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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 6 post(s) |
Killah Bee
Cataclysm Enterprises Nulli Secunda
4
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Posted - 2015.03.03 22:19:23 -
[751] - Quote
Classic eve community dev blog rage.
Still no way you can put these changes in like that.
Groups like reavers will literally take regions in intie gangs while having like 0 risk.
RIP AU TZ / RUS aswell.
So I wonder what its gonna look like when you reinforce the entire const instead of just one system aswell .. gonna be like 50 beacons to claim and groups like the CFC can still just steamroll all beacons at once .. dunno how thats gonna split them apart.
and so on ...
CCP pls fix these changes.
tyvm |
Lord Parallax
Dead Pirates Syndicate
6
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Posted - 2015.03.03 22:19:29 -
[752] - Quote
Just and Idea, since this is all about protecting a ship that is cycling some module and blowing up the ships that are counter cycling,
1. systems that are being actively contested should have a preventive measure on stations, If a entosis link is being used on the station, after the 3nd cycle is completed the station goes into lockdown, preventing anyone from docking or undocking from the station until the entosis link has been stopped or the capture is completed.
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captain foivos
State War Academy Caldari State
265
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Posted - 2015.03.03 22:20:12 -
[753] - Quote
Nullsec will remain terrible until the answer to "What is the best way to make money in Eve Online?" is not "highsec incursions." |
Milla Goodpussy
Federal Navy Academy
171
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Posted - 2015.03.03 22:20:34 -
[754] - Quote
Anthar Thebess wrote:So again big guys are getting head start before every thing starts. CCP can we get something earlier? Like removing some of the timers? Let us put eve on fire a bit earlier Pretty please Quote:Alliance:Northern Associates. From:MissMary Thornbush Sent:2015-03-03 21:16:00 http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/politics-by-other-means/ So with sov changes comeing N3 will be makeing plans to adjsut how we do things - Now before everyone has a hart attack the patch isnt till June but we have to make adjustments prior too. With this said somethings you need to be prepaird to do. 1. If you are a CAP BUILDER all building needs to stop no lator then march 30th this means finished done nothing more going into build till after we send you a update when this can be done. why- there will be some re adjusting of space and you may or may not be able to build where you currently are and or sov will change to a new alliance as we re orgnize. 2. Some renters will be asked to relocate to new rental alliances as they are formed as we re work how this is done. Atmo you have no need to stress your renter managers for your regions will contact you when and if you are effected how ever the most important part is being ready for adjustments anyone who puts a build in after this mail is fked if we decide your region is being transferd to a new alliance. So do not do it !!! Lady
CSM did their work they're excellent puppets. what are you talking about!.. don't like it then VOTE THEM OUT! |
Vincent Athena
V.I.C.E.
3186
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Posted - 2015.03.03 22:22:02 -
[755] - Quote
KelSaor wrote:I am seeing very little reason why anyone would want to hold 0.0 sov except for the moon income. Your system makes 0.0 the riskiest place to live (which I agree it should be) but doesnt offer anything over just mission running in highsec and fighting in lowsec.
The 4 hour timer is always a bad mechanic, no in fact its terrible. Sorry guys, only one tz gets to play 0.0, the rest of you just go back to ratting or on a pointless roam.
Bye bye supers, no point to them now.
...and we all move to NPC space. If everyone currently in null moves out, then it will be quite easy for a small group to claim a system. And, as no one in their right mind wants sov, that small group will have no trouble holding it. All you need is a few players who "Are not quite in their right mind", and all of null is yours.
Know a Frozen fan? Check this out
Frozen fanfiction
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Scatim Helicon
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3116
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Posted - 2015.03.03 22:22:25 -
[756] - Quote
I guess what's most disappointing isn't what is in this proposal, rather what is absent from it:
- Any mention of being able to upgrade your space to encourage occupancy or conquest? Nope. The same old crap anomalies with the same old flaws and limitations, encouraging nullsec players to just log into their highsec incursion alts to make money like so many do now.
