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CCP Phantom
C C P C C P Alliance
5371
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Posted - 2015.03.03 15:07:45 -
[1] - Quote
With the Phoebe release in November 2014 we started "Phase One" of the sovereignty changes. Those changes included significant changes to the speed of long distance travel and power projection, as well as smaller changes to the hitpoints and resistances of Sovereignty structures.
Now it is time to look back a bit and evaluate the effects of those changes.
Read more about the effects and results of those changes and check the interesting stats presented in CCP Fozzie's blog Where we stand.
CCP Phantom - Senior Community Representative - Volunteer Manager
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Gilbaron
Free-Space-Ranger Nulli Secunda
1683
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Posted - 2015.03.03 15:10:14 -
[2] - Quote
The link to the second Devblog isn't working. And my battery is at 15%. fml
Build your empire !
Rent Space in Feythabolis and Omist
Contact me for details :)
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GeeShizzle MacCloud
521
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Posted - 2015.03.03 15:15:57 -
[3] - Quote
#reserved |
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation The Kadeshi
1271
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Posted - 2015.03.03 15:23:25 -
[4] - Quote
Why do you release these graphs all the time without the vertical axis label? I mean, there is a blue line but it tells me next to nothing in terms of numbers, which makes this graph about as objectively informative as reading tea leaves. That graph can be 1k, 10k or just 100 people.
Station Tab :: UI Improvement Collective
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Aebe Amraen
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
119
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Posted - 2015.03.03 15:30:23 -
[5] - Quote
I noticed a distinct lack of statistics about black ops battleship usage, which was a large area of concern for both the CSM (according to the summer summit minutes) and the player base as a whole when the changes were announced.
Certainly in the 38.1% of nullsec PvP that HERO accounts for, black ops usage both for bridging and combat has dropped dramatically due to jump fatigue. What about the rest of the game? Are you happy with the changes in black ops activity? |
TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc Shadow Cartel
1027
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Posted - 2015.03.03 15:59:21 -
[6] - Quote
I read the whole thing |
Commander Insignia
Di-Tron Heavy Industries Fatal Ascension
22
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Posted - 2015.03.03 16:23:34 -
[7] - Quote
Still doesn't stop be from wanting to be reimbursed sp across 12 alts that will now never use their caps again |
Vincent Athena
V.I.C.E.
3173
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Posted - 2015.03.03 16:32:28 -
[8] - Quote
One issue with a graph showing the number of subs in null increasing is I do not know if that is from a general move to null, or a general increase in subs across the entire game.
Is the percentage of players operating in Null increasing?
The same issue exists for the graphs of PvP activity. Is it null improving, or just more activity in general?
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Frozen fanfiction
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TheSmokingHertog
TALIBAN EXPRESS
293
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Posted - 2015.03.03 17:12:47 -
[9] - Quote
Nice read, thx. |
War Kitten
Panda McLegion
5908
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Posted - 2015.03.03 17:47:27 -
[10] - Quote
Rivr Luzade wrote:Why do you release these graphs all the time without the vertical axis label? I mean, there is a blue line but it tells me next to nothing in terms of numbers, which makes this graph about as objectively informative as reading tea leaves. That graph can be 1k, 10k or just 100 people.
1) They explained in the blog why they didn't use numbers. 2) They said the Y-axis was linear, so you can extrapolate percentages based on distance from 0. 3) If you couldn't figure out #2 or read to find #1, does it mean you're trolling or just not that into graph-****?
I find that without a good mob to provide one for them, most people would have no mentality at all.
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Sodamn In-sane
Phorever People
3
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:01:36 -
[11] - Quote
lol ofc the numbers went high people logged in to suicide their caps ,loot at numbers now they heading DOWN
well that being said im greased up ready for another penetration from CCP fossil
what do you mean lock caps? my caps-lock is on,
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Vaju Enki
Secular Wisdom
1436
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:40:24 -
[12] - Quote
More nullbear tears please.
The Tears Must Flow
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Jenn aSide
Smokin Aces.
10014
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Posted - 2015.03.03 19:39:49 -
[13] - Quote
Reading that dev blog is proof that some people are incredibly optimistic no matter what lol. No, the jockeying for position that resulted from phoebe isn't proof of success, like wise I'll be their are increases in low sec and wormhole activity, but that's because null coalitions are taking low sec moons they might not have bothered with otherwise and because null coalitions have to rely on wormholes for travel and content now.
Those coalitions have concentrated in 'near null' while still possessing deep null. With the exception of the Immensea/south area, it's business as usual in null, it's a renters paradise. Phase to has to address the VALUE of null, not just how it's won or lost. |
Soldarius
Kosher Nostra The 99 Percent
1159
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Posted - 2015.03.03 20:07:19 -
[14] - Quote
Sov changes are still anemically low, and most of those are not from pvp, but arranged sov transfers. Is it better than right before Phoebe? Yes. But not by much.
