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Gustav Knuttsen
Billionaires Club C0VEN
2
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Posted - 2011.12.02 15:49:00 -
[1] - Quote
As in topic. They(ccp) made this rebalance ?? I dont see ANY difference. :( Anyone ?
Thanks |
Kelsay Rush
6
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Posted - 2011.12.02 15:49:00 -
[2] - Quote
5% more damage is a difference. Also 10% more tracking, less PG and cpu, more range, less cap use... yeah |
Herpus McDerpus
5
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Posted - 2011.12.02 15:51:00 -
[3] - Quote
Kelsay Rush wrote:5% more damage is a difference. Also 10% more tracking, less PG and cpu, more range, less cap use... yeah
Agree. |
Grimpak
Midnight Elites Echelon Rising
159
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Posted - 2011.12.02 15:53:00 -
[4] - Quote
for rails might be enough, but not for blasters.
much more work is needed, both on guns and hulls. [img]http://eve-files.com/sig/grimpak[/img]
[quote]The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.[/quote] ain't that right |
Daedalus Arcova
Havoc Violence and Chaos
220
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Posted - 2011.12.02 15:58:00 -
[5] - Quote
You can put lipstick on a pig, but it's still a pig. You can polish a turd, but it's still a turd. You can buff a blaster, but it's still a blaster. |
Whimmy Wham Whamwazzle
3
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Posted - 2011.12.02 16:01:00 -
[6] - Quote
I guess we'll see how many people start using Gallente agin and ccp will buff as needed? |
I Love Boobies
All Hail Boobies
30
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Posted - 2011.12.02 16:02:00 -
[7] - Quote
Kelsay Rush wrote:5% more damage is a difference. Also 10% more tracking, less PG and cpu, more range, less cap use... yeah
I believe they also gave them half the reload time as other forms of ammunition, so that is also a pretty good point too... ( o Y o ) ( o Y o ) ( o Y o ) ( o Y o ) ( o Y o ) ( o Y o ) ( o Y o ) ( o Y o ) ( o Y o ) ( o Y o ) ( o Y o ) ( o Y o )
The world would be a better place if boobies ran the world instead of boobs. |
Tore Vest
Vikinghall
98
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Posted - 2011.12.02 16:09:00 -
[8] - Quote
5 sec reloade time is nice.... but... been blasting a bit now.... cant say i feel any difference... |
Rac3r3000
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
1
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Posted - 2011.12.02 16:18:00 -
[9] - Quote
it really made a big difference to some ships, like Megathron. You can fit a full rack of neutrons, a heavy cap booster, a heavy neut, and 2 1600 plates, and mwd now, with no Grid problem! It also does 1300+ dps with just 2 magstabs... |
ClusterFook
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
10
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Posted - 2011.12.02 21:50:00 -
[10] - Quote
Rac3r3000 wrote:it really made a big difference to some ships, like Megathron. You can fit a full rack of neutrons, a heavy cap booster, a heavy neut, and 2 1600 plates, and mwd now, with no Grid problem! It also does 1300+ dps with just 2 magstabs...
Really... you sure about that.... because i call BS. Why? because its called CPU and you are at least 40 cpu in the hole in that build.