- Anything that either side can do to affect the battle in between reinforcement and the capture event? Any sign of secondary objectives or side-goals to carry out while you wait? Nope. Hurry up and wait, scrubs, no fun allowed for 48 hours and god forbid you have any alliance members outside the defender's chosen timezone, they're just deadweight.
- Any suggestion of nuance or strategic decision making in attacking sov? More than one way to storm the castle? Nope. Spam ento-ceptors to get timers, wait 48 hours, alarm clock for your opponent's primetime and then derp around the constellation capturing Sov Nodes whilst Yakkity Sax plays in the background.
- Any suggestion of nuance or strategic decision making in establishing or defending sov? Nope. Grind out your indexes as best you can to get the defensive bonus, CTA for your primetime and then derp around the constellation securing Sov Nodes whilst Yakkity Sax plays in the background.
- Any real new mechanics? Nope. You've pretty much grafted FacWar onto 0.0 and called it done. You're even recycling the IHubs and TCUs and sov indeces and fixed reinforcement phase from the system we have now. Lazy, lazy, lazy. Let's not call this a new sov system, it's effectively Dominion 1.2 with the EHP grind removed.
On the bright side, this can't have taken you much more than 10 minutes for you to throw together so it won't take long to rewrite something much better!
Post on the Eve-o forums with a Goonswarm Federation character that drinking bleach is bad for you, and 20 forum warriors will hospitalise themselves trying to prove you wrong.
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Hairpins Blueprint
CBC Interstellar Fidelas Constans
130
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Posted - 2015.03.03 22:22:45 -
[757] - Quote
Ryan Air wrote:
Time zones: you have created a system that will force time zones into a specific role. Either attackers or defenders. Those of us "in between" guys are being left out (I live in Alaska for instance). We will see even bigger collations (NC. EU, NC. US, NC. AU, ect) to make this work or it would pointless to be in a multi timezone alliance. A possible fix for this is to make it so corps can pick the vulnerability window, not the alliance.
Is not a curent sov the same damn thing right now? Come on....
But +1 for this corp thing, timers ashould be set by corps that hold not allaince. |
Vajrabhairava
Windrammers Black Legion.
2
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Posted - 2015.03.03 22:23:03 -
[758] - Quote
(1) TCU can be within 50 km of a POS (2) Entosis Link (T2) has a range of 250 km (3) Jammers and Large POS weapons can reach out > 300km (4) Entosis ship cannot warp or be repped; the can presumably speed tank or burn off grid.
Post #35 discussed ceptor swarms with Entosis modules; I'm thinking at least pretty suicidal for the TCU. In fact, this could be quite difficult for many ships, and maybe even impossible for a dickstar with gunners to manage the jams (assuming Entosis requires maintenance of lock, and assuming it is possible to tell who is activating one if you are a defender.)
Perhaps it would be best to require that no TCU can be anchored in range of any POS module, and vice versa? |
KC Kamikaze
Blue-Fire
60
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Posted - 2015.03.03 22:24:18 -
[759] - Quote
KelSaor wrote:I am seeing very little reason why anyone would want to hold 0.0 sov except for the moon income. Your system makes 0.0 the riskiest place to live (which I agree it should be) but doesnt offer anything over just mission running in highsec and fighting in lowsec.
The 4 hour timer is always a bad mechanic, no in fact its terrible. Sorry guys, only one tz gets to play 0.0, the rest of you just go back to ratting or on a pointless roam.
Bye bye supers, no point to them now.
...and we all move to NPC space.
Actually wormholes are the riskiest place to live. The 4 hour timer is fine. It's the reverse of no timer. It means you only get attacked at your peak time. Thats fantastic in my opinion. That way the aggressing force can't use your lack of activity in a particular timezone to their advantage.
In wspace we don't get that luxury. Somone attacks you and to maintain hole control you are in the game for 12 hours a day fighting to keep your **** after working for 8 hours. The 4 hour window will lower the divorce rate amongst eve players. |
Escuro
Disassembly workshop Out of Sight.