Sov is off life support. But it is still in the Serious Condition Ward pending further improvement.
http://youtu.be/YVkUvmDQ3HY
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Saidin Thor
The Odin Conspiracy
43
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Posted - 2015.03.03 20:12:26 -
[15] - Quote
I'd be very interested to see a little bit more information on the "characters in null sec" statistic. Not the numbers themselves, mind you, but the same statistic in relation to other numbers.
Specifically, I think it would be worth looking at four additional graphs:
1. Active Null Characters Normalized by Total Active Characters
2. Active Null Characters Normalized by Active Lowsec Characters
3. Active Null Characters Normalized by Active Highsec Characters
4. Active Null Characters Normalized by Active Wormhole Characters
It's really, really easy to find SOME sort of statistic to support literally any viewpoint. What we have right now is a single snapshot taken out of context and being used to give positive support to changes. A much more credible way to look at the information you've presented is in the reference to the other major groups of space. Knowing that the number of players went up is one thing, but knowing that both the number of players went up AND knowing that this change is actively moving players towards null sec and away from other types of space (which should be the goal here) is quite another thing entirely.
Of course, the axes can be obfuscated the exact same way as the original graph. The dates and trends are really the only important things. |
Scatim Helicon
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3114
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Posted - 2015.03.03 20:27:23 -
[16] - Quote
It's cute that you tried to put a brave face on it but the real story here is that Phoebe's much vaunted changes completely failed to have any lasting effect beyond a wave of fully consensual sov transfers between the usual Great Powers. Most of those graphs show the brief spike of activity one would expect in the wake of any patch before retreating to the status quo, the 'Nullsec population' graph being particularly telling in that the decline in activity seems to have been only halted by the trailer release.
Post on the Eve-o forums with a Goonswarm Federation character that drinking bleach is bad for you, and 20 forum warriors will hospitalise themselves trying to prove you wrong.
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Krell Kroenen
The Devil's Shadow
241
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Posted - 2015.03.03 20:38:27 -
[17] - Quote
Given the decline of the average player count I can't help but wonder where the slight uptick of Null population came from? Could you show us a graph of Highsec and Lowsec populations for the same time periods?
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flapie 2
Planetary Traders Union
15
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Posted - 2015.03.03 22:15:05 -
[18] - Quote
Hmm no data on what % of the player base actually has / used (or not used for that matter) or had a Capital before and after the changes, i wonder how that looks next to the rest of the graphs. Id say that type of data would be at least as important as how often they are used in actual PvP across the Universe.
Also i would have like to see more split data on Capitals, not just across the Universe but also low and null separate to see witch of the 2 has been most affect by said changes, and thus if the intention behind the changes has really worked out or just boosted a single area.
Nice read though, interesting results, maybe ill tackle the SOV changes part 2 tomorrow it was quite the wall text when i quickly scrolled over it. |
Alexis Nightwish
112
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Posted - 2015.03.03 22:31:04 -
[19] - Quote
Can someone smarter than me explain how they would meta the **** out of the graphs if they had a Y-axis?
CCP only approaches a problem in one of two ways: nudge or cludge
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Cr Turist
Burning Napalm Northern Coalition.
40
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Posted - 2015.03.03 23:38:00 -
[20] - Quote
hummm |
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Vladimir Markovich
BOVRIL bOREers Mining CO-OP Brave Collective
0
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Posted - 2015.03.04 00:12:22 -
[21] - Quote
Will there be any restrictions on the use of the entosis module in conjunction with bastion/siege modules? |
Gregor Parud
Ordo Ardish
1242
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Posted - 2015.03.04 00:43:45 -
[22] - Quote
It's funny how large coalitions remain large after those jump fatigue changes and then go "see, there's nothing to shoot". No **** Sherlock, how about actually resetting some neighbours. |
Ncc 1709
Fusion Enterprises Ltd Shadow of xXDEATHXx
137
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Posted - 2015.03.04 01:23:17 -
[23] - Quote
Id like to see data on just how many people were killed by 'skynet' and how many were just killed by fighters next to the carrier vs the all pvp numbers |
Mr Omniblivion
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
414
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Posted - 2015.03.04 03:05:28 -
[24] - Quote
Whoever is running and/or evaluating your data is not very good at it. You're looking at correlations and calling them causation. You're attributing things like increased activity in null to Phoebe, when in fact it is due to other factors such as the "this is eve" video and recruitment in nullsec in general. KarmaFleet alone has picked up several hundred players (hundreds more of characters) that were recruited from high sec and/or directly into null from Reddit.
This data does not show any causation based on Phoebe, and without realizing that, you're going to severely ruin the majority of nullsec. |
Ser Berus
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
20
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Posted - 2015.03.04 03:11:05 -
[25] - Quote
Gregor Parud wrote:It's funny how large coalitions remain large after those jump fatigue changes and then go "see, there's nothing to shoot". No **** Sherlock, how about actually resetting some neighbours.