Highs: 7 T2 Neutrons 1 MED nuet
Mid: heavy cap booster Mwd Web scram
Low: 1 Eanm T2 1 explosive hardener T2 1 adaptive nano membrane T2(note 0 cpu here) 1 DC T2 1 1600 plate 2 Mags stabs T2's
You have only about 3 CPU left in this build and plenty of power grid, notice it has a MED nuet and an Adaptive membrane instead of your 2nd plate and Heavy nuet, so it is using a lot less cpu than your build and it barely fits. So no it did not help the Megathron much in fitting. |
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Count MonteCarlo
The New Era C0NVICTED
14
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Posted - 2011.12.02 21:54:00 -
[11] - Quote
ClusterFook wrote:Rac3r3000 wrote:it really made a big difference to some ships, like Megathron. You can fit a full rack of neutrons, a heavy cap booster, a heavy neut, and 2 1600 plates, and mwd now, with no Grid problem! It also does 1300+ dps with just 2 magstabs... Really... you sure about that.... because i call BS. Why? because its called CPU and you are at least 40 cpu in the hole in that build. Highs: 7 T2 Neutrons 1 MED nuet Mid: heavy cap booster Mwd Web scram Low: 1 Eanm 1 adaptive nano membrane (note 0 cpu here) 1 DC2 1 1600 plate 2 Mags stabs 2's You have only about 3 CPU left in this build and plenty of power grid, notice it has a MED nuet and an Adaptive membrane instead of your 2nd plate so it is using a lot less cpu than your build and it barely fits. So no it did not help the Megathron much in fitting.
Fit a pseudo instead of dc ii and adaptive nano plating instead of eanm, sorted
Noticed big differences, genos gangs favours vigilants over cynabals/vagabonds for antisupport duty now , great combination with tornados |
Jerick Ludhowe
The Scope Gallente Federation
27
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Posted - 2011.12.02 21:57:00 -
[12] - Quote
ClusterFook wrote:Rac3r3000 wrote:it really made a big difference to some ships, like Megathron. You can fit a full rack of neutrons, a heavy cap booster, a heavy neut, and 2 1600 plates, and mwd now, with no Grid problem! It also does 1300+ dps with just 2 magstabs... Really... you sure about that.... because i call BS. Why? because its called CPU and you are at least 40 cpu in the hole in that build. Highs: 7 T2 Neutrons 1 MED nuet Mid: heavy cap booster Mwd Web scram Low: 1 Eanm T2 1 explosive hardener T2 1 adaptive nano membrane T2(note 0 cpu here) 1 DC T2 1 1600 plate 2 Mags stabs T2's You have only about 3 CPU left in this build and plenty of power grid, notice it has a MED nuet and an Adaptive membrane instead of your 2nd plate and Heavy nuet, so it is using a lot less cpu than your build and it barely fits. So no it did not help the Megathron much in fitting.
Fit some inexpensive low cpu faction mods and off you go, no need to downgrade to an adaptive nano.....
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Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
163
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Posted - 2011.12.02 22:02:00 -
[13] - Quote
Kelsay Rush wrote:5% more damage is a difference. Also 10% more tracking, less PG and cpu, more range, less cap use... yeah Also CCP buffed many Gallente ships to make them faster. |
Takseen
University of Caille Gallente Federation
58
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Posted - 2011.12.02 22:06:00 -
[14] - Quote
I've been trying medium blasters out in pve a bit. The 5 second reload time is great for switching between Null and Antimatter. And I'm able to hit most frigates fairly regularly. Not really wtf amazing, but they'll do. Oh, and they're not nearly as heavy on the capacitor. |
MotherMoon
Huang Yinglong
202
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Posted - 2011.12.02 23:03:00 -
[15] - Quote
ok, seriously.
less power grid and cpu, is awesome.
30% less cap use is nothing to laugh at.
They track better which is great for when you actually get in close. Now you wreck when your in range.
5 second reload time is great. That's a lot more dps. Plus the 10% increase in damage plus 10% more damage upgrade for rail guns means a rail gun destoryer will be amazing stuff. |
Freyya
Aliastra Gallente Federation
17
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Posted - 2011.12.02 23:52:00 -
[16] - Quote
Ok one of the main probs was cap use of mwd to get in range and then cap use of blasters. Sorted. Blasters use less cap now so percentage and recharge wise you're much better off.
Range has been increased so you can start applying damage sooner and a switch of long to short range now takes 5 seconds instead of 10. Dps increase as you're not gimped for 10 (or 5 in case of double grouping with interval switch) seconds but only 5 (or 2.5).