15
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Posted - 2015.03.03 22:24:30 -
[760] - Quote
Killah Bee wrote:
So I wonder what its gonna look like when you reinforce the entire const instead of just one system aswell .. gonna be like 50 beacons to claim and groups like the CFC can still just steamroll all beacons at once .. dunno how thats gonna split them apart.
tyvm
have 5 smaller groups, don't engage, make them rush to a single point while you capture 4 others. profit? |
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Hairpins Blueprint
CBC Interstellar Fidelas Constans
130
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Posted - 2015.03.03 22:25:48 -
[761] - Quote
captain foivos wrote:Nullsec will remain terrible until the answer to "What is the best way to make money in Eve Online?" is not "highsec incursions."
I think best thing to do with hi sec incursions is to remove them from hi sec.
Risk/reward right? move you ass to low or null for good isk, not hi sec ;/ |
Soaran Sikadi
Valkyries of Night Of Sound Mind
21
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Posted - 2015.03.03 22:27:32 -
[762] - Quote
I'd like to propose an amendment to the system. The revamp overall has me very excited, but I'm worried about the effect on off-timezone players of the declared "primetime" and the weakness of the occupancy bonuses.
Goals:
- Allow off-timezone players to participate in sovereignty warfare.
- Make the occupancy bonus more meaningful.
Let the multiplier on capture difficulty, already defined by the changes, be O (for occupancy, ranges between 1 and 4).
- Allow defenders to pick, per system, but not per structure, a (24 / O) hour window of vulnerability.
- Allow defenders to select floor(O) different 4 hour slices as reinforcement zones.
- When a structure goes into reinforce, executor corp directors have the opportunity to select one of the different slices for the structure within some number of hours of the reinforce. That timezone will have the reinforcement timer randomly rolled within it.
It's possible I've missed some obvious flaw in this plan, but it seems like this would allow off-timezone players to be able to participate without making it easy to just flip around timezones to random values, since each additional potential timezone comes with an occupancy cost. It also allows occupancy to define the battlefield rather than just giving structures the equivalent of more hitpoints. |
Harry Saq
Blueprint Haus Get Off My Lawn
62
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Posted - 2015.03.03 22:27:33 -
[763] - Quote
I do like the idea of unused systems being wide open, and the tz being narrowed down by use. The TZ thing does have the potential to overly compartmentalize, still not sure of an alternative that doesn't equal griefing and turning this into Neverest online....
Harry Saq for CSM X
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RadiantShadow
Cascading Failure Un.Bound
0
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Posted - 2015.03.03 22:28:59 -
[764] - Quote
CCP Nicely done, very very nice.
I like it.
The only thing I have is if you make it this far through the 800 whatever comments, one more vote for a bigger prime time window. At least 6 but 8 or 12 hours for any big alliance shouldn't be an issue.
Massive applause. |
Soldarius
Kosher Nostra The 99 Percent
1166
|
Posted - 2015.03.03 22:29:23 -
[765] - Quote
Grath Telkin wrote:I would go so far as saying any system upgraded past level 1 (so 2 and above) should give that warning, but only those, so basically if your alliance makes even a passing try at using the space you get that benefit, otherwise, your clueless about who's doing what in that wooded 10 acre lot behind your house.
More timely warnings based on sov index seems like a pretty decent benefit for owning sov. Tie it into the Strategic Index. Say a 2 minute reduction in time required per level? So at level 1, 8 minutes. At level 5, 0 minutes.
http://youtu.be/YVkUvmDQ3HY
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Myriad Blaze
Common Sense Ltd Nulli Secunda
352
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Posted - 2015.03.03 22:29:45 -
[766] - Quote
Quote:and the Industrial Index is obtained by mining in the system. So considering the new importance of maxing defense bonuses from occupancy, how is mining for a high industrial index better than grinding structures? If I wanted to shoot rocks, I could have stayed in high-sec. At least tie the industrial index to industry maybe? Probably in the form of building/producing stuff? Maybe even consider planetary industry.