Perhaps we would if there was any reason to beyond "it makes some hisec residents unhappy".
Wait, that's actually a reason not to. |
ergherhdfgh
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
398
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Posted - 2015.03.04 05:11:54 -
[26] - Quote
Granted that I am not a PvPer but I do mostly live in null and I don't think that having system flipping as a goal is really a good goal for increased PvP.
I think the focus should be more on giving people reasons to fight over the space that they occupy rather than constantly forcing people to move around.
I in the past have mentioned working use of the space into profitability of the space and also increasing the reasons to go NRDS as having a lot of neuts flying around can increase small gang activity.
I have posted some of my ideas on this before and won't duplicate them here but if one of the devs want more info drop me a mail and I'll expand on this.
I think cloaky camping is a huge problem that give way too much power to what is mostly afk game play. The amount of affect that an afk cloaky camper has compared to his actual time engaged with that client is so off balance that I think it is a far far greater problem than the off grid fighter assist that you are currently nerfing.
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Aiyshimin
Fistful of Finns Triumvirate.
428
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Posted - 2015.03.04 07:18:18 -
[27] - Quote
Mr Omniblivion wrote:Whoever is running and/or evaluating your data is not very good at it. You're looking at correlations and calling them causation. You're attributing things like increased activity in null to Phoebe, when in fact it is due to other factors such as the "this is eve" video and recruitment in nullsec in general. KarmaFleet alone has picked up several hundred players (hundreds more of characters) that were recruited from high sec and/or directly into null from Reddit.
This data does not show any causation based on Phoebe, and without realizing that, you're going to severely ruin the majority of nullsec.
Then again, nobody in their right minds would have joined nullsec before Phoebe changes.
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WNxWolfy
Common Sense Ltd Nulli Secunda
8
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Posted - 2015.03.04 09:18:04 -
[28] - Quote
In this devblog: Graphs are wildly misinterpreted, statistics are given the finger. |
Gregor Parud
Ordo Ardish
1249
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Posted - 2015.03.04 09:51:47 -
[29] - Quote
Ser Berus wrote:Gregor Parud wrote:It's funny how large coalitions remain large after those jump fatigue changes and then go "see, there's nothing to shoot". No **** Sherlock, how about actually resetting some neighbours. Perhaps we would if there was any reason to beyond "it makes some hisec residents unhappy". Wait, that's actually a reason not to.
How do high sec residents have anything to do with "stop being a ***** and start resetting some blues, instead of whining like a girl"? |
Freelancer117
So you want to be a Hero
268
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Posted - 2015.03.04 12:25:08 -
[30] - Quote
Thanks for the graphs and information CCP, however there is something bugging me from this devblog.
1. You say that there is a +23.6% increase in manufacturing jobs per day in Nullsec since Phoebe, thats nice But only a +0.7% increase in mining volume per day in Nullsec since Phoebe. Even with the +5% increase in NPC kills per day in Nullsec since Phoebe and presumed reprocessing of loot into manufacturing materials, the numbers mined from nullsec to support these building jobs come up way to short.
I can only conclude that nullsec is still on the Jita life support, and it has been mentioned in the [Phoebe] Long Distance Travel Changes - updates! thread that nullsec needs this lifeline because the major coalitions are to scared to truly life in nullsec on their own without outside help.
The [Kronos] Freighters and Jump Freighters Rebalance [Updated] was a great start at looking how hisec and nullsec interaction of materials could be improved, but you kinda dropped the ball by caving into nullsec Lords demand and allowing Jump Freighters and Rorquals to be special-cased, the conditions for any nullsec stagnation is not taken away this way.
2. Capital Ship Activity, you mentioned in the original Phase One Dev Blog, that you hoped the reduced chance of being hotdropped would provide more opportunities for people to feel comfortable using small numbers of capital ships in PVP. Your conclusion so far is that the overall score for Capital Ship Activity: A wash.
Continued work on engaging and balanced roles for Capital Ships will be needed in the future, especially as some of their current roles in structure shooting are de-emphasized in Phase Two. Please also keep in mind that you also have Covert Ops Black Ships to play around with for balancing
3. Sovereignty Conquests, now this is where I have the most trouble with. The whole article about this reads like CCP wants to play in the sandbox and the company decides how nullsec social clubs are allowed to play with the sand.
Quote:The results of Phase One on this metric have been noticeable and positive, however we would have been happier with a higher status quo over the past three months. If Phase Two is a success, we would ideally like to see a significantly higher status quo, less reliant on bursts of activity from major wars.
There is hubris in this, and I would like to call Bullshit on this before we have another "customer disgruntlement" incident.
Regards, a Freelancer
The players will make a better version of the game, then CCP initially plans.
http://eve-radio.com//images/photos/3419/223/34afa0d7998f0a9a86f737d6.jpg
GÇÖChilde Roland to the Dark Tower came.GÇÖ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nY3oMRLfArU
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