Grid AND cpu have been lowered so there are alot more ways to make a blaster ship more survivable to fly and get more damage out of it. It kind of makes ions and electrons obsolete but they where anyways.
Agility boost (and less mass i think?) of the ships means less chance of overshooting your target. Boost for the hybrids. Wasn't a prob for Yeh more experienced pilots out there anyways but still.
More tracking is the last boost to enable blaster ships to hit their moving target more. This was gimped back in the day by the nerfing of 90% webs. Now a 60% web should enable you to apply more damage than before.
I'd say it's a nice start to boosting hybrids don't you think?
Ohh and for the double plated full rack of neutrons; 3% less cpu implant on hybrid weapons does wonders..... |
DarkAegix
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
439
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Posted - 2011.12.03 00:20:00 -
[17] - Quote
I, for one, think all blasters should have unlimited tracking, as it would be highly amusing. |
Mariner6
EVE University Ivy League
38
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Posted - 2011.12.03 00:28:00 -
[18] - Quote
Freyya wrote:Ok one of the main probs was cap use of mwd to get in range and then cap use of blasters. Sorted. Blasters use less cap now so percentage and recharge wise you're much better off.
Range has been increased so you can start applying damage sooner and a switch of long to short range now takes 5 seconds instead of 10. Dps increase as you're not gimped for 10 (or 5 in case of double grouping with interval switch) seconds but only 5 (or 2.5).
Grid AND cpu have been lowered so there are alot more ways to make a blaster ship more survivable to fly and get more damage out of it. It kind of makes ions and electrons obsolete but they where anyways.
Agility boost (and less mass i think?) of the ships means less chance of overshooting your target. Boost for the hybrids. Wasn't a prob for Yeh more experienced pilots out there anyways but still.
More tracking is the last boost to enable blaster ships to hit their moving target more. This was gimped back in the day by the nerfing of 90% webs. Now a 60% web should enable you to apply more damage than before.
I'd say it's a nice start to boosting hybrids don't you think?
Ohh and for the double plated full rack of neutrons; 3% less cpu implant on hybrid weapons does wonders.....
No increase to range was given, so not sure where you are this? 5 seconds is 5 second longer than lasers, and they don't have to close in close. They still use cap and still have to fight in neut range 5% agility is roughly a .4 sec increase in align time for a plated brutix...meh 10 m/s is barely notcible.
Bottom line, still no reason to pick hybrids over lasers or the now hyper buffed projectiles especially that Hail has now made the perfect weapons completely overpowered.
And did Void get any help, no. still sucks.
Overall CCP failed to get this right. Move in the right direction but not anywhere near the mark. |
SpaceSquirrels
17
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Posted - 2011.12.03 01:27:00 -
[19] - Quote
You do realize they admitted this wasn't going to be enough. I believe the next changes will revolve around specific ships. I will say the BS's and BC's also need to have other stats adjusted eg: rokh better sig/scan or speed. Ferox needs another high etc.
Also I notice many ship fits people tend to stick the cookie cutter on and dont make up for deficiencies on specific ships or platforms. EG: Blaster falloff sucks...but not putting on mods or rigs to help alleviate the problem...rather fit that 4th DPS mod.
Might time to also look at your own ship fits.
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Freyya
Aliastra Gallente Federation
18
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Posted - 2011.12.03 13:29:00 -
[20] - Quote
Mariner6 wrote:Freyya wrote:Ok one of the main probs was cap use of mwd to get in range and then cap use of blasters. Sorted. Blasters use less cap now so percentage and recharge wise you're much better off.
Range has been increased so you can start applying damage sooner and a switch of long to short range now takes 5 seconds instead of 10. Dps increase as you're not gimped for 10 (or 5 in case of double grouping with interval switch) seconds but only 5 (or 2.5).
Grid AND cpu have been lowered so there are alot more ways to make a blaster ship more survivable to fly and get more damage out of it. It kind of makes ions and electrons obsolete but they where anyways.