Quote:In the new Sovereignty system, each alliance will designate a four hour window through a new option available in the Corporation Management window to certain members of the alliance executor corp. This period will represent the allianceGÇÖs declared prime time, I assume the feedback so far makes it clear that (most) players think Prime Time is a bad idea. Please axe this. If you think about it for a moment, you might realize that locking out a significant portion of the playerbase from partaking in defensive ops for their alliances is a bad move, because you're denying them content. And forcing players into timezone based alliances would be silly, too.
Also I don't see how a smaller alliance could have a chance to stand against a larger alliance within the new system. It seems it would be possible to just hellcamp the defender with a fleet of mains, have a two or three groups in fast ships ready to deal with stragglers, while using cheap throwaway alts in (relatively) cheap ships to zip around and reinforce ALL sov structures of the defending alliance in one sweep.
J'Poll:
EVE doesn't hand out cookies to you.
EVE kicks you down, steals your cookie and then laughs at you for bringing a cookie in the first place.
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Hairpins Blueprint
CBC Interstellar Fidelas Constans
133
|
Posted - 2015.03.03 22:29:49 -
[767] - Quote
Lord Parallax wrote:Just and Idea, since this is all about protecting a ship that is cycling some module and blowing up the ships that are counter cycling,
1. systems that are being actively contested should have a preventive measure on stations, If a entosis link is being used on the station, after the 3nd cycle is completed the station goes into lockdown, preventing anyone from docking or undocking from the station until the entosis link has been stopped or the capture is completed.
Meh easy to counter, just one dude use link and every one dock.
And not beeing able to undock -_-'' for real mate? |
Dixie Mason
ZERO TAX MERCS
7
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Posted - 2015.03.03 22:30:14 -
[768] - Quote
Have to admit I am very please to see changes and overall I really like those. Here is my ideas to address most common issues with the current propositions.
It's obvious that main problem with the new SOV system is compulsory division of alliances into narrow TZ based entities. While I understand the need to make it easier sov warfare for "small guys" we have to look at big multinational alliances too.
So it would be logical to extend "Prime time" based on number of constellation where SOV is held. Base value remain same for 1 constellation but any additional system in other constellation would add 2 more hours of prime time. As an example: if alliance have systems with SOV over it in 2 constellation prime time will be 6 hours. If Brave have SOV in 14 constellations prime time will 24 hours. This will force alliances to more strategic placement of SOV system but if alliance feels strong enough to defend around the clock let them.
Proposed mediocre activity based model lacks both rewards for active SOV owners as well as negative impact in deserted systems for attacker. If CCP is forcing to live everybody closer and share same space it would be logical to greatly expand PVE anomalies or introduce some new capital/supers targeted sites in upgraded systems. As a side result it will make living in 0.0 more risk/reward balanced. From the other hand attacker don't get anything if he attacks literally deserted system with zero activity. This should be addressed by making SOV capture even more easier by removing second timer and sending no notification to defenders (if you dont know your system is reinforced mby you don't need it).
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Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
5762
|
Posted - 2015.03.03 22:31:39 -
[769] - Quote
"Prime Time" is just CCP's way of saying "**** you, Australia", right?
Here's a suggestion:
- Ditch the "prime time" concept. It's just another feature you'll be scrapping six months down the track
- Ditch the "Entosis" module since you'll just be replacing it with hacking or removing it completely down the track
- Structures are vulnerable all the time
- Command nodes are always spawned randomly through the constellation once the structure is built (no reinforcement timer related mechanics, no fancy new hacking-but-not-hacking mechanism)
- Balance spawn rate of command nodes so that attackers/defenders need to be active throughout the entire day
- "winning" the command node competition is based on the current Incursion style influence bar, with influence for each structure of interest
- Command nodes have multiple sizes, just like Incursion or FW sites
- Command node sites can be anomalies, ore, relic, data or beacon sites
- Harder-to-find or harder-to-beat command nodes are worth more influence
- Sov owner can influence command node sizes through deployment of specific IHUB upgrades, only one of each allowed per constellation, which can nominate one system to be small/medium/large encounters, so an alliance that favours frigate combat can anchor a "Small Command Anchor" in their HQ system to ensure that the important fights end up being in frigates
- PVP kills in that constellation count towards all influence bars for all structures
Note that you have no built-in time-out on the capture process using the funky link things. If I and my opponent can manage to keep links active on the structure, the contest will never end. Welcome to the world of fleet boosted maximum-EHP titans duking it out, with each side having 10 minutes to chew through a few million EHP. Whoever has N+1 replacement buffer titans wins.
