand removing access to complexes from capital ships, but i cant for the life in me understand why they would remove access to level 4 missions, i mean anyone that has actually done a level 4 mission in a carrier or dread will tell you that its bloody slow going. I have seen carriers do average level 4 missions slower than a solo battleship, and as for overpowered, ive also seen capital ships go POP in level 4 missions like the new Mordus Headhunters (which btw is practically impossible to solo unless you spend as much or even more on faction mods as you would spend on a carrier).
So, my final thought... I agree with removing capital ships from complexes, but strongly urge the people responsible to reconsider level 4 mission access, especially with the recent addition of even harder missions. A carrier or dread is not much more than an alternative to sinking 2bln into pirate implants and faction items to solo in a raven for instance without blinking an eye. The only thing that could right this "wrong" without giving access to level 4 missions agin would be to implement level 5 agents within a couple of weeks, rather than a couple of years (as i feel it might take) Otherwise the people that have staked their clame of ISK in a carrier are going to be sat in the hanger waiting out the rest of their paid subscription before they leave for pastures new. Because, after all,who in their right mind is going to buy a carrier in empire after this patch.
Thanks to anyone that listens to my ramble, And to anyone that bothers to reply to it.
See ya in space
But there is no risk, therein lie the problem. ---
Cache Clearer
Still waiting for a Wrangler-edit! |
putukas
Enterprise Estonia Veritas Immortalis
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Posted - 2006.09.29 08:43:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Grytok To all you whiners sitting in Carriers not anymore able to run Missions with them:
THIS IS A ROLE-PLAYING-GAME!!!
Therefore also the ships have different roles in this Game-Universe. A Carrier or any other Capital ship was designed to engage in Fleet-Battles. They are not ment to run missions or farm complexes. If you whine about it know, then you misunderstood the whole Game in that point.
We do LVL4-Missions in a little Group with 2 BS, a supporter and a cruiser and it just works fine. This is exactly how CCP wanted it to be. So get warm with it.
By other capital ships you mean dreads? I dont see how you can be helpful in fleet with dread expect maybe tank a bit firepower.
They should make Dreads more usefull in fleetbattles!!!11 Im Phoenix pilot and im using it for hauling :D and time to time to engage POS but 99% of the time shes in station collecting dust to her sexy body :)
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Grytok
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Posted - 2006.09.29 09:05:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Dratheros
Originally by: Grytok To all you whiners sitting in Carriers not anymore able to run Missions with them:
THIS IS A ROLE-PLAYING-GAME!!!
Therefore also the ships have different roles in this Game-Universe. A Carrier or any other Capital ship was designed to engage in Fleet-Battles. They are not ment to run missions or farm complexes. If you whine about it know, then you misunderstood the whole Game in that point.
We do LVL4-Missions in a little Group with 2 BS, a supporter and a cruiser and it just works fine. This is exactly how CCP wanted it to be. So get warm with it.
Then I guess Battleships weren't meant to sit in a belt for 2H and mine away, able to tank the rats in 0.0? No, didn't think so. And yet people do this. So please, lay off the talk about 'Role' of a ship. Do you get a sportscar and always go to the racing-track to drive it? No, you drive where the other normal cars drive, to show it off.
OK then. Let's say all NON-MINING-SHIPS get nerfed with unability to fit Mining-Lasers.
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