Agility boost (and less mass i think?) of the ships means less chance of overshooting your target. Boost for the hybrids. Wasn't a prob for Yeh more experienced pilots out there anyways but still.
More tracking is the last boost to enable blaster ships to hit their moving target more. This was gimped back in the day by the nerfing of 90% webs. Now a 60% web should enable you to apply more damage than before.
I'd say it's a nice start to boosting hybrids don't you think?
Ohh and for the double plated full rack of neutrons; 3% less cpu implant on hybrid weapons does wonders..... No increase to range was given, so not sure where you are this? 5 seconds is 5 second longer than lasers, and they don't have to close in close. They still use cap and still have to fight in neut range 5% agility is roughly a .4 sec increase in align time for a plated brutix...meh 10 m/s is barely notcible. Bottom line, still no reason to pick hybrids over lasers or the now hyper buffed projectiles especially that Hail has now made the perfect weapons completely overpowered. And did Void get any help, no. still sucks. Overall CCP failed to get this right. Move in the right direction but not anywhere near the mark.
I did mention that it was a nice start didn't i? They weren't supposed to get this right as it was a first look at why blasters suck and if some of the tweaks helps the entire platform become more what it should be. As for the range; Though they got a small increase on optimal and falloff, might have been wrong on that then.
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Tanya Powers
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
318
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Posted - 2011.12.03 13:34:00 -
[21] - Quote
Gustav Knuttsen wrote:As in topic. They(ccp) made this rebalance ?? I dont see ANY difference. :( Anyone ?
Thanks
Usual "Eve search is your friend scub!! "
Then I can also re direct you to dedicated threads has "Hybrids and Tech 2 ammo rebalancing" on General Discussion, you can also share your opinion on Test server Feedback under Hybrids rebalancing thread.
There's so much to say it's useless to restart another thread. |
Dr Karsun
Coffee Lovers Brewing Club Care Factor
27
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Posted - 2011.12.03 13:39:00 -
[22] - Quote
I managed to experiance a big nice buff to the blasters today... Not only I managed to land shots on a drake at 1.5km range when both targets were moving, but also I did almost as much damage as a megathron with a deimos.
I would probably have done the same, but I missed a moment and didn't start shooting at the same time as he did.
Blasters seem usable now.
And in general gallente ships rock now. The blasters may need a little range bonus at some point, but they are serving their purpose now. "Have you had your morning coffee?" -> the Coffee Lovers Brewing Club is recruiting! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=363976#post363976 |
Suitonia
Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
34
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Posted - 2011.12.03 13:43:00 -
[23] - Quote
The fitting reduction is probably the best part of the buff. |
Aloe Cloveris
The Greater Goon Clockwork Pineapple
49
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Posted - 2011.12.03 13:57:00 -
[24] - Quote
Mariner6 wrote: 10 m/s is barely notcible.
When multiplied by 630% mwd + 25% Navigation skill + module bonuses + implant bonuses + Rapid Deployment Link bonuses, that additional 10m/s does add up.
Not that all ships don't benefit from the aforementioned bonuses, but we're talking about the new supplementary 10 m/s that is now also benefitting from those modifiers.
It's not the worst change.
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Caulk H0lster
Kazakh Ministry of Wealth Redistribution
46
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Posted - 2011.12.03 14:00:00 -
[25] - Quote
The buffs to hybrids have been subtle, but so far have made a difference. I think it's premature to say whether or not it's "enough".
I went and bought a Vindicator and Vigilant as soon as the hybrid rebalance was announced, and I dusted off my Rokh. So far I've only really had a chance to fly the Vigilant in combat, and while I didn't have a lot of experience before the buff flying this ship, it definitely does it's job now. When you can apply DPS on the target quickly, you will probably be the top damage dealer. The speed (and agility) is enough to zip around and get in range quickly, and with the tracking buff even when you are MWDing into orbit of a target, you don't miss as many shots as you used to (from my Deimos experiences).