This way a small Australian corp can still harass a large nullsec alliance that is strong in US time zone, perhaps flying interceptor fleets and engaging any/all small command sites, or infiltrating a large number of covops frigates to engage all the data/relic command sites in unconventional warfare.
The defenders maintain their influence by simply killing the invaders (PVP adjusts all influence bars), or by running command node sites themselves.
Oh, and push ore sites back into the exploration system rather than the anomaly system.
Day 0 Advice for New Players
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Random Interrupt
The Desolate Order Brave Collective
14
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Posted - 2015.03.03 22:32:46 -
[770] - Quote
I read the post and read/skimmed over all 39 pages of this thread. I haven't seen anything to change my mind from my initial take on this.
Prime time needs adjusting for sure. Many corps and alliances are multi-time zone. I highly doubt many alliances, even small ones, exist in a single time zone.
Aside from that overall I'm excited about the changes. It's definitely a great start. |
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Aram Kachaturian
Verge of Collapse
164
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Posted - 2015.03.03 22:33:03 -
[771] - Quote
Thanks for those changes CCP Fozzie.
Great features and I'm glad to see that this game is heading an honourable way.
By the way, I'm on the internet since 1997 and I've never seen such amount of tears.
That's beautiful and atrocious at the same time.
You redefined mordern art and the future of the web.
Thanks to everyone.
"A remnant of the time long past.
Wielder of the Flame of Ballin', Ruler of the Monocle Clubhouse, Skymarshal on a Cosmic Level & Owner of the Wisdom of Kings: The French Prince."
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Tyanshe
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2015.03.03 22:33:18 -
[772] - Quote
Looks good to me. All the crying is by babies who want easy isk and no effort in null.
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KelSaor
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1
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Posted - 2015.03.03 22:33:19 -
[773] - Quote
KC Kamikaze wrote:KelSaor wrote:I am seeing very little reason why anyone would want to hold 0.0 sov except for the moon income. Your system makes 0.0 the riskiest place to live (which I agree it should be) but doesnt offer anything over just mission running in highsec and fighting in lowsec.
The 4 hour timer is always a bad mechanic, no in fact its terrible. Sorry guys, only one tz gets to play 0.0, the rest of you just go back to ratting or on a pointless roam.
Bye bye supers, no point to them now.
...and we all move to NPC space. Actually wormholes are the riskiest place to live. The 4 hour timer is fine. It's the reverse of no timer. It means you only get attacked at your peak time. Thats fantastic in my opinion. That way the aggressing force can't use your lack of activity in a particular timezone to their advantage. In wspace we don't get that luxury. Somone attacks you and to maintain hole control you are in the game for 12 hours a day fighting to keep your **** after working for 8 hours. The 4 hour window will lower the divorce rate amongst eve players.
I'll concede on WH having more risk, but sorry still disagree about the timer and 0.0 being worth it.
When you are flying with an alliance that has 1000s of pilots, 1 TZ will be on constant guard for sov fights, the other 2 wont. As I suspect my alliance/allies will pick US tz I doubt I'll even see much sov action. |
GeeShizzle MacCloud
521
|
Posted - 2015.03.03 22:33:52 -
[774] - Quote
what is really unclear is if the Entosis link module cycle forces a target lock to hold regardless of anything.
For example, many modules have a cycle time that requires a lock to activate, and continues cycling even if that lock fails due to ewar / ecm or other factors like drifting out of lock range.
