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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Garrett Howe
Spectres
2
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Posted - 2015.03.21 19:53:35 -
[1] - Quote
To elaborate, activating a Warfare Link would provide a buff to each ship that the linking ship is currently targeting i.e. establishing a link between the linking ship and the targeted ones. I would also include an optimal and falloff for Warfare Links which would be buffed by hull bonuses for Command Ships and T3s. Finally, I would get rid of the current command processor bonus and increase the number of active links by one for each level of the relevant ship skill (Command Ships or Defensive Subsystem for T3s). Thus, Lv 0 = 1, Lv 1 = 2, ..., Lv 5 = 6. Instead, command processors would simply increase the range/falloff of your active links.
Pros: No more off-grid boosting Still viable for small gang since one command ship can target several ships (perhaps entire gang depending on gang size) More strategy for larger fleets since range dictation and choosing which ships to buff would matter i.e. would actually require an understanding of where the ships in your fleet were relative to you and what they were accomplishing at that time to determine if they needed/could receive buffs (kinda like you might expect a Fleet Commander to already know)
Cons: Might make linking obsolete if too easily disrupted by EWAR (since one Command Ship is simultaneously providing benefits to multiple ships unlike logi which only heal one ship at a time), would probably have to buff targeting range and sensor strength of Command Ships and T3s with Warfare Processor subsystem
I'm not saying this is perfect, but I feel like having any sort of on-grid boosting that is not targeted turns into the same AFK fest that off-grid boosting currently is (unless you have something like scripts like another poster suggested).
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Madd Adda
41
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Posted - 2015.03.21 20:30:21 -
[2] - Quote
why not just make warfare links affect ships within a fleet in a radius around the command ship?
as it stands some command ships can target 9 ships and other only 7.
Carebear extraordinaire
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Lugh Crow-Slave
932
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Posted - 2015.03.21 20:34:52 -
[3] - Quote
links are supposed to work just as well no matter the fleet size this is one of poorest ways i have seen to get command ships on grid
Fuel block colors? Missiles for Caldari T3?
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Garrett Howe
Spectres
2
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Posted - 2015.03.21 20:36:33 -
[4] - Quote
Madd Adda wrote:why not just make warfare links affect ships within a fleet in a radius around the command ship?
as it stands some command ships can target 9 ships and other only 7.
Because that is more computationally intensive I would think, and it basically just turns the link ship into the anchor. You might have to slightly buff the maximum number of targeted ships, but again, keeping it to just targeted ships provides balance between small and large fleet applications i.e. small gangs may only need one command ship, but larger fleets would need several coordinating to buff everyone. |
Garrett Howe
Spectres
2
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Posted - 2015.03.21 20:40:28 -
[5] - Quote
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:links are supposed to work just as well no matter the fleet size this is one of poorest ways i have seen to get command ships on grid What makes you say that about links? If you have a large fleet, you should need multiple boosters to buff everyone, not just have one booster buff hundreds of people orbiting them. Where is the strategy? |
Baali Tekitsu
AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse
703
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Posted - 2015.03.21 20:57:09 -
[6] - Quote
That is the role of a command ship however, what you described is Logistics role. Would be interesting to have mire remote assist high slot modules but -1 to being them links.
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Garrett Howe
Spectres
2
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Posted - 2015.03.21 21:05:21 -
[7] - Quote
Baali Tekitsu wrote:That is the role of a command ship however, what you described is Logistics role. Would be interesting to have mire remote assist high slot modules but -1 to being them links. It just seems pointless to have a command ship that doesn't actually command, a 1 day old player can buy a command ship account and be just as effective as a veteran with off-grid or AOE boosts if all you are doing is orbiting the command ship. The gameplay just doesn't seem very deep. |
Baali Tekitsu
AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse
703
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Posted - 2015.03.21 21:17:22 -
[8] - Quote
They do command pretty often actually and usually have the fleet commander flying them. Are you suggesting a 1 day old character shouldnt be able to buy characters?
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Garrett Howe
Spectres
2
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Posted - 2015.03.21 21:23:29 -
[9] - Quote
Baali Tekitsu wrote:They do command pretty often actually and usually have the fleet commander flying them. Are you suggesting a 1 day old character shouldnt be able to buy characters? Of course not, but if, for instance, a 1 day old character bought a logi character, I wouldn't expect them to be as effective as someone with play experience. Imagine if logi was AOE within a certain radius of your ship. It would be a terrible mechanic with no logical basis and lead to simplistic play (everyone just orbit logi ship). Links are very powerful, like logi, and game experience should be a factor in how effective they are (like logi). |
FT Diomedes
The Graduates Forged of Fire
896
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Posted - 2015.03.21 21:27:18 -
[10] - Quote
I often FC small gang fights, using my on-grid Claymore pilot (not this character, for all you killboard checkers). Now, in addition to tracking intelligence channels, scout reports, tactical positioning, fleet composition, damage application, flying my own ship, and everything else, you also want me to have to lock my own pilots and get the right boosts targeted on each of them? Get bent.
The Greatest Ship Ever. Credit to Shahfluffers.