Another thing worth mentioning is that while Gallente ships definitely lean towards armor tanking, especially with ships like the Vigilant, Deimos, Talos, Brutix, and probably a few others I'm missing, you CAN fit them very similar to the way you'd fit a Minmatar ship like a Vagabond, and get a great deal more range out of filling your lows with TEs and Magstabs (though this probably isn't gonna work for soloing as well as it does in gangs). You should be able to reach out and touch someone close to 30k with Null loaded if you've got 2 TEs fit. You're not going to do Vagabond dps at 30k, but at least you'll be hitting frequently.
One thing is pretty certain right now though, and that is that you're not going to see Deimos' replacing Zealots as the standard for Armor HAC fleets, and you're not going to see Abaddon fleets suddenly switching for Megathrons either. The lack of range of blasters is going to be a severely limiting factor in fleet combat, where blaster ships are going to have less than half the range of pulse lasers, and the ships they're attached to can't tank as well as their Amarr counterparts either. Rail Rokhs might have a brighter future in fleet combat, we'll have to wait and see. Their main advantage over Abaddons is range and tank (especially since shield reps come at the beginning of the rep cycle instead of the end like armor reps do), but their drawbacks of 30-40% less DPS and horrible tracking might make them too inflexible for practical use.
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tEcHnOkRaT
Aliastra Gallente Federation
1
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Posted - 2011.12.09 06:36:00 -
[26] - Quote
hybrids are still the best at being worst
so no this rebalance was a kik between the legs, to make high hopes and even bigger dissapointment.
for blasters: u can use them only for high sec ganking railguns: there is no application where u need to shoot further then 120 km cuz u will get a warp in and both other turrets do more damage at long range |
AkJon Ferguson
JC Ferguson and Son Ltd Ferguson Alliance
62
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Posted - 2011.12.09 06:56:00 -
[27] - Quote
Great job on hybrids, CCP! You made them much better and useful without making them overpowered. You very easily could have ****** this up and you managed not to. |
Vedje
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
6
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Posted - 2011.12.12 10:36:00 -
[28] - Quote
Whimmy Wham Whamwazzle wrote:I guess we'll see how many people start using Gallente agin and ccp will buff as needed?
That is very productive Whinny. Let's stit back, get wasted and see what happens maybe they buff them maybe the nerf them.
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baltec1
238
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Posted - 2011.12.12 10:40:00 -
[29] - Quote
My mega now flies at 1200m/s, has the tracking to melt a cruiser, moar firepower, half the loading time and can shoot all the guns forever
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Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
1385
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Posted - 2011.12.12 11:30:00 -
[30] - Quote
ClusterFook wrote:Rac3r3000 wrote:it really made a big difference to some ships, like Megathron. You can fit a full rack of neutrons, a heavy cap booster, a heavy neut, and 2 1600 plates, and mwd now, with no Grid problem! It also does 1300+ dps with just 2 magstabs... Really... you sure about that.... because i call BS. Why? because its called CPU and you are at least 40 cpu in the hole in that build. Highs: 7 T2 Neutrons 1 MED nuet Mid: heavy cap booster Mwd Web scram Low: 1 Eanm T2 1 explosive hardener T2 1 adaptive nano membrane T2(note 0 cpu here) 1 DC T2 1 1600 plate 2 Mags stabs T2's You have only about 3 CPU left in this build and plenty of power grid, notice it has a MED nuet and an Adaptive membrane instead of your 2nd plate and Heavy nuet, so it is using a lot less cpu than your build and it barely fits. So no it did not help the Megathron much in fitting.
Meta 4 web & scram makes quite a difference to CPU.
I'd go 2x 1600RT, 2x Mag Stab II, DCU II, 2 EANM II and a tracking enhancer, btw. The extra falloff (and tracking) is at least as good as a 3rd damage mod IMO.
You can fit a very nice neutron blaster mega with a 3% CPU implant now.
Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
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