So we still don't really know if this module needs the lock to be retained throughout its cycle else it fails to apply its effect to the Structure? Or if the effects of the module on the ship using it retains even if the lock is broken? (ie can we warp off if the lock breaks but the cycle is still continuing?)
...as you can tell, many grey areas and requirements to clarify the module and its mechanics still. |
Escuro
Disassembly workshop Out of Sight.
15
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Posted - 2015.03.03 22:33:57 -
[775] - Quote
Myriad Blaze wrote: Also I don't see how a smaller alliance could have a chance to stand against a larger alliance within the new system. It seems it would be possible to just hellcamp the defender with a fleet of mains, have a two or three groups in fast ships ready to deal with stragglers, while using cheap throwaway alts in (relatively) cheap ships to zip around and reinforce ALL sov structures of the defending alliance in one sweep.
it's a chance to zerg-rush a big bad alliance by smaller ones in different parts of space. you don't need a cap-blob to gain sov with this mechanic, so just get a roam going - no one is capable defending 3-5 consts at once. |
BoomBoss
Void Experiments Void..
20
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Posted - 2015.03.03 22:34:29 -
[776] - Quote
Seems nice, i was dissapointed though there is no Sansha mom to be defeated to end the 'nulcursion'. |
Phoenix Jones
Isogen 5
1112
|
Posted - 2015.03.03 22:34:51 -
[777] - Quote
KC Kamikaze wrote:KelSaor wrote:I am seeing very little reason why anyone would want to hold 0.0 sov except for the moon income. Your system makes 0.0 the riskiest place to live (which I agree it should be) but doesnt offer anything over just mission running in highsec and fighting in lowsec.
The 4 hour timer is always a bad mechanic, no in fact its terrible. Sorry guys, only one tz gets to play 0.0, the rest of you just go back to ratting or on a pointless roam.
Bye bye supers, no point to them now.
...and we all move to NPC space. Actually wormholes are the riskiest place to live. The 4 hour timer is fine. It's the reverse of no timer. It means you only get attacked at your peak time. Thats fantastic in my opinion. That way the aggressing force can't use your lack of activity in a particular timezone to their advantage. In wspace we don't get that luxury. Somone attacks you and to maintain hole control you are in the game for 12 hours a day fighting to keep your **** after working for 8 hours. The 4 hour window will lower the divorce rate amongst eve players.
Quoting for the truth about divorce rates.
Yaay!!!!
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d0cTeR9
Astro Technologies SpaceMonkey's Alliance
60
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Posted - 2015.03.03 22:36:35 -
[778] - Quote
#1 I hope this is a VERY basic idea going around, because it's extremely poorly thoughout. #2 Why bother keeping space? #3 Another slap to supercarriers... last thing to do was structure fighter bomber bashing or repping, gone! #4 Here comes fleet of cov-ops going around trolling stations...
Well that was dissapointing...
Can my supers dock now? At least i can station-spin them... Maybe use their fitting service since station services are going to be near-perma disabled... |
KelSaor
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
3
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Posted - 2015.03.03 22:38:41 -
[779] - Quote
d0cTeR9 wrote:#1 I hope this is a VERY basic idea going around, because it's extremely poorly thoughout. #2 Why bother keeping space? #3 Another slap to supercarriers... last thing to do was structure fighter bomber bashing or repping, gone! #4 Here comes fleet of cov-ops going around trolling stations...
Well that was dissapointing...
Can my supers dock now? At least i can station-spin them... Maybe use their fitting service since station services are going to be near-perma disabled... #1 its ccp........ #2 moon income, thats it #3 Pretty much #4 yup |
GeeShizzle MacCloud
521
|
Posted - 2015.03.03 22:42:53 -
[780] - Quote
Also this is a nice copy+paste style point capture mechanic lifted from Planetside 2 and dumped into Eve, you do realise it works well in Planetside due to no cooldown or cost/limiting factor to choosing your defensive respawning location and re-engaging in fights over contested points right?
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