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Garrett Howe
Spectres
2
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Posted - 2015.03.21 21:36:40 -
[11] - Quote
FT Diomedes wrote:I often FC small gang fights, using my on-grid Claymore pilot (not this character, for all you killboard checkers). Now, in addition to tracking intelligence channels, scout reports, tactical positioning, fleet composition, damage application, flying my own ship, and everything else, you also want me to have to lock my own pilots and get the right boosts targeted on each of them? Get bent. If my original post wasn't clear, each link you activated would apply to each ship in fleet you are targeting, so all you would have to do (as a small gang leader) is lock up your pilots and activate your links, and each link would apply to each ship you are targeting. |
Lienzo
Amanuensis
53
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Posted - 2015.03.21 21:39:33 -
[12] - Quote
Command ships are too slow to properly support ships that would actually benefit from skirmish links. |
Garrett Howe
Spectres
2
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Posted - 2015.03.21 21:43:03 -
[13] - Quote
Lienzo wrote:Command ships are too slow to properly support ships that would actually benefit from skirmish links. I think it depends on how large the field is. If your links have 50km optimal with 25km falloff base, you have quite a lot of space to work with, and you could add command processors to effectively increase that distance to the majority of the grid. |
Mechanical Infidel
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
0
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Posted - 2015.03.21 21:54:39 -
[14] - Quote
I think the proposal is good at making links play an active role, but I would try and give the links more flexibility by making them scripted between single, targeted aoe, self aoe modes. The ships and modules would have to be rebalanced to fit the new mechanics obviously. But the two main questions you should also consider is; should the AoE buff be FoF and would you maintain that you require fleet structure to apply gank links boosts. (1. No 2. Yes would probably require dogma be completed) |
Garrett Howe
Spectres
3
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Posted - 2015.03.21 22:07:07 -
[15] - Quote
Mechanical Infidel wrote:I think the proposal is good at making links play an active role, but I would try and give the links more flexibility by making them scripted between single, targeted aoe, self aoe modes. The ships and modules would have to be rebalanced to fit the new mechanics obviously. But the two main questions you should also consider is; should the AoE buff be FoF and would you maintain that you require fleet structure to apply gank links boosts. (1. No 2. Yes would probably require dogma be completed) The Squad/Wing/Fleet Command skills would remain unchanged. You can only pass bonuses onto people you would normally bonus with the existing system, but they also have to be targeted and the strength of the bonus would be modified based on how far away they are and the optimal/falloff of the link. |
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors Snuffed Out
7710
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Posted - 2015.03.21 22:14:40 -
[16] - Quote
Madd Adda wrote:why not just make warfare links affect ships within a fleet in a radius around the command ship?
as it stands some command ships can target 9 ships and other only 7. The last thread on this is not even a few days old: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=5591541#post5591541
Copy-pasting what I said in that thread: It's a matter of complexity.
A watchlist (or bubble) is a simple check-recheck, relay information within a given distance ("the grid") with no real effect (or large effect) on ship stats. AoE warfare links would have to check within a certain distance, calculate application from linker's skills and fit, calculate bonuses to be applied to recipient fleet member's fit, apply bonuses, recheck and recalculate and reapply, rinse and repeat.
(NOTE: this is guesstimated speculation based on what I understand of EVE's architecture though... I honestly have no idea what the problem is beyond Fozzie once saying "it creates 10% TiDi in a 20 man fight")
The only thing that can be confirmed is that it is an optimization issue regarding the old code... which the DEVs are (and have been) working on.
Garrett Howe wrote:It just seems pointless to have a command ship that doesn't actually command, "Command Ship" is a misnomer. The ships should actually be called "Fleet Support Battlecruisers."
It's the same way "suicide ganking" is not really suicide... because... technically you don't actually die. Or how "Recon Ships" (T2 cruisers) are not actually for reconnaissance... they are "Electronic Warfare Cruisers." Or how "Tech 3 Destroyers" are not actually destroyers... they are "Advanced Light Cruisers."
How did you start?
The SP System
IFW
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joecuster
AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse
3
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Posted - 2015.03.22 02:13:57 -
[17] - Quote
Is this a troll bait post, or are you just that bad? |
Garrett Howe
Spectres
3
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Posted - 2015.03.22 02:15:17 -
[18] - Quote
joecuster wrote:Is this a troll bait post, or are you just that bad? No troll, what don't you like about my idea? |
FT Diomedes
The Graduates Forged of Fire
898
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Posted - 2015.03.22 15:48:52 -
[19] - Quote
Garrett Howe wrote:joecuster wrote:Is this a troll bait post, or are you just that bad? No troll, what don't you like about my idea?
People do not usually FC from a logistics ship, yet that is essentially what you are asking them to do. Bottom line: as I tried to explain, mostFC's would not FCfrom a ship that requires targeting friends. There is already enough for them to do.
The Greatest Ship Ever. Credit to Shahfluffers.
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Arden Elenduil
Unlimited Ripoff Works
359
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Posted - 2015.03.22 16:05:00 -
[20] - Quote
Garrett Howe wrote:Lienzo wrote:Command ships are too slow to properly support ships that would actually benefit from skirmish links. I think it depends on how large the field is. If your links have 50km optimal with 25km falloff base, you have quite a lot of space to work with, and you could add command processors to effectively increase that distance to the majority of the grid.
You do realise that for kiting fleets, that's not a lot of space...at all Besides, interceptors and other fast tackle who benefit HUGELY from links would no longer be able to receive them.
Your idea would also completely mess up larger fleets and cause it to either be a shitfest where every single squad commander is pulling out his hairs because of issues with getting all the pilots locked, or people just giving up in frustration and flying without them. And with that, congratulations, you have just caused an entire shipclass to become useless in all but pve situations...
In short, no, your idea is terrible and you should feel terrible for even suggesting it, if it isn't a troll because that feels likely